MB on Pete Carroll

Sgt. Largent · Apr 19, 2018

WmHBonney":268ih2v2 said:
The players are grown men. They are professionals. They KNOW what happened and who was responsible. Why buy in when you see a double standard?

You contradicted yourself.

If the players are grown men and professionals, then they shouldn't act like children holding grudges, throwing tantrums and being disruptive. They should do what players like Russell, Doug, KJ and Bobby did, stay positive, continue to buy in and be the team leaders this team needed them to be.

But some couldn't act like men and professionals, and now they're gone.

btw, no one talks about the 10 pt lead our offense had going into the 4th quarter in that SB. Why is the defense absolved of letting Brady do whatever he wanted, which caused the offense to have to make a miracle drive to win?

Sorry, this is a team sport, EVERYONE'S responsible.

mrt144 · Apr 19, 2018

Sgt. Largent":2faiv5k1 said:
WmHBonney":2faiv5k1 said:

btw, no one talks about the 10 pt lead our offense had going into the 4th quarter in that SB. Why is the defense absolved of letting Brady do whatever he wanted, which caused the offense to have to make a miracle drive to win?

Sorry, this is a team sport, EVERYONE'S responsible.

Click to expand...

No one? It is reflexively spat out during any conversation about SB49 by someone.

Furthermore, does the fact that Atlanta also blew a seemingly more insurmountable lead figure into the responsibility thing to some degree? I'd say yes - The Pat's bread and butter is letting the other team step on their dick while they chip away at the lead and then pull away at the end. In both cases you can fault the defense for not holding up but then when you go through some of those offensive series, ya know, the things that help reduce offense drives of the other team or ratchet up the necessary value of those drives to get back in the game, they were straight trash.

Everyone has a job to do and both sides let down in crunch time. I just find it harder to really castigate the side playing against the GOAT coach and QB who routinely pull this kinda stuff out of their hat against all comers when the last gasp at victory was a ridiculously awful play in execution alone.

Sgt. Largent · Apr 19, 2018

mrt144":k185mvn2 said:
Sgt. Largent":k185mvn2 said:

WmHBonney":k185mvn2 said:

btw, no one talks about the 10 pt lead our offense had going into the 4th quarter in that SB. Why is the defense absolved of letting Brady do whatever he wanted, which caused the offense to have to make a miracle drive to win?

Sorry, this is a team sport, EVERYONE'S responsible.

Click to expand...

Click to expand...

No one? It is reflexively spat out during any conversation about SB49 by someone.

Furthermore, does the fact that Atlanta also blew a seemingly more insurmountable lead figure into the responsibility thing to some degree? I'd say yes - The Pat's bread and butter is letting the other team step on their dick while they chip away at the lead and then pull away at the end. In both cases you can fault the defense for not holding up but then when you go through some of those offensive series, ya know, the things that help reduce offense drives of the other team or ratchet up the necessary value of those drives to get back in the game, they were straight trash.

Everyone has a job to do and both sides let down in crunch time. I just find it harder to really castigate the side playing against the GOAT coach and QB who routinely pull this kinda stuff out of their hat against all comers when the last gasp at victory was a ridiculously awful play in execution alone.

I've NEVER read one post on here about the defense in SB 49, other than they were depleted and played their hardest.

4,000 posts and threads about Bevell, Pete, Cable, Russell and Kearse not blocking BB...............but no posts I can remember on the defense coughing up the lead, of which ironically were all the players complaining about the final play for years.

mrt144 · Apr 19, 2018

:lol: Putting never in caps makes you sound facetious. Did you even read the other posts in this thread? There is one that says exactly what youve missed over 4k posts...

Just kinda weird to double down on an easily false strawman.

Sgt. Largent · Apr 19, 2018

mrt144":4jydsso6 said:
:lol: Putting never in caps makes you sound facetious.

THANKS

mrt144 · Apr 19, 2018

rjas77":2wj5ybo3 said:
With roughly eight minutes left in the 4th, the Offense had a 10 point lead. Truth is it was the D that lost SB 49

Sgt. Someone said exactly this in this thread. If you missed this lil tidbit right in front of your face, no wonder you never saw another in 4k posts.

jammerhawk · Apr 19, 2018

More of the same convo that surrounded the release of Sherman.

Either you are all in, and prepared to comply with the team rules or you are not. However, if you are not, then you are gone.

Pete's rules are pretty simple:

1. Always protect the team
2. No whining
3. Show up early

These rules are the only rules and they are applied in an enviroment where you always compete for everything.

Bennett reading books in meetings is him exporting his protest to team activities, and Sherman's public criticism of Pete is is ego driven whining. Neither is protecting the team. These guys were paid to be professional and team leaders and their behaviours were childish and inconsistent with their respective roles on the the team. Any other player who gets to the stage that they think they are bigger than the team and the above three simple rules don't need to apply to them should be shipped out talented or not. Bennett and Sherman began to think they were bigger than the team and eventually didn't fit here anymore.

While I genuinely liked both players for their play Sherman was starting to 'big time' folks as he believed he was smarter than his coaches or disagreed with the coaching style. he was being paid to be a leader and not a whining sniper. Bennett was starting to do the same, and both were elite players looked up to by younger team members. If the rules didn't apply to them why should they apply to anyonefor both they were not 'all in' so they were were moved out before they completely poisoned the program.

Pete certainly screwed up by not recognizing that Cable was a fable and was repeatedly failing to meet all stated objectives. He absolutely sabotaged his team by not canning Bevell after Bevell threw Lockette under the bus. Bevell as well was demonstrating he was more important than his team and should have been canned.

harryjohnson · Apr 19, 2018

After Pete supported MB when he got arrested this how he pays him back?
Bennett's true colors are showing.

He and Sherman are classless narcissists. I have lost all respect for them both.

Sgt. Largent · Apr 19, 2018

jammerhawk":3525i4ox said:
More of the same convo that surrounded the release of Sherman.

Either you are all in, and prepared to comply with the team rules or you are not. However, if you are not, then you are gone..

This is NE, not here.

Pete is actually one of the more open to listening to criticism from the players type of coaches. He tried hard to work things out with Richard, how many one on one meetings did they have? At least two publicly that I know of, which means probably even more privately.

But IMO that's changed, Pete knows that style of coaching isn't sustainable for more than a couple years. Once the message gets old and criticized, it's time to move on with some player showing those signs of discontent.

scutterhawk · Apr 19, 2018

rjas77":qvbn8jve said:
With roughly eight minutes left in the 4th, the Offense had a 10 point lead. Truth is it was the D that lost SB 49

True, but it's a convenient Skate Free excuse for the Defense to group together & lay the blame on ONE PLAY by the Offense.
Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain.

ivotuk · Apr 19, 2018

Byron Maxwell said the game changed when Cliff Avril went out with a concussion. He said half-jokingly "Tom Brady was standing back there patting the ball..."

Somebody else said "And don't forget, it took a miracle catch from Jermaine Kearse to even get us down there."

There was a lot more going on in that game than the interception. The Patriots should have pulled their WR, every saw him get hammered then wobble around. In an interview 6 months later he was asked "Didn't you have a concussion?" he smirked as said "What's a concussion?"

If you want to put the outcome of an entire 60 minute game on one point, IMHO it's the fact that we pulled our concussed guy out, and they didn't.

Uncle Si · Apr 19, 2018

ivotuk":1lwpj0u1 said:
If you want to put the outcome of an entire 60 minute game on one point, IMHO it's the fact that we pulled our concussed guy out, and they didn't.

I find it generally naive and disingenuous that people want to put the past 4 years on that 60 minutes, let alone one play

since many on this board love to hold us to the Patriots standard... i wonder how they were able to recover from such devastating Super Bowl losses...

mrt144 · Apr 19, 2018

Uncle Si":2tnm82w0 said:
ivotuk":2tnm82w0 said:

If you want to put the outcome of an entire 60 minute game on one point, IMHO it's the fact that we pulled our concussed guy out, and they didn't.

Click to expand...

I find it generally naive and disingenuous that people want to put the past 4 years on that 60 minutes, let alone one play

since many on this board love to hold us to the Patriots standard... i wonder how they were able to recover from such devastating Super Bowl losses...

Make more than 2?

Sgt. Largent · Apr 19, 2018

Uncle Si":3rpa4wfk said:
. i wonder how they were able to recover from such devastating Super Bowl losses...

Because their head coach has no soul.

He can't be bargained with. He can't be reasoned with. He doesn't feel pity, or remorse, or fear. And he absolutely will not stop until he wins another SB.....................

jeremiah · Apr 19, 2018

Popeyejones":1r0athap said:
IrishNW":1r0athap said:

Pete's loyalty is his biggest flaw as a coach

Click to expand...

He fired his coordinators and is shipping off his All Pros. I don't think loyalty is his issue.

I don't want to excuse Bennett for doing this or for talking about it publicly, but it is yet another indication of what PC's biggest flaw is as a HC IMO:

He just errs very far to the "let the players be themselves"/"anything goes" side of the leadership equation, and has never seemed to have any desire to balance that "loving mother" style out with "stern father" moments. That works perfectly fine when everything is working, but when things get more challenging everything implodes.

I mean yeah, that Bennett is reading a book while his coach is conducting a team meeting doesn't look good for Bennett, but it's insane that he didn't get kicked out of the meeting and chewed out the first time he tried to pull that stunt. Essentially, from P.C. Bennett learned that he could completely disregard his coach when he felt like it without any consequences.

And Seahawks players over the years have learned that lesson over and over again: If guys are getting in fist fights with each other on the sidelines without consequences, pushing their coaches without consequences, telling national reporters they're going to turn them into their prostitutes without consequences, sitting their reading a book while the coach is addressing the room without consequences, taking dumb penalties all the time without consequences, pretending to to take a sh!t in the endzone without consequences, criticizing each other in the media without consequences, and so on, and so on, and so on, you have made it clear to everyone that they can practically do whatever they want without any repercussions.

I sincerely don't know if PC knows this or not, but if he's jettisoning vet All Pros under the belief that they're just bad seeds and he needs to get them out of there to get the ship back in order, that's a huge mistake. His leadership style creates a lack of accountability, and if he doesn't change that or balance out more he's just going to be restarting with (what are very likely going to be less talented) younger players who will come in and learn all the same lessons and over time in the aggregate have all the same problems.

I could not agree more. Your analysis/opinion is spot on.

Jville · Apr 19, 2018

MB is just another in a long line of those who squander time in second guessing. He'll regret not fully embracing his assigned task of instilling Pete's message in new comers ..... just as he admittedly regretted not fully appreciating the genius of a once in a life time seven man rotation when it asserted itself in 2013. For many, squandered leadership opportunities sink in sometime after the fact. Regrets make themselves known through reflections on missed opportunities and responsibilities some time later.

Looking back on 2017 with benefit of hindsight, one might speculate that Pete may have been a year tardy in culling the ranks. So much noisy second guessing kind of suggests as much ..... don't it.

toffee · Apr 19, 2018

Seymour":2dkokb7o said:
toffee":2dkokb7o said:

It came down to pre-big contract and post big contract. Pre? Everything came out of Pete’s mouth was gold, post? Gold turned into shit.

Not complicated at all.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Click to expand...

Exactly. I've said this many times over the years. It's hard to feel hungry when you are rolling in cash. Bennett is weak minded and is suffering from sour grapes syndrome. Predictable.

A long time ago in a valley pathed with silicon. I managed some young guys in a startup, two weeks after IPO, boys worth $20 mil or so, one worth north of $30 mil. Boy, did that change people over night!

In Sherman and Bennett of the world, the sec they ink the big contract, their focus shifted to their “brand”, saving some mileage on their body, next big contract, career after football.

Always compete? Go f yourself Pete.

I have respect for Tom Brady, he still Love and respect his job, and the hand that feed him after all these years.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

adeltaY · Apr 19, 2018

mrt144":1rmtdiwh said:
rjas77":1rmtdiwh said:

With roughly eight minutes left in the 4th, the Offense had a 10 point lead. Truth is it was the D that lost SB 49

Click to expand...

Sgt. Someone said exactly this in this thread. If you missed this lil tidbit right in front of your face, no wonder you never saw another in 4k posts.

I've noticed this in almost every lengthy discussion of SB49 both on this board and other Seahawks sites. Sgt. maybe reflexively overexaggerating or have selective vision loss. Not mentioned nearly as often is that we had a good shot to salt away the game if Kearse didn't drop a pass that hit him in the hands on a 3rd and 10. Both O and D had problems, but AFAIK, only the D was playing with major injuries. Also, the fact that Edelman wasn't taken out the game and Cliff was - not sure how that's a fair or consistent application of the concussion protocol.

All kinds of stuff led to that moment, but ultimately that INT took us from a very high chance of repeating to crushing that hope.

hawkfan68 · Apr 19, 2018

jammerhawk":2b5ail4c said:
More of the same convo that surrounded the release of Sherman.

Either you are all in, and prepared to comply with the team rules or you are not. However, if you are not, then you are gone.

Pete's rules are pretty simple:

1. Always protect the team
2. No whining
3. Show up early

These rules are the only rules and they are aplied in an enviroment where you always compete for everything.

Bennett reading books in meetings is him exporting his protest to team activities, and Sherman's public criticism of Pete is is ego driven whining. Neither is protecting the team. These guys were paid to be professional and team leaders and their behaviours were childish and inconsistent with their respective roles on the the team. Any other player who gets to the stage that they think they are bigger than the team and the above three simple rules don't need to apply to them should be shipped out talented or not. Bennett and Sherman began to think they were bigger than the team and eventually didn't fit here anymore.

While I genuinely liked both players for their play Sherman was starting to 'big time' folks as he believed he was smarter than his coaches or disagreed with the coaching style. he was being paid to be a leader and not a whining sniper. Bennett was starting to do the same, and both were elite players looked up to by younger team members. If the rules didn't apply to them why should they apply to anyonefor both they were not 'all in' so they were were moved out before they completely poisoned the program.

Pete certainly screwed up by not recognizing that Cable was a fable and was repeatedly failing to meet all stated objectives. He absolutely sabotaged his team by not canning Bevell after Bevell threw Lockette under the bus. Bevell as well was demonstrating he was more important than his team and should have been canned.

I guess that's why Bennett was jumping offsides consistently....he was trying to do point #3 - show up early.

pittpnthrs · Apr 19, 2018

Ace_Rimmer":tyfzf35p said:
The only difference now is that we have a franchise QB in his prime to go along with this rebuild.

Pete not having first hand experience with the college players coming up and the absence of Scot McCloughan is also a difference. I think its a huge difference too.

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