Trade down possibility?

Coxal · Feb 9, 2014

According to walterfootball.com :

Sources with the Redskins tell WalterFootball.com that they believe some good talents are going to fall to the Nos. 30-34 range. Washington's first selection is the second pick of the second round, so moving up into the Nos. 30-32 range could cost as little as a mid-level third-day pick.

Redskins' sources also have in mind the long-term contract benefits that trading up would provide the organization. Trading up into the first round has the added advantage of an extra year being tacked onto the rookie contract. First-round picks get 5-year contracts while second-rounders receive a 4-year deal, so the Redskins would get another year of that player's prime for a bargain, while also potentially buying more time before deciding on an extension. For example, Carolina would have had a fifth year on Greg Hardy's rookie contract rather than him entering unrestricted free agency.

One team to keep an eye on is the Super Bowl champions. The Seahawks could be a good trading partner with Washington, as Seattle is without its third-round pick thanks to the Percy Harvin trade. Moving from No. 34 to No. 32 could be done for perhaps as low as a fifth-round pick. The Redskins could be more sure to get the player they want and not have to worry about a team jumping ahead of them with Houston to open Friday night.

It makes sense with our FO... I'd like that. Anyway I trust our FO so much that I'd like any moves they'll do in a draft.

Throwdown · Feb 9, 2014

They'll ask for a bit more than a 5th I think, but to move down only two spots??? I'm fine with that.

It'd be a waste of a Thursday night in May though if it happened.

davidonmi · Feb 9, 2014

Throwdown":3h4vkhl8 said:
They'll ask for a bit more than a 5th I think, but to move down only two spots??? I'm fine with that.

It'd be a waste of a Thursday night in May though if it happened.

disagree, the draft is never a waste of a day.
If we could get a 5 for moving down 2 spots I'm all for it

kearly · Feb 9, 2014

That extra year could potentially save the team several millions of dollars in future cap space.

Teams that are picking in the high second round should all be trying to move back up into the first on the cheap. The extra year could easily be worth more than the day 3 pick they give up. Seattle would be pretty dumb to give up that extra year for a 5th round pick, IMO. Not every late 1st round pick turns into a stud, but imagine if we could sacrifice a 5th round pick to delay Sherman's payday by one year. A fifth round pick just turned into $13-16 million dollars.

SonicHawk · Feb 10, 2014

kearly":35nz5wex said:
That extra year could potentially save the team several millions of dollars in future cap space.

Teams that are picking in the high second round should all be trying to move back up into the first on the cheap. The extra year could easily be worth more than the day 3 pick they give up. Seattle would be pretty dumb to give up that extra year for a 5th round pick, IMO. Not every late 1st round pick turns into a stud, but imagine if we could sacrifice a 5th round pick to delay Sherman's payday by one year. A fifth round pick just turned into $13-16 million dollars.

Solid analysis Kearly.

sutz · Feb 10, 2014

Yeah, Kip, a 5th sounds a bit low to move out of the first, given that logic. Would you consider it for, say a 3rd? Or maybe 2 3rd day picks?

It's an interesting consideration, given we're really about maintenance of our roster more than finding "that one last piece of the puzzle" so to speak. IMO, we're less interested in finding #1's at almost any position and more about finding quality depth that could possibly develop into starters in 2-3 years.

Just discussing, here. I'm no expert.

EverydayImRusselin · Feb 10, 2014

Why would the Redskins trade up a few spots though? They've already gutted their team with trading up for RG3. They need all the picks they can get.

Scottemojo · Feb 10, 2014

EverydayImRusselin":1h89y96d said:
Why would the Redskins trade up a few spots though? They've already gutted their team with trading up for RG3. They need all the picks they can get.

Don't think of it as the 32nd pick. Think of it as the last pick of day 1. The intrinsic value of the 32nd pick is not having to wait for the second round to begin the next day to move up and get who you want. There is a lot of intrigue and deal making in the 18 hours between the end of day one and the first pick of the 2nd round.

I would be fine with anything up to pick 40.

EverydayImRusselin · Feb 10, 2014

Scottemojo":3nkuik3d said:
EverydayImRusselin":3nkuik3d said:

Why would the Redskins trade up a few spots though? They've already gutted their team with trading up for RG3. They need all the picks they can get.

Click to expand...

Don't think of it as the 32nd pick. Think of it as the last pick of day 1. The intrinsic value of the 32nd pick is not having to wait for the second round to begin the next day to move up and get who you want. There is a lot of intrigue and deal making in the 18 hours between the end of day one and the first pick of the 2nd round.

I would be fine with anything up to pick 40.

I understand that, but in addition to them sealing up a top pick for 1 extra year at a reasonable rate, they are giving up a 4th or 5th or whatever, which would be another pick making peanuts. My point is they have a ton of needs and are already out of a 1st rd pick. To me it just reeks of more front office ineptitude to give up even more picks. Then again, it is Snyder.

Edit: I would love it if they did trade up with us. I'm all for trading back 2 places to allow JS another chance at finding a gem.

HawkWow · Feb 10, 2014

kearly":bvo9802b said:
That extra year could potentially save the team several millions of dollars in future cap space.

Teams that are picking in the high second round should all be trying to move back up into the first on the cheap. The extra year could easily be worth more than the day 3 pick they give up. Seattle would be pretty dumb to give up that extra year for a 5th round pick, IMO. Not every late 1st round pick turns into a stud, but imagine if we could sacrifice a 5th round pick to delay Sherman's payday by one year. A fifth round pick just turned into $13-16 million dollars.

Absolutely.

And leave it the Skins to announce this as though they pioneered the concept.

There is now very little to gain in moving out of the 1st if a player of interest / value is sitting in your 1st rd spot. The pot will need to be sweeter than the Skins believe, IMO. Most teams feel they are getting a starter with that 1st pick...so what is that 5th year worth when we're talking an NFL starter?

Adding a late rd pick will severely limit their options, IMO. Their only hope would be to have a team, picking late in the 1st, that does not see a remaining player as 1st team material. I'd say dangling a 4th would get more bites, while likely moving them up into the late 20s.

kearly · Feb 10, 2014

sutz":1bufkh8o said:
Yeah, Kip, a 5th sounds a bit low to move out of the first, given that logic. Would you consider it for, say a 3rd? Or maybe 2 3rd day picks?

I think a 3rd rounder to move to maybe #40 would be fair. Also, it really depends who's there. If there is a big run on Seattle's board right before they pick and suddenly the BPA is a guy they have a mid 2nd round grade on, a guy who's pretty unlikely to be a top dollar megastar, then moving down a few spots for a day 3 pick isn't as crazy.

But if a potential future franchise tag type guy like ASJ is there, I'd much rather have the extra year on his deal. Seattle may spin day 3 picks into gold, but there are other ways to add them.

Recon_Hawk · Feb 10, 2014

kearly":2s68ln1n said:
sutz":2s68ln1n said:

Yeah, Kip, a 5th sounds a bit low to move out of the first, given that logic. Would you consider it for, say a 3rd? Or maybe 2 3rd day picks?

Click to expand...

I think a 3rd rounder to move to maybe #40 would be fair. Also, it really depends who's there. If there is a big run on Seattle's board right before they pick and suddenly the BPA is a guy they have a mid 2nd round grade on, a guy who's pretty unlikely to be a top dollar megastar, then moving down a few spots for a day 3 pick isn't as crazy.

But if a potential future franchise tag type guy like ASJ is there, I'd much rather have the extra year on his deal. Seattle may spin day 3 picks into gold, but there are other ways to add them.

Excellent thinking.

I'd add that if the team is drafting a player who may need a couple years to develop, having a 5th year would help avoid paying top dollar for a player who might of only contributed his 3rd and/or 4th season.

ASuperForce · Feb 10, 2014

Greg Hardy was a sixth round pick. I'm not sure how he applies to a 1st round versus 2nd round discussion other than it being nice to have any underpaid guy underpaid for as long as possible in the salary cap era.

Is there any rule prohibiting straight cash deals for draft picks? It'd be nice if Paul Allen could just buy some picks like he did with the Trailblazers in the past.

Mr. McGibblets · Feb 10, 2014

Hey I'm new on the board but have been hovering for about a year now....but I'm all in for trading back and getting an extra pick . Before I was a bit skeptical trading back but the FO showed me they can rack up talent in the later rounds....We don't have any glaring needs except maybe an OL and arguably a WR

sutz · Feb 11, 2014

kearly":1ynyw7zg said:
sutz":1ynyw7zg said:

Yeah, Kip, a 5th sounds a bit low to move out of the first, given that logic. Would you consider it for, say a 3rd? Or maybe 2 3rd day picks?

Click to expand...

I think a 3rd rounder to move to maybe #40 would be fair. Also, it really depends who's there. If there is a big run on Seattle's board right before they pick and suddenly the BPA is a guy they have a mid 2nd round grade on, a guy who's pretty unlikely to be a top dollar megastar, then moving down a few spots for a day 3 pick isn't as crazy.

But if a potential future franchise tag type guy like ASJ is there, I'd much rather have the extra year on his deal. Seattle may spin day 3 picks into gold, but there are other ways to add them.

Hard to argue against that logic. I think the draft pick value chart is starting to normalize based on the new CBA.

HawkMeat · Feb 12, 2014

For several years the 32nd pick is kept. It isn't like a top ten or fifteen pick where the trade partner is moving up in the first round and the team still gets a first round pick. You trade away the 32nd pick and you lose out on the extra year on the contract for a later round pick. Trading out of the 64th pick is more likely then the 32nd.

Like mentioned above it is unlikely this pick is traded.

Attyla the Hawk · Feb 13, 2014

I wouldn't put too much stock in the frequency with which the 32nd pick is moved. The sample size is just too small. We do see late first round trades all the time, but if we were to look at any one particular pick, they probably don't get moved often either.

Kip alluded to why acquiring the pick should have innate advantages given the new CBA. We've only had 2 drafts under this CBA so there really is no track record to speak of. Teams were still feeling out the impact of the CBA as it pertained to the draft. Seattle is a team that is notorious for moving back and we are a team that doesn't really drive hard bargains to do it. I'd say the conditions are good that we could make a move back.

It will depend on the talent still available. If a run on talent develops in the first round, a team in the 38-45 range may move up in fear that they'll lose out on improving that position.

I still see the ability to move back. But it'll probably mean moving back into the middle of round 2 at best.

Seahawkfan80 · Feb 16, 2014

In this year of the new agreement, does not the player only have a single or two year deal if drafted? Or is that next year? What affect will that have on the draft? Also one other question, does the draft round determine what paychex the player should draw or is that up to the player/dealer/coaching staff/owner make that decision? I have seen here where the round of the draft does make some money, but wonder if that changes with the new CBA. Thanks...

Lords of Scythia · Feb 17, 2014

If they do it it'll probably be minutes before the 32nd pick is on the clock.

sutz · Feb 18, 2014

Seahawkfan80":2bbfyhsb said:
In this year of the new agreement, does not the player only have a single or two year deal if drafted? Or is that next year? What affect will that have on the draft? Also one other question, does the draft round determine what paychex the player should draw or is that up to the player/dealer/coaching staff/owner make that decision? I have seen here where the round of the draft does make some money, but wonder if that changes with the new CBA. Thanks...

There is far more structure and a hard cap on how big the top contracts can be now. That's a good thing IMHO. There's also more limits, set value in the slotting of later rounds, IIRC. Oh, and no holdouts, I believe.

IIRC, 1st Day picks get 5 years deals, 2d day picks get 4 year deals, and rounds 4-7 I'm not really sure. But no player gets a 1 year deal on being drafted, I think. I'm pretty sure that any player drafted gets at least a 3 year deal.

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