CB making the most sense

Hawks46

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The more I think about it, the more and more taking a CB in the 1st makes sense.

CB is one of the deeper positions in the draft. We'll get a really quality prospect at our draft spot.

Shead tore his ACL late in the year. He likely won't be ready, or be 100% by Training Camp.

Looking at Sherman's age...well we could get a guy in the 1st and have him for 5 years. At that point, we could determine how much time Sherm has left. If he's one the downside and doesn't want to take a more team friendly salary, we could have a guy that is high level that could take his place, thus avoiding having 2 CB's on huge contracts.

Or, Sherm sticks around and we have two elite guys. Either way, I think the timing is right for this, and the draft seems to be telling us this as well.
 

gmor

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I would go OL. Locking up the big money on the last few rounds of FA makes it a good bet on going that way. OL is the weak link on this team. Getting some quality depth at OLB would be nice as well.
 

chris98251

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I don't care who you take at O line we can't make them pan out, we need secondary depth at CB, if it's as deep as they say then trade down and stack CB's and let them fight it out for a roster spot, I also want a thumper RB, most I want Reece to be resigned and us to change our blocking scheme to power run.

I think interior D line is a good place to go as well.
 

Largent80

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titan3131":3gglkxw6 said:
Interior DLINE
Corner/NB
LB
OT/G

Pretty much all of our needs. Hoping the experience for the younger guys who got to play with the injuries will make for more quality depth in the backfield.
 
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Hawks46

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gmor":nftbvpd2 said:
I would go OL. Locking up the big money on the last few rounds of FA makes it a good bet on going that way. OL is the weak link on this team. Getting some quality depth at OLB would be nice as well.

The OL didn't give up 38 to GB and 36 to Atlanta. If we don't get our secondary and secondary depth fixed, we'll have this problem.

Sure, we can go all OL and try to dominate time of possession and hide the defensive flaws like Dallas did, but even if you used our first 5 picks on OL (or 4 if you like Britt), it won't turn our OL around in one year. You want an immediate impact, you're going to have to get a decent vet and pay them.

Also, OL talent at the top of the draft is really weak this year, especially at Tackle where we're really weak. Not sure we get good value at our draft slot. I saw one mock with us getting Ramcyk and I'm really good with that, but not sure how likely that is.
 
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Hawks46

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chris98251":r8lczhk4 said:
I don't care who you take at O line we can't make them pan out, we need secondary depth at CB, if it's as deep as they say then trade down and stack CB's and let them fight it out for a roster spot, I also want a thumper RB, most I want Reece to be resigned and us to change our blocking scheme to power run.

I think interior D line is a good place to go as well.

Everything I've read says we're going to see insane depth in this draft in the secondary (both CB and S), DE and DT.

I'd be great with an elite 3T DT talent, as we really have no interior pass rush and the draft pick doesn't duplicate positions. I see people pining for DE, but I don't see the need. We have Clark, Bennett and Avril. The latter two don't show signs of slowing down at all, while Clark is still developing. Marsh also looked pretty good this year. Drafting a DE in round 1 is duplicating depth.
 

penihawk

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I brought up last year that CB was a big need and if one of the top rated ones slipped to the bottom of rd1 we should consider it. I got killed for that. The defense needs to be addressed early and often in this years draft. CB,OLB,DL & S depth in that order for me.

O-line imo needs to be somehow addressed in FA with a couple of vets not off the scrap heap. Our history and really history league wide makes it a crapshoot with college OL prospects transitioning. RB is a concern with health but I can't see a rd1 pick on one. With some youth development and health, I think the offense is actually closer than the defense to being good enough to get back to the SB. It's gonna be a vital and interesting offseason for sure.
 

Coug_Hawk08

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I'd like us to draft Kevin King, in whatever round it takes.

I think he could definitely lock up the RCB spot.
 

Attyla the Hawk

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penihawk":h4h1c10v said:
I brought up last year that CB was a big need and if one of the top rated ones slipped to the bottom of rd1 we should consider it. I got killed for that. The defense needs to be addressed early and often in this years draft. CB,OLB,DL & S depth in that order for me.

Well, to be fair we'd just resigned Lane and Shead ascended to the #2 spot. Obviously the outlook in April of '16 was very very different than that of today.

Shead is a system guy. Who has developed as a often used backup. Injury aside, I would maintain that the body of work in '16 indicates that he is probably just that. A very top notch backup. Not the caliber of Maxwell or Browner when they patrolled the opposite side of the field.

Lane had a tough year. Definitely not his finest. Was it an aberration? Hard to know.

At this point, I think we know more about our CB situation than we did last year. Seattle definitely needs a starter quality CB to pair with Sherman. Probably more than that, we need to get a player who will eventually succeed Sherman. Age will sap him of ability in much the same way it did Marcus Trufant here and most recently, Darrelle Revis.

This is the draft to maintain consistency in the years ahead. And it coincides very nicely with immediate need for a better quality CB on the outside.

I'd love to see us get a FS and a pair of CBs. Not unlike 2011 when we added Sherman and Maxwell.

If we felt that the RB depth in 2016 merited 3 draft picks -- then 2017's DB class should almost demand it.

If I'm looking at best case scenario, I'm thinking Budda Baker, Kevin King and Rasul Douglas makes a very effective boost to the DB rotation. I think we'd be very fortunate if Shead isn't IRed next season. Certainly he'll be rehabbing all the way through training camp and the preseason. Lane is probably the day one starter, unless a rookie CB can just be better than we thought on draft day and ends up being a Jarran Reed type of addition.

Baker very likely starts as the vacated nickel C/S position on day one.

Whatever our needs were heading into the tail end of the season, Shead's injury changes that outlook. And the now realized value of what Thomas means to this pass defense cannot be understated or be left to the next man up kind of talent. From what we saw, a backup FS has more value to us in terms of winning than a backup QB. Average at that position cripples our method of winning.
 

Attyla the Hawk

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Coug_Hawk08":1h417ukb said:
I'd like us to draft Kevin King, in whatever round it takes.

I think he could definitely lock up the RCB spot.

I could agree with that to a point.

This draft is going to be almost must see. It'll really depend on if the CB depth in this class serves to push quality down the draft as the edge talent in 2012 and the WR talent in 2015 did. If we see QB/DL/RB/OL talents get scooped up early because of positional value (QB) or scarcity (OL) -- it's likely that the run on CBs won't start until the second day.

Also worth noting, that as much as we covet King for the attributes that we recognize Seattle wants -- it's not a profile that a lot of other teams covet. Some teams that tried to copycat our blueprint have already abandoned a more man/press scheme. The failures of the Desir's, the Maxwell's and the Jean-Baptiste's still sting.
 

Pandion Haliaetus

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Secondary is one of the most lacking positions heading in 2017.


These are the players under contract.

CB: Sherman, Lane, Elliott
S: Thomas, Chancellor

You have Thomas's injury and questions about desire.

Questions about Kam's contract.

Lane had a very poor season and was exposed pretty badly.

Sherman seems to be teetering on a ledge within himself. I think some of his passion is being drained by the demands and hypocrisy of the NFL as well as its officiating. He's still a great corner but you wonder how much he as left especially if you question if his heart is not in it.

And we've built this team defense on backs of a unique secondary and I feel the team would do well to infuse fresh, NFL ready talent that they can still mold.

So if I was John Schnieder, I would go:

1st Round, CB Sidney Jones, 6'0-6'1, 180, (190-195)
2nd Round, FS Budda Baker (trade up), 5-10, 192 (200-205)
3rd Round, CB, Kevin King, 6-2, 190 (195-200)

* Weight: Best listed weight i could find (ideal weight in nfl)

This is totally homerish and I haven't really invested in researching prospects yet, I just know these guys that I listed are projected in those rounds.

But even so, if Seahawks could pull this off, there would be plenty of things to like.

1. These guys likely are very familiar with the Seahawks system and the style they will be asked to play.

2. These guys probably have molded themselves somewhat after current Seahawks players and likely have had the opportunity to meet and pick some of the brains in the Seahawks secondary.

3. All three are familiar with each other, not only can they support each other in the NFL, they already have the rapport, chemistry, relationships, and ample experience with each other to excel when they are on the field together. Also, that brotherhood and familarity being established could mean they'll also hold each other accountable and push each other much harder. More so than three rookies who never met each other would.

4. They are f:amiliar with city of Seattle and that is always a plus as there won't be any huge psychological impact to enviroment changes or culture shock that I would argue can affect some players earlier in their careers as they grow and mature. They also might be more adept down the road to re-sign if they end up calling Seattle home.

5. And this one could be greatly important. If these guys falter or find it tough to find their game or whatever negative obstacle they can face. They are a drive away from thier collegiate roots where they can confide in Peterson, Lake, ex-teammates, friends to help them mentally or whatever. I know with social media and technology communication is not a big deal. However, being close to UW and being able to physically go back for whatever reasons could help keep them grounded and feeling overwhelmed by the transition and expectations of the NFL.

I just think if by chance Seahawks have the opportunity to draft all three of these players in these rounds, I think the potential is there to grow elite players off the bat to without some adversity factors both football and non-football factors that can hinder such growth because of the familarity as well as the options of support they'll have.

Seahawks imo would instantly shore up thier secondary depth and have a great foundation to build off for the future. King/Jones compete at RCB/NCB with Lane. With Baker backing up Thomas and also getting looks at NCB and in Dime packages.

Injuries would seem less detrimental and it would inject actual competitive factors back into the secondary that had been sorely lacking since probably 2014.

All of a sudden Lane is on a hot seat, not only could he lose playing time, the team could simply move on from his contract after 2017 especially if he has another sub-par year.

You have a contingency plan in place to take over Richard Sherman and Earl Thomas after 2018. I feel Sherman is or has entered the 2nd half of his prime, so you could expect maybe 2-3 years of sub-elite to elite play with some gradual decline towards average from now until then. Sherman in a low possibility could also be the hot seat, especially if he continues to alienate the team, falls of faster than expected. He could find himself cut or traded after 2017. So there is plenty of reasons for him to come back down somewhat into focus, dig in, and just stay on top of his craft without the distractions.

Thomas gives me a vibe that he could retire at the end of his contract if not before if he goes through another big injury set back. So having Baker is a great insurance policy to your most important player on Defense. If Thomas stays healthy, Baker as stated is versatile and talentef enough to earn playing time at NCB and the Seahawks possibly create a hybrid DB role for him.

For Comparison sakes (to Seahawksy players in this regime):

Sidney Jones. You kind of look at the Ht/Wt and maybe think of Jeremy Lane. But Seahawks once had a potentially elite corner prospect that fell off due injuries and suspensions who was listed at 5'11, 189. Both corners possess similar aggressive styles, skills, and play-making ability. The mystery corner would be Walter Thurmond.

Baker is more Mathieu 2.0 than Thomas 2.0 although the two NFL players both are very similar. Mathieu is more unique for his versatility, so he is more the player I envision Baker early on especially when you comp there size and speed (Thomas is heavier and faster than both). Baker, however, is definately more Thomas-esque than Steven Terrell instinctually and as a play-maker and tackler.

Kevin King, I think his ceiling is Sherman 2.0 and his floor Byron Maxwell 2.0. Although he'll need to continue to develop himself physically adding muscle to his superb length.


On a side note, I would love to see a flyer taken on the 6'2, 255 Joe Mathis. He has a Chris Clemons sort of feel to him. Develop him as a SAM/LEO hybrid.

I also wouldn't mind a flyer on the 6'1, 320 Ellijah Qualls too as a potential Rubin replacement. Ultra physical, high-energy space eater to pair with Reed for the future. Yes, please.

Give me all the Dawgs :stirthepot:
 

Attyla the Hawk

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Don't see us high on Jones.

This draft is very very deep at CB. With the size and length we like. Most drafts, we're looking at 2-4 guys. This draft should have closer to 6-8. And not a lot of obscure prospects at that.

Also, Thurmond was an outlier. At a time when our model was in it's infancy. We haven't drafted or even brought in for a visit a CB (that I'm aware of) that violates our measurement threshold.

I like Baker tremendously. Love King. I could get down with a draft where we triple dip in the DB pool. My fantasy picks:

1. Budda Baker
2. Kevin King
3. Rasul Douglas

I'd probably have Douglas over King. But King is getting a lot of momentum and I expect it to become hotter after the combine.
 

Boycie

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gmor":11doldyb said:
I would go OL. Locking up the big money on the last few rounds of FA makes it a good bet on going that way. OL is the weak link on this team. Getting some quality depth at OLB would be nice as well.

It's a pretty weak draft for O-linemen from what the experts are saying. I'd rather go CB or the BPA instead of reaching on an O-lineman.
 
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It really does to me too! I was thinking this after watching the Falcons game. You know what else makes a ton of sense too in my book a Safety. So maybe Adoree Jackson CB USC cuz I have a need for speed and for his return skills. How about Jabril Peppers so we can have that Hybrid Linebacker/Safety that they wanted to have with Brandon Browner. The more and more I look at it Peppers would the perfect prospect for what they want to do with this defense. Good post tho Op I was thinking the same thing. Sick of tired of the 3rd and longs and I kid u not Im like they wont stop them and we don't. We need a cb opposite Sherman to lock someone done this would also help our pass rush or a Safety to take pressure and to learn off two of the best in the biz!
 

sondevil89

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If you prioritizing by need then offensive linemen are far and away the team's biggest need. That doesn't mean that corners aren't a big need also, but I think you draft by what's available. Last year we needed OL too but when Jarran Reed dropped in our lap in the 2nd round we didn't hesitate. It will probably be the same this year, we're not going to take just any OL, CB, or DE but someone who has real upside.
 
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sondevil89":3cpf9rq1 said:
If you prioritizing by need then offensive linemen are far and away the team's biggest need. That doesn't mean that corners aren't a big need also, but I think you draft by what's available. Last year we needed OL too but when Jarran Reed dropped in our lap in the 2nd round we didn't hesitate. It will probably be the same this year, we're not going to take just any OL, CB, or DE but someone who has real upside.
I agree we need to infuse this team with talent. We missed in the last couple drafts on some prospects we need to make up for those of those misses.
 
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Coug_Hawk08":2wqyk37h said:
I'd like us to draft Kevin King, in whatever round it takes.

I think he could definitely lock up the RCB spot.

I am going on record that he will be the cornerback with the highest ceiling of all taken in the 2017 draft.

Go get him Hawks.
 

poplarbluffman

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1st rd looks to the spot for a 6'0 long armed press cb..lot of very solid smaller ones later.

.
 
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