Drafting o-line

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Drafting o-line
Mon Feb 06, 2017 12:44 pm
  • Sorry about just another o-line thread, but lets really look at it from a player acquisition point of view:

    The past 3 drafts have brought the Seahawks 5 starters(3 via draft, 2 via FA) and 1 potential starter.

    LT Fant (FA-16), LG Glowinski (4th round-14), C Britt (2nd Round-14), RG Ifedi (1st Round-16), RT Gilliam (FA-14).

    Potential starter Odhiambo (3rd Round-16).
    Last year they brought in 2 street FA in Sowell and Webb. On the surface they are at least trying. The past few years they have been bringing in 3-4 guys to at least complete. I fully expect to see at least that many more this offseason, be it street FA, draft or undrafted FA.

    Could the state of the o-line during the 16 season be one of inexperience alone? They are obviously bringing in guys to compete. Are they the wrong guys? Is the coaching too patient with younger guys?

    How much potential do any new guys need to show before they can unseat the above 5 "starters"? Is anyone deemed safe at their position? Britt most likely, but what if an all-pro Center fell in their lap? Where would Britt go? Were Britts failures at G & T just due to inexperience? Could we potentially see a different guy at each position on the line? Not necessarily completely different guys but more a shuffling of positions?

    So many questions. Its gonna be fun to watch it unfold.
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Re: Drafting o-line
Mon Feb 06, 2017 6:45 pm
  • I don't see them bringing in a LT via draft or free agency to replace Fant. Fant was thrown to the fire this year, which I think will pay dividends year two and beyond. Fant is a special athlete at LT and I really like his playing demeanor.

    I wasn't impressed with either Glow or Ifedi at OG. Both are young and have upside, so I give them a pass. But I expect them to improve next year, no first year starter excuses next year. Coach Carroll has said Ifedi is staying at OG, so there is a good chance Ifedi stays at OG.

    Britt was surprisingly good at OC, and I like that he was a vocal leader with the young o-lineman.

    I'm of the opinion that the coaching staff believe that these young guys just needed experience playing next to each other to jell as a unit. If that is the case, then they just need to find a new RT. I think they will draft one o-lineman somewhere in the first four rounds and then another one in the 6th or 7th round. Then sign a couple of lower tier free agent o-lineman. Sign OG Chance Womack, who so far has been a 1st round bust. Then sign maybe OT Byron Bell. Bell has good size, and a good amount of playing experience.



    RT is a big need and here our different options to address it...

    1) Trade up in the 1st round of the draft to get Bolles or Ramcyzk. (Highly unlikely)
    2) Stay put in the 1st round and draft Cam Robinson, if he falls to them. Caution: he has a fair amount of mental mistakes (penalties) and an off the field incident. But, he has size, length, and would be good for our run game.(Good option)
    3) Target a OT that they like between rounds 2 through 4. (Highly likely)
    4) Draft a late round OT and sign a couple lower tier free agent OT. Let them compete for the starting RT spot. (worst cast scenario)
    5) Sign OT Ricky Wagner, who is considered the best free agent OT. (Highly unlikely)
    6) Trade for a OT. (Highly unlikely)
    7) Move Ifedi to RT and draft a OG. There are some really good mid-round OG's in the draft. (Good option)
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Re: Drafting o-line
Wed Feb 08, 2017 4:59 pm
  • If they don't bring in an experienced LT, then I think they need to bring in an experienced guard and try sliding ifedi to tackle. There are some pretty good guards hitting FA, tackles not so much. Although, if bolles or ramzyck are there, I think they need to pull the trigger. I still want to see a trade for a stud LT though. That and find a good RT in the draft or FA would be the best scenario, but probably won't happen.
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Re: Drafting o-line
Thu Feb 09, 2017 10:15 am
  • Drafting Oline with Cable is pointless. He is that bad of a coach. The final 4 teams in the playoffs had Oline built with 3-4th rounders. Cable is the black hole that is destroying the team.
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Re: Drafting o-line
Thu Feb 09, 2017 8:44 pm
  • Love to see them go get Zietler from Cincinnati and kick Ifedi out to tackle.
    Draft a few rooks to battle it out.
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Re: Drafting o-line
Thu Feb 09, 2017 10:25 pm
  • When you pay your three specialists combined more than the starting OL the offense will suck ass. No coach can turn that many turds into a good line right away. Hopefully Pete and John learned something in 2016.
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Re: Drafting o-line
Thu Feb 09, 2017 10:30 pm
  • We have enough young talent for the oline. I would be against drafting any oline man this year. I think we would be better off giving in to free agency. Defense needs some new guns. DT and Cb or even safety. This is completely different than I have felt the last few years. We need some journeymen or even a top shelf T or G.
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Re: Drafting o-line
Thu Feb 09, 2017 11:02 pm
  • It makes sense to continue to add to the mix in this group.

    The group takes up almost 20% of the roster spots. It's smart to add every year to the group. Injuries and UFA defections pretty much demand it.

    There is no magical solution. You add whenever you feasibly can. UFA, street FAs, trades and the draft. No reason to cut off any possible avenue to improve here.
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Re: Drafting o-line
Fri Feb 10, 2017 9:28 pm
  • sdog1981 wrote:Drafting Oline with Cable is pointless. He is that bad of a coach. The final 4 teams in the playoffs had Oline built with 3-4th rounders. Cable is the black hole that is destroying the team.


    So true. Almost every single Cable recommendation has been a bust, with exceptions of Britt and Sweeney. And here we are yet again after multiple drafts and still don't have 2 average tackles. So despie multiple needs, we're going to have to look to the draft again. Please PCJS-draft actual tackles who project as tackles! No more SPARQ, athletic types, just get us a couple huge hombres that can pass block.

    It's almost to the point I'd rather we put 2 large mules at our tackle positions-they'd at least have the size, sturdiness and strength to hold off rushers for a couple seconds-and their stubbornness and toughness are good Seahawk traits. And their cap hit would be very low-a couple buckets of grain and carrots and they're game!
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Re: Drafting o-line
Sat Feb 11, 2017 10:50 am
  • West TX Hawk wrote:
    sdog1981 wrote:Drafting Oline with Cable is pointless. He is that bad of a coach. The final 4 teams in the playoffs had Oline built with 3-4th rounders. Cable is the black hole that is destroying the team.


    So true. Almost every single Cable recommendation has been a bust, with exceptions of Britt and Sweeney. And here we are yet again after multiple drafts and still don't have 2 average tackles. So despie multiple needs, we're going to have to look to the draft again. Please PCJS-draft actual tackles who project as tackles! No more SPARQ, athletic types, just get us a couple huge hombres that can pass block.

    It's almost to the point I'd rather we put 2 large mules at our tackle positions-they'd at least have the size, sturdiness and strength to hold off rushers for a couple seconds-and their stubbornness and toughness are good Seahawk traits. And their cap hit would be very low-a couple buckets of grain and carrots and they're game!



    Just look how dumb Cable is.

    Keeps Drew Nowak over Patrick Lewis in 2015. The team struggles to do anything on offense. Cuts Drew Nowak and puts in Patrick Lewis and the Seahawks have an offensive explosion. Team already has guards and center somewhat set going into the offseason.

    So the expected Oline looks something like this

    2016 Projected
    LT Britt
    LG Glowinski
    C Patrick Lewis
    RG FA departure
    RT Gilliam

    So the 2016 draft comes along and the team drafts a tackle who can play in space and a gaurd/tackle combo player.

    The 2016 line should look like this

    LT Britt/Sowell
    LG Glowinski
    C Patrick Lewis
    RG Webb/Odhiambo
    RT Ifedi/Webb/Gilliam

    So what does Cable do? Cuts and moves all 4 players and benches the other players. So now the 2016 line looks like this

    LT Basketball player
    LG Glowinski
    C Britt
    RG Ifedi
    RT TE

    That is just changing for the sake of change. It kind of reminds me of the coach from Waterboy when they first meet him and his is all crazy and just out thinks himself.

    No one can convince me that Britt is an upgrade over Patrick Lewis and that Fant is any upgrade over Britt. The line should look like this last season.

    LT Britt
    LG Glow
    C Lewis
    RG Odhiambo
    RT Ifedi

    No way that line is as bad as the line we saw last season.
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Re: Drafting o-line
Sat Feb 11, 2017 3:09 pm
  • Your entire post is centered around Justin Britt playing LT. Justin Britt couldn't play RT. He sure as hell can't play LT.

    I've got many problems with Cable, but come on.
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Re: Drafting o-line
Sat Feb 11, 2017 3:30 pm
  • Britts feet are concrete, why he can't play a tackle, he is smart and doesn't have to move a lot or drop step and block like a tackle at Center, why he succeeds.
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Re: Drafting o-line
Sat Feb 11, 2017 5:19 pm
  • Britt was not as big of an upgrade over Lewis at center and Britt would have been an upgrade over Fant at LT.
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Re: Drafting o-line
Sat Feb 11, 2017 7:43 pm
  • sdog1981 wrote:Britt was not as big of an upgrade over Lewis at center and Britt would have been an upgrade over Fant at LT.



    Britt was horrible at RT and a hot mess at LG, this year he found finally found a home at OC. He is not athletic enough to play LT. Fant is a supreme athlete with great length for LT. IMO Fant has way more upside than Britt at LT. Keep Britt at OC, where he finally proved to be a legit starting o-lineman.
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Re: Drafting o-line
Sat Feb 11, 2017 9:05 pm
  • cover-2 wrote:
    sdog1981 wrote:Britt was not as big of an upgrade over Lewis at center and Britt would have been an upgrade over Fant at LT.



    Britt was horrible at RT and a hot mess at LG, this year he found finally found a home at OC. He is not athletic enough to play LT. Fant is a supreme athlete with great length for LT. IMO Fant has way more upside than Britt at LT. Keep Britt at OC, where he finally proved to be a legit starting o-lineman.


    Britt was very solid at C this year-definitely agree on that point. He is our C for the foreseeable future.

    Disagree on Fant. He's incredibly athletic and quick and has earned a roster spot but we need a huge, big bodied, experienced LT. Now whether that's through drafting a highly regarded tackle who played tackle all through college or signing a decent FA remains the question.

    I would love to see us trade up for once in the 1st round and get the best tackle available if all FA tackles are too cap detrimental.
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Re: Drafting o-line
Sun Feb 12, 2017 4:47 am
  • West TX Hawk wrote:
    cover-2 wrote:
    sdog1981 wrote:Britt was not as big of an upgrade over Lewis at center and Britt would have been an upgrade over Fant at LT.



    Britt was horrible at RT and a hot mess at LG, this year he found finally found a home at OC. He is not athletic enough to play LT. Fant is a supreme athlete with great length for LT. IMO Fant has way more upside than Britt at LT. Keep Britt at OC, where he finally proved to be a legit starting o-lineman.


    Britt was very solid at C this year-definitely agree on that point. He is our C for the foreseeable future.

    Disagree on Fant. He's incredibly athletic and quick and has earned a roster spot but we need a huge, big bodied, experienced LT. Now whether that's through drafting a highly regarded tackle who played tackle all through college or signing a decent FA remains the question.

    I would love to see us trade up for once in the 1st round and get the best tackle available if all FA tackles are too cap detrimental.


    As fans, we lived through Fant's first year's growing pains at LT. I feel like we would have gone through those growing pains for naught, if we gave up on him. I'm really excited to see how much Fant has improved for his second year. IMO Fant played similarly to Germain Ifedi, both struggled, both showed promise, and both have size/athletic ability. The difference is that Ifedi is a 1st round pick and Fant was an undrafted free agent. If Fant were the 1st round pick and Ifedi was the undrafted free agent, fans would talking about giving up on Ifedi at OG and bring in a proven veteran to replace him.

    If we are fortunate enough to land one of the top two OT in the draft, I believe that player would start at RT not LT.
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Re: Drafting o-line
Sun Feb 12, 2017 9:16 am
  • Glowinski struggled/showed promise as well. So, in reality only Britt showed improvement and he has found his home as a center in the NFL.

    Glow and Ifedi should improve so that gives us a decent interior. we absolutely need RT.
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Re: Drafting o-line
Sun Feb 12, 2017 2:28 pm
  • It feels like working in Cable's system is a 3 year learning curve. Given contracts and free agency, it just doesn't make sense to draft somebody for Cable to work with almost to the point they contract is up. Pete needs to find an OL coach who can do more with the talent he's given right away. There simply isn't enough time to develop OL the way Cable seems to need to.
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Re: Drafting o-line
Sun Feb 12, 2017 5:21 pm
  • The fact is that every rookie struggles, and it doesn't matter the system. Unless they are once in a lifetime players that just happen to be available when the Hawks pick, that rookie is going to have bad moments.

    Pete chose Cable as his line coach so if you have issues with Cable then you also have issues with Pete.
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Re: Drafting o-line
Sun Feb 12, 2017 7:04 pm
  • Largent80 wrote:Pete chose Cable as his line coach so if you have issues with Cable then you also have issues with Pete.


    This is such a lame argument. If you have a problem with Pete then you must have a problem with Paul Allen then, right? People can have faults or flaws but still be good on the whole.
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Re: Drafting o-line
Sun Feb 12, 2017 9:06 pm
  • HawkGA wrote:
    Largent80 wrote:Pete chose Cable as his line coach so if you have issues with Cable then you also have issues with Pete.


    This is such a lame argument. If you have a problem with Pete then you must have a problem with Paul Allen then, right? People can have faults or flaws but still be good on the whole.



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Re: Drafting o-line
Mon Feb 13, 2017 7:10 am
  • HawkGA wrote:
    Largent80 wrote:Pete chose Cable as his line coach so if you have issues with Cable then you also have issues with Pete.


    This is such a lame argument.


    It's not an argument, it is simple fact. Cable is Pete's guy. Pete is Allen's guy. Did that help you any?

    You can't polish newbie turds no matter WHO you are. I would say that coming into a ZBS after not being anywhere near one would produce the results you are seeing.
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Re: Drafting o-line
Mon Feb 13, 2017 9:01 am
  • HawkGA wrote:It feels like working in Cable's system is a 3 year learning curve. Given contracts and free agency, it just doesn't make sense to draft somebody for Cable to work with almost to the point they contract is up. Pete needs to find an OL coach who can do more with the talent he's given right away. There simply isn't enough time to develop OL the way Cable seems to need to.



    This is the problem. PC is still trying to use the college formula with rookies where he has them only for three to five years and then they leave. The only problem is that in this league you don't have the luxury of waiting that long and expect to really compete and win championships. He needs to treat the O-Line in the same way as he does his vaunted defense.

    Develop and then keep the core O-line players together to build and maintain consistency. This is the only way that RW will not only thrive, but more importantly survive in the long term. Right now RW will be out of this league in no more than 5 more years because of injury or the David Carr syndrome.

    I would personally sacrifice some of our defensive performance for a consistent, above average O-Line play to balance out the team.

    Perhaps PC doesn't give a damn about that, but we and mostly Paul Allen should.
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Re: Drafting o-line
Mon Feb 13, 2017 9:39 am
  • kf3339 wrote:
    HawkGA wrote:It feels like working in Cable's system is a 3 year learning curve. Given contracts and free agency, it just doesn't make sense to draft somebody for Cable to work with almost to the point they contract is up. Pete needs to find an OL coach who can do more with the talent he's given right away. There simply isn't enough time to develop OL the way Cable seems to need to.



    This is the problem. PC is still trying to use the college formula with rookies where he has them only for three to five years and then they leave. The only problem is that in this league you don't have the luxury of waiting that long and expect to really compete and win championships. He needs to treat the O-Line in the same way as he does his vaunted defense.

    Develop and then keep the core O-line players together to build and maintain consistency. This is the only way that RW will not only thrive, but more importantly survive in the long term. Right now RW will be out of this league in no more than 5 more years because of injury or the David Carr syndrome.

    I would personally sacrifice some of our defensive performance for a consistent, above average O-Line play to balance out the team.

    Perhaps PC doesn't give a damn about that, but we and mostly Paul Allen should.


    To be consistent you have to keep them around more then 2 yrs, that's been our biggest issue, they never work together as a group at the same positions, they are in constant learning curve mode.
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Re: Drafting o-line
Mon Feb 13, 2017 1:34 pm
  • Were in serious jeopardy of wasting our franchise QB's career as a guy that can get us to and win superbowls.

    It needs to be stopped NOW. Get a Friggin GRIP and give RW some god damned protection.

    Don't throw Walgreens FA band aids into the mix. Sowell and Webb?....They played as hideous as their signings were.

    Get a top tier OL or draft properly for RT and hope Fant is the LT of the future. Were winning so we will never get a stud LT with our draft position.
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