Top Coach/GM Duos

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3) Pete Carroll/John Schneider, Seattle Seahawks
I don't feel good about putting Seattle's duo at No. 3. To me, the top three are pretty interchangeable -- maybe I should call them 1A, 1B and 1C. Schneider pounded the table for the Seahawks to draft Russell Wilson. That's a résumé builder. Schneider's a brilliant talent evaluator and a tireless worker. Seattle has deftly crafted contracts for sustained success.

And Carroll, despite his ridiculous decision to not give Marshawn Lynch the ball at the end of the Super Bowl, is a great head coach who gets the most out of his players with the competition at every position mantra.

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1) Bruce Arians/Steve Keim, Arizona Cardinals
It is rather remarkable what these two have accomplished over their two years in the desert. Arians just won AP Coach of the Year by a landslide. Keim has been recognized as Executive of the Year across numerous outlets. Playing in the toughest division in the NFL, the Cardinals have gone 21-11.

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Zero Super Bowl Wins or Appearances
Zero Playoff Wins
Zero Division Titles
1-3 against Carroll/Schneider's Seahawks
Hmmm . . . :1:

Our guys shouldn't even be in the discussion. Neither of them have ever won a Coach or GM of the year award for crying out loud. They obviously suck.

hawknation2015":3o2eecym said:

1) Bruce Arians/Steve Keim, Arizona Cardinals
It is rather remarkable what these two have accomplished over their two years in the desert. Arians just won AP Coach of the Year by a landslide. Keim has been recognized as Executive of the Year across numerous outlets. Playing in the toughest division in the NFL, the Cardinals have gone 21-11.

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Zero Super Bowl Wins or Appearances
Zero Playoff Wins
Zero Division Titles
1-3 against Carroll/Schneider's Seahawks
Hmmm . . . :1:

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He did say 1-3 are basically interchangable. But you do have a point and I would be far more comfortable with Baltimore as number one, Seattle number two, and Arizona number three if that were the available choices if you insist Seattle isn't number one for some insane reason.

MysterMatt":24o36zt9 said:

Our guys shouldn't even be in the discussion. Neither of them have ever won a Coach or GM of the year award for crying out loud. They obviously suck.

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Absolutely. Someone should tell Pete and John to stop focusing more on winning games and start focusing on winning awards. I'm surprised they were even as high as #3 with their lack of accomplishments.

And we care about what this douche thinks because???? This guy is a moron who is hardly ever right in his evaluations or predictions.

JTB":rukq1n49 said:

And we care about what this douche thinks because???? This guy is a moron who is hardly ever right in his evaluations or predictions.

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I'm pretty sure it's possible to read an article without actually caring what the author thinks.

With that being said, I'm not sure how saying that Pete/John are in the group as the best combos in the business is something we want to disagree with, but if you choose to do so, feel free

kidhawk":16onnquy said:

I'm pretty sure it's possible to read an article without actually caring what the author thinks.

With that being said, I'm not sure how saying that Pete/John are in the group as the best combos in the business is something we want to disagree with, but if you choose to do so, feel free

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Well in an article that is an opinion piece, the author's credibility does matter. As for his take on this, pretty much everyone would put JS/PC at or near the top. I guess my issue is putting Keim/Arians at 1 with a far less impressive resume - no playoff wins. Beyond that, his overall list is pretty debatable and should have included Belichick in there anyway.

The big takeaway for me though is that we are pretty lucky as Seattle fans because the list beyond a handful is meh.

Pete and John get undervalued in these things because the team went 7-9 the first two years. The fact they inherited a far worse team doesn't seem to matter.

sc85sis":25eg7bgg said:

Pete and John get undervalued in these things because the team went 7-9 the first two years. The fact they inherited a far worse team doesn't seem to matter.

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They really are undervalued because of that.

I like to point out to people that when Pete and John were hired, they stated they had a 4 year plan. Then they won the Super Bowl in year 4.

They improved the team immediately, but it was a slow build to create a championship team. They had a plan and executed it to perfection. They didn't just inherit a team and make additions. They tore down what they inherited and started from scratch.

When you look at the whole picture, it's a shame they aren't recognized more for what they have done.

Carroll won a playoff game and division title in year one. And yes, it's still crazy to think how close Carroll came to becoming the only coach in history to win back to back championships in both college and the NFL. If he just dials up a running play on 2nd and 1 or if the play they did call succeeds, he is now looked at as one of the greatest coaches ever. Instead, we get to read articles about how Bill Belichick is on a totally other level or about how other coaches/GMs, who have never won anything, are somehow superior.

Fortunately, this is far from over. They have had the No. 1 scoring defense for three consecutive years. They have a core group of defensive talent (11 of 12 starters) that is locked in for the foreseeable future. They also have a solid group of young defenders, who they are still in the process of developing (Hill, Simon, KPL, Burley, etc.), as well as 10 or 11 draft picks to work with this year.

After studying Carroll's history at USC, the one and only concern for me is whether he is capable of hiring a consistent offensive play caller. Kiffin . . . Sarkisian . . . Bates . . . Bevell. None of these four have been consistent play callers, much less revolutionary offensive thinkers. All four lack a foundation of understanding in blocking schemes to fully implement of Carroll's vision of a balanced offensive attack.

We need a play caller with the killer instinct to get the job done in the red zone -- 51%, 20th in the league is not getting it done. That is someone with his own bold offensive philosophy, who doesn't need either Carroll calling the plays for him or Carroll taking responsibility for his failed play calls.

I use the word "need," knowing full well what Carroll has already accomplished without that kind of play caller . . . Carroll's post-2004 history at USC illustrates the need for the presence of a strong counterbalance on the offensive side to Carroll's own strong personality, with full or nearly full control of the offensive reins. Is that someone already on the staff, perhaps Tom Cable, or is it an outside hire? I don't know. I just see it as his most glaring weakness going forward.

I can't dispute him putting Bellichick in a class by himself. Look at all the coaches that had success, then wanted additional GM duties: guys like Holmgren, Shanahan, etc. It's usually too much and they generally don't do as well as they did coaching alone. Bellichick does it all, and he's been damned good at it. Can't argue. Plus, it can be argued that we just got outcoached (or out coached ourselves) in the Superbowl.

AZ's duo is good. I was amazed at their season last year, after all the injuries and suspensions. I thought that team would tank, and instead the defense carried an offense that lost not one, but two QBs. How do we think we'd play with BJ Daniels at QB ? I do have a problem ranking then ahead of Pete and John, when they're 1-3 against the roster that John and Pete drafted, and Pete coached. If you're 1-3, you've been out coached and out played.

I think Pete is going to suffer a bit, but not because of the first couple of years. Oh, I agree that it isn't emphasized enough about how bad of a roster they picked up, but it's a "what have you done for me lately" league and I honestly don't think people really analyze it all that much. I think Pete is going to suffer from that last call in the SB. It's going to go down as a big coaching gaffe, and until he wins another one, it won't go away easily.

The guy is entitled to his opinion but it sounds like he wrote the article to justify his hyperbolic tweet. Arians is nothing but Rex Ryan in a Kangol. Bruce did a good job in Indy and has done good in AZ but the only reason he gets this much love is because the Media is in love with the story about a OC lifer getting his shot and making good. They also love a good quote and Arians gives them fodder. I realize these awards and accolades are a popularity contest but I've never seen a coach and GM get so much hype for starting the season 9-1.

Yeah he seems reasonable in his assessment. I mean look how consistent he is in how he evaluates these duo's.

Before we get into the rankings, allow me to explain my parameters for this exercise. I am primarily judging coach/GM tandems on where they stand right now, with an eye to the future. I will, of course, acknowledge precedent. You can't ignore the past. But it cannot be the be-all, end-all factor, either.

5) Sean Payton/Mickey Loomis, New Orleans Saints
Yes, 2014 was a lost season for the Saints. Wholly disappointing. That said, you cannot disrespect this pair. Since they joined forces in 2006, the Saints have gone 80-48 and won a Super Bowl. And it's not like this franchise had a pronounced track record of success in the preceding years: Payton has guided New Orleans to the playoffs five times -- the same number of postseason bids nabbed by the Saints in their first 39 years of existence, prior to Payton's arrival.

Nice job reviewing where they stand right now and with of course an eye to the future.

Isn't this guy suppose to be a professional journalist with his area of expertise on the eye of football?

This is a complete joke also. If this is truly about where they are and where they are headed, do you think he would bet money that either of these duo's teams will finish ahead of Seattle next year? Sorry but based on his own parameters if you are basing it on where they are now, you cannot ignore two consecutive super bowls and if you are basing it on where they are headed, the Seahawks are still the offs on favorite to win it all next year. The only way to sway away from Pete and John as the blatantly obvious best duo requires effort in ignorance. You have to blatantly ignore reality in other words.

I love how he quantifies AZ playing in the toughest division in football while ignoring why it is the toughest division in football.

They must be the best in football because jeeze, they have to play the Seahawks. Yeah that makes sense.

Consider that in the 4 years that Pete and John have been here, they are on their 2nd OC and 2nd DC and now onto the 3rd DC because the first two have been promoted to head coach out of Pete and Johns system. Is there another team in football that has produced two or more head coaches over the last four years? This while complete rebuilding the roster from one of the worst in the league. How do you ignore everything Pete and John have accomplished without a complete commitment to ignorance? You can't.

Yeah read this today and could not believe it. Even though the writer tried to qualify it by his,1a,1b,1c,,,, still obsurd. Arizona, much like the 49er's in the late oots, have secured many first round draft picks from I beieve 09 to 14, stacked on their prior to Kurt Warners run, of other previous top picks. Fitz, 04,,Dockette 04,,Calais Campbell 08,,sure I've missed some (because of thier consistent shittyness much like SF and currently ST. Loius)

How many Super Bowls has Harbaugh and Newsome been to in 5 years? I'm sure the NE argument is why Baltimore is # 2 in as if it wasn't for NE, Baltimore would have been in SB11 and 14 as well as winning 12 (dynasty?)

Never liked this guy. He is on the "Prisco" side in regards to Seattle Seahawk politics

Sports writing can be so dumb sometimes. I think Keim is a solid GM and Arians is a very good coach. But there is poor accounting in the Keim/Arians logic. Arians won coach of the year because he got a mediocre team with poor depth at key positions to 11 wins (they were without a doubt the worst 11 win team of all time). Ok fine. So why then is the GM who built that flawed roster getting praise too? Can't have it both ways.

Against Seattle, Arians and Keim stole one win by the skin of their teeth and got their asses kicked in the other three games. Jeff Fisher has been more competitive against Seattle than Arians has.

Ultimately though, having an NFC West opponent over-rated nationally is good for the Seahawks brand too.

Swap one and three, and the list is solid. Harbaugh and Newsome do a terrific job almost every year.

FWIW, last week on espn710 radio Clayton's take on this subject was Seattle's combo is #1... hands down.

Any top 4 that doesn't include NE, SEA, GB, and BAL has issues IMO. We can debate who's #1 but the job PC/JS did in the last 5 years is really incredible. They dismantled the entire roster and built a SB contender in the 3rd year.

Not sure how NO gets ranked so high by Schein and clearly there is some projection going on with Indy, SD, and Houston. I tell you one group that probably should be in the top 10 but isn't - Cincinnati. Granted their playoff success is not there at all but this team has made the playoffs 4 years in a row.

One of the takeaways I had from the article is that great coach/GM duos are really rare. Mainly because there are so few outstanding GMs. Most GMs are cookie cutter types. Fungible.