Total Access: Have The Seahawks Lost Their Way?

They haven't so much lost their way as lost their advantage.

When we were dominating, we had much better players. The defense was literally historic. We probably have at least 2 HOF on that defense, and 2 borderline HOFs. We also had a scheme that perfectly fit their strengths and weaknesses. I remain convinced that had we kept Browner - we win that SB. So one of the best rosters on D, almost ever and a borderline HOF quality RB.

This was a physical smashmouth team that could wear down teams because the players were tougher, more violent and stronger/faster than the guys on the other side.

We lost guys. We cut guys. We failed to re-sign key pieces and we traded for pieces of garbage or Charmin soft players.

We moved from physical to finesse. We tossed Always Compete into the dumpster, but in reality it was only there for defensive players and special teams anyway.

But ultimately, what we really did was lose the advantage that better players than the other team gave us.

It isn't like we had great tactical or strategic coaching. We had coaches that developed players well and let them play to their strengths. But the actual use of our guys was pretty brute force. We never had the coaches to be able to scheme our way to a win. So when we lost the player advantage we lost games.

We are now middle of road in roster strength, maybe worse overall but the QB is very good and that carries a lot of weight. Not enough to carry a team to or through the playoffs though. So the key difference is the roster is weaker, not as deep, and filled with holes now. Teams that have those issues lose more games.

Note: I will concede that Brim's point on losing play action killed us though. I swear I thought I saw play action fakes last year when we had literally no run game. I don't think it fooled anyone, just wasted a down - sometimes a possession.

Sure we had some great players but the whole was greater than the pieces. Bennett looked like a future HOF until we had to let the depth around him go in order to pay his salary. Don’t get me wrong, he was still pretty good for us but not nearly the same level when forced to become an every down player.

TwistedHusky":2pgcd6xj said:

Note: I will concede that Brim's point on losing play action killed us though. I swear I thought I saw play action fakes last year when we had literally no run game. I don't think it fooled anyone, just wasted a down - sometimes a possession.

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We did fine with play action. Look at the Texans game, we had five net rushing yards and were murdering them with play action all game.

Stars got old. Stupid to say they lost their way. They didn't replace them well, especially Lynch and the OL.

But this is a fact. Their worst season since RW is 9-7. Teams who make top 10 picks frequently have to pay for it with horrible seasons. Perhaps PC/JS biggest "failure" was being too loyal to people like Sherm. The Pats have no problem trading away stars.

The draft is a crap shoot. It takes some real luck to be consistently successful picking stars. Another luck factor is injuries.

I don't believe their "way" is so lost that the Hawks can't learn and recover from it.

MontanaHawk05":3mtdzu4o said:

Seattle had to lose Kam Chancellor, Richard Sherman, Cliff Avril, and the starting running back on the roster to injury; have the worst OL in the league for a year; ; get a down year from Jon Ryan and Justin Britt; and sign an awful kicker...to fall to 9-7. All that's needed is to return some of these factors to marginal - maybe even just one, given we lost multiple games by one field goal's worth - and we're back in the playoffs.

So I'm really not seeing the team having lost their way. I'm seeing a down year via something of a perfect storm. I'm also seeing an awful lot of "what have you done for me lately" handwringing - not from you, Attyla, necessarily, but from a lot of fans and from the media. The media I expect it from.

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They gutted the team for a reason. I'm not trying to argue with you Montana, but your making it out to sound like whatever could have gone wrong last season did and we would have been fine just leaving well enough alone, when in truth the team has been in a downward spiral since 'The Play'. Sure they made the playoffs, but they havent been serious contenders since 2014. This reboot needed to happen, but its still to be seen if its even going to work.

pittpnthrs":rdlzz1aj said:

MontanaHawk05":rdlzz1aj said:

Seattle had to lose Kam Chancellor, Richard Sherman, Cliff Avril, and the starting running back on the roster to injury; have the worst OL in the league for a year; ; get a down year from Jon Ryan and Justin Britt; and sign an awful kicker...to fall to 9-7. All that's needed is to return some of these factors to marginal - maybe even just one, given we lost multiple games by one field goal's worth - and we're back in the playoffs.

So I'm really not seeing the team having lost their way. I'm seeing a down year via something of a perfect storm. I'm also seeing an awful lot of "what have you done for me lately" handwringing - not from you, Attyla, necessarily, but from a lot of fans and from the media. The media I expect it from.

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They gutted the team for a reason. I'm not trying to argue with you Montana, but your making it out to sound like whatever could have gone wrong last season did and we would have been fine just leaving well enough alone, when in truth the team has been in a downward spiral since 'The Play'. Sure they made the playoffs, but they havent been serious contenders since 2014. This reboot needed to happen, but its still to be seen if its even going to work.

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Like I said in another thread, you want to be pessimistic and are finding reasons to do so. You go ahead and continue with that. But I personally am not interested in debates with people who can't get over "The Play" any more than Richard Sherman could, and think continued playoff participation qualifies as a "downward spiral". I know half a football league who would love to spiral the way the Seahawks have.

MontanaHawk05":3p3rybvb said:

pittpnthrs":3p3rybvb said:

MontanaHawk05":3p3rybvb said:

Seattle had to lose Kam Chancellor, Richard Sherman, Cliff Avril, and the starting running back on the roster to injury; have the worst OL in the league for a year; ; get a down year from Jon Ryan and Justin Britt; and sign an awful kicker...to fall to 9-7. All that's needed is to return some of these factors to marginal - maybe even just one, given we lost multiple games by one field goal's worth - and we're back in the playoffs.

So I'm really not seeing the team having lost their way. I'm seeing a down year via something of a perfect storm. I'm also seeing an awful lot of "what have you done for me lately" handwringing - not from you, Attyla, necessarily, but from a lot of fans and from the media. The media I expect it from.

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They gutted the team for a reason. I'm not trying to argue with you Montana, but your making it out to sound like whatever could have gone wrong last season did and we would have been fine just leaving well enough alone, when in truth the team has been in a downward spiral since 'The Play'. Sure they made the playoffs, but they havent been serious contenders since 2014. This reboot needed to happen, but its still to be seen if its even going to work.

Click to expand...

Like I said in another thread, you want to be pessimistic and are finding reasons to do so. You go ahead and continue with that. But I personally am not interested in debates with people who can't get over "The Play" any more than Richard Sherman could, and think continued playoff participation qualifies as a "downward spiral". I know half a football league who would love to spiral the way the Seahawks have.

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That's why half the league isn't in the playoffs and ascending versus descending, recognition of issues and acting on them may give you a down year but puts you back on the path to ascension, Patriots and Steelers and Packers are three teams that keep themselves in the hunt by doing this.

Well all people have to do is look at the first couple years. PC came in and went from the dismal previous season to 7-9 with a bunch of pick ups. then with a couple of drafts got to 11-5. This team from last year is no way starting from the place that Jim Mora left the team at 5-11.

This change over is no difference than the first PC year but starting from a much stronger base. Notwithstanding that all the pundits see a 4 or 5 win season I believe you will see the team surprise a lot of people with a 9 to 11 win season. If PC can get 7 wins out of Travaris Jackson he can definitely get 10 wins out of the remains of this team and RW.

Pete doesn’t have TJ on this squad. If we fail to protect Russell and he goes down we will go O - fer the remainder of the season.

chris98251":9y80scks said:

This is a kick them when they are down thing using Sherms comments as a catalyst. Let them talk, let them eat some raw uncooked crow.

It simply falls in line with everyone elses bullshit. More to come so get ready as we get closer to training camp.

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Agreed.

Of course the LOB is gone. The NFL stands for "Not for Long."

And as always, especially with different players, one cannot really predict what this season will be like.

I've read everything from 4 wins to 10 wins this season. Speculation masturbation.

(I'm often a little bit of a pessimist in my sports teams, but I do feel good.

Most of us agree, that the Rams will win the division - if - things go according to plan.)

Down Under Hawk":2vcsgdot said:

This change over is no difference than the first PC year but starting from a much stronger base. Notwithstanding that all the pundits see a 4 or 5 win season I believe you will see the team surprise a lot of people with a 9 to 11 win season. If PC can get 7 wins out of Travaris Jackson he can definitely get 10 wins out of the remains of this team and RW.

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I've seen this sentiment a few times now, and I can't figure out how you're arriving at this conclusion.

Yes having Russell in his prime is THE biggest ray of light on this new re-build. But do you honestly think this group of new players is starting from a stronger base than the likes of Marshawn, Earl, Kam, Bobby, Doug, Okung, Unger, Bennett, Avril, Clemons, Miller, Big Red, Browner and Sherman?

There are HOF'ers in this base, ain't no way in hell you can think our past 2-3 drafts and player acquisitions is a stronger group than 2010's team. This base is far weaker, and IMO will take another 2-3 years to get back to even a consistent playoff level of team, and that's IF Pete and John haven't lost their fastball on mining talent in the draft.

Which if you look at our past 2-3 drafts, their hit rate is terrible.