Uncalled Horse Collar on Doug?

Watching the game again. With 26 seconds left in the 4th quarter, in 3rd and 6th, on the pick play Doug gets open in the middle. As he's running the Saint's defender grabs his jersey from the back looking like a horse collar. The film cuts it shortly, wish they would of shown the full back for a few more seconds. I think that would of been a TD by Doug but he was pulled down by the defender.

I also think too that the refs didn't want to call anything since it was under 2 minutes as well.

Didnt notice it, but wouldnt be surprised if true. That was the worst reffing the whole season.

Here's a video on youtube of the game's highlight that shows the play, looks like more of a jersey pull on the back, but still can't see if the Saint's defender reached in there first before he was able to put his left arm on Doug. Wish I had a better angle on it.

Go to the 3:39 mark on the video


[youtube]WIuiul5xZQU[/youtube]

I have yet to watch the game on my DVR.

I'm sure there has been some over reaction but from the sounds of things, if even 1/2 is legit, those refs sucked.

One of the things I found strange was, they didn't replay penalties in the Stadium. They may have replayed a couple that I missed but I don't think so.
Wish I knew if this was the "norm" for that stadium.

Not a horsecollar. Barely touches his name plate.

They quit showing questionable calls in replay on TV, that's when I knew something was up with the officiating.

McGruff":14joeg71 said:

Not a horsecollar. Barely touches his name plate.

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Not saying it was or wasn't as I'm not that up on the rule, but I think the closest is actually the hand in the front, not the one in the back.

There seemed to be one pull in the back on the top of the jersey collar and the pull in the front made it look ok. I, too, watched the part of the game that I had available yesterday. This dvd will be erased....not because we lost, but because I missed the first quarter and half of the second quarter due to the overtime in England. Halftime highlights show the ball escaping from the Saints to Earl for the first touchdown for those inclined to know about it.

HawkGA":3ls1ha9w said:

McGruff":3ls1ha9w said:

Not a horsecollar. Barely touches his name plate.

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Not saying it was or wasn't as I'm not that up on the rule, but I think the closest is actually the hand in the front, not the one in the back.

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IIRC the front is fair game.

It was strange to see the Pac 12 Refs at our game in New Orleans :?

I have been a subscriber to NFL Game Pass for a few years now, you can watch the first two quarters of play there.

Including that gift from heaven take away that Earl ran in for a TD, handed the ball off to a 12 wearing his jersey number, and then gave the ref a hug in all the excitement and drew a penalty for showing affection to the official.

The crap officiating aimed at Seattle this year didn't start and won't end with this game.

I'm not clear on the why's of it, almost wonder if it isn't related to the unified locking of arms on the field. The NFL is looking for the reason for decline in viewership this year and might be spanking any team that supported the cause, which I stand with Seattle and all the other teams out there that do.

The NFL needs to start accounting for streaming in their viewers formula, they will not only find their missing viewers but a boat load more they didn't know about.


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But it's OK for Antonio Brown, Erin Rodgers and Antonio Brown to slap the Refs butt?
Seems legit

SoulfishHawk":3leyfvkp said:

But it's OK for Antonio Brown, Erin Rodgers and Antonio Brown to slap the Refs butt?
Seems legit

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It's what a few of us have already mentioned, inconsistency in play calling. This is why the NFL needs to have the refs full time employees, so they can train during the off season.

Couldn't agree more.

ARTICLE 15. HORSE-COLLAR TACKLE

No player shall grab the inside collar of the back or the side of the shoulder pads or jersey, or grab the jersey at the name plate or above, and pull the runner toward the ground. This does not apply to a runner who is in the tackle box or to a quarterback who is in the pocket.

Note: It is not necessary for a player to pull the runner completely to the ground in order for the act to be illegal. If his knees are buckled by the action, it is a foul, even if the runner is not pulled completely to the ground.

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253hawk":3w487gpr said:

ARTICLE 15. HORSE-COLLAR TACKLE

No player shall grab the inside collar of the back or the side of the shoulder pads or jersey, or grab the jersey at the name plate or above, and pull the runner toward the ground. This does not apply to a runner who is in the tackle box or to a quarterback who is in the pocket.

Note: It is not necessary for a player to pull the runner completely to the ground in order for the act to be illegal. If his knees are buckled by the action, it is a foul, even if the runner is not pulled completely to the ground.

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Interesting. From the other angle I didn't think the back hand got anywhere near the top of the jersey.

That said, I don't think the Saints player made the downward jerk motion that is required. The danger with the horsecollar is that it doesn't let the upper body go with how the lower body is going. We saw that with Russell's knee injury where the player hit his leg and then pulled by the collar back over to essentially bend him in half sideways.

HawkGA":2qzgujqm said:

253hawk":2qzgujqm said:

ARTICLE 15. HORSE-COLLAR TACKLE

No player shall grab the inside collar of the back or the side of the shoulder pads or jersey, or grab the jersey at the name plate or above, and pull the runner toward the ground. This does not apply to a runner who is in the tackle box or to a quarterback who is in the pocket.

Note: It is not necessary for a player to pull the runner completely to the ground in order for the act to be illegal. If his knees are buckled by the action, it is a foul, even if the runner is not pulled completely to the ground.

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Interesting. From the other angle I didn't think the back hand got anywhere near the top of the jersey.

That said, I don't think the Saints player made the downward jerk motion that is required. The danger with the horsecollar is that it doesn't let the upper body go with how the lower body is going. We saw that with Russell's knee injury where the player hit his leg and then pulled by the collar back over to essentially bend him in half sideways.

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Glad that there is a slow mo video of it. To me it looks almost how Wilson got tackled when he got injured, the difference was it yanked Wilson backwards.

Looking at that to me still looks like a horse collar tackle. Saint's player was able to extend his arm to Doug's collar which he used it as leverage to be able to pull himself towards Doug then use his left arm for the rest of the tackle. Even at the end of the tackle, dude's hands was still by Doug's collar. You can clearly see the yank of Doug's jersey. Pay attention to the neckline as the Saint's defender grabs him from the back. Doug's shoulder pad gets shown blue or black color by the neckline.

20 seconds in this video it says a horse collar tackle is a foul regardless of which direction the runner is pulled.

[youtube]8I6bmZAMNtk[/youtube]

253hawk":12arhfz3 said:

ARTICLE 15. HORSE-COLLAR TACKLE

No player shall grab the inside collar of the back or the side of the shoulder pads or jersey, or grab the jersey at the name plate or above, and pull the runner toward the ground. This does not apply to a runner who is in the tackle box or to a quarterback who is in the pocket.

Note: It is not necessary for a player to pull the runner completely to the ground in order for the act to be illegal. If his knees are buckled by the action, it is a foul, even if the runner is not pulled completely to the ground.

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Yeah, that's a letter vs. spirit thing, and that tackle is nowhere near a horsecollar tackle. If they started calling that kind of thing, the game would get even more intolerable than it already is.

And actually, I think there could be two things that would disqualify it from the rule.

First, it doesn't cause Baldwin's knees to buckle.

Second, it is not the contact with the back of the jersey that pulls Baldwin to the ground.

True, but the tackle is initiated by grabbing inside of the collar and he never lets go. If anything, the NFL is pedantic as hell about little details like that with all of their other rules.

Let's hope that one of our defensive guy don't pull the same move, because for sure they would of been called for it.