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The offense has no identity

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The offense has no identity
Sun Sep 10, 2017 4:41 pm
  • The scheme and play calling feels like they still have marshawn and want to be a smash mouth team but don't invest in the players to do that. They could grind games out with marshawn getting positive gains every down which opened up the big play later. Getting negative plays to start every series kills them. I saw the opening drive bubble screen coming from a mile away, so did GB.

    Jimmy Graham is dreadfully misused in this offense and I still wonder why that trade was ever made if the vision is to just have him playing around the line of scrimmage. I counted at least four times on third and 6+ where he was blocking or releasing late. What's the point of trading for one of the biggest intermediate route mismatches in the NFL to roll him out as a traditional blocking TE?

    The players on the roster flourish in the up tempo style offense and yet only go to it with little time left in the quarter. So many games seem like they get no rhythm until 2 minutes left and then march down the field with ease. Why avoid it for 3/4 of the game?

    Being lifeless for entire first halves puts far too much pressure on the defense and ultimately tires them out by the fourth.
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Re: The offense has no identity
Sun Sep 10, 2017 8:39 pm
  • mistaowen wrote:...

    Jimmy Graham is dreadfully misused in this offense and I still wonder why that trade was ever made if the vision is to just have him playing around the line of scrimmage. I counted at least four times on third and 6+ where he was blocking or releasing late. What's the point of trading for one of the biggest intermediate route mismatches in the NFL to roll him out as a traditional blocking TE?

    ...



    My guess is that John Schneider and Pete have the vision, and that is why they made that trade. And that Bevell lacks that vision, and Pete for some reason will not force Bevell to use Graham primarily as a receiver.

    Who does GB have that can defend against a high pass to Graham? We have the same problem with Martellus Bennett. Their height allows them to go high were DBs can not go. Lacking tall enough DBs, the only way is to pressure the quarterback, which takes us back to our OL.
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Re: The offense has no identity
Sun Sep 10, 2017 8:42 pm
  • I believe Jimmy was targeted more than any other receiver today. As others have said, he needs to play a little stronger, especially in the red zone. Yes, he was mugged for what should have been a PI call on one of them, but he had a jump ball on the other and couldn't come down with it. He also dropped a pass on third down that would have moved the chains. He was being fed today.
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Re: The offense has no identity
Sun Sep 10, 2017 8:49 pm
  • I miss the days, when we all wished for a TE...
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Re: The offense has no identity
Sun Sep 10, 2017 9:09 pm
  • Siouxhawk wrote:I believe Jimmy was targeted more than any other receiver today. As others have said, he needs to play a little stronger, especially in the red zone. Yes, he was mugged for what should have been a PI call on one of them, but he had a jump ball on the other and couldn't come down with it. He also dropped a pass on third down that would have moved the chains. He was being fed today.


    Whatever keeps the blame off coaching huh? Saying he was targeted more in a game like this means nothing, he is almost never used properly.
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Re: The offense has no identity
Sun Sep 10, 2017 9:14 pm
  • cymatica wrote:
    Siouxhawk wrote:I believe Jimmy was targeted more than any other receiver today. As others have said, he needs to play a little stronger, especially in the red zone. Yes, he was mugged for what should have been a PI call on one of them, but he had a jump ball on the other and couldn't come down with it. He also dropped a pass on third down that would have moved the chains. He was being fed today.


    Whatever keeps the blame off coaching huh? Saying he was targeted more in a game like this means nothing, he is almost never used properly.

    Yes, hitting him in the hands for an apparent first-down catch that he dropped isn't using him properly? Sheesh.
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Re: The offense has no identity
Sun Sep 10, 2017 9:31 pm
  • Siouxhawk wrote:I believe Jimmy was targeted more than any other receiver today. As others have said, he needs to play a little stronger, especially in the red zone. Yes, he was mugged for what should have been a PI call on one of them, but he had a jump ball on the other and couldn't come down with it. He also dropped a pass on third down that would have moved the chains. He was being fed today.


    Targeting him has nothing to do with what the OP was saying. Like blocking a lot on 3rd down or releasing late. This offense has no identity or diversity of plays. It is embarrassing. As far as I'm concerned Jimmy should be running sprints all over the field, either making catch attempts or taking coverage away from other players. He can't do that trying to block Clay Matthews.

    Why is he not running in motion on pre snaps, spread out with WR's etc.? His talent should, at the very least bring high attention, why isn't that being used to our advantage.
    Last edited by seahawkfreak on Sun Sep 10, 2017 10:00 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: The offense has no identity
Sun Sep 10, 2017 9:43 pm
  • seahawkfreak wrote:
    Siouxhawk wrote:I believe Jimmy was targeted more than any other receiver today. As others have said, he needs to play a little stronger, especially in the red zone. Yes, he was mugged for what should have been a PI call on one of them, but he had a jump ball on the other and couldn't come down with it. He also dropped a pass on third down that would have moved the chains. He was being fed today.


    Targeting him has nothing to do with what the OP was saying. Like blocking a lot on 3rd down or releasing late. This offense has no identity or diversity of plays. It is embarrassing. As far as I'm concerned Jimmy should be running sprints all over the field, either making catch attempts or taking coverage away from other players. He cant do that trying to block Clay Matthews.

    Why is he not running in motion on pre snaps, spread out with WR's etc.? His talent should, at the very least bring high attention, why isn't that be used to our advantage.


    This is what pisses me off about our coaching staff as of late. Before we used to grab guys with unique talents and utilize those talents, but now it just seems we are bringing in big names and forcing them to fit their vision even if it goes against their strengths as a player. The Jimmy Graham trade was really stupid if this is how we are going to use him. Signing Eddie Lacy was another stupid move given that he can't even gain a yard without a competent O-line. Im also starting to believe we ruined Russell Wilson because his football instincts seem to be getting worse after trying to turn him into a pocket passer first QB.
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Re: The offense has no identity
Sun Sep 10, 2017 9:48 pm
  • mistaowen wrote:The scheme and play calling feels like they still have marshawn and want to be a smash mouth team but don't invest in the players to do that. They could grind games out with marshawn getting positive gains every down which opened up the big play later. Getting negative plays to start every series kills them. I saw the opening drive bubble screen coming from a mile away, so did GB.

    Jimmy Graham is dreadfully misused in this offense and I still wonder why that trade was ever made if the vision is to just have him playing around the line of scrimmage. I counted at least four times on third and 6+ where he was blocking or releasing late. What's the point of trading for one of the biggest intermediate route mismatches in the NFL to roll him out as a traditional blocking TE?

    The players on the roster flourish in the up tempo style offense and yet only go to it with little time left in the quarter. So many games seem like they get no rhythm until 2 minutes left and then march down the field with ease. Why avoid it for 3/4 of the game?

    Being lifeless for entire first halves puts far too much pressure on the defense and ultimately tires them out by the fourth.



    You're making too much sense on this board. STOP IT! :irishdrinkers:
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Re: The offense has no identity
Sun Sep 10, 2017 9:55 pm
  • Jimmy and Eddy won't be on the team next year. I guess problem solved.
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Re: The offense has no identity
Sun Sep 10, 2017 9:57 pm
  • I was watching some post game show and someone said and I paraphrase:

    "The Seahawks have lost their offensive identity. Without Marshawn Lynch, they are struggling to find that solution that makes them a strong running team. Whenever Russell Wilson is running for more yards than your running backs...That is a problem!"

    They went on to talk about how you can't have running back by committee...You need to commit to ONE MAN as the running back period (and let the other RBs spell him of course).

    I agree. This whole Lacy/Rawls/Prosise/Carson thing needs to end. PICK ONE and go with it!

    My vote is Carson, and let the others come in to mix things up.
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Re: The offense has no identity
Sun Sep 10, 2017 10:48 pm
  • What made the running game great was Lynch AND Wilson. Teams couldn't key on either one running the read option or they'd have huge gains. They opened holes for each other.

    The Read option is completely abandoned now.

    News flash coaches. The read option doesn't get RW killed (he actually can protect himself running the RO), it is thinking this line can create a pocket for him. That is going to kill him.
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Re: The offense has no identity
Mon Sep 11, 2017 3:21 am
  • Smellyman wrote:What made the running game great was Lynch AND Wilson. Teams couldn't key on either one running the read option or they'd have huge gains. They opened holes for each other.

    The Read option is completely abandoned now.

    News flash coaches. The read option doesn't get RW killed (he actually can protect himself running the RO), it is thinking this line can create a pocket for him. That is going to kill him.



    You hit the nail on the head here.
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Re: The offense has no identity
Mon Sep 11, 2017 3:57 am
  • Identity? = weak offense.

    The identity was 5 series that were 3 and out plus one turnover at our 21. Little ability to pass protect and no ability to run block. Zero TDs and less the 100 yards of rushing, with RW getting 40 of the 90 + yards weakly scratchedout.

    Welcome to the new OLine, same as the old OLine.

    The identity is Charmin soft on O and overworked on D.
    Until we develop a pass rush that will cause opposing teams to be forced to scheme to defend it we will never be able to consistently take the final step. The interior rush needs improvement. The OLine clearly still needs work.

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Re: The offense has no identity
Mon Sep 11, 2017 4:06 am
  • Hawkfish wrote:Jimmy and Eddy won't be on the team next year. I guess problem solved.


    Tom Cable will still be on the team though....until he is gone....the problem will remain
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Re: The offense has no identity
Mon Sep 11, 2017 12:04 pm
  • First you don't run big power backs horizontally , we did it with Lynch also and it was almost always a disaster, Lacy is even more of a problem, Lynch had a bit of wiggle, Lacy not so much, worst yet is doing it with a O line that can't seal the edge or the interior or anywhere else yesterday, it was a sieve and defenders were just picking the shortest route to attack.
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Re: The offense has no identity
Mon Sep 11, 2017 12:06 pm
  • We do have an identity, we just don't have the O-line personnel to run it.

    But Pete's gonna keep on trying, bless his heart.
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Re: The offense has no identity
Mon Sep 11, 2017 5:20 pm
  • I guess it's possible that perhaps, most likely the offense doesn't really have much of a true identity maybe.
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Re: The offense has no identity
Mon Sep 11, 2017 6:34 pm
  • We have an identity on offense.

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Re: The offense has no identity
Mon Sep 11, 2017 6:40 pm
  • chris98251 wrote:We have an identity on offense.

    Image


    Image
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Re: The offense has no identity
Mon Sep 11, 2017 6:51 pm
  • Siouxhawk wrote:
    cymatica wrote:
    Siouxhawk wrote:I believe Jimmy was targeted more than any other receiver today. As others have said, he needs to play a little stronger, especially in the red zone. Yes, he was mugged for what should have been a PI call on one of them, but he had a jump ball on the other and couldn't come down with it. He also dropped a pass on third down that would have moved the chains. He was being fed today.


    Whatever keeps the blame off coaching huh? Saying he was targeted more in a game like this means nothing, he is almost never used properly.

    Yes, hitting him in the hands for an apparent first-down catch that he dropped isn't using him properly? Sheesh.


    Yeah because when I said they weren't using him properly I was referring to that one play :sarcasm_off:
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Re: The offense has no identity
Mon Sep 11, 2017 7:06 pm
  • We could easily have an identity we saw it in 2015 but the Coaches refuse to let it be. PC wants a bruising, ball control offense and we don't have the oline or RBs for that, We do have the WR and QB for a quick, call control passing game, see the 2nd half of 2015, but alas that coach is not making a system to fit the players but making the players fit a system.
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Re: The offense has no identity
Mon Sep 11, 2017 7:28 pm
  • Image

    4 of his 7 targets were at or behind the line of scrimmage. YUCK.

    His one drop, the deep left route, ironically, was the way we should be using him.
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Re: The offense has no identity
Mon Sep 11, 2017 7:47 pm
  • cymatica wrote:
    Siouxhawk wrote:
    cymatica wrote:
    Siouxhawk wrote:I believe Jimmy was targeted more than any other receiver today. As others have said, he needs to play a little stronger, especially in the red zone. Yes, he was mugged for what should have been a PI call on one of them, but he had a jump ball on the other and couldn't come down with it. He also dropped a pass on third down that would have moved the chains. He was being fed today.


    Whatever keeps the blame off coaching huh? Saying he was targeted more in a game like this means nothing, he is almost never used properly.

    Yes, hitting him in the hands for an apparent first-down catch that he dropped isn't using him properly? Sheesh.


    Yeah because when I said they weren't using him properly I was referring to that one play :sarcasm_off:


    But by the same token, IF you're getting INFREQUENT chances to show your Pro-Bowl stuff, then there aren't many excuses for dropping the easy ones, eh?
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Re: The offense has no identity
Mon Sep 11, 2017 7:50 pm
  • So guys it turns out the running game wasn't having much success against a Packers defense that was in Dime the majority of the game...

    https://twitter.com/DavisHsuSeattle/sta ... 3568649218

    If you can't get rushing yards against 2 DL/2OLB/1ILB/3S/3CB then we have major problems with this run game. Maybe more than we feared.
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Re: The offense has no identity
Mon Sep 11, 2017 10:30 pm
  • Anthony! wrote:We could easily have an identity we saw it in 2015 but the Coaches refuse to let it be. PC wants a bruising, ball control offense and we don't have the oline or RBs for that, We do have the WR and QB for a quick, call control passing game, see the 2nd half of 2015, but alas that coach is not making a system to fit the players but making the players fit a system.


    No thanks, ran the same thing in 2016.
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Re: The offense has no identity
Mon Sep 11, 2017 10:50 pm
  • seahawkfreak wrote:
    Anthony! wrote:We could easily have an identity we saw it in 2015 but the Coaches refuse to let it be. PC wants a bruising, ball control offense and we don't have the oline or RBs for that, We do have the WR and QB for a quick, call control passing game, see the 2nd half of 2015, but alas that coach is not making a system to fit the players but making the players fit a system.


    No thanks, ran the same thing in 2016.


    ahh actually we did not, we could not because RW was injured, so sorry we did not but we should
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Re: The offense has no identity
Mon Sep 11, 2017 10:53 pm
  • adeltaY wrote:So guys it turns out the running game wasn't having much success against a Packers defense that was in Dime the majority of the game...

    https://twitter.com/DavisHsuSeattle/sta ... 3568649218

    If you can't get rushing yards against 2 DL/2OLB/1ILB/3S/3CB then we have major problems with this run game. Maybe more than we feared.


    This just keeps getting better.
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Re: The offense has no identity
Mon Sep 11, 2017 11:19 pm
  • cymatica wrote:
    adeltaY wrote:So guys it turns out the running game wasn't having much success against a Packers defense that was in Dime the majority of the game...

    https://twitter.com/DavisHsuSeattle/sta ... 3568649218

    If you can't get rushing yards against 2 DL/2OLB/1ILB/3S/3CB then we have major problems with this run game. Maybe more than we feared.


    This just keeps getting better.


    wow okay then that says just how bad our oline is, if they were getting the kind of pressure on Rw with their dime package.
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Re: The offense has no identity
Mon Sep 11, 2017 11:51 pm
  • Anthony! wrote:
    seahawkfreak wrote:
    Anthony! wrote:We could easily have an identity we saw it in 2015 but the Coaches refuse to let it be. PC wants a bruising, ball control offense and we don't have the oline or RBs for that, We do have the WR and QB for a quick, call control passing game, see the 2nd half of 2015, but alas that coach is not making a system to fit the players but making the players fit a system.


    No thanks, ran the same thing in 2016.


    ahh actually we did not, we could not because RW was injured, so sorry we did not but we should


    So are you saying we need to bring back the read option?
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Re: The offense has no identity
Tue Sep 12, 2017 12:07 am
  • seahawkfreak wrote:
    Anthony! wrote:
    seahawkfreak wrote:
    Anthony! wrote:We could easily have an identity we saw it in 2015 but the Coaches refuse to let it be. PC wants a bruising, ball control offense and we don't have the oline or RBs for that, We do have the WR and QB for a quick, call control passing game, see the 2nd half of 2015, but alas that coach is not making a system to fit the players but making the players fit a system.


    No thanks, ran the same thing in 2016.


    ahh actually we did not, we could not because RW was injured, so sorry we did not but we should


    So are you saying we need to bring back the read option?


    go back and look at the 2nd half of 2015, you know the tear Rw went on. They were using a uptempo, quick passing game, that they stopped using when Lynch came back, and could not use last year due to RWs injuries, which impacted his mavuverability, his knee and ankkle as well as his throwing his knee, ankle and pectoral. That is what we should be using, as it works for us. Think of it as uptempo west coast offense.
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Re: The offense has no identity
Tue Sep 12, 2017 2:51 am
  • netskier wrote:Who does GB have that can defend against a high pass to Graham? We have the same problem with Martellus Bennett. Their height allows them to go high were DBs can not go. Lacking tall enough DBs, the only way is to pressure the quarterback, which takes us back to our OL.


    Bennett had 3 catches, same as Graham. And if not for a Graham drop and blatant pass interference he'd have had at least 2 more catches, including a TD.
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Re: The offense has no identity
Tue Sep 12, 2017 3:04 am
  • [quote="
    go back and look at the 2nd half of 2015, you know the tear Rw went on. They were using a uptempo, quick passing game, that they stopped using when Lynch came back, and could not use last year due to RWs injuries, which impacted his mavuverability, his knee and ankkle as well as his throwing his knee, ankle and pectoral. That is what we should be using, as it works for us. Think of it as uptempo west coast offense.[/quote]


    This spot on and how we need to change up our offense. I thought I read someplace that this is Pete's offense his design and our OC just runs the plays. Our offense lacks vision and it is a boring offense with ineffective results. Like some of the poster's said above we do not have the personnel to run it we need to get back to the read option and quick throws we started doing it in 2015 we can do it now. Why as team we can build off of what we were doing in 15 and adapt. We try to go back and have the power offense and we are suffering for tremendously. It is embarrassing how we look I cant even watch any football shows for the rest of the week because they just bring me down having to see this garbage over and over again it is enough to make u puke.
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Re: The offense has no identity
Tue Sep 12, 2017 8:28 am
  • Hawkfish wrote:Jimmy and Eddy won't be on the team next year. I guess problem solved.


    But another year of wasted talent is the issue
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Re: The offense has no identity
Tue Sep 12, 2017 9:18 am
  • netskier wrote:
    mistaowen wrote:...

    Jimmy Graham is dreadfully misused in this offense and I still wonder why that trade was ever made if the vision is to just have him playing around the line of scrimmage. I counted at least four times on third and 6+ where he was blocking or releasing late. What's the point of trading for one of the biggest intermediate route mismatches in the NFL to roll him out as a traditional blocking TE?

    ...



    My guess is that John Schneider and Pete have the vision, and that is why they made that trade. And that Bevell lacks that vision, and Pete for some reason will not force Bevell to use Graham primarily as a receiver.

    Who does GB have that can defend against a high pass to Graham? We have the same problem with Martellus Bennett. Their height allows them to go high were DBs can not go. Lacking tall enough DBs, the only way is to pressure the quarterback, which takes us back to our OL.


    Wrong, it falls on all the coaches not just Bevell. If you can't see how poorly he's being used it's a problem. Literally look at how he was used in New Orleans. Someone and I'm guessing it's Pete or Bevell has a pride problem and doesn't want to change things up. So instead of using Graham as the world class TE he is we use him to block.

    That's just wasted money. Might as well use that money on upgrading the offensive line.
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Re: The offense has no identity
Tue Sep 12, 2017 9:21 am
  • scrummymustard wrote:Image

    4 of his 7 targets were at or behind the line of scrimmage. YUCK.

    His one drop, the deep left route, ironically, was the way we should be using him.


    LMAO... nice play calling brah.

    hahahahahah man, it's so painfully obvious they don't know what they're doing with him.
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Re: The offense has no identity
Tue Sep 12, 2017 9:22 am
  • adeltaY wrote:So guys it turns out the running game wasn't having much success against a Packers defense that was in Dime the majority of the game...

    https://twitter.com/DavisHsuSeattle/sta ... 3568649218

    If you can't get rushing yards against 2 DL/2OLB/1ILB/3S/3CB then we have major problems with this run game. Maybe more than we feared.


    They know we can't run and we rarely attack the middle of the field with short routes.

    Of COURSEEEE the Packers defense looked all world.
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Re: The offense has no identity
Tue Sep 12, 2017 9:31 am
  • This is a huge part of the problem. Lynch was unique in his ability to overcome poor blocking and still be effective. He and Wilson also were deadly in the read option sets although I do think teams got better at defending Wilson on that based on film and RW slowing down some.

    The 2nd half of 2015 with Rawls is probably the template for what suits their talents best. It also came without Graham, who just isn't an inline TE. Vannett is the closest thing they have to one.

    I think they need to maximize spread sets, which should open up some middle of the field routes as well as open up some running lanes. I also think it's clear to me that Carson, Rawls, and Procise fit that much better than Lacy.

    All of this said, if the OL plays like they did versus GB, it's nearly impossible to win.
    GO HAWKS!
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    JTB
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Re: The offense has no identity
Tue Sep 12, 2017 9:34 am
  • NFSeahawks628 wrote:
    scrummymustard wrote:Image

    4 of his 7 targets were at or behind the line of scrimmage. YUCK.

    His one drop, the deep left route, ironically, was the way we should be using him.


    LMAO... nice play calling brah.

    hahahahahah man, it's so painfully obvious they don't know what they're doing with him.


    Good lord.... Jimmy spent his first few seasons terrorizing defenses as a pseudo WR and he's running chip-block wheel routes behind the LOS. This is exactly what I'm talking about. What the hell is the purpose of having a pro bowl TE run those routes? Luke Willson can do that.
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