Linebackers . . . 3 to keep an eye on

McGruff

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First round . . . Leonard Floyd, OLB, Georgia: probably the closest to a Bruce Irvin clone in this draft, Floyd is LONG, athletic with a good nose for the ball, whether that is playing the run or rushing the QB. Georgia pklayed him all over the place, from OLB, ILB and even slot corner. He's freaky to watch, because he's so long and skinny and wears #84 so he looks like he's playing the wrong position. But he's very fluid, has great play recognition, and is the kind of quick twitch player Pete likes. He is light and can get pushed around, and he needs to work on his tackling.

3rd-5th round . . . Travis Feeny, OLB Washington: He's starting to get some pub and getting pushed up, but I think the injury history and tweener status still land him in the middle round. Athletically he's similar to Floyd and was also a jack of all trades at Washington, but he doesn't seem as versatile to me, especially in coverage.

5th-6th round . . . Nick Vigil, Utah State: First of all . . . 108 snaps playing both ways in a single game.

[youtube]MDohl-zDzxE[/youtube]

He's a little light and his top end speed isn't great, but his 10 yard split and especially his 3-cone and shuttle were elite. As in, rare elite. As in, putting Bobby Wagner to shame elite. Kory Toomer and KPL put up similar numbers a few years ago and league wide Vigil's times compare favorably to guys like Kuechly, Bowman, Sean Lee, Ryan Shazier and Thomas Davis. Problem is there is really no footage of him to be found.
 
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McGruff

McGruff

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If anyone can find anything on Nick Vigil, Utah St. or Stephen Weatherly, Vanderbuilt, I'd love to hear it. Weatherly looks like a potential LEO De candidate in terms of size and skills, but I can't find much on him either.
 

Attyla the Hawk

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McGruff":2taevum0 said:
3rd-5th round . . . Travis Feeny, OLB Washington: He's starting to get some pub and getting pushed up, but I think the injury history and tweener status still land him in the middle round. Athletically he's similar to Floyd and was also a jack of all trades at Washington, but he doesn't seem as versatile to me, especially in coverage.

I went ahead and checked the LBs that ran in the low 4.5's with a sub 1.60 10 yard split (Seahawks benchmarks). And who also had similar Vert/BJ tests -- again very important for Seahawks grading.

Here's the comp list:

    • 2015:
    • Kwon Alexander
    • 2014:
    • Khalil Mack
    • Kevin Pierre-Louis
    • 2013:
    • None
    • 2012:
    • None
    • 2011:
    • Von Miller
    • Martez Wilson
    • 2010:
    • None


Feeney really is incredibly unique in terms of his athleticism. I'd expect his stock to rise very very quickly. The only real inhibitor will be injuries.

In this class, with this shortage of pass rush talent -- Feeney stands apart. If he had played for Clemson he's be a day one candidate based on production and athleticism.
 

TwistedHusky

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I am a fan of Feeney but the measurables on him scream SS. 6 4 230lbs, and remember he was moved from safety to play LB.

Sure he was a UW guy, so I saw more of him. But he was a difference maker, even so - LBs are undervalued (like RBs) so he probably goes in the 4th or 5th, even with him being 3rd in the Pac12 in TFLs and I think for sacks.

And I saw him in coverage a fair bit of time, he seemed to do just fine. The shoulder work (4!) he has had done is a worry but that might just mean he has to work on his tackling form to avoid the injuries. Someone that knows more than me can probably contribute on that one.

Last year, was a huge fan of Kikaha - but kept my mouth shut because figured I would be being kind of a homer. But with the Seahawks in need of more pass rush, some LB depth and SS depth, he seems like a great pickup in the 5th, and I would not freak out if they grabbed him in the 4th.

It also bears mentioning that guys coming out of UW defense may not turn into stars but a lot of them stick. Still, a 4.5 40 is not even a dealbreaker for a safety these days, so for a LB that is pretty decent. Admittedly his shuttle #s were bad, so you have to consider that, but as a guy that can get to the QB and punish people on routes? He does a good job. Also a really effective special teamer.

Of course, I think we all know that since he is probably not exactly a secret out here, if you watched any CFB this year where UW played - he probably stood out.
 

firebee

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Attyla the Hawk":2mjdmj03 said:
McGruff":2mjdmj03 said:
3rd-5th round . . . Travis Feeny, OLB Washington: He's starting to get some pub and getting pushed up, but I think the injury history and tweener status still land him in the middle round. Athletically he's similar to Floyd and was also a jack of all trades at Washington, but he doesn't seem as versatile to me, especially in coverage.

I went ahead and checked the LBs that ran in the low 4.5's with a sub 1.60 10 yard split (Seahawks benchmarks). And who also had similar Vert/BJ tests -- again very important for Seahawks grading.

Here's the comp list:

    • 2015:
    • Kwon Alexander
    • 2014:
    • Khalil Mack
    • Kevin Pierre-Louis
    • 2013:
    • None
    • 2012:
    • None
    • 2011:
    • Von Miller
    • Martez Wilson
    • 2010:
    • None


Feeney really is incredibly unique in terms of his athleticism. I'd expect his stock to rise very very quickly. The only real inhibitor will be injuries.

In this class, with this shortage of pass rush talent -- Feeney stands apart. If he had played for Clemson he's be a day one candidate based on production and athleticism.
Speaking of Clemson... How about that TJ Green... Noted for being a shoulder hitter and not a wrap up tackler, but his physical ability is insane. With PCs emphasis on fundamental tackling exercises here, we might be able to mold him into one hell of a DB that could have a crazy impact on our defense.
 

JSeahawks

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I hate, HATE Travis feeney. He's one of those guys that gets under the opponents skin. Hitting after the whistle, being rougher then necessary. He's one of those guys you notice on the field. Much more so then a guy like Shaq Thompson who although he was a better player always seemed invisible or inconsequential when playing against him.

I HATE feeney, which probably means I'd love him of he was on my team. So I'd be all for it 3rd round or later.
 

titan3131

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McGruff":97oj3jqw said:
If anyone can find anything on Nick Vigil, Utah St. or Stephen Weatherly, Vanderbuilt, I'd love to hear it. Weatherly looks like a potential LEO De candidate in terms of size and skills, but I can't find much on him either.

stephen weatherly is my dark horse leo atm. I dont see us getting ogbah or tapper, so i needed an alternative.
 

DJrmb

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I've been on the Feeney bandwagon for a few years now. He screams Kam Chancellors replacement to me, and I've told many of my family and friends that I believe he will be just that. In Pete's system Feeney could be a beast if he stays healthy.
 

titan3131

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DJrmb":1jvffshb said:
I've been on the Feeney bandwagon for a few years now. He screams Kam Chancellors replacement to me, and I've told many of my family and friends that I believe he will be just that. In Pete's system Feeney could be a beast if he stays healthy.

do we want to gamble on that?

Alot of "ifs" have bitten us in the past.
 

kearly

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I like Floyd a lot, but it's worth mentioning that he is an extremely unique LB, in both goods ways and bad.

I think the best part of his game by far is his ability to pass rush. He's effortless and sneaky fast around the edge, and his hand-fighting to cut back inside is very good. His bull rush is better than I expected given his build.

As a linebacker, he lacks instincts and is constantly getting caught up in the scrum. He's also really really bad at shedding blocks, which is ironic given how good his pass rush repertoire is. He doesn't take great angles. His pursuit speed is good, but not special like Irvin or Wagner.

Physically, Floyd reminds me a lot of Dion Jordan. Both are very similar in terms of size and athleticism (Floyd is 6'6" rounded up, Jordan is 6'6" rounded down, both ran the exact same 40 time). Both were guys who left evaluators scratching their heads to figure out if he was a DE, a 3-4 rush backer, or a 4-3 LB. Ultimately, Jordan's hype was too much as he was drafted WAY too high despite the confusion over his role.

The difference is, I always thought Jordan was a massive hype job as a pass rusher (the guy had zero moves and just tried to run by people), but Jordan DID show tremendous promise as a blitz or cover Will LB in a 4-3 defense... particularly in a scheme like Seattle's. With Floyd I see it the opposite. I think he will likely struggle and frustrate at any 4-3 LB spot, but his pass rush potential is like that of a more athletic Chris Clemons.

Draft Floyd, have him add a little weight if needed, and use him as a situational pass rusher and see how he grows. If they can polish him enough to make him a passable SAM LB then bonus points for that too.

With Feeney, he just had the combine performance of a high first round pick, but his on field performance was more day 3 territory. He was a good but not great player. But would he fit the Irvin role? Like a glove. Medicals will be interesting. I had previously thought that Feeney to Seattle in UDFA was a shoe-in, but after he destroyed the combine he'll probably end up a mid-round pick, barring the status of his medical.

I don't know anything about Vigil. The track record of small school LBs is not great. Wagner is a pretty big exception to the norm. Nothing wrong with taking a late flyer, but I'd set my expectations to Ty Powell territory.
 

xgeoff

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The LAST thing I want is a Bruce Irvin Clone. I like Travis Feeny, though. Would love to see us pick him up. My favorite linebacker in the draft is Deion Jones. That guy is a playmaker all over the field.
 

titan3131

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xgeoff":28a1ixlm said:
The LAST thing I want is a Bruce Irvin Clone. I like Travis Feeny, though. Would love to see us pick him up. My favorite linebacker in the draft is Deion Jones. That guy is a playmaker all over the field.

Idk what tape ur watching but the combine solidified how weak deion jones is.
 

vin.couve12

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xgeoff":3hnt8lve said:
The LAST thing I want is a Bruce Irvin Clone. I like Travis Feeny, though. Would love to see us pick him up. My favorite linebacker in the draft is Deion Jones. That guy is a playmaker all over the field.
Bruce Irvin i a bit of a Von Miller clone, albeit not as good a pass rusher. That said I don't quite follow what you mean by that.
 

xgeoff

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titan3131":gkk3u6nu said:
xgeoff":gkk3u6nu said:
The LAST thing I want is a Bruce Irvin Clone. I like Travis Feeny, though. Would love to see us pick him up. My favorite linebacker in the draft is Deion Jones. That guy is a playmaker all over the field.

Idk what tape ur watching but the combine solidified how weak deion jones is.

I don't know what combine you're watching but his stock has risen as a result. Flashed really good speed. If you're saying he's weak because he didn't do the bench press, who cares? Go draft Tony Mandarich. There has never been a correlation between bench press performance and linebacker performance.

You know the one thing they have been able to draw some degree of correlation with? Game film. Watch the Senior Bowl tape and you'll see Deion Jones excel against the elite players of this draft.
 
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McGruff

McGruff

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xgeoff":35czrdov said:
titan3131":35czrdov said:
xgeoff":35czrdov said:
The LAST thing I want is a Bruce Irvin Clone. I like Travis Feeny, though. Would love to see us pick him up. My favorite linebacker in the draft is Deion Jones. That guy is a playmaker all over the field.

Idk what tape ur watching but the combine solidified how weak deion jones is.

I don't know what combine you're watching but his stock has risen as a result. Flashed really good speed. If you're saying he's weak because he didn't do the bench press, who cares? Go draft Tony Mandarich. There has never been a correlation between bench press performance and linebacker performance.

You know the one thing they have been able to draw some degree of correlation with? Game film. Watch the Senior Bowl tape and you'll see Deion Jones excel against the elite players of this draft.

Aaron Curry had great game film. Just sayin'.
 

xgeoff

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McGruff":2j3044co said:
xgeoff":2j3044co said:
titan3131":2j3044co said:
xgeoff":2j3044co said:
The LAST thing I want is a Bruce Irvin Clone. I like Travis Feeny, though. Would love to see us pick him up. My favorite linebacker in the draft is Deion Jones. That guy is a playmaker all over the field.

Idk what tape ur watching but the combine solidified how weak deion jones is.

I don't know what combine you're watching but his stock has risen as a result. Flashed really good speed. If you're saying he's weak because he didn't do the bench press, who cares? Go draft Tony Mandarich. There has never been a correlation between bench press performance and linebacker performance.

You know the one thing they have been able to draw some degree of correlation with? Game film. Watch the Senior Bowl tape and you'll see Deion Jones excel against the elite players of this draft.

Aaron Curry had great game film. Just sayin'.

Aaron Curry was good for a while. And nothing is 100%. Archie Griffin won two heismans. Was terrible in the NFL. I'd go with game film over measurables any day of the week though.
 
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McGruff

McGruff

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xgeoff":3u5i3txh said:
Aaron Curry was good for a while. And nothing is 100%. Archie Griffin won two heismans. Was terrible in the NFL. I'd go with game film over measurables any day of the week though.

I'd go with both. JMO, but game film indicates the floor of a player, but measurables indicate potential ceiling. You've got to have both working hand in hand.
 

firebee

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McGruff":214zu5ho said:
xgeoff":214zu5ho said:
Aaron Curry was good for a while. And nothing is 100%. Archie Griffin won two heismans. Was terrible in the NFL. I'd go with game film over measurables any day of the week though.

I'd go with both. JMO, but game film indicates the floor of a player, but measurables indicate potential ceiling. You've got to have both working hand in hand.

I think you use measurables to gauge what you saw on film and get a comparison on players with similar measurables and abilities. A lot of the measurables at the combine give false impressions though. Sure some guy runs a 4.4 and the other runs a 4.5 until they get pads on and then the 4.5 guy is leaving the 4.4 guy in the dust on downfield routes or the guy with the 40 inch vertical is getting outplayed on the ball by a guy with a 36 inch vertical. I value play over measurable tests because measurables don't tell you have fast a player reacts, how they carry pads or what kind of coordination they have in regards to motion, hand-eye, balance, targets in motion, etc. Pretty much, measurables are good for determining who might be a better athlete between guys that have similar abilities, traits and styles.
 

xgeoff

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vin.couve12":3iqqs2bz said:
xgeoff":3iqqs2bz said:
The LAST thing I want is a Bruce Irvin Clone. I like Travis Feeny, though. Would love to see us pick him up. My favorite linebacker in the draft is Deion Jones. That guy is a playmaker all over the field.
Bruce Irvin i a bit of a Von Miller clone, albeit not as good a pass rusher. That said I don't quite follow what you mean by that.

So, comparing Bruce Irvin to Von Miller. Hmmmm.... Hmmmmm... Look, I'm not saying Bruce Irvin is bad. He played, I think, OK. Certainly not 1st round caliber.

His pass rush, in my opinion, is just flat out terrible. I never saw any moves from this guy. If the tackle got out in time, it seemed as if Irvin just gave up and spied on the QB. Now, maybe this was what he was supposed to do, but I never saw a dynamic pass rusher. Which is really weird cause the guy is big and strong and fast. I never understood that.

Salk likes to say that Irvin sets the edge well. Ok, I'll give you that, but I don't think it is that hard to find a guy who only has to 'set the edge'. Cause Irvin didn't pursue well, despite his speed, and he didn't cover well either. Now, he was a DL in College, so expecting him to cover guys is a bit of a stretch. And it's not like he was a terrible cover guy. He wasn't, he just wasn't good either.

So, in terms of comparing him to Von Miller, I just don't see any comparison at all, really. Except that their both fast?
 

xgeoff

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McGruff":1sm41tb8 said:
xgeoff":1sm41tb8 said:
Aaron Curry was good for a while. And nothing is 100%. Archie Griffin won two heismans. Was terrible in the NFL. I'd go with game film over measurables any day of the week though.

I'd go with both. JMO, but game film indicates the floor of a player, but measurables indicate potential ceiling. You've got to have both working hand in hand.

OK, sounds reasonable to me. If I was a Scout that would probably be the smartest approach.
 
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