Some SEA cap analysis via FG

Laloosh

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Curious if any of our resident cap junkies could dovetail on this a bit? Anybody who's read opposing fan sites, ESPN or NFLN stuff has seen / heard the comments about how we can't keep this going.

http://www.fieldgulls.com/seahawks-anal ... arroll-nfl

Strong coaching, revolutionary drafting styles, and a unique salary cap structure has established Seattle as one of the best teams in the NFL.

...and it’s not going to change anytime soon.
 

kearly

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I always love it when a writer goes after the naysayers, what a great way to grab the reader's attention right at the start.
 

DavidSeven

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I think it's true that Seattle does have quite a bit of flexibility going forward, and that's definitely a good spot to be in. At the same time, we have lost a lot of good players since 2013. Are we as deep as we were then? Probably not, but I agree that's the formula for continued success, and it's definitely the way I would've done it. We've identified the stars; now it's a matter of replenishing the depth.

Seattle has all its 1A talent locked up. Assuming they stay healthy, this team can continue to contend. The only difference I see now that all these guys got their second contracts is that proven depth has been stripped down. If any two of our top five players got injured, could we still contend? Back when we had Maxwell, Browner, Thurmond, Jeron, Miller, Tate, Clemons, Red, McDonald, McDaniel, Unger, Breno, Carpenter, M. Smith, etc., you could probably still afford to lose anyone but your QB for a stretch. Even without Russell, we probably could have snuck in the 2013 playoffs with T-Jack. That squad was stacked. We killed everyone in the preseason because we were cutting guys who became starters on other teams. It was insane.

So, yeah, at the top end, I agree this team is as good as it ever was and should continue to be that way. And if the stars stay healthy, the team is always going to have a chance. That being said, the depth has changed, and we need guys from the 2013-2015 draft classes to really start hitting if this team wants to be as deep and impervious to injury as it was two years ago. In 2013, if you lost your LT or CB1, you'd still have some solid players to compensate. In 2015, what does our OL or CB situation look like without Okung or Sherman? I think that's the big difference.
 

Hawkstorian

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I think league-wide there's a huge problem coming to a head. The problem is perceived "market" values are not really keeping up with the actual cap growth. As a result, we're actually seeing a lot of teams (not the Seahawks) with 10s of millions of unused cap room, which they can then roll forward and make the "problem" worse next year.

If I was Bobby Wagner, no way would I have signed an extension. I think real stars on the open market can command huge contracts if that's what they want. Ndamukong Suh is a great example, but what if there were 10 star players on the market?

The league is underspending, in my opinion. There are minimum spends that will come into play, not sure how that will change much.
 

Sports Hernia

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Laloosh":2ccxsxmo said:
Curious of any of our resident cap junkies could dovetail on this a bit? Anybody who's read opposing fan sites, ESPN or NFLN stuff has seen / heard the comments about how we can't keep this going.

http://www.fieldgulls.com/seahawks-anal ... arroll-nfl

Strong coaching, revolutionary drafting styles, and a unique salary cap structure has established Seattle as one of the best teams in the NFL.

...and it’s not going to change anytime soon.
Great find. This should be required reading for all niner fans, but that might send their fanbase into a deeper depression then most are already in due to their dreadful last 12 months or so.
 

chris98251

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Another we have no money thread, we can't win a Super Bowl with a short third round QB, our corners can't be good we took them to late and Shut down Corners are 1st round talent, Kam is to big and slow to be a Safety, we can't make it back to back.

Keep Talking everyone.
 

Seahawkfan80

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DavidSeven":105y4o17 said:
I think it's true that Seattle does have quite a bit of flexibility going forward, and that's definitely a good spot to be in. At the same time, we have lost a lot of good players since 2013. Are we as deep as we were then? Probably not, but I agree that's the formula for continued success, and it's definitely the way I would've done it. We've identified the stars; now it's a matter of replenishing the depth.

Seattle has all its 1A talent locked up. Assuming they stay healthy, this team can continue to contend. The only difference I see now that all these guys got their second contracts is that proven depth has been stripped down. If any two of our top five players got injured, could we still contend? Back when we had Maxwell, Browner, Thurmond, Jeron, Miller, Tate, Clemons, Red, McDonald, McDaniel, Unger, Breno, Carpenter, M. Smith, etc., you could probably still afford to lose anyone but your QB for a stretch. Even without Russell, we probably could have snuck in the 2013 playoffs with T-Jack. That squad was stacked. We killed everyone in the preseason because we were cutting guys who became starters on other teams. It was insane.

So, yeah, at the top end, I agree this team is as good as it ever was and should continue to be that way. And if the stars stay healthy, the team is always going to have a chance. That being said, the depth has changed, and we need guys from the 2013-2015 draft classes to really start hitting if this team wants to be as deep and impervious to injury as it was two years ago. In 2013, if you lost your LT or CB1, you'd still have some solid players to compensate. In 2015, what does our OL or CB situation look like without Okung or Sherman? I think that's the big difference.

I believe they are also looking to the future too....when the Alpha players are fading away.....always look to the future. So what I think they are looking at is also who is to replace Sherman, ET, and the others that make our core great. They are so upper level in this that I think, I THINK, they have a plan that is fantastic for the future of THIS Franchise. Good luck other teams on trying to make this work with your template. Go You Freaking Hawks......tm by Byau.
 

MizzouHawkGal

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I'm thinking you're already seeing how we'll replace Earl and Sherman. Maybe not replace but mitigate by a shift in focus on defense via the front seven.
 

Tical21

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I don't know that flexibility is the word that I would use to describe our situation. 11 guys make 80 percent of our cap, and they're almost all locked up for a while. I get flexibility means we can cut a few going, although I don't see that really happening for any of them. To me, it is quite obvious that they have decided, "hey, we're going to lock up one helluva defense for the next handful of years, and we'll take our chances with that." Not really a bad place to be, but it is just so different from a team like NE, who only had a couple stars, and a whole bunch of mid-level guys. There is more pressure on our front office to draft well than anybody else in the league, because it is going to be a while before we can pay more young talent. I'm pretty sure that's exactly how they want it.
 

dumbrabbit

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Tical21":1zqe4k0n said:
I don't know that flexibility is the word that I would use to describe our situation. 11 guys make 80 percent of our cap, and they're almost all locked up for a while. I get flexibility means we can cut a few going, although I don't see that really happening for any of them. To me, it is quite obvious that they have decided, "hey, we're going to lock up one helluva defense for the next handful of years, and we'll take our chances with that." Not really a bad place to be, but it is just so different from a team like NE, who only had a couple stars, and a whole bunch of mid-level guys. There is more pressure on our front office to draft well than anybody else in the league, because it is going to be a while before we can pay more young talent. I'm pretty sure that's exactly how they want it.

It's much easier maintaining a Dynasty with rookies than mid-level guys. Mid-level guys are just that. They're not horrible talent, then again, they're not great, nor will they ever be.

With the Seahawks model, you draft and pay your core young talent, and then you draft rookies to replace them, and rookies are much easier to re-sign than to sign mid-level talent guys. And rookies can have so much more talent potential than mid-level guys and can help maintain your dynasty.
 

Hawks46

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MizzouHawkGal":37w00cqs said:
I'm thinking you're already seeing how we'll replace Earl and Sherman. Maybe not replace but mitigate by a shift in focus on defense via the front seven.

It worked for the Giants. And Pete and John are a hell of a lot better at assembling a secondary than anyone the Giants have. Or have had.
 

Hawks46

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Tical21":3tch7a24 said:
I don't know that flexibility is the word that I would use to describe our situation. 11 guys make 80 percent of our cap, and they're almost all locked up for a while. I get flexibility means we can cut a few going, although I don't see that really happening for any of them. To me, it is quite obvious that they have decided, "hey, we're going to lock up one helluva defense for the next handful of years, and we'll take our chances with that." Not really a bad place to be, but it is just so different from a team like NE, who only had a couple stars, and a whole bunch of mid-level guys. There is more pressure on our front office to draft well than anybody else in the league, because it is going to be a while before we can pay more young talent. I'm pretty sure that's exactly how they want it.

It's hard to ascertain really what the specific plan was for the FO. I honestly think we favor the defense a bit, but I'm not sure they actually wanted to lock up this much cap space with this few of players because at some point, it does hamper some flexibility.

The perception is that we want to go very heavy on the defense, yet we've spent good money on the QB, Harvin, and now Graham, so Pete and John show they're not averse to spending money on special skill position players (and Harvin). I theorize that they probably want a balanced team on both sides.

We take it for granted, but the thing is, we don't just have a good, or great defense, but it's one of the historically great defenses in NFL history. I'm not sure how we'll replicate this once guys like Sherman, Thomas and Wagner go into retirement. People have theorized that Bennett is harder to replace than Chancellor, but it already looks like we did it with Clark, but how often are we going to find a Sherman or a Chancellor in the 5th ? Heck, it's not easy to find a Thomas anywhere....look at the last 4-5 safeties taken in the 1st round.

I'm confident that Pete and John could field a good to very good defense, even with mostly mid rounders, but THIS defense might not ever happen again for us. Of course you're going to pay them and keep them together.
 

Sgt. Largent

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DavidSeven":27kryk2m said:
I think it's true that Seattle does have quite a bit of flexibility going forward, and that's definitely a good spot to be in. At the same time, we have lost a lot of good players since 2013. Are we as deep as we were then? Probably not, but I agree that's the formula for continued success, and it's definitely the way I would've done it. We've identified the stars; now it's a matter of replenishing the depth. .

This is a HUGE year to see if our depth shines or not.

If guys like Hill, Marsh, KPL, Shead, Bailey, Simon, P-Rich, Lockett and Clark can step up and fill in those crucial depth roles necessary for this formula to work? Then we're in good shape going forward.

If most of these guys continue to get hurt and/or not perform? Then we're in trouble and have to reload.
 

12thbrah

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Its a damn good thing the studs on this team are locked up for at least the next 3 years. Plenty of time for their replacements to hopefully develop and step up. We just can't have crap like the Kam situation happen every year.
 

hawksfansinceday1

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Sports Hernia":1h1kyelp said:
Laloosh":1h1kyelp said:
Curious of any of our resident cap junkies could dovetail on this a bit? Anybody who's read opposing fan sites, ESPN or NFLN stuff has seen / heard the comments about how we can't keep this going.

http://www.fieldgulls.com/seahawks-anal ... arroll-nfl

Strong coaching, revolutionary drafting styles, and a unique salary cap structure has established Seattle as one of the best teams in the NFL.

...and it’s not going to change anytime soon.
Great find. This should be required reading for all niner fans, but that might send their fanbase into a deeper depression then most are already in due to their dreadful last 12 months or so.
Naw, they'd just deny it was the truth, say the Hawks are cheating or both. Wasn't the movie line "you can't fix stupid"? (rlkats excluded)
 

Lords of Scythia

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Tical21":2048bnom said:
I don't know that flexibility is the word that I would use to describe our situation. 11 guys make 80 percent of our cap, and they're almost all locked up for a while. I get flexibility means we can cut a few going, although I don't see that really happening for any of them. To me, it is quite obvious that they have decided, "hey, we're going to lock up one helluva defense for the next handful of years, and we'll take our chances with that." Not really a bad place to be, but it is just so different from a team like NE, who only had a couple stars, and a whole bunch of mid-level guys. There is more pressure on our front office to draft well than anybody else in the league, because it is going to be a while before we can pay more young talent. I'm pretty sure that's exactly how they want it.
That's the way they built it. We won a SB with these low/mid picks, now we're trying to build a dynasty with same--it's exactly what JS did by design.
 

Lords of Scythia

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dumbrabbit":mzyafq46 said:
Tical21":mzyafq46 said:
I don't know that flexibility is the word that I would use to describe our situation. 11 guys make 80 percent of our cap, and they're almost all locked up for a while. I get flexibility means we can cut a few going, although I don't see that really happening for any of them. To me, it is quite obvious that they have decided, "hey, we're going to lock up one helluva defense for the next handful of years, and we'll take our chances with that." Not really a bad place to be, but it is just so different from a team like NE, who only had a couple stars, and a whole bunch of mid-level guys. There is more pressure on our front office to draft well than anybody else in the league, because it is going to be a while before we can pay more young talent. I'm pretty sure that's exactly how they want it.

It's much easier maintaining a Dynasty with rookies than mid-level guys. Mid-level guys are just that. They're not horrible talent, then again, they're not great, nor will they ever be.

With the Seahawks model, you draft and pay your core young talent, and then you draft rookies to replace them, and rookies are much easier to re-sign than to sign mid-level talent guys. And rookies can have so much more talent potential than mid-level guys and can help maintain your dynasty.
Mid level level talent like...Russell Wilson?
 

Northwest Seahawk

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My concern is we replaced Rice and Tate with Baldwin and Kearse. Lockett probably won't play much WR this year and he is a rookie. Matthews is really the only WR that has a chance to really help the offense at WR this year and he's injured hopefully he will be back and healthy for the Ram game maybe he plays Sat I don't know. The move for Graham may turn out to be a season saving decision .
 

McGruff

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Northwest Seahawk":on6xwwly said:
My concern is we replaced Rice and Tate with Baldwin and Kearse. Lockett probably won't play much WR this year and he is a rookie. Matthews is really the only WR that has a chance to really help the offense at WR this year and he's injured hopefully he will be back and healthy for the Ram game maybe he plays Sat I don't know. The move for Graham may turn out to be a season saving decision .

Lockett will play a lot more receiver than most expected. I predict he will get more opportunities than Matthews and that he will outperform Kearse . . . this season.
 

purpleneer

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It still basically comes down to the simple concepts of being right in your player scouting as much as possible and allocate the money/cap accordingly. Their methods have been techniques to mitigate potential mistakes in that regard are also illustrations of where the convention has put too much value.
 
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