The cover-3 is officially dead

Tical21 · Nov 15, 2015

One of my big concerns for this season was how our defense was going to evolve. Since the success of our cover-3 has been so widely publicized, you knew that teams were going to devote a lot of time figuring out how to beat it. Over the first half of this season, we deviated from it far more often than we have the past two years, and it largely led to miscommunication and open receivers, so we knew we were going to just get back to basics. We seemed bound and determined this week to re-commit ourselves to the cover-3.

Arizona was waiting for it. They started off the game right away with the deep comeback. They hit floods. They ran our corners up the field and hit wide open guys in the seams beneath them. They widened us out and found the soft spots in the middle. You name a way to beat the cover-3, they did it. Richard got so sick of watching cover-3 beaters eat us up that he lost a huge gamble trying to make a play. So we finally changed our gameplan, manned up and blitzed. And it worked for quite a while. Ultimately though, Arizona adapted, and we didn't have another counter. We got caught being predictable with our blitzes.

We'll still get away with our cover-3 against middling QB's, but the good passing teams have such good plans in place for us now, we have no choice but to adapt if we want to survive. Does that mean more man? Does that mean more cover-2? Does Pete have any other tricks up his sleeve, any other ways to change the game again? Our cover-3 has been historical. We'll be forever tied to it, almost like the Bears and their 46. But it has run it's course. Time to find another way to put our studs in the best positions for success.

MontanaHawk05 · Nov 15, 2015

Earl Thomas has been out of position on almost all of those TE seam touchdowns. He's actually not having a good season.

WilliamCooper · Nov 15, 2015

Tical21":3fnflpn6 said:
One of my big concerns for this season was how our defense was going to evolve. Since the success of our cover-3 has been so widely publicized, you knew that teams were going to devote a lot of time figuring out how to beat it. Over the first half of this season, we deviated from it far more often than we have the past two years, and it largely led to miscommunication and open receivers, so we knew we were going to just get back to basics. We seemed bound and determined this week to re-commit ourselves to the cover-3.

Arizona was waiting for it. They started off the game right away with the deep comeback. They hit floods. They ran our corners up the field and hit wide open guys in the seams beneath them. They widened us out and found the soft spots in the middle. You name a way to beat the cover-3, they did it. Richard got so sick of watching cover-3 beaters eat us up that he lost a huge gamble trying to make a play. So we finally changed our gameplan, manned up and blitzed. And it worked for quite a while. Ultimately though, Arizona adapted, and we didn't have another counter. We got caught being predictable with our blitzes.

We'll still get away with our cover-3 against middling QB's, but the good passing teams have such good plans in place for us now, we have no choice but to adapt if we want to survive. Does that mean more man? Does that mean more cover-2? Does Pete have any other tricks up his sleeve, any other ways to change the game again? Our cover-3 has been historical. We'll be forever tied to it, almost like the Bears and their 46. But it has run it's course. Time to find another way to put our studs in the best positions for success.

You're spot on. But I will say this, a vicious four man rush makes the cover 3 look like lock down coverage. The fact that we are having to bring a LB to get pressure is troubling.

Tical21 · Nov 15, 2015

MontanaHawk05":3dcf9m5z said:
Earl Thomas has been out of position on almost all of those TE seam touchdowns. He's actually not having a good season.

You might be right, but without seeing tape, I would venture actually to disagree. I don't think he's been out of position at all. That's exactly where the soft spot is. As soon as Kam passes him off, there is a void right there. The play that beat us tonight was four verticals. If they run verticals, and there is no threat of an underneath receiver, Kam needs to carry the seam. If Earl cheats towards the TE, the slot is wide open. It was a solid playcall against cover-3 and a nice pass, and Earl isn't tall enough to get a hand in there. The play wasn't completed because Earl was out of position. They came in to this game knowing they were going to try to hit that against our cover-3.

The play against Ertz was a different concept. In that play, they actually did have an underneath receiver, so Kam couldn't carry the TE up the field.

seahawkfreak · Nov 15, 2015

MontanaHawk05":13hk0aet said:
Earl Thomas has been out of position on almost all of those TE seam touchdowns. He's actually not having a good season.

I've been on the defense for the defense but this is absolutely true. Does Earl solely depend on his physical abilities? It's starting to look like it

TheLegendOfBoom · Nov 15, 2015

Tical21":t8cna3dj said:
One of my big concerns for this season was how our defense was going to evolve. Since the success of our cover-3 has been so widely publicized, you knew that teams were going to devote a lot of time figuring out how to beat it. Over the first half of this season, we deviated from it far more often than we have the past two years, and it largely led to miscommunication and open receivers, so we knew we were going to just get back to basics. We seemed bound and determined this week to re-commit ourselves to the cover-3.

Arizona was waiting for it. They started off the game right away with the deep comeback. They hit floods. They ran our corners up the field and hit wide open guys in the seams beneath them. They widened us out and found the soft spots in the middle. You name a way to beat the cover-3, they did it. So we finally changed our gameplan, manned up and blitzed. And it worked for quite a while. Ultimately though, Arizona adapted, and we didn't have a counter. We got caught being predictable with our blitzes.

We'll still get away with our cover-3 against middling QB's, but the good passing teams have such good plans in place for us now, we have no choice but to adapt if we want to survive. Does that mean more man? Does that mean more cover-2? Does Pete have any other tricks up his sleeve, any other ways to change the game again? Our cover-3 has been historical. We'll be forever tied to it, almost like the Bears and their 46. But it has run it's course. Time to find another way to put our studs in the best positions for success.

How to beat the Seahawks Cover-3 scheme.

1. Line up your tight end by your left tackle.

2. Run your left side flanker in a quick slant dragging the linebackers and forcing them to cover the middle.

3. Run doubles on the right with your slot receiver running a drag and pick with the flanker, and your split end runs post.

4. Tight end runs a seam route on cleared space.

5. Strong safety will have to make a decision on who to guard slot or flanker running in the middle.

6. Free safety will have to make a decision to help the corner once the split end runs the post and goes into the free safety's zone.

7. Tight end gets clean release and if the tight end runs a second behind the split that entire area will be vacated by the free safety making a break for the split end entering his "zone."

8. Tight end open.

9. Depending on field of play

10. Perfect execution, touchdown.

WilliamCooper · Nov 15, 2015

TheLegendOfBoom":1644kmsb said:
Tical21":1644kmsb said:

One of my big concerns for this season was how our defense was going to evolve. Since the success of our cover-3 has been so widely publicized, you knew that teams were going to devote a lot of time figuring out how to beat it. Over the first half of this season, we deviated from it far more often than we have the past two years, and it largely led to miscommunication and open receivers, so we knew we were going to just get back to basics. We seemed bound and determined this week to re-commit ourselves to the cover-3.

Arizona was waiting for it. They started off the game right away with the deep comeback. They hit floods. They ran our corners up the field and hit wide open guys in the seams beneath them. They widened us out and found the soft spots in the middle. You name a way to beat the cover-3, they did it. So we finally changed our gameplan, manned up and blitzed. And it worked for quite a while. Ultimately though, Arizona adapted, and we didn't have a counter. We got caught being predictable with our blitzes.

We'll still get away with our cover-3 against middling QB's, but the good passing teams have such good plans in place for us now, we have no choice but to adapt if we want to survive. Does that mean more man? Does that mean more cover-2? Does Pete have any other tricks up his sleeve, any other ways to change the game again? Our cover-3 has been historical. We'll be forever tied to it, almost like the Bears and their 46. But it has run it's course. Time to find another way to put our studs in the best positions for success.

Click to expand...

How to beat the Seahawks Cover-3 scheme.

1. Line up your tight end by your left tackle.

2. Run your left side flanker in a quick slant dragging the linebackers and forcing them to cover the middle.

3. Run doubles on the right with your slot receiver running a drag and pick with the flanker, and your split end runs post.

4. Tight end runs a seam route on cleared space.

5. Strong safety will have to make a decision on who to guard slot or flanker running in the middle.

6. Free safety will have to make a decision to help the corner once the split end runs the post and goes into the free safety's zone.

7. Tight end gets clean release and if the tight end runs a second behind the split that entire area will be vacated by the free safety making a break for the split end entering his "zone."

8. Tight end open.

9. Depending on field of play

10. Perfect execution, touchdown.

That's it. We've been okay over the last two years because we could get home with a four man rush.

hawksfansinceday1 · Nov 15, 2015

Good posts Tical and easy for a guy like me who isn't an Xs and Os type to understand. And yeah they countered the blitzes and that was the end of the D being effective.That was quite obvious. Do you think Pete has a counter? I immediately think "more man" but are Sherm and Williams capable?\
And the post above mine is spot on. Four man rush doesn't seem as effective this year.

WilliamCooper · Nov 15, 2015

hawksfansinceday1":2m519sye said:
Good posts Tical and easy for a guy like me who isn't an Xs and Os type to understand. And yeah they countered the blitzes and that was the end of the D being effective.That was quite obvious. Do you think Pete has a counter? I immediately think "more man" but are Sherm and Williams capable?\
And the post above mine is spot on. Four man rush doesn't seem as effective this year.

I wouldn't say more man is the answer. PC and JS have specifically drafted guys that are built to play in cover 3 shell. They are built for keeping things underneath with fast LB's that can close on the short to intermediate routes and drop back and play mid-center field on 3rd down passing scenarios.

It's not quite this dramatic, but it's like telling a triple option team that they are changing to a west coast route system. You just can't do that this late in the game.

The fact is the offense and defense have a symbiotic relationship. The offense depends on the defense to go out and make stops and give them a turnover a game to help them for the conservative offensive philosophy. The defense depends on the offense to sustain long drive and keep them off of the field. This is something you don't see much of now days due to the game being so offensively geared to throwing the ball 30-40 times a game.

Tical21 · Nov 15, 2015

One correction, the TD to Floyd over Sherman was actually cover-4. It is just as inexcusable as he still has deep responsibility on the outside, just thought it was a little strange as I don't remember seeing us play cover-4 in quite some time. I thought we typically played cover-2, when we weren't in our cover-3, but I could be wrong.

kearly · Nov 16, 2015

I agree with the OP on the problem with Seattle's zones. I'm not an X's and O's guy but even a layman could see Palmer was pitch and catch against zone last night. Guys like Dalton and Newton were killing Seattle's zones in the 4th quarter, probably because their coaches saved certain plays as trump cards.

That said, the Cardinals scored most of their points on drives that were extended by penalties by a very uneven officiating performance and those types of calls can be incredibly deflating to a secondary. The refs didn't let Seattle play their game and even in 2012-2014 they would usually lose games where that happened.

I think the man + blitz approach mostly worked in the second half (and it also essentially produced two defensive TDs), but penalties (and a few ridiculous catches in clutch moments) were too much to overcome. Even when Palmer did complete a pass against the blitz vs. man it rarely looked easy. Palmer played a hell of a game.

While I do think the cover3 has been exposed on a handful of plays in big games this season, and against Palmer last night, I think just as big an issue if not bigger is that our corners aren't playing anywhere near the same level this season as they did from 2011-2014. And that scares me more because I don't see a quick fix if 2015 Sherman and 2015 Cary Williams are the new normal at the position.

Northwest Seahawk · Nov 16, 2015

We played a lot more man with BB and Maxwell fact i'll leave it at that . Actually no I won't the big elephant in the room is Wilson and this Offense. That's the biggest problem they have this Offense is pathetic Wilson simply can't disappear for quarters and entire halfs of football and be considered a franchise QB.

marko358 · Nov 16, 2015

Northwest Seahawk":1o4tces4 said:
this Offense is pathetic Wilson simply can't disappear for quarters and entire halfs of football and be considered a franchise QB.

Here is what the offense did until they got their first score with 1:52 remaining in the first half (via ESPN.com)

1st drive: 6 plays, 8 yards
2nd drive: 3 plays. -5 yards
3rd drive: 1 play, -22 yards (SAFETY)
4th drive: 3 plays, -8 yards

That's all they could accomplish for the first 28 minutes of the game after two weeks of preparation.

MeanBlueGreen · Nov 16, 2015

Cover 3 only works if everyone is on the same page. I don't think you can underestimate a. how crappy Cary Williams is playing right now (and most of this season) and b. how much Earl and Richard have been forced to compensate for it.

Both guys have had to take chances because Williams is getting picked on.

2_0_6 · Nov 16, 2015

marko358":1vhtn9s6 said:
Northwest Seahawk":1vhtn9s6 said:

this Offense is pathetic Wilson simply can't disappear for quarters and entire halfs of football and be considered a franchise QB.

Click to expand...

Here is what the offense did until they got their first score with 1:52 remaining in the first half (via ESPN.com)

1st drive: 6 plays, 8 yards
2nd drive: 3 plays. -5 yards
3rd drive: 1 play, -22 yards (SAFETY)
4th drive: 3 plays, -8 yards

That's all they could accomplish for the first 28 minutes of the game after two weeks of preparation.

Another key stat:

39 minutes of Possession for the Cards to 21 minutes for the Hawks

Three and outs burn out the defense.

SNDavidson · Nov 16, 2015

Sorry Pete Carroll, sometimes it's not how you finish it's how you start, they're both pretty important.

kearly · Nov 16, 2015

marko358":3ng2welf said:
Northwest Seahawk":3ng2welf said:

this Offense is pathetic Wilson simply can't disappear for quarters and entire halfs of football and be considered a franchise QB.

Click to expand...

Here is what the offense did until they got their first score with 1:52 remaining in the first half (via ESPN.com)

1st drive: 6 plays, 8 yards
2nd drive: 3 plays. -5 yards
3rd drive: 1 play, -22 yards (SAFETY)
4th drive: 3 plays, -8 yards

That's all they could accomplish for the first 28 minutes of the game after two weeks of preparation.

Penalties pretty much destroyed Seattle's ability to move the ball in the first four drives. And some of the calls were questionable at best. When Seattle's offense wasn't staring down the barrel of 1st and 20, they did pretty well.

Northwest Seahawk · Nov 16, 2015

kearly":1qahkb0b said:
marko358":1qahkb0b said:

Northwest Seahawk":1qahkb0b said:

this Offense is pathetic Wilson simply can't disappear for quarters and entire halfs of football and be considered a franchise QB.

Click to expand...

Here is what the offense did until they got their first score with 1:52 remaining in the first half (via ESPN.com)

1st drive: 6 plays, 8 yards
2nd drive: 3 plays. -5 yards
3rd drive: 1 play, -22 yards (SAFETY)
4th drive: 3 plays, -8 yards

That's all they could accomplish for the first 28 minutes of the game after two weeks of preparation.

Click to expand...

Penalties pretty much destroyed Seattle's ability to move the ball in the first four drives. And some of the calls were questionable at best. When Seattle's offense wasn't staring down the barrel of 1st and 20, they did pretty well.

Wilson has been ineffective for long stretches this entire season and that's not exclusive to just this season either . Have defenses figured him out it's starting to look that way . Wilson is in his 4rth year he is what he is I don't see a dramatic change in his game going forward . So bottom line unless we have a great running game and a great defense this is going to be a 500 team and that's not going to cut it at 22 million a year .

The cover-3 is officially dead

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