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What are the chances Poona Ford makes it?

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  • Long time no post guys! But I with the last few years of the same thing and not holding coaches accountable and saying O-line is getting better . I kinda just gave up on hoping things will get better under Bevell the mongoloid and thee atrocious line coaching by Cable.

    But with the silent and solid moves this off-season, I feel a renewed hope for the upcoming season!!

    Back to the question at hand, what do you guys think will be the odds a guy like Poona Ford makes our squad? This guy's senior bowl workouts,drills , and game tape are ridiculous! Just low balled because he was 5:11ft , for god sakes man ! If he has proven himself, why not give him a shot? I really think this is one of our key additions this offseason. F.Y.I the great John Randle H.O.F , my favorite 3tech DT was only 6ft. So it can be done at that size.

    But I feel like this D-Line is heavy stacked! DE : Frank Clark, Smith, Dion Jordan, Raheem Green.
    DT: Reed, Shamar Stephen,Quinton Jefferson,Tom Johnson and Poona Ford.

    IF this Undrafted Poona can show nothing but great things in O.T.A's ,and Preseason I sure hope that the mantra of always compete earns him a spot in the 53
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  • I think his chances are fairly decent simply because I don't think that there is really another 1T on the roster outside of Reed.
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  • I have no idea of his chances, but I hope the best for him. He seems to have a great attitude. Here is a recent write up on him. :2thumbs:

    https://247sports.com/college/texas/Article/Texas-Longhorns-Football-Poona-Ford-signs-with-Seattle-Seahawks-as-free-agent-2018-NFL-Draft-117789921
    “Seattle was a team that flew me out for a visit and showed real interest in me, so that really meant something," Ford said. "It’s a beautiful place and a beautiful city that I fell in love with, and I think it will be a good situation for me."

    The Big 12 Defensive Lineman of the Year made the most his draft process, performing well enough at the East-West Shrine Game to get an invite to the Senior Bowl, where Ford flashed some pass rush ability from the interior in practices leading up to the game. However, a body of work that included being named the Big 12 Defensive Lineman of the Year in 2017 wasn’t enough to get Ford invited to the NFL Scouting Combine.

    The lack of an invite could have impacted Ford’s draft status and while it’s not a consolation prize in that regard, NFL Network draft analyst Mike Mayock told Horns247 at Texas Pro Day in March that Ford should have been competing in Indianapolis.

    “Productive, tough,” Mayock said of what he liked about Ford. “I think what’s happening is that so many juniors are coming out each year that they’re holding spots for juniors and kicking some of the seniors out, but there’s no doubt he should have been invited to the combine.
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  • Cant wait to see what he does in preseason! , hope he makes the most of game snaps. Really wow the coaching staff.
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  • 95%

    I think he gets in our DT rotation this season for sure.
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  • Ford is my UDFA adopt a rookie this year. He is going to make this team. Book it. :irishdrinkers:
    Last edited by kf3339 on Fri Jun 01, 2018 4:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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  • If he has the basic strength and technique needed, being an inch or two short shouldn't be a problem. In fact, it could help him in one way at least. It would be easier to get under his opponents pads and generate leverage to move the guy.

    There are some advantages to being small that can be exploited by someone with talent and training. I'm sure that any martial artist on the board could point that out. It's not all about being bigger.

    Chartric Darby played for us at 6'0" for several years. Not a superstar, but a good solid DT.
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  • The team was highly interested in him and had him here for pre-draft visit.

    He's a Pete type DT and strong against the run with some ability to push the pocket inside. Very hard to move out of the way when he sets his anchor. He's got an 80" wingspan and 33+" arms. His only knock is his height but his squatty shape allows him to be superior as far as playing with leverage.

    I suspect he's got a good chance to make the 53 and even to get some meaningful time if his play is anything like it was in college. I like his positive attitude as well.

    I think he was a pure steal as a UDFA and should have been drafted. Happy he's here.
    Until we develop a pass rush that will cause opposing teams to be forced to scheme to defend it we will never be able to consistently take the final step. The interior rush needs improvement. The OLine clearly still needs work.

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  • He is mini-Mebane. 53 on lock.
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  • Poona-Tang!! ... sorry, I couldn't resist it -- if he turns out half as good as John Randle, he's a keeper.
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  • sutz wrote:If he has the basic strength and technique needed, being an inch or two short shouldn't be a problem. In fact, it could help him in one way at least. It would be easier to get under his opponents pads and generate leverage to move the guy.

    There are some advantages to being small that can be exploited by someone with talent and training. I'm sure that any martial artist on the board could point that out. It's not all about being bigger.

    Chartric Darby played for us at 6'0" for several years. Not a superstar, but a good solid DT.

    THIS ^^^^^^^^
    I like the hell out of Ford, and I too believe that his lower center of gravity is going to be huge for our Defense...If he can master hand fighting anywhere close to Michael Bennett's, he's going to wreak havoc for the Seahawks Defensive front.
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  • Too short

    What's his SPARQ?
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  • My gut feeling that s if he is healthy he makes it.
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  • In my opinion he makes the team easily. He is young cheap and he has an upside. Youth always wins out. He will play his way on to the team.
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  • OK so I guess I should be more analytical. Ford is less than a 1.5 inches shorter than Bane so roughly an inch. Their wingspan, with roughly 33 inch arms each and a broad back, is over 80 inches for each player while also having a wide base a good anchor/lower body development. Ford's pro day is probably even a little bit better than Bane's in every category, however,with the exception of the 10 yard split. Bane's was better, which is illustrated by Mebane being quite the interior pass rusher for his first 3-4 years or so before he widened out even more.

    The point is, it's not just that he's a shorter DT with natural leverage that likens him to Mebane. The wingspan and surprising athleticism is going to be really familiar to Pete and it's something he can absolutely use. I think Naz is a heck of a 3T, but he's not a 1T even though he was used as such when Reed was out. And I really don't think there is another DT on the roster who is stout enough to take on combos and doubles as a natural 1T. Reed can, Naz is a 3T, and I think Ford is going to be so familiar in this defense and will show up as the gamer that he is, that he'll earn a spot. It's really pretty likely, IMO. The rest is kind of wide open, IMO. Given that we have two 5Ts on the roster in Jordan and Green, Q-Jeff is going to have to show out at 3T and really make a case over Johnson to stick. I'm not expecting anything from Stephen even though he's got a record of being a role player and I'm expecting even less of Wilson. I keep looking at Jackson and wondering what he's up to being at 295 pounds right now though.

    I like this group and I think it's going to be competitive, but Ford has some traits that are real assets for us and is familiar. I just don't see him getting cut. That said, I don't know that Reed is only, merely a pure 1T on 1st and 2nd down either. He can play 3 really well himself so there's still some fluid functionality there with how the roster shakes up. Crossed my mind that we might keep 5 DTs, but I don't know about that.
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  • I always like to see the underdog (no pun intended) succeed. Guys that don't fit the ideal picture but make it through hard work, tough mentality and transforming their disadvantages into advantages. Poona Ford looks like one of those so I hope he makes the 53.
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  • Zeearend wrote:I always like to see the underdog (no pun intended) succeed. Guys that don't fit the ideal picture but make it through hard work, tough mentality and transforming their disadvantages into advantages. Poona Ford looks like one of those so I hope he makes the 53.


    If you're over 300 pounds, you run a sub 5 40, and have a wingspan of over 80 inches, then you're good. If you're about 6'0 or 5"11 and 5/8ths, then you just have natural leverage, which isn't a disadvantage. Being that height doesn't necessarily mean that a player has a good center of gravity, but the longer the athlete, the more rare the equilibrium to control it. If a NT or 1T is 6'4 or over, it is a rarity where the player still maintains a good center. The position requires both raw power and the correct geometry to hold sometimes twice their weight with proper lean at the proper time dynamically.

    EDIT: You could almost call it the Atlas of 1st and 2nd down. For more reasons than one.
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  • vin.couve12 wrote:
    Zeearend wrote:I always like to see the underdog (no pun intended) succeed. Guys that don't fit the ideal picture but make it through hard work, tough mentality and transforming their disadvantages into advantages. Poona Ford looks like one of those so I hope he makes the 53.


    If you're over 300 pounds, you run a sub 5 40, and have a wingspan of over 80 inches, then you're good. If you're about 6'0 or 5"11 and 5/8ths, then you just have natural leverage, which isn't a disadvantage. Being that height doesn't necessarily mean that a player has a good center of gravity, but the longer the athlete, the more rare the equilibrium to control it. If a NT or 1T is 6'4 or over, it is a rarity where the player still maintains a good center. The position requires both raw power and the correct geometry to hold sometimes twice their weight with proper lean at the proper time dynamically.

    EDIT: You could almost call it the Atlas of 1st and 2nd down. For more reasons than one.


    Thank you for the insight. Still learning the details of Football as I am from across the pond. From several articles I concluded that his measurements were different from a typical 1T, but as you write this isn't as much so. But then I wonder why did he go undrafted? What's your opinion on this?
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  • Well if nothing else Wilson and Ford will be able to start marketing step stools for the Urinals in the locker rooms for too short players.
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  • Zeearend wrote:
    vin.couve12 wrote:
    Zeearend wrote:I always like to see the underdog (no pun intended) succeed. Guys that don't fit the ideal picture but make it through hard work, tough mentality and transforming their disadvantages into advantages. Poona Ford looks like one of those so I hope he makes the 53.


    If you're over 300 pounds, you run a sub 5 40, and have a wingspan of over 80 inches, then you're good. If you're about 6'0 or 5"11 and 5/8ths, then you just have natural leverage, which isn't a disadvantage. Being that height doesn't necessarily mean that a player has a good center of gravity, but the longer the athlete, the more rare the equilibrium to control it. If a NT or 1T is 6'4 or over, it is a rarity where the player still maintains a good center. The position requires both raw power and the correct geometry to hold sometimes twice their weight with proper lean at the proper time dynamically.

    EDIT: You could almost call it the Atlas of 1st and 2nd down. For more reasons than one.


    Thank you for the insight. Still learning the details of Football as I am from across the pond. From several articles I concluded that his measurements were different from a typical 1T, but as you write this isn't as much so. But then I wonder why did he go undrafted? What's your opinion on this?


    Hi Zeearend

    Good to see some of our European neighbors taking an interest in our uniquely American sport.

    You posed your question to vin.couve12 but this is my take on why he and others like him go undrafted. It's about fear of getting fired.

    First of all the NFL has massive turnover every year. A scout or a low or mid level coach can lose his job any given year for nearly any reason including simple unrelated frustration from ownership, upper management or the head coach. Even upper management and head coaches have a short lifespan at most places. Fear of being fired is a constant. The pressure to win that breeds that stress and turnover means everyone has to be accountable for every decision. That leads to a huge tendency for all involved to make safe "defend-able" decisions.

    Secondly Draft picks are EXTREMELY valuable. It's how you inject talent into your team. It's also the only time that talent is added relatively cheaply. Rookies don't make the big money of free agents. A team that doesn't consistently draft well is going to be a perennial loser. Short of play calls at the end of Super Bowls few things in the NFL are more scrutinized than the draft picks. There are entire careers made in the media analyzing and critiquing teams draft picks. Teams are assigned an A-F grade for their draft each year and it's broadcast and debated nation wide on TV and around the world on the internet. Anyone doing things outside the norm is descended upon.

    Every single position in the NFL has the "Prototype", the perfect physical specimen to play that position. The prototype has it's perfect target points and it also has it's upper an lower limits.Things like minimum height for some positions like QB's and Linemen and maximum and minimum weights for receivers and RB's It's very scary for anybody who can be called in to account, to actually decide to vary from the prototype. If say 30% of draft picks are busts it's easy to defend picking the prototype guys who failed. "Who could of known? He was the perfect prototype for the position." But if your, 1 inch under the prototype minimum guy, flames out then "Why the hell did you draft this guy?" questions get thrown around and are harder to answer. If your down to looking at 2 guys for a position and the physical performances are similar, bench press, 40 times, vertical and long jumps, 3 cone drill, etc, then the guy who physically is closer to the prototype in size is going to get the nod every time. Taking the safe route by coaches and scouts means that sometimes he gets the nod even when his performance might be a little lower.

    While guys like vin.couve12 can say 1 inch in height doesn't matter as long as the guy has the weight and speed and arm span (and he's likely right) he and the rest of us on the internet will not be fired if said short guy fails and is considered a wasted draft pick by the national press. You and I and vin.couve12 don't think an inch in height is that big a deal but some in the business and in the press treat such things as cast in stone laws of nature. Sometimes former NFL players are the most dogmatic about it. I personally think it's how they rationalize why they got selected for an NFL career while the shorter guy that played just as well did not.

    Pete Carrol and John Schneider are one of the few HC, GM combos willing to take some big risks when it comes to stepping away from the prototype template. As a newcomer and an outsider I'm not sure how aware you are of the circumstances surrounding Russell Wilson when he was drafted. At this point given his fantastic level of success, two Super Bowl appearances and Seattle's first Lombardi trophy, it might seem a little silly to be told that the minimum standard for a QB has forever been six feet. At 5' 10" Russell was considered to short to EVER play in the NFL. Based on his college stats and performances had he been 6' or taller he would have been considered a shoe in first round selection. But he is not 6' and when Seattle drafted him in the 3rd round one of the nations leading draft experts went into a full blown temper tantrum on live TV criticizing Seattle as idiotic and called it a wasted pick. One of the local Seattle sports radio personalities, a 6' 5" former NFL QB himself, said that Wilson's height was an insurmountable limitation and that if Wilson ever became even an average NFL quarterback he'd eat his microphone. (Did he ever do that BTW?) Had Russell Wilson not become successful, Pete and John would have been forever branded idiots for taking that one risk and many in the media would have been calling for their jobs at every rough patch.
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  • That ^, and the fact that no coach in the history of the league, I believe, ever started training camp with a 3-way competition for the starting QB position.

    What Pete Carroll did was unheard of, particularly with deciding that a 5' 10 5/8" tall rookie QB would start day one.
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  • onanygivensunday wrote:That ^, and the fact that no coach in the history of the league, I believe, ever started training camp with a 3-way competition for the starting QB position.

    What Pete Carroll did was unheard of, particularly with deciding that a 5' 10 5/8" tall rookie QB would start day one.


    Damn straight. Ballsiest GM HC combo I've ever seen.

    He didn't just start camp with a 3-way competition for the starting QB position. At the end of the competition JS sent Tarvaris Jackson packing to Buffalo. We traded away the only guy who'd ever been an opening day starter! We started the season with 2 Quarterbacks who had a combined total of 2 NFL starts between them. The roster had essentially no starting experience at the most important position on the field. That was pulling the cruise ship out of the harbor with no lifeboats on board.

    Absolute balls of steel!
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  • Thank you TasteTheBeastmode for sharing your view. Interesting to read that PC and JS are apparently more willing to take a player that doesn't fitt the ideal picture. Sounds to me that there looking to gain an advantage by doing things differently. Sometimes with great succes and some other conversion projects with less.Just increasing their odds by seeing as much players as they can. Sound like a good plan and to execute that you apparently only need balls :D
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  • Zeearend wrote:Thank you TasteTheBeastmode for sharing your view. Interesting to read that PC and JS are apparently more willing to take a player that doesn't fitt the ideal picture. Sounds to me that there looking to gain an advantage by doing things differently. Sometimes with great succes and some other conversion projects with less.Just increasing their odds by seeing as much players as they can. Sound like a good plan and to execute that you apparently only need balls :D


    And players that have a chip and won't listen to you can't do it.
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  • chris98251 wrote:
    Zeearend wrote:Thank you TasteTheBeastmode for sharing your view. Interesting to read that PC and JS are apparently more willing to take a player that doesn't fitt the ideal picture. Sounds to me that there looking to gain an advantage by doing things differently. Sometimes with great succes and some other conversion projects with less.Just increasing their odds by seeing as much players as they can. Sound like a good plan and to execute that you apparently only need balls :D


    And players that have a chip and won't listen to you can't do it.


    That too indeed. Poona Ford might fit that bill then because of his height and we already have some others in-house with chips on their shoulder therefore I am optimistic about the new season. Can't wait! Go Hawks!
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  • Zeearend wrote:Thank you TasteTheBeastmode for sharing your view. Interesting to read that PC and JS are apparently more willing to take a player that doesn't fitt the ideal picture. Sounds to me that there looking to gain an advantage by doing things differently. Sometimes with great succes and some other conversion projects with less.Just increasing their odds by seeing as much players as they can. Sound like a good plan and to execute that you apparently only need balls :D



    You are more than welcome.

    Just to further emphasize the pressure that exists for General Managers and Head Coaches to make the safe, defend-able picks in the draft, check out this article from a nationally read website condemning the Seahawks for the that 2012 draft and their selection of Wilson.

    http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1165 ... -draft-day

    The writer calls the selection of Wilson the worst pick of the draft! He grades the Seahawks draft an F based not just on Wilson but also on Bruce Irvin, another guy who didn't fit the prototype for an NFL position. Irvin was considered a "tweener", a guy who physically falls between the ideal size (prototype) for a Defensive End and the ideal size (prototype) for an Outside LineBacker. Tweeners are considered not big enough to anchor the edge or to push a tackle for sacks (DE) and to big/not fast enough to cover backs out of the backfield (OLB). A poor trade off.

    The writer specifically ridicules Pete Carroll in his F grade of the Seahawks. When coaches are getting national press like this and don't make the playoffs they can count on being run out of town in short order. Bad press tends to undermine fan support and good press of course lends itself to more fan support. While wins and losses are ultimately what should be the factors in a coaches career, for right or wrong, human nature is to want public/fan support in the hopes that it will buy some leeway if the wins don't come. And, right or wrong, ownership can bow to negative press and fan pressure and cut loose a coach who might well deserve another year. Fans have to be kept happy to buy tickets.

    The pressure is HUGE to make the safe picks and avoid the bad press.

    Of course history is the ultimate judge and vindicator. Pete Carroll and John were obviously right with both of those two, seeing things that didn't appear obvious to the press and others. Wilson had the "It factor" between the ears that only a handful of humans on the planet have when it comes to playing QB regardless of size. He also has Huge hands, 10.5" handspan, completely disproportional to his frame. That eliminates one of the truly legitimate problems with small QB's, they tend to have small hands and drop the ball more. He also has a very vertical throwing motion so his release point is higher than it would be if he used more traditional 3/4 angle . This means his throws come out of his hand the same distance off the ground as a typical QB several inches taller than him. Important when another criticism of short QB's is that with the ball coming from a lower spot they have a higher percentage of passes knocked down by linemen. Then there's his speed. Truly unique for his position. It warps the field and changes the way the opponent has to defend. It opens up options for the offense not normally seen in the NFL.

    You are correct that Pete and John are taking chances looking for an advantage. But they don't just throw spaghetti at the wall to see what sticks with every out of the prototype guy. They do their homework on those guys looking for reasons the typical rules of thumb shouldn't apply. Like those things I listed about Wilson above. Also they look for something truly special or unique, a talent that guy has that no one else has. With Wilson the speed and it factor made it worth taking the risk of seeing if his hands and throwing motion could negate the traditional criticisms of guys under 6'. With Irvin it was his speed as well. He has elite speed and quickness almost superhuman in a guy his size. The prototypes exist for a reason. No one his weight had been successful at DE. They get pushed around and can't shove a tackle back into the QB. But with his speed Irvin was able to launch off the ball and beat the tackle around the corner. He racked up 8 sacks his rookie year.

    That leads to the second thing that John and Pete do. When they find that unique talent they find a way to maximize it while limiting the shortcomings of not fitting the prototype. With Wilson they added the read option to make use of his speed. They also run a lot of their plays out of shotgun giving Wilson a good view of the field. Under center the QB has to stoop or squat to take the snap. (Maybe an unpopular thought here but I think Wilson would have less success in a pure traditional West Coast offense where there's no shotgun, every play is under center and slants and short crossing routes are emphasized. Not suck or fail, just a little less success as that's not his best strength) With Irvin they used him as an edge rusher and didn't try to use him to set the edge against the run. They put him in a position to best succeed. They are willing to be creative and think outside the box with guys.

    One last note, the press has no shame. They will shred a coach for not making the safe choices and then simply pretend it didn't happen when they were dead wrong. Check out this article from the same website that called the 2012 draft a failure, mocked Pete and called Wilson and Irvin the 2 worst moves of the draft. In this 2016 article about Irvin's big free agent contract with the Raiders, (The single best indicator of how a pick performed BTW) they refer to the Seahawk's 2012 draft as "epic" and credit it for Seattle's rise and Super Bowl win, without a single mention of how they trashed it at the time.

    It takes a lot of guts to stand up to that.

    https://bleacherreport.com/articles/260 ... d-reaction
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  • TasteTheBeastmode wrote:
    Zeearend wrote:Thank you TasteTheBeastmode for sharing your view. Interesting to read that PC and JS are apparently more willing to take a player that doesn't fitt the ideal picture. Sounds to me that there looking to gain an advantage by doing things differently. Sometimes with great succes and some other conversion projects with less.Just increasing their odds by seeing as much players as they can. Sound like a good plan and to execute that you apparently only need balls :D



    You are more than welcome.

    Just to further emphasize the pressure that exists for General Managers and Head Coaches to make the safe, defend-able picks in the draft, check out this article from a nationally read website condemning the Seahawks for the that 2012 draft and their selection of Wilson.

    http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1165 ... -draft-day

    The writer calls the selection of Wilson the worst pick of the draft! He grades the Seahawks draft an F based not just on Wilson but also on Bruce Irvin, another guy who didn't fit the prototype for an NFL position. Irvin was considered a "tweener", a guy who physically falls between the ideal size (prototype) for a Defensive End and the ideal size (prototype) for an Outside LineBacker. Tweeners are considered not big enough to anchor the edge or to push a tackle for sacks (DE) and to big/not fast enough to cover backs out of the backfield (OLB). A poor trade off.

    The writer specifically ridicules Pete Carroll in his F grade of the Seahawks. When coaches are getting national press like this and don't make the playoffs they can count on being run out of town in short order. Bad press tends to undermine fan support and good press of course lends itself to more fan support. While wins and losses are ultimately what should be the factors in a coaches career, for right or wrong, human nature is to want public/fan support in the hopes that it will buy some leeway if the wins don't come. And, right or wrong, ownership can bow to negative press and fan pressure and cut loose a coach who might well deserve another year. Fans have to be kept happy to buy tickets.

    The pressure is HUGE to make the safe picks and avoid the bad press.

    Of course history is the ultimate judge and vindicator. Pete Carroll and John were obviously right with both of those two, seeing things that didn't appear obvious to the press and others. Wilson had the "It factor" between the ears that only a handful of humans on the planet have when it comes to playing QB regardless of size. He also has Huge hands, 10.5" handspan, completely disproportional to his frame. That eliminates one of the truly legitimate problems with small QB's, they tend to have small hands and drop the ball more. He also has a very vertical throwing motion so his release point is higher than it would be if he used more traditional 3/4 angle . This means his throws come out of his hand the same distance off the ground as a typical QB several inches taller than him. Important when another criticism of short QB's is that with the ball coming from a lower spot they have a higher percentage of passes knocked down by linemen. Then there's his speed. Truly unique for his position. It warps the field and changes the way the opponent has to defend. It opens up options for the offense not normally seen in the NFL.

    You are correct that Pete and John are taking chances looking for an advantage. But they don't just throw spaghetti at the wall to see what sticks with every out of the prototype guy. They do their homework on those guys looking for reasons the typical rules of thumb shouldn't apply. Like those things I listed about Wilson above. Also they look for something truly special or unique, a talent that guy has that no one else has. With Wilson the speed and it factor made it worth taking the risk of seeing if his hands and throwing motion could negate the traditional criticisms of guys under 6'. With Irvin it was his speed as well. He has elite speed and quickness almost superhuman in a guy his size. The prototypes exist for a reason. No one his weight had been successful at DE. They get pushed around and can't shove a tackle back into the QB. But with his speed Irvin was able to launch off the ball and beat the tackle around the corner. He racked up 8 sacks his rookie year.

    That leads to the second thing that John and Pete do. When they find that unique talent they find a way to maximize it while limiting the shortcomings of not fitting the prototype. With Wilson they added the read option to make use of his speed. They also run a lot of their plays out of shotgun giving Wilson a good view of the field. Under center the QB has to stoop or squat to take the snap. (Maybe an unpopular thought here but I think Wilson would have less success in a pure traditional West Coast offense where there's no shotgun, every play is under center and slants and short crossing routes are emphasized. Not suck or fail, just a little less success as that's not his best strength) With Irvin they used him as an edge rusher and didn't try to use him to set the edge against the run. They put him in a position to best succeed. They are willing to be creative and think outside the box with guys.

    One last note, the press has no shame. They will shred a coach for not making the safe choices and then simply pretend it didn't happen when they were dead wrong. Check out this article from the same website that called the 2012 draft a failure, mocked Pete and called Wilson and Irvin the 2 worst moves of the draft. In this 2016 article about Irvin's big free agent contract with the Raiders, (The single best indicator of how a pick performed BTW) they refer to the Seahawk's 2012 draft as "epic" and credit it for Seattle's rise and Super Bowl win, without a single mention of how they trashed it at the time.

    It takes a lot of guts to stand up to that.

    https://bleacherreport.com/articles/260 ... d-reaction


    Very reason I am a Pete/John homer, dudes have ground touching big balls. Got to remember these two didn’t really enjoy job security back in 2012.


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    Seems to me Poona Ford needs a blocking dummy built lower to the ground.
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  • Yep, as such it’s hard to imagine an OLineman being able to get lower man leverage on Poona.
    Until we develop a pass rush that will cause opposing teams to be forced to scheme to defend it we will never be able to consistently take the final step. The interior rush needs improvement. The OLine clearly still needs work.

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  • It's not just selecting out-of-prototype guys. They pick the guys who don't fit the mould and yet have production at or higher than the prototypes.

    Wilson was too short, but his college numbers were phenomenal. Poona Ford was also very successful in college. And you don't get more out-of-the-mould than a one-handed linebacker, yet Shaquem Griffin was one of the best linebackers in the college game.

    So we're not the land of misfit players; we're the land of misfit players who have proven they can play, and who have the desire to overcome their physical flaws. It's not a coincidence they have chips on both shoulders - they have been using the nay-sayers as motivation to push themselves.

    They push themselves harder than physically gifted players because they are judged on their flaws every play. Wilson could throw 4 TDs and run for another, but if a pass gets batted down, it's due to his lack of stature. If Griffin misses a tackle, it's because he only has one hand. Those guys are going to work their asses off to make sure those things don't happen, because thy've had to do it all along just to be taken seriosuly next to the prototypes.
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  • KiwiHawk wrote:It's not just selecting out-of-prototype guys. They pick the guys who don't fit the mould and yet have production at or higher than the prototypes.

    Wilson was too short, but his college numbers were phenomenal. Poona Ford was also very successful in college. And you don't get more out-of-the-mould than a one-handed linebacker, yet Shaquem Griffin was one of the best linebackers in the college game.

    So we're not the land of misfit players; we're the land of misfit players who have proven they can play, and who have the desire to overcome their physical flaws. It's not a coincidence they have chips on both shoulders - they have been using the nay-sayers as motivation to push themselves.

    They push themselves harder than physically gifted players because they are judged on their flaws every play. Wilson could throw 4 TDs and run for another, but if a pass gets batted down, it's due to his lack of stature. If Griffin misses a tackle, it's because he only has one hand. Those guys are going to work their asses off to make sure those things don't happen, because thy've had to do it all along just to be taken seriosuly next to the prototypes.



    Are you talking the 2018 Seahawks or the 1970's Raiders :P
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  • KiwiHawk wrote:It's not just selecting out-of-prototype guys. They pick the guys who don't fit the mould and yet have production at or higher than the prototypes.

    Wilson was too short, but his college numbers were phenomenal. Poona Ford was also very successful in college. And you don't get more out-of-the-mould than a one-handed linebacker, yet Shaquem Griffin was one of the best linebackers in the college game.

    So we're not the land of misfit players; we're the land of misfit players who have proven they can play, and who have the desire to overcome their physical flaws. It's not a coincidence they have chips on both shoulders - they have been using the nay-sayers as motivation to push themselves.

    They push themselves harder than physically gifted players because they are judged on their flaws every play. Wilson could throw 4 TDs and run for another, but if a pass gets batted down, it's due to his lack of stature. If Griffin misses a tackle, it's because he only has one hand. Those guys are going to work their asses off to make sure those things don't happen, because thy've had to do it all along just to be taken seriosuly next to the prototypes.


    This!!

    It’s partially based on the confidence of Pete, being confident, he is more willing to take chances. Also the trust of Paul have in Pete, which boosts that confidence.


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    Last edited by toffee on Thu Jun 14, 2018 7:45 am, edited 1 time in total.
    toffee
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  • chris98251 wrote:Are you talking the 2018 Seahawks or the 1970's Raiders :P

    Not sure I follow.

    Stabler, Casper, Matuzak, Belitnikoff, Branch et al. may have had bad boy personas, but were not outside the mould of their prototypes.

    As an aside, I used to work at Emilio's Delicatessen in Danville, CA in the mid-80's, which is near to John Madden's home in the Blackhawk country club. Had Raiders and former Raiders through all the time including Madden.
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  • ImTheScientist wrote:95%

    I think he gets in our DT rotation this season for sure.


    So he's definitely getting in the DT rotation but only a 95% chance to make the team?
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