Seahawks Haven't Recovered From "The Play"

AROS

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I was watching Inside The NFL last night and Ray Lewis made a comment about how the Seahawks have never been the same since that fateful final play in XLIX. I've flirted with the notion since then but when he said it it really hit me.

"He's right."

Now I know "The Play" has been discussed ad nauseum here (insert beating dead horse image here) so the point of this thread isn't to rehash that, but I wanted to talk about the fallout. This isn't about the unfortunate series of events that occur over any given season that happens to all teams (i.e. injuries) but how something as profound as "The Play" can have an impact on a dominant franchise 1-yard away from a potential dynasty.

When that EPSN article came out during the offseason, I largely dismissed it as did the players. After all, the goal for any writer is to get clicks or reads. Sensationalism, hyperbole and "Truth-stretching" are often the norm, especially in the world of sports journalism driven by readership.

However, where there's smoke there's always some kind of fire. The Seahawks were built on the foundation of finding scrappy, late round players with a giant chip on their shoulders. Pete has always celebrated individuality (within the confines of the culture concept) and at times it has proven problematic (i.e. player explosions on the sidelines).

I was hoping this team had the character and determination to move beyond the travesty of that final play in XLIX. Now I feel sadly that they do not. As optimistic as I tend to be, I think I have to face the fact that this Championship-Caliber Era has come to an end and we are witnessing the sights and sounds of inevitability right before our eyes.

With Russell Wilson and many of our current players and culture I will always have hope, but I have to finally admit, the window - if not closed - is barely letting any light in anymore.
 

Seymour

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First, Ray Lewis is a complete douche bag IMO and I won't even listen to the guy myself.

2nd, there is what 8-10 players of 53 left from that game?

Say 10 were and 43 weren't, that doesn't make much sense the players are most effected from that meltdown.

Coaches....absolutely.
 

PlinytheCenter

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Those 8-10 players left happen to be in leadership positions. Trickle down effect. When new guys come in, they invariably look to the vets to see what's up. Messages, subliminal or otherwise, may have been sent. Since we're not in the locker room we'll never know, but to discount this happening isn't realistic either.

my 2 cents...
 

Seymour

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I don't believe we are "trickling down" "we are losers" from the top core group. I do however believe that too many core players were extended, plus poor drafting along with some players have a hard time "staying hungry" with a wallet the size of a brick.
 

hawknation2017

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I think it's hard to move on when the same OC is still here. The guy who was outfoxed by Bill Belichick's decision not to call a timeout and suckered into calling a quick hitter to preserve time against what was the league's worst red zone and power run defense.

Bevell is a below average play caller on a team that is striving to be the best. For the last two years, Bevell was shielded from criticism due to the offensive line's porousness. Now that the level of talent on the offensive line has improved with the acquisition of Duane Brown, Bevell's rudimentary route tree, inability to react to in-game circumstances, predictable red zone play calling, and really poor understanding of the running game have become more glaring.

Pete wanted to take the blame and stand by his much-maligned play caller. Three years later, the effort has failed. Bevell is not making this offense better. Until we bring in a new OC or at least allow for some competition at play caller, the organization will be wasting the herculean efforts of Russell Wilson.
 

kf3339

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Aros":2aj8h9uc said:
I was watching Inside The NFL last night and Ray Lewis made a comment about how the Seahawks have never been the same since that fateful final play in XLIX. I've flirted with the notion since then but when he said it it really hit me.

"He's right."

Now I know "The Play" has been discussed ad nauseum here (insert beating dead horse image here) so the point of this thread isn't to rehash that, but I wanted to talk about the fallout. This isn't about the unfortunate series of events that occur over any given season that happens to all teams (i.e. injuries) but how something as profound as "The Play" can have an impact on a dominant franchise 1-yard away from a potential dynasty.

When that EPSN article came out during the offseason, I largely dismissed it as did the players. After all, the goal for any writer is to get clicks or reads. Sensationalism, hyperbole and "Truth-stretching" are often the norm, especially in the world of sports journalism driven by readership.

However, where there's smoke there's always some kind of fire. The Seahawks were built on the foundation of finding scrappy, late round players with a giant chip on their shoulders. Pete has always celebrated individuality (within the confines of the culture concept) and at times it has proven problematic (i.e. player explosions on the sidelines).

I was hoping this team had the character and determination to move beyond the travesty of that final play in XLIX. Now I feel sadly that they do not. As optimistic as I tend to be, I think I have to face the fact that this Championship-Caliber Era has come to an end and we are witnessing the sights and sounds of inevitability right before our eyes.

With Russell Wilson and many of our current players and culture I will always have hope, but I have to finally admit, the window - if not closed - is barely letting any light in anymore.


^ This.

IMO we will at this point never move past this point until we have new coaching leadership in place. Remember what happened after our first SB with Holmgren and the refs issues in that game. The stigma left a really bad affect compounded by the Hutch decision right after the season. It just slowing destroyed the team and in only a few years we were a shell of that first SB team.

It is going to take a complete change in coaching leadership to turn things around again. All who think things are fine are just kidding themselves. This team has slowing regressed since that play and if people would just open their eyes it is clear to see.

The one person though that has to see this is Paul Allen. Only he can do whats best for the team. Just not sure he gets it at all.
 

hawknation2017

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Pete Carroll is a great coach. I don't think we would be in a position to win the division right now, with all the injuries they have had on the defensive side of the ball, with a lesser head coach. The people who want him gone will inevitably miss him when he does retire. It's extremely hard to find great head coaches who have the ability to keep a team competitive week after week.

Having said that, the list of Carroll's offensive coordinators that he has stood by reads like a wall of shame. At this point, I hope he puts competition ahead of his interest in standing by and taking responsibility for his assistant coaches. He needs a better play caller to compete for a Super Bowl next season and take full advantage of Russell Wilson's greatness. It would be best for both sides to move on from Darrell Bevell.

I would also like to see Ken Norton, Jr. return in some capacity to provide a stronger personality on the coaching staff that would hopefully translate into better discipline. He's not a great DC working on his own, but I think he would make Kris Richard better in a shared coordinator role.
 

scutterhawk

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Some of the Media, and Fans are indeed holding the Seahawks to "The Play".
I don't see "The Play" as a definition of who THESE Seahawks Players / Coaches are, NOR do I really believe they've shackled themselves to it......But, maybe if WE keep reminding them? :lol:
 

kf3339

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hawknation2017":1kt7bo54 said:
Pete Carroll is a great coach. I don't think we would be in a position to win the division right now, with all the injuries they have had on the defensive side of the ball, with a lesser head coach. The people who want him gone will inevitably miss him when he does retire. It's extremely hard to find great head coaches who have the ability to keep a team competitive week after week.

Having said that, the list of Carroll's offensive coordinators that he has stood by reads like a wall of shame. At this point, I hope he puts competition ahead of his interest in standing by and taking responsibility for his assistant coaches. He needs a better play caller to compete for a Super Bowl next season and take full advantage of Russell Wilson's greatness. It would be best for both sides to move on from Darrell Bevell.

I would also like to see Ken Norton, Jr. return in some capacity to provide a stronger personality on the coaching staff that would hopefully translate into better discipline. He's not a great DC working on his own, but I think he would make Kris Richard better in a shared coordinator role.

What makes you think that PC would pick any other OC that would be given enough chance to change the offensive philosophy of the team? What happens to Cable and his influence on the offense? Would PC be willing to see how the league has caught up and passed his philosophy bye, and truly change to do what is best for the team?

I don't disagree that PC has been a great coach and will always be grateful for the one SB win. But the truth is that we should have 2 or 3 SB wins right now. That defense and a more creative offense would have gotten us those extra SB wins if not for one person.......PC. He didn't see it and adjust and nothing is going to make that happen going forward with him still here. Sorry, but that is just how I see it.
 

hawknation2017

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kf3339":xmcsbddb said:
hawknation2017":xmcsbddb said:
Pete Carroll is a great coach. I don't think we would be in a position to win the division right now, with all the injuries they have had on the defensive side of the ball, with a lesser head coach. The people who want him gone will inevitably miss him when he does retire. It's extremely hard to find great head coaches who have the ability to keep a team competitive week after week.

Having said that, the list of Carroll's offensive coordinators that he has stood by reads like a wall of shame. At this point, I hope he puts competition ahead of his interest in standing by and taking responsibility for his assistant coaches. He needs a better play caller to compete for a Super Bowl next season and take full advantage of Russell Wilson's greatness. It would be best for both sides to move on from Darrell Bevell.

I would also like to see Ken Norton, Jr. return in some capacity to provide a stronger personality on the coaching staff that would hopefully translate into better discipline. He's not a great DC working on his own, but I think he would make Kris Richard better in a shared coordinator role.

What makes you think that PC would pick any other OC that would be given enough chance to change the offensive philosophy of the team? What happens to Cable and his influence on the offense? Would PC be willing to see how the league has caught up and passed his philosophy bye, and truly change to do what is best for the team?

I don't disagree that PC has been a great coach and will always be grateful for the one SB win. But the truth is that we should have 2 or 3 SB wins right now. That defense and a more creative offense would have gotten us those extra SB wins if not for one person.......PC. He didn't see it and adjust and nothing is going to make that happen going forward with him still here. Sorry, but that is just how I see it.

Bevell has been given an opportunity to change the offensive philosophy, and he has failed. We have not run the ball consistently since the 2013 season. Even in 2014, there were far too many situations where Marshawn was not getting the damn ball. Carroll's offensive philosophy is pretty simple: make things as hard as possible for the defense by being as strong on the ground as you are through the air. Since 2013, we have seen a continued abandonment of the run game by Bevell. We don't even have a fullback now, and all of our TEs are better receivers than blockers. The Bevell experiment has been given a chance, and it has failed. In part, because his route tree is rudimentary, and he doesn't have a sense of offensive flow or taking what the defense gives him. We need a play caller who is better. It's time to move on.

Super Bowls are never guaranteed. All you can do is strive to be the best team you can be, which is what the other 31 teams are trying to do, as well. Don't forget that Carroll constructed this team. Players like Thomas, Sherman, Chancellor, Wagner, and Lynch would never have been Seahawks without Pete Carroll. Without him, I could see a continuation of where we were under Jim Mora, with many seasons falling somewhere between the Niners and the Chargers this year.
 

RussB

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Yes it is true. Some fans deny it but its true. They were 1 yard away from going back to back and beating brady. They were on the verge of a dynasty with an all time great defense. And they blew it, ever since then they are trying to get back to that point and right that wrong but they just cant. They are now aging and its getting harder and harder.
 

StoneCold

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What does it mean to "move on"? I contend that no one completely moves on from anything major that happens in life. It's a pointless exercise and he's only saying because he has air to fill.

Pain is what makes us who we are. It teaches us about how to deal with adversity and appreciate the good times.

[youtube]qJ6td1J0-Us[/youtube]
 

gowazzu02

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This is so stupid.

The correct statement is "Seattle hasn't been back to the Super bowl since the play" Thats it.

That play has no effect at all on our Olines inability to block people.

That play has no effect at all on our star studded Injury report

That play has no effect at all on Paul Richardson getting interfeared with and the refs not calling it

That play has no effect at all on our first draft pick this year being a moron and getting into an ATV accident

That play has no effect at all on our team losing players due to the salary cap

That play has no effect at all on the fact our team was/still is the model franchise and others studying, copying, making it their mission in life to beat us

I can go on but I think you get the point.
 

IrishNW

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I think its obvious we didn't cope properly. Pete's biggest coaching mistake was not firing Bevel after that play. I understand that its probably not fair to put the blame squarely on Bevel, but it should have been done. Instead Pete took the bullet and that wound never healed properly.

That being said time heals everything and its been long enough. I'm pretty confident this team has put that play in the past and is moving forward. Even Richard Sherman has seemed to move on.
 

PaVloVa!8

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gowazzu02":ddjitmyj said:
This is so stupid.

The correct statement is "Seattle hasn't been back to the Super bowl since the play" Thats it.

That play has no effect at all on our Olines inability to block people.

That play has no effect at all on our star studded Injury report

That play has no effect at all on Paul Richardson getting interfeared with and the refs not calling it

That play has no effect at all on our first draft pick this year being a moron and getting into an ATV accident

That play has no effect at all on our team losing players due to the salary cap

That play has no effect at all on the fact our team was/still is the model franchise and others studying, copying, making it their mission in life to beat us

I can go on but I think you get the point.


#PREACH
 

olyfan63

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This is just silly. Of course you don't "recover from" "The Play". Players and coaches just set it aside, forget about it, use it as extra motivation, or whatever, and MOVE ON.

As someone pointed out, we're several years removed and only about 20% of the players who were in SB49 are still on the team. Yes, most of the coaching staff, so they would be the only ones potentially affected.

The real issue is poor drafts and especially the ongoing crappy offensive line. Another huge issue is the rest of the NFL developing a better "book" on the Seahawks, like largely neutralizing the Read-Option, figuring out ways to attack the Pete Carroll defense, etc., and the Seahawks not reacting and adapting as quickly as they need to, being too stubborn about "imposing their will" rather than matching up to each opponent to exploit strengths and weaknesses.

The NFL is a brutally competitive business. Pete & Co have all they can do each week to game plan for the upcoming opponent, prepare the players, analyze matchups, etc.

If Malcolm Butler stumbles and Lockette catches the game winner, I don't think very much is different right now, other than the Seahawks have two Lombardis in the case, and some media storylines change. For example, that 2013-2014 Seahawks defense gets regularly brought up as one of the all-time great defenses, and Brady gets labeled as a choker in the big games, instead of all the knob slobbering that occurred. (Brady gets his redemption from the SB comeback vs. the Falcons)

"The Play" is a non-factor with today's Seahawks team. Poor drafts, injuries, boneheaded coaching at times/failure to adjust and learn, and an all-time crappy O-Line are all real factors, among others.
 
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AROS

AROS

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gowazzu02":1zmlxv2m said:
This is so stupid.

The correct statement is "Seattle hasn't been back to the Super bowl since the play" Thats it.

That play has no effect at all on our Olines inability to block people.

That play has no effect at all on our star studded Injury report

That play has no effect at all on Paul Richardson getting interfeared with and the refs not calling it

That play has no effect at all on our first draft pick this year being a moron and getting into an ATV accident

That play has no effect at all on our team losing players due to the salary cap

That play has no effect at all on the fact our team was/still is the model franchise and others studying, copying, making it their mission in life to beat us

I can go on but I think you get the point.

Yeah and all due respect, I see your points and understand where you are coming from but here's my point to your points:

hiding-head-in-sand-620x250.jpg.jpg


:lol:
 

adeltaY

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I think a lot of guys who are really into stats and facts like to brush off the effects of players' mental states on how they perform on the field. The players and coaches talk about it all the time, so it's probably important.
 
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