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Ok....the lateral????

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Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:23 pm
  • Legal or not?

    I initially thought it was legal, still do, and a rule was posted in the GameDay forum.

    It was legal as far as I know.

    Within 4 minuets of the play, “bleacher report” was already asking if it should have been allowed.
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    Sometimes, most of the time, I hate the National media.

    What’s your opinion of the play?
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:27 pm
  • Lateral..if not..too close to call
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:28 pm
  • MVP play.
    I hate Tim Ruskell.
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:34 pm
  • It helped the game winning play which was the non challenge.
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:36 pm
  • THey were correct, started at 47, caught at 48..
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:37 pm
  • just stop
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Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:38 pm
  • Bobblehead wrote:THey were correct, started at 47, caught at 48..


    Does this mater by the letter of the rule, or does it only matter that it gets tossed backwards?
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:39 pm
  • What's the rule? He obviously was throwing it backwards, but with the momentum it ended up further ahead than where it was thrown from.
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:40 pm
  • Probably illegal, but we won by 14 not 7.
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:40 pm
  • pmedic920 wrote:
    Bobblehead wrote:THey were correct, started at 47, caught at 48..


    Does this mater by the letter of the rule, or does it only matter that it gets tossed backwards?

    I have no idea if I am right, but that is how I think it should be and how I thought it was.
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:40 pm
  • Cyrus12 wrote:Lateral..if not..too close to call


    That's it I think. Might have been a forward pass but it would very likely not have been overturned.
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:41 pm
  • If the question is did Wilson throw it behind himself, the yes. Two players running parallel and one tosses it backward to the other, the ball will drift forward....but it was still thrown behind the QB.
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:43 pm
  • Philly is dumb for not challenging. Almost always do refs miss a live, close lateral play. Nobody expects it.
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:43 pm
  • The ball travelled forward. Illegal pass
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:45 pm
  • lobohawk wrote:If the question is did Wilson throw it behind himself, the yes. Two players running parallel and one tosses it backward to the other, the ball will drift forward....but it was still thrown behind the QB.


    No, the ball was released at about the 47 and was caught about the 48.. it looked like a lateral, but if you references it with the hashmarks it's pretty clearly forward.
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:45 pm
  • mikeak wrote:The ball travelled forward. Illegal pass


    Is this your opinion or are you quoting the rule as it applies to this play?
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:47 pm
  • it must have been russell's baseball experience kicking in... a curve ball... can't recall ever having seen that before...
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:51 pm
  • pmedic920 wrote:
    mikeak wrote:The ball travelled forward. Illegal pass


    Is this your opinion or are you quoting the rule as it applies to this play?



    Both?

    The ball was thrown at the Seahawks 47 and caught at the Seahawks 48. The rule states that if the ball strikes ANYTHING (incliding Mike Davis) at a point closer to the goal line than where the ball was RELEASED, it is a forward pass


    None of this really matters though as th Eagles couldn't put up another point and arguably got away with OPI on their lone TD.
    Last edited by XxXdragonXxX on Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:53 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:52 pm
  • https://static.nfl.com/static/content/public/image/rulebook/pdfs/11_Rule8_ForwardPass_BackPass_Fumble.pdf

    Rule 8
    Forward Pass, Backward Pass, Fumble
    Section 1
    Forward Pass
    DEFINITION
    Article 1 Definition

    It is a forward pass if:
    (a) the ball initially moves forward (to a point nearer the opponent’s goal line) after leaving the passer’s hand(s); or
    (b) the ball first strikes the ground, a player, an official, or anything else at a point that is nearer the opponent’s goal line than the point at which the ball leaves the passer’s hand(s).

    Released at ~47 yard line.

    Caught at ~47.5 - 48 yard line.

    Ball does not change direction of travel in mid-flight.

    It was a forward pass.

    If challenged and overturned it would have been 4th and 8 (loss of down) from the 42 (5 yard penalty).
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:54 pm
  • This Rugby player says, the ball has to be released and thrown toward your own goal line. I'll count rugby rules this time.
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:56 pm
  • The ball was touched by the receiver forward of the point where it was released and Russ. Russ was past the line of scrimmage. By rule, this should have been an illegal forward pass. That said, a foul doesn't exist until an official rules on it and they could have thrown the red flag.

    The MVP play was on the team to quickly get to the line and run the next play.
    Last edited by BullHawk33 on Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:57 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:56 pm
  • At full speed its a beautiful lateral. It's only when they slow it down were the illusion is exposed and yes it went forward. Eagles can't point the finger at the refs on that one....It's on their coach for not challenging.
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:57 pm
  • Hey what about the facemask that wasn't called on PRich? Oh wait he's a SEAHAWK that got screwed over, nevermind.
    Last edited by Uncle Si on Mon Dec 04, 2017 7:52 am, edited 1 time in total.
    Reason: Talking about the lateral, aren't we?
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:58 pm
  • lobohawk wrote:If the question is did Wilson throw it behind himself, the yes. Two players running parallel and one tosses it backward to the other, the ball will drift forward....but it was still thrown behind the QB.

    Yeah, throw a football BACKWARDS out of a fast moving car and it will still land forward of where it was thrown.
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:58 pm
  • My eyes told me it was a lateral. That's a the evidence I need. Russ tossed it to the trailing back.
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:59 pm
  • Bobblehead wrote:THey were correct, started at 47, caught at 48..
    It's called physics.. A backwards pass will still travel forward when you running full speed. The announcers were off base imo.

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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:00 pm
  • Wasn't a big issue in college before instant replay. As long as the ball was pitched behind the QB to the RB all was good.
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:00 pm
  • It's not even remotely close to a forward pass. Some of you need to take a #_&@ physics class.
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:00 pm
  • Another famous or dubious play for us on national tv!
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:00 pm
  • It did essentially carry forward, but the ball did travel backwards relative to Wilson because he was running so fast. The faster you go, the more force you need to throw the ball backwards to cancel out its velocity. Most laterals are done at much slower speed, so it's not usually an issue.

    At least that was challengeable, unlike the helmet pull/facemask that killed one of our drives.
    Last edited by 253hawk on Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:01 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:00 pm

Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:02 pm
  • It's OVER, GET OVER IT !!!!!

    It did not affect the game outcome since we were ahead anyway.
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:02 pm
  • jlwaters1 wrote:
    Bobblehead wrote:THey were correct, started at 47, caught at 48..
    It's called physics.. A backwards pass will still travel forward when you running full speed. The announcers were off base imo.

    Sent from my LG-H918 using Tapatalk


    By NFL rules, that makes it a forward pass:

    "(b) the ball first strikes the ground, a player, an official, or anything else at a point that is nearer the opponent’s goal line than the point at which the ball leaves the passer’s hand(s)."
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:02 pm
  • renofox wrote:https://static.nfl.com/static/content/public/image/rulebook/pdfs/11_Rule8_ForwardPass_BackPass_Fumble.pdf

    Rule 8
    Forward Pass, Backward Pass, Fumble
    Section 1
    Forward Pass
    DEFINITION
    Article 1 Definition

    It is a forward pass if:
    (a) the ball initially moves forward (to a point nearer the opponent’s goal line) after leaving the passer’s hand(s); or
    (b) the ball first strikes the ground, a player, an official, or anything else at a point that is nearer the opponent’s goal line than the point at which the ball leaves the passer’s hand(s).

    Released at ~47 yard line.

    Caught at ~47.5 - 48 yard line.

    Ball does not change direction of travel in mid-flight.

    It was a forward pass.

    If challenged and overturned it would have been 4th and 8 (loss of down) from the 42 (5 yard penalty).


    Look up the definition of INITIALLY
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:02 pm
  • The actull rule has been posted here, people ignore it and keep thinking it was a lateral.
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:03 pm
  • Here is the bottom line as far as I am concerned:

    1. It looked in play like a legal lateral.
    2. It was so close that I doubt it would have been overturned on replay review.
    3. The Eagles HAD two time outs and a challenge left. If was the responsibility of the Eagles to throw the challenge flag, but apparently they thought it was legal too. Too bad, so sad.

    If we wanted to nitpick everything, games would last 3 days not three hours.
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:03 pm
  • renofox wrote:https://static.nfl.com/static/content/public/image/rulebook/pdfs/11_Rule8_ForwardPass_BackPass_Fumble.pdf

    Rule 8
    Forward Pass, Backward Pass, Fumble
    Section 1
    Forward Pass
    DEFINITION
    Article 1 Definition

    It is a forward pass if:
    (a) the ball initially moves forward (to a point nearer the opponent’s goal line) after leaving the passer’s hand(s); or
    (b) the ball first strikes the ground, a player, an official, or anything else at a point that is nearer the opponent’s goal line than the point at which the ball leaves the passer’s hand(s).

    Released at ~47 yard line.

    Caught at ~47.5 - 48 yard line.

    Ball does not change direction of travel in mid-flight.

    It was a forward pass.

    If challenged and overturned it would have been 4th and 8 (loss of down) from the 42 (5 yard penalty).

    I get it, but the rule was written describing a motionless passer. In this case the "release point" was moving, so you could say it was always behind the release point.

    Bet if you go through the archives, you will find lots of laterals that also drifted forward due to this same scenario.
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:04 pm
  • Sgt Largent wrote:
    renofox wrote:https://static.nfl.com/static/content/public/image/rulebook/pdfs/11_Rule8_ForwardPass_BackPass_Fumble.pdf

    Rule 8
    Forward Pass, Backward Pass, Fumble
    Section 1
    Forward Pass
    DEFINITION
    Article 1 Definition

    It is a forward pass if:
    (a) the ball initially moves forward (to a point nearer the opponent’s goal line) after leaving the passer’s hand(s); or
    (b) the ball first strikes the ground, a player, an official, or anything else at a point that is nearer the opponent’s goal line than the point at which the ball leaves the passer’s hand(s).

    Released at ~47 yard line.

    Caught at ~47.5 - 48 yard line.

    Ball does not change direction of travel in mid-flight.

    It was a forward pass.

    If challenged and overturned it would have been 4th and 8 (loss of down) from the 42 (5 yard penalty).


    Look up the definition of INITIALLY


    Look up the definition of "or"
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:04 pm
  • Why are supposed seahawk fans always so hell bent to criticize Russell Wilson’s every move? Well he is top of his game right now so I suggest you trade him away for a kings ransom so you can finally be happy.
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:05 pm
  • brimsalabim wrote:Why are supposed seahawk fans always so hell bent to criticize Russell Wilson’s every move? Well he is top of his game right now so I suggest you trade him away for a kings ransom so you can finally be happy.


    Absolutely no one is criticizing Russ for trying to lateral. It was an incredibly heads-up play to even try to lateral the ball.
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:06 pm
  • Jeremy517 wrote:
    jlwaters1 wrote:
    Bobblehead wrote:THey were correct, started at 47, caught at 48..
    It's called physics.. A backwards pass will still travel forward when you running full speed. The announcers were off base imo.

    Sent from my LG-H918 using Tapatalk


    By NFL rules, that makes it a forward pass:

    "(b) the ball first strikes the ground, a player, an official, or anything else at a point that is nearer the opponent’s goal line than the point at which the ball leaves the passer’s hand(s)."


    It gets a bit silly though, because a lateral while running at full speed is almost physically impossible to pull off without jumping into the air and winging it backwards wildly with both hands. I'm curious as to how many players can whip a ball backwards at 20+ MPH (to bring the ball's relative momentum to zero) and not blow their shoulder and elbow out.
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:08 pm
  • Now that I've read part (b) of the rule as posted here, I apologize. Now that my apology is out of the way, who in God's name thought that that would be a good definition of a forward pass?

    Running the option back in the day, we would pitch the ball in exactly that situation all day and it was perfectly legal.
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:09 pm
  • 253hawk wrote:
    Jeremy517 wrote:
    jlwaters1 wrote:
    Bobblehead wrote:THey were correct, started at 47, caught at 48..
    It's called physics.. A backwards pass will still travel forward when you running full speed. The announcers were off base imo.

    Sent from my LG-H918 using Tapatalk


    By NFL rules, that makes it a forward pass:

    "(b) the ball first strikes the ground, a player, an official, or anything else at a point that is nearer the opponent’s goal line than the point at which the ball leaves the passer’s hand(s)."


    It gets a bit silly though, because a lateral while running at full speed is almost physically impossible to pull off without jumping into the air and winging it backwards wildly with both hands. I'm curious as to how many players can whip a ball backwards at 20+ MPH (to bring the ball's relative momentum to zero) and not blow their shoulder and elbow out.


    They can't and it was never expected. Forward means pushed in front, that is not what happened.
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:09 pm
  • The Seahawks got away with one - the lateral.

    The Eagles got away with one - the facemask.

    Can we just call it even?
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:09 pm
  • We're making this more complicated than it needs to be. The ball goes behind Wilson. Forward passes don't go behind the passer.

    Next question.
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:10 pm
  • I don't care! Awesome play!!! Any and all Iglesias fans can kiss my ass. Twice! Thr Thr Thr THREEE TIMES! I LOVE PRIME TIME GAMES!
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:11 pm
  • renofox wrote:The Seahawks got away with one - the lateral.

    The Eagles got away with one - the facemask.

    Can we just call it even?


    No
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:11 pm
  • XxXdragonXxX wrote:The actull rule has been posted here, people ignore it and keep thinking it was a lateral.



    Not really as black and white as you keep painting it to be due to the factors discussed above.

    May have been overturned.....unlikely though. At the rate he was running, it would have been nearly impossible to lateral a ball and not have it drift forward a bit due to physics.

    Bang bang call probably stands as called
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:11 pm
  • Oops! Lol! Or Iggles fans :lol:
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Re: Ok....the lateral????
Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:12 pm
  • Why would they include the word "initially" if it didn't matter? Initially, he threw the ball behind him. Lateral. Legal.
    Great play.
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