We only need to tweak the roster to squeeze two more wins
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Bobblehead
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StoneCold":13n4ct6s said:
That won't win the SB though.
hawknation2017
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Good topic. The proverbial iceberg that we have watched inching toward us over the last six years has been the failure to draft ANY offensive tackle prospect.
In the last six drafts, the team has essentially avoided drafting from the small pool of players with the requisite skills to succeed at offensive tackle in the NFL. Only 7th Rounder Michael Bowie in 2013 (their fourth and final 7th-round selection in that draft) saw any significant time as an offensive tackle, and even he was another G-RT tweaner better suited for the interior. In fact, zero offensive linemen at all were drafted above the 7th Round in the 2012, 2013, and 2014 drafts.
Plenty of people have been sounding the alarm bells over this problem as the years crept on. It should come as no surprise now that we have two undrafted offensive line conversion projects manning the offensive tackle positions. Yes, I consider Garry Gilliam a conversion project because he only moved from TE his senior season at Penn State. However, not even the most anxious offensive line observer among us could have imagined a power forward protecting Russell Wilson's blindside.
The team clearly had a plan in place to cut the fat from the roster by spending leanly on offensive line veterans. But if that was the plan all along, then they should have made a concerted effort to stock the roster with offensive linemen on rookie deals. Linemen drafted in 2013 and 2014 would have been grisly veterans this season playing on the 3rd and 4th years of rookie contracts.
I think they need to draft a protypical tackle like they have not done since taking Russell Okung with this regime's first selection in 2010. Gilliam should be tendered or re-signed on a cheap deal at the near minimum because they badly need the depth. George Fant needs major work this off-season on his pass blocking technique, working on his footwork, hand placement, drop, punch, etc. But most importantly, they must find a way to draft a true offensive tackle who already has experience at the position. It's a small pool - and clearly not a group they have been very fond of - but they must do it if they hope to make the offensive line competent again.
In the last six drafts, the team has essentially avoided drafting from the small pool of players with the requisite skills to succeed at offensive tackle in the NFL. Only 7th Rounder Michael Bowie in 2013 (their fourth and final 7th-round selection in that draft) saw any significant time as an offensive tackle, and even he was another G-RT tweaner better suited for the interior. In fact, zero offensive linemen at all were drafted above the 7th Round in the 2012, 2013, and 2014 drafts.
Plenty of people have been sounding the alarm bells over this problem as the years crept on. It should come as no surprise now that we have two undrafted offensive line conversion projects manning the offensive tackle positions. Yes, I consider Garry Gilliam a conversion project because he only moved from TE his senior season at Penn State. However, not even the most anxious offensive line observer among us could have imagined a power forward protecting Russell Wilson's blindside.
The team clearly had a plan in place to cut the fat from the roster by spending leanly on offensive line veterans. But if that was the plan all along, then they should have made a concerted effort to stock the roster with offensive linemen on rookie deals. Linemen drafted in 2013 and 2014 would have been grisly veterans this season playing on the 3rd and 4th years of rookie contracts.
I think they need to draft a protypical tackle like they have not done since taking Russell Okung with this regime's first selection in 2010. Gilliam should be tendered or re-signed on a cheap deal at the near minimum because they badly need the depth. George Fant needs major work this off-season on his pass blocking technique, working on his footwork, hand placement, drop, punch, etc. But most importantly, they must find a way to draft a true offensive tackle who already has experience at the position. It's a small pool - and clearly not a group they have been very fond of - but they must do it if they hope to make the offensive line competent again.
SeahawksFanForever
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Pete was basically saying the same thing in almost all of his press conferences & interviews after the playoff loss. There will be changes but most of the roster should remain the same including the guys play as OL.
hawknation2017
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SeahawksFanForever":2l8mzxji said:
Well, there is a salary cap to contend with, and you do not improve depth by throwing out the baby with the bathwater. Instead of cutting guys, you add to the competition with draft picks. Gilliam, for example, has a couple years of starting experience at RT. He can be re-signed for very little, which maintains the depth. Then you add to it with a couple draft picks capable of playing OT. The best case scenario is that you strike gold with a rookie, experienced at the offensive tackle position, who beats out one of the current starters. In that case, Gilliam provides depth and experience on the cheap. The worst case scenario is still more depth with rookies developing behind the current starters.
SeahawksFanForever
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hawknation2017":26jpngg6 said:
Yes, they are going to add to the depth but core positions should remain the same.
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SeahawksFanForever":vqfsbyng said:
Unless they are beaten out through the competition. They just need to provide that opportunity.
tmobilchawker79
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Gee Scott (710AM) was saying that Odihambo has a chance to make a big jump in year two. I'd expect Fant to be better. Actually I'd expect Russ to stay healthy and really play a lot better. Now, if we could figure out our leaky secondary, that would be great.
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CHawkTailGator":dujf3am1 said:
Fant will almost certainly be better. I mean he has only played football for a year, so he has to get better. He is a very good looking athlete for LT. We just need an experienced LT prospect to push him in the competition.
But I have to say I was extremely disappointed in Odihambo. He looked incompetent on the right side of the line, uncomfortable at guard, and he lacks the length and agility to succeed at offensive tackle. I thought he would at least be better than Alvin Bailey, but his lack of versatility has made him worse. He is one of those backups who will probably be on the bubble to make the roster if they draft sufficiently well.
sondevil89
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Will our line get better in '17? Yes. BUT, being the worst rated line in the NFL leaves them no place to go but up. Going with what we have will just be a repeat of the last two years. They need to draft a 1st rounder if a legit one is available and then go find a FA OT.
We are not rebuilding, the future is now!
We are not rebuilding, the future is now!
Sgt. Largent
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You could say this about 8-10 playoff bubble teams right now.
IMO that's a shortsighted sentiment. What we want is a dynasty, a 13-14 win team for the next 10 years.
THAT requires more than just a couple roster tweaks. That requires major improvements on and off the field in coaching, philosophy, scheme, playcalling, roster talent, depth, hitting on a higher percentage of draft picks, team attitude and distraction.
Yes a couple roster tweaks might hold this group of players together for one more run at a SB. But I don't want just one more run............As long as Russell's our QB, I want 4-5 more SB appearances. That's going to require more than just trying to squeeze out two more wins.
IMO that's a shortsighted sentiment. What we want is a dynasty, a 13-14 win team for the next 10 years.
THAT requires more than just a couple roster tweaks. That requires major improvements on and off the field in coaching, philosophy, scheme, playcalling, roster talent, depth, hitting on a higher percentage of draft picks, team attitude and distraction.
Yes a couple roster tweaks might hold this group of players together for one more run at a SB. But I don't want just one more run............As long as Russell's our QB, I want 4-5 more SB appearances. That's going to require more than just trying to squeeze out two more wins.
sondevil89":32e2w93s said:
Smart teams are always rebuilding. We have a very young team. What will really tell the tape is how the team does in the years to come. 3 years from now if we're a 7-9 team that hasn't gone to the playoffs for 2 years, then you can look back and with hindsight see that Pete and John didn't do a good job. But right now? Tear the team apart? Fire the coaches? I don't buy it. I'm not saying there's no chance that some of the doomers aren't right, it's just way to early to write this teams epitaph.
hawknation2017
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Sgt. Largent":1a41su2m said:
I think the OP meant that two more wins gets us back to the Super Bowl, which would have been our 3rd appearance in four years.
The coaching and philosophy is what got us to those Super Bowls. It is the philosophy of competition that ultimately set the NFL record for most consecutive games without losing by a TD and most consecutive games without losing by more than 10 points. It is what allowed them to lead the NFL in scoring defense for an unprecedented four-straight seasons.
The failure to stock the offensive line with experienced talent - and untimely injuries - ultimately cost us those two more wins. If they can re-stock the line with talent to improve the competition there, the team's track record shows they will have another good chance to compete for a Super Bowl. The team is already littered with Pro Bowl talents that have been developed on both sides of the ball.
Sgt. Largent":3a9tuc92 said:
We were a tie and a a 3 point loss to AZ from being 12-4. With a seriously injured QB and work in progress Oline. I see the need for improvement, but no wholesale changes. Hawks are not the 2014-2015 Mariners.
Sgt. Largent
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StoneCold":vlaoz81a said:
Like I said, 10 teams could pick out 2-3 games and injuries this year and say the same thing. The Patriots didn't have their starting or 2nd string QB for 4 and 2 games, and lost their best receiver for most of the year. Yet 14 wins and in the SB, again.
Sorry, but I just don't buy that minor tweaking is going to fix this team long term as the elite 13-14 wins a year team we all think it can be.
Too many major issues going on right now, on and off the field.
hawknation2017
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Sgt. Largent":32d697ad said:
Your mean the Patriots team we beat this season at Gillette Stadium . . . on a short week. :2thumbs:
The foundation of the team is very strong. How many teams can say they have every starter back (sans Shead due to the ACL)? There is quite a lot to be excited about on this current roster we have returning. Can they get better at certain positions like offensive tackle, backup guard, backup safeties, etc.? Absolutely, that is what the draft and $30 million in cap space are for.
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hawknation2017":vdq3yvui said:
We are probably somewhere in between these two trains of thought...
hawknation2017
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Uncle Si":yivqj790 said:
Absolutely, and just because they can get better at these positions doesn't mean they will. They showed through the last six drafts that they are unable or unwilling to draft a player who can play offensive tackle at the NFL level. Maybe I am being naive to think this will change in the coming draft.
I think there are also some other things they can do to get back to the core of their philosophy that brought us so much success. For example, establishing a physical presence on offense by using a higher percentage of their plays with an experienced fullback, like they did so well in the wild card game against Detroit.
