Baldwin beat Revis a lot more than we thought he did

Hasselbeck · Feb 20, 2015

Hawkblogger had a great write up on Baldwin's Super Bowl performance that you guys should check out (especially the ones that suddenly are saying Baldwin is crap because of a dumb touchdown celebration)

http://www.hawkblogger.com/2015/02/doug ... Blogger%29

This also leads to bigger questions involving the passing game. Did Bevell basically sacrifice Baldwin to Revis and presume that Revis would win that matchup more often than not? Or is Russ just flat missing reads and being gun shy on making some of these throws. Or both?

We definitely need to address the WR corps and add a couple more targets to it... but this is pretty eye opening.

DavidSeven · Feb 20, 2015

Maybe my eyes are deceiving me, but Baldwin doesn't look that open in those gifs. The first one, yes. Russell completely missed him. A lot of the other gifs show Baldwin running into congestion/zone or Revis easing off after Russell has already thrown or been sacked. Most of them are cut off before any material separation is shown.

I dunno, I'm sure if we gif'ed all 40+ of Sherman's coverage snaps, we'd see WRs getting free on a decent number of them, too. Doesn't mean it's a good idea to consistently look his way as first or even second read.

hawkblogger is close to Baldwin in the way that can make this analysis biased.

cacksman · Feb 20, 2015

DavidSeven":16jr1jkc said:
Maybe my eyes are deceiving me, but Baldwin doesn't look that open in those gifs. The first one, yes. Russell completely missed him. A lot of the other gifs show Baldwin running into congestion/zone or Revis easing off after Russell has already thrown or been sacked. Most of them are cut off before any material separation is shown.

I dunno, I'm sure if we gif'ed all 40+ of Sherman's coverage snaps, we'd see WRs getting free on a decent number of them, too. Doesn't mean it's a good idea to consistently look his way as first or even second read.

hawkblogger is close to Baldwin in the way that can make this analysis biased.

Schneider said on the radio that Baldwin was open all game, they just didn't get the ball to him.

This seems to back that analysis up.

HawkFan72 · Feb 20, 2015

I am at least optimistic now because I thought Baldwin was owned all game except for the one time he used a ref to get open for the TD. Good to see he was actually getting open. I think Baldwin underrated as a route runner, hopefully next year we can upgrade the WR group because if Baldwin is the #2 or #3 WR, he's going to get open a lot more.

DavidSeven · Feb 20, 2015

cacksman":3ri9efwk said:
DavidSeven":3ri9efwk said:

Maybe my eyes are deceiving me, but Baldwin doesn't look that open in those gifs. The first one, yes. Russell completely missed him. A lot of the other gifs show Baldwin running into congestion/zone or Revis easing off after Russell has already thrown or been sacked. Most of them are cut off before any material separation is shown.

I dunno, I'm sure if we gif'ed all 40+ of Sherman's coverage snaps, we'd see WRs getting free on a decent number of them, too. Doesn't mean it's a good idea to consistently look his way as first or even second read.

hawkblogger is close to Baldwin in the way that can make this analysis biased.

Click to expand...

Schneider said on the radio that Baldwin was open all game, they just didn't get the ball to him.

This seems to back that analysis up.

Did he say "all the time"? My recollection was that he said he was open a few times and that we missed him. I can believe that. But I dunno about him burning Revis consistently. Nevertheless, Russell misses open receivers all the time, especially on the short crossing routes that Baldwin got open on a couple times. Was he too conservative in regard to Revis? Yeah, maybe, but would he really be the first QB to be guilty of that? I don't think there's a big conspiracy here.

DJrmb · Feb 20, 2015

Baldwin was about as open as you can expect in this league on most of those plays. Only two of the gifs I saw were not good examples as he was either running into another zone or Wilson had already thrown the ball. Most of the one on ones Baldwin straight beat Revis.

Hope this helps open some people's eyes. I doubt it though. WR is something we need but our #1 need? I disagree. This WR group is not as "Pedestrian" as some of you 12's say it is.

Hasselbeck · Feb 20, 2015

DavidSeven":1xk3ukx3 said:
Maybe my eyes are deceiving me, but Baldwin doesn't look that open in those gifs. The first one, yes. Russell completely missed him. A lot of the other gifs show Baldwin running into congestion/zone or Revis easing off after Russell has already thrown or been sacked. Most of them are cut off before any material separation is shown.

I dunno, I'm sure if we gif'ed all 40+ of Sherman's coverage snaps, we'd see WRs getting free on a decent number of them, too. Doesn't mean it's a good idea to consistently look his way as first or even second read.

hawkblogger is close to Baldwin in the way that can make this analysis biased.

A couple of the plays.. he was open on throws that were bigger plays (namely the Matthews bomb)

But the 3rd and 7 where Russ was sacked by Ninkovich? Baldwin was wide open over the middle. He beat Revis. Russ just didn't make the throw. Now granted, if Carpenter just so much as breathes on the blitzing LB .. Russ has an extra split second to make the throw.. but he was open.

DavidSeven · Feb 20, 2015

Hasselbeck":3ivzggbg said:
But the 3rd and 7 where Russ was sacked by Ninkovich? Baldwin was wide open over the middle. He beat Revis. Russ just didn't make the throw. Now granted, if Carpenter just so much as breathes on the blitzing LB .. Russ has an extra split second to make the throw.. but he was open.

Yeah, but Russell misses those short middle reads all the time, even against lesser DBs.

pehawk · Feb 20, 2015

I actually agree with DavidSeven here. Blogger goes Single White Female at times with Baldwin. He probably has a black cabbage patch doll he's named ADB - which he heavily "pets" on those lonely nights.

Anthony! · Feb 20, 2015

So having seen them all there were a couple of times he was open were Wilson missed him, it happens. However in a lot of others he was either open after the ball was thrown, or he was the 3rd read and the ball was gone, or he was not open meaning yeah he had a little separation from Revis, but he also had a safety over the top and LB underneath, That is a very very risky pass. Those GIF show ADB was not as open as the writer suggests most of the time, however it does show a time or 2 he was, but either the ball had been thrown or Wilson just did not see it. Something all QBs do at least a few times a game.

Anonymous · Feb 20, 2015

:thcoffee:

hawknation2015 · Feb 20, 2015

At the time, I thought Russell looked overly tentative in targeting Revis, even when there were clear opportunities to do so.

John Schneider even mentioned this in a radio interview a couple weeks ago that there were opportunities to get Baldwin the ball in the Super Bowl that did not happen "for whatever reason."

purpleneer · Feb 20, 2015

Hasselbeck":2375pafv said:
But the 3rd and 7 where Russ was sacked by Ninkovich? Baldwin was wide open over the middle. He beat Revis. Russ just didn't make the throw. Now granted, if Carpenter just so much as breathes on the blitzing LB .. Russ has an extra split second to make the throw.. but he was open.

Can't really blame Carp on that one. He was busy cleaning up the man Okung let go, who would have had just as good of a shot. Really, the ball could have been out.

Hawks46 · Feb 20, 2015

Hasselbeck":1e8urlvy said:
DavidSeven":1e8urlvy said:

Maybe my eyes are deceiving me, but Baldwin doesn't look that open in those gifs. The first one, yes. Russell completely missed him. A lot of the other gifs show Baldwin running into congestion/zone or Revis easing off after Russell has already thrown or been sacked. Most of them are cut off before any material separation is shown.

I dunno, I'm sure if we gif'ed all 40+ of Sherman's coverage snaps, we'd see WRs getting free on a decent number of them, too. Doesn't mean it's a good idea to consistently look his way as first or even second read.

hawkblogger is close to Baldwin in the way that can make this analysis biased.

Click to expand...

A couple of the plays.. he was open on throws that were bigger plays (namely the Matthews bomb)

But the 3rd and 7 where Russ was sacked by Ninkovich? Baldwin was wide open over the middle. He beat Revis. Russ just didn't make the throw. Now granted, if Carpenter just so much as breathes on the blitzing LB .. Russ has an extra split second to make the throw.. but he was open.

Yea, well pressure screws QBs up and it's why teams do nothing but figure out how to pressure a QB. Any QB.

This is also a good example of why having a crap OL is stunting Wilson's growth. It's not just the pressure, but the fact that you expect the pressure, almost immediately, on most plays. So now your internal clock is ticking and saying "throw it in 2 seconds" instead of 4. You rush reads, you miss reads, and you look to bail the pocket more quickly.

I've seen a lot of gifs where Wilson is missing open WRs, but it's really hard to tell if he's got a DT in his face or not at that exact time.

ZagHawk · Feb 20, 2015

Anyone else wondering if RW really can't see?

I just remember the SoundFX after the INT and RW asking "What Happened" as if he didn't see it, I don't remember him taking a hit after the throw either.

ZorntoLargent · Feb 20, 2015

So if Russ is looking the OTHER direction for a split second, how is it that he "missed" a wide open Doug?

SoulfishHawk · Feb 20, 2015

Wilson could win 5 Super Bowl title's and people would still question how good he is :?

hawksurething · Feb 20, 2015

Hasselbeck":2ksjyg8r said:
Hawkblogger had a great write up on Baldwin's Super Bowl performance that you guys should check out (especially the ones that suddenly are saying Baldwin is crap because of a dumb touchdown celebration)

http://www.hawkblogger.com/2015/02/doug ... Blogger%29

This also leads to bigger questions involving the passing game. Did Bevell basically sacrifice Baldwin to Revis and presume that Revis would win that matchup more often than not? Or is Russ just flat missing reads and being gun shy on making some of these throws. Or both?

We definitely need to address the WR corps and add a couple more targets to it... but this is pretty eye opening.

I would be gun shy throwing to a 5'10 Baldwin vs revis who is known to bait and jump the route ! Now if my WR was 6'3 with long arms and can win jump balls like D.Thomas then I will test revis... Even then I'm still shy to throw his way.

Ranker777 · Feb 20, 2015

The two main thing I noticed (outside of the Kearse 3rd and 3 drop- Great route concept, especially Baldwin's) is Wilson isn't at Brady's level yet (many aren't). Brady finds the open guy almost instantly. And the routes in itself are garbage. Bunch of them run right into coverage.

Scottemojo · Feb 20, 2015

About 3 of those should have been throws to Baldwin.

It's a reach to call him wide open on a bunch of those.

Baldwin beat Revis a lot more than we thought he did

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