Not impressed with Simon

I just haven't seen anything from him. He only plays 11 games in 2 years from injuries, and when he is on the field he is midiocre at best. Still doesn't turn to make a play on the ball, and is continually trailing receivers. I just haven't seen any development by him. Think the staff sees the same things, or will they keep him around?

Not to overstate intangibles, but you wonder if SB XLIX did irreparable damage to Simon's confidence. He was never a sound DB, but he was at least a ballhawk. Now he's not even that.

Yep.

Not using Burley in that game screwed us.

We use Burley, we win that one.

And I think Simon ends up being pretty good then, we shelled his confidence probably from playing him hurt.


But we are so thin at CB and CBs are so important, I don't think we CAN cut Simon because at least we know he can be average. Right now, he is like a big, muscular Kelly Jennings. In position sometimes but never makes plays on the ball.

I was hoping we could turn McNeil into a CB but for some reason we decided it would be better to try him at WR again? (?!?!) So the other hope was Ty Smith, but it is becoming clear that our CB whisperer either had help from an assistant who left for another opportunity or current staff really cannot develop DBs like it could before. Maybe Kris Richard working with the whole defense means he cannot help the DBs he normally worked with - no idea.

Either way, our system of magically "manufacturing" stud corners is now in real danger - and our defensive success depends on that system. At least we have Burley and Lane but if anyone gets hurt or tired, we are in it deep.

Simon's awful. I've never liked him and never got the love for the guy.

TwistedHusky":1v89oust said:

Yep.

Not using Burley in that game screwed us.

We use Burley, we win that one.

And I think Simon ends up being pretty good then, we shelled his confidence probably from playing him hurt.


But we are so thin at CB and CBs are so important, I don't think we CAN cut Simon because at least we know he can be average. Right now, he is like a big, muscular Kelly Jennings. In position sometimes but never makes plays on the ball.

I was hoping we could turn McNeil into a CB but for some reason we decided it would be better to try him at WR again? (?!?!) So the other hope was Ty Smith, but it is becoming clear that our CB whisperer either had help from an assistant who left for another opportunity or current staff really cannot develop DBs like it could before. Maybe Kris Richard working with the whole defense means he cannot help the DBs he normally worked with - no idea.

Either way, our system of magically "manufacturing" stud corners is now in real danger - and our defensive success depends on that system. At least we have Burley and Lane but if anyone gets hurt or tired, we are in it deep.

Click to expand...

I hate the confidence argument with Simon. I can't remember him ever showing me that he was good. That SB game was almost two years ago. If he hasn't recovered that confidence and believes he can play in this secondary, he doesn't belong.

Simon and Smith had a disappointing preseason. No doubt about it.

Burley is a baller though. Elliott was surprisingly impressive. Shead and Lane looked solid through the first three games. Safety play has looked great too.

I am no, too, mister!

He's still whining for calls. After he was taken for a ~15 yard gain he's right to the ref complaining about a pick instead of working it out with his teammates.

CodeWarrior":2tcbdah3 said:

He's still whining for calls. After he was taken for a ~15 yard gain he's right to the ref complaining about a pick instead of working it out with his teammates.

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That stood out to me too. SMH. Like, c'mon man. Really.

Simon started as "a guy with the measurables who might someday put it all together."

But he seems to be just "a guy with the measurables."

Rob12":2stfwrtd said:

TwistedHusky":2stfwrtd said:

Yep.

Not using Burley in that game screwed us.

We use Burley, we win that one.

And I think Simon ends up being pretty good then, we shelled his confidence probably from playing him hurt.


But we are so thin at CB and CBs are so important, I don't think we CAN cut Simon because at least we know he can be average. Right now, he is like a big, muscular Kelly Jennings. In position sometimes but never makes plays on the ball.

I was hoping we could turn McNeil into a CB but for some reason we decided it would be better to try him at WR again? (?!?!) So the other hope was Ty Smith, but it is becoming clear that our CB whisperer either had help from an assistant who left for another opportunity or current staff really cannot develop DBs like it could before. Maybe Kris Richard working with the whole defense means he cannot help the DBs he normally worked with - no idea.

Either way, our system of magically "manufacturing" stud corners is now in real danger - and our defensive success depends on that system. At least we have Burley and Lane but if anyone gets hurt or tired, we are in it deep.

Click to expand...

I hate the confidence argument with Simon. I can't remember him ever showing me that he was good. That SB game was almost two years ago. If he hasn't recovered that confidence and believes he can play in this secondary, he doesn't belong.

Click to expand...

Before his shoulder injury in 2014, he was one of the best CB's in the league. At one point he was only allowing like a 40 QBR against him and QB's were completing less than 50% of their passes in his direction. Those are Sherman level numbers. Then he hurt his shoulder and went down hill big time.

kearly":9s40ix2j said:

Not to overstate intangibles, but you wonder if SB XLIX did irreparable damage to Simon's confidence. He was never a sound DB, but he was at least a ballhawk. Now he's not even that.

Click to expand...

No one on our team are ballhawks anymore. I doubt we will have anyone with more than 4 picks this year. As a team they might get like 12 for the year.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Expected him to really step up this preseason and have been very disappointed.

I'll state this again, we are best when we play man, it's a different skill set playing off and zone, when you are a press corner you get your hands on a receiver and redirect, that's a strength of Simon and Sherman, Sherman is so long he also can play the zone, Guys like Lane and Burley are quicker and play the slot better.

When Simon is asked to play zone exclusively he is not at his best, seems to bite on moves and recovers slow.

Quinn played more man in his defense, Bradley and now Richard play a lot more soft zone, it's asking guys to use a different skill set, some have that ability and some don't, a guy that is a zone defender has a harder time going press corner, might be size and strength but it's a skill fit, same the other directing with reading a receiver and film to know how they come off the line when not being jammed and what kind of moves they use a lot to be able to stay close in coverage.

EverydayImRusselin":1lbdxtdd said:

Rob12":1lbdxtdd said:

TwistedHusky":1lbdxtdd said:

Yep.

Not using Burley in that game screwed us.

We use Burley, we win that one.

And I think Simon ends up being pretty good then, we shelled his confidence probably from playing him hurt.


But we are so thin at CB and CBs are so important, I don't think we CAN cut Simon because at least we know he can be average. Right now, he is like a big, muscular Kelly Jennings. In position sometimes but never makes plays on the ball.

I was hoping we could turn McNeil into a CB but for some reason we decided it would be better to try him at WR again? (?!?!) So the other hope was Ty Smith, but it is becoming clear that our CB whisperer either had help from an assistant who left for another opportunity or current staff really cannot develop DBs like it could before. Maybe Kris Richard working with the whole defense means he cannot help the DBs he normally worked with - no idea.

Either way, our system of magically "manufacturing" stud corners is now in real danger - and our defensive success depends on that system. At least we have Burley and Lane but if anyone gets hurt or tired, we are in it deep.

Click to expand...

I hate the confidence argument with Simon. I can't remember him ever showing me that he was good. That SB game was almost two years ago. If he hasn't recovered that confidence and believes he can play in this secondary, he doesn't belong.

Click to expand...

Before his shoulder injury in 2014, he was one of the best CB's in the league. At one point he was only allowing like a 40 QBR against him and QB's were completing less than 50% of their passes in his direction. Those are Sherman level numbers. Then he hurt his shoulder and went down hill big time.

Click to expand...

That's the problem with small sample sizes, they don't always tell the whole story.

Simon also sucks at man. Remember Edelman abusing him in the Super Bowl?

He was injured in the SB.

But I really think chris98521 is right.

He was playing man and doesn't play zone well.

At some point, if you have a guy that is stellar at man and terrible at zone - you have to adjust. If THAT is the problem and the reason half our corners are suddenly looking shoddy then it is a big problem.

It would mean we are moving off our strength to concentrate on our weakness, which is something losers do.

I am hoping his shoulder is still hurt. But I am also hoping it isn't one of those deals where he played hurt, messed up his shoulder and it just won't get right again.

More I think about it though, the more I think chris nailed it. Because you just don't go to crap that fast without something being the reason. He WAS good, it was not just the SB he played in. Now tactically it was terminally stupid not to use Burley because little slot guys tend to give our big corners fits - and that was the NE roster. Burley does a good job on those.

So it feels like Simon really is just being used wrong, and in doing that we are gutting his confidence.

That makes me feel better Simon can come back from this but it also makes me worry about the D staff.

TwistedHusky":2c0t3dv0 said:

Yep.

Not using Burley in that game screwed us.

We use Burley, we win that one.

And I think Simon ends up being pretty good then, we shelled his confidence probably from playing him hurt.


But we are so thin at CB and CBs are so important, I don't think we CAN cut Simon because at least we know he can be average. Right now, he is like a big, muscular Kelly Jennings. In position sometimes but never makes plays on the ball.

I was hoping we could turn McNeil into a CB but for some reason we decided it would be better to try him at WR again? (?!?!) So the other hope was Ty Smith, but it is becoming clear that our CB whisperer either had help from an assistant who left for another opportunity or current staff really cannot develop DBs like it could before. Maybe Kris Richard working with the whole defense means he cannot help the DBs he normally worked with - no idea.

Either way, our system of magically "manufacturing" stud corners is now in real danger - and our defensive success depends on that system. At least we have Burley and Lane but if anyone gets hurt or tired, we are in it deep.

Click to expand...

What is your problem with Kelly Jennings?

He never played the ball.

Kelly Jennings was awful.

Just google image search his name, its gallery of him being abused.

Tharold Simon may not even make the team. I mean he was returning punts in the 4th quarter of last night's game.

Simon has looked terrible all pre-season. He's always getting burned, holding receivers, and then complaining to the refs. I mean, is there a play where he doesn't complain to the refs?