Running Game vital to resurgance

nwHawk

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We can talk about cutting, trading and rebuilding the defense all we want, but we MUST rebuild our running game. This will help make some of our growing pains as we developed the next wave of defensive studs. Think about the transform Pete made when he first arrived. We will not develop that dominate mindset again until we control games. We need to shorten games again.

We need to change our oline mentality - get nasty SOBs that are ready for battle. We need to add at least two more legit RBs, and one needs to be a bellcow thumper. Stop playing catch up football!

One fear I have is that we have moved too far with lean athletic lineman because of Wilson's "keep the play alive" style. The future will be interesting.
 

pittpnthrs

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Change the scheme and the results will follow.
 

hawknation2017

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The biggest problem with the running game has been the incredibly poor play of the running backs. Thomas Rawls and Eddie Lacy have been dreadful, making terrible reads and slamming head first into piles. When Mike Davis has gotten the ball, he has been relatively effective, which makes Rawls/Lacy look even worse.

The run blocking has improved since we replaced Rees Odhiambo (the worst starting lineman in the NFL) with Duane Brown. The two worst run blockers we have now are the guards: Ethan Pocic (poor leverage and not strong enough) and Luke Joeckel (who still looks non-explosive and probably hurt).

Alex Collins looked great in the preseason (so did Mike Davis), but Rawls, Lacy, and Prosise were automatically entered into the top of the depth chart without having to demonstrate any actual ability in the preseason. We are lucky that no one poached Davis from our practice squad.

We need a really good RB next year!
 

Grahamhawker

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Agree. Fixing the run game is paramount.

It will be an interesting off season. That's all I got.
 

hawknation2017

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Can we count on Chris Carson? We could not count on Thomas Rawls after a similar rookie season. I think we need to draft a franchise RB.
 

IrishNW

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hawknation2017":2x1xwqhg said:
The biggest problem with the running game has been the incredibly poor play of the running backs. Thomas Rawls and Eddie Lacy have been dreadful, making terrible reads and slamming head first into piles. When Mike Davis has gotten the ball, he has been relatively effective, which makes Rawls/Lacy look even worse.

The run blocking has improved since we replaced Rees Odhiambo (the worst starting lineman in the NFL) with Duane Brown. The two worst run blockers we have now are the guards: Ethan Pocic (poor leverage and not strong enough) and Luke Joeckel (who still looks non-explosive and probably hurt).

Alex Collins looked great in the preseason (so did Mike Davis), but Rawls, Lacy, and Prosise were automatically entered into the top of the depth chart without having to demonstrate any actual ability in the preseason. We are lucky that no one poached Davis from our practice squad.

We need a really good RB next year!

I agree with this 100%

I thought Collins and Davis looked better then lacy, rawls and procsise. Collins fumbled against the vikings and pretty much killed his chances because Pete will not tolerate fumbles.

Its obvious the "always compete" does not apply to everyone, and that's probably why Pete has lost this team. I don't think its because Pete is fake, its because he has this unwavering believe that he can fix people and will value a players upside over production.
 

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Part of the issue nobody seems to be talking about is injury at the RB position. Going back to Lynch’s final year the Seahawks have not been able to keep a RB healthy. That’s three years running! Look at what committing to the run has done for the Saints! The most important thing JS/PC can do this year is finding a bell cow RB! Bring Carson back Davis can stay as well as McKissic but everyone else need to go! I’m ok with C.J. getting another chance but he should not be relied on and cut loose if injured again! I’m completely ok with drafting multiple RB’s this year! Three years of a broken running game is enough!
 

pittpnthrs

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Alex Collins on route for 1000 yards for Baltimore, cant make the team in Seattle.

Its not the players.
 

hawknation2017

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pittpnthrs":2ap9srvz said:
Alex Collins on route for 1000 yards for Baltimore, cant make the team in Seattle.

Its not the players.

After a poor rookie year, Collins improved a lot and ran the ball extremely well in the preseason. They weren't willing to cut bait with Eddie Lacy ($$$), Thomas Rawls (because of his rookie year), or C.J. Prosise (draft investment). So it came down to Collins or Chris Carson, then Carson gets hurt.

It's definitely the players. It's just that, without the benefit of hindsight, it was hard to imagine Lacy and Rawls would be such spectacular failures. They probably thought Collins would make the practice squad, along with Mike Davis.
 

pittpnthrs

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Alex Collins would not be doing what he's doing here in Seattle. Its the scheme.

Guess we'll just have to agree to disagree.
 

hawknation2017

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pittpnthrs":34h1fg41 said:
Alex Collins would not be doing what he's doing here in Seattle. Its the scheme.

Guess we'll just have to agree to disagree.

Collins did it here in the preseason, as did Mike Davis. Chris Carson did it here before he got hurt. Thomas Rawls did it here as a rookie, before his body gave up on him. Seahawks averaged 142 rushing yards per game in 2015.
 

Cyrus12

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If rawls procise and lacey come back next year you can count on another year of not being in the playoffs.
 

hawknation2017

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Cyrus12":2n9jn1ve said:
If rawls procise and lacey come back next year you can count on another year of not being in the playoffs.

Rawls/Lacy are done, I think. I would keep Prosise on the PUP list (not counting against the active roster limit) until he proves he can stay healthy.
 

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nwHawk":1yfx4ew8 said:
We can talk about cutting, trading and rebuilding the defense all we want, but we MUST rebuild our running game. This will help make some of our growing pains as we developed the next wave of defensive studs. Think about the transform Pete made when he first arrived. We will not develop that dominate mindset again until we control games. We need to shorten games again.

We need to change our oline mentality - get nasty SOBs that are ready for battle. We need to add at least two more legit RBs, and one needs to be a bellcow thumper. Stop playing catch up football!

One fear I have is that we have moved too far with lean athletic lineman because of Wilson's "keep the play alive" style. The future will be interesting.


Riiiight its Wilson fault, LOL
 

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I know I'm not the only one that recognizes that the Seahawks now have a viable running game, with Mike Davis and the eventual return of Chris Carson. It's been a long time coming, but I think that its apparent to most, that aren't blinded by hatred for the man, that Tom Cable has assembled a pretty capable bunch of guys, who are now playing like a complete offensive unit.

The additions of Duane Brown and Luke Joekel to our line, has allowed other players to assume the positions they were better suited to play, and with their veteran influences on some of the youngsters on the Oline, they now have an offense that can open up the gaps and creases that our running backs have lacked for so long.

Even at the end of Marshawn's days with the Seahawks, he was getting beaten up and injured trying to make something happen from nothing. Thomas Rawls, Lacy, and every other back in between now and then, has gone the same route as Lynch did, and have reaped the same dismal results as he did in his final season with us, which was injury upon injury.

The Seahawks have a long history of scouting out gems in the rough, that others have overlooked or not thought worth the time and effort to develop, and from that bunch of less than's and would be rejects, they have assembled some of the greatest offenses and defenses in the NFL. That is evidenced by other teams that try and replicate our styles of play.

We haven't gotten the opportunity to play out our running game, in recent games, because our opponents have buried us point wise, early on, and left us having to revert to our only hope, being a passing attack, to try and get the scores back under control and give ourselves a fighting chance to win. That worked a few times, but that style of play comes with a lot of inherent risks, and we have seen the evidence of that to the negative as well.

Last week was about as bad as it can get for a team. If ever there was a text book example of Murphy's Law at work, "If anything can go wrong, it will go wrong, and always at the worst possible moment", in this game make that a plural, moment's, it was a case study specimen for Mr. Murphy.

From the very first play of the game, it was obvious that the Football Gods where not going to cut us an ounce of slack, with the completed 3rd down pass that would have given us great field position, and a 1st and 10, being knocked looses from the arms of receiver, who has always demonstrated incredible ball control, it set the stage for what would come our way the rest of the game.

One damn crazy messed up play after another, and the Rams didn't wasted time capitalizing on all our screw ups. I don't know if Russell was rattled or what, only he knows the answer to that one, but he sure didn't play like his normal self, throughout the rest of the game. The harder he tried to catch up the further behind we got.

The passes to Richardson, who was running one route and Russell was throwing the ball for an completely different route. If Russell had been connecting well with other plays to his other targets, I would have to consider if Richardson just, didn't hear the play call right, and was running the wrong route, but when it happened over and over again, I dismissed that idea.

Richardson has been the most on target receiver on the team short of maybe Doug Baldwin, and followed by a close second in Tyler Lockett, who I believe, like Jimmy Graham, is still on the mend and not back at a 100% yet. Russell couldn't seem to get his rhythm, or tempo going at any point in the game.

Russell just wasn't able to pull any rabbits out of his magic hat in this game, I don't think he ever gave up, its not in his vocabulary, but he surely had to be feeling about as embarrassed and humiliated and beaten as a human being can feel, and I'm sure that it was foreign territory for him. You would have to be a piece of wood to not be rattled by what was unfolding on the field last Sunday, in order to not be affected by it.

The Saying "On any given Sunday", never rang truer than it did for the Seahawks and Rams for that matter last Sunday. We are all entitled to a bad day once in awhile, and that is what I've had to write this game, and the one before it, off to. The Seahawks obviously have the talent and skill sets to beat the best teams in the NFL and have proven that, even without Kam, Sherm, Cliff, and a few others able to play their parts.

The Seahawks are a well coached team, with an assembly of highly talented, and very capable players at every position. Does it hurt us when some of our talents go out of the game injured? sure, it does, especially so many so close together, not so much because their replacements aren't as talented or capable, than the players they are replacing, but because its a team sport, and as individuals, they need time playing as a part of a team. in order to get in sync, and be able to meet up to their own expectations of themselves, and the expectations of their coaches, teammates and fans.

I look to see the Seahawks execute and stick to a running game, through out the rest of the season, provided that our defense can hold our opponents to a minimum in scoring, and doesn't leave our offense trailing by a large margin, not saying that the offense hasn't contributed to a lot of their own demise, and find themselves, once again playing desperation catchup football.

In that frame of mine, is when all the interceptions, blown pass routes, crazy scrambles with sacks, negative yards start adding up, and leaving us with unachievable 3rd down conversion numbers, mounting holding penalties, because Russell needs more time, than any offense can reasonably give their QB, in order to set up the fail Mary sort of passes we need to convert, along with all the other maddening things that can and do go wrong when they are forced to play that kind of football.

I think that the Seahawks, at this very moment in time, are on the cusp of genuine greatness, as crazy as that might sound to some of you, their defense is solid and capable, if their minds are right, and they choose to believe in themselves and each other. The same holds true for our offense, we have some really great talent across the board, on offense, they need to pull together, trust in each other and they can do battle with the best in the game and beat any team out there when they are in the right mind set.

A lot of folks fail to recall, that the year we made it to the super bowl, and won it, and the year we made it to the super bowl and lost it, under Pete Carroll's guidance, that luck and fate played a huge role in getting us there. Its human nature to remember things through rose colored glasses, where everyone played like a super star, and forget that we caught some lucky breaks here and there, and that calls went our way, when they just as easily could have gone the other, that put us in a position to play for all the marbles. The place we are in right now isn't all that different than where we have been almost every season with Pete. Now is not the time to abandon ship, its time to unite and stay the course, until every last opportunity has passed us by.

I still believe in Pete Carroll and I still believe in this team. They have had some time to develop some cohesiveness and familiarity with each other the past few weeks. I think that with some focus, combined with a few breaks and a little luck good old fashion luck, or as I like to call it the magic of the 12th man spirit at play, we could very well find ourselves taking the field on Super Bowl Sunday in 2018. No Fear, Never Give Up, Always Believe, it's the heart and soul of the Seahawks.

Go Seahawks !
 

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pacific101":1u9o3ppz said:
I know I'm not the only one that recognizes that the Seahawks now have a viable running game, with Mike Davis and the eventual return of Chris Carson. It's been a long time coming, but I think that its apparent to most, that aren't blinded by hatred for the man, that Tom Cable has assembled a pretty capable bunch of guys, who are now playing like a complete offensive unit.

The additions of Duane Brown and Luke Joekel to our line, has allowed other players to assume the positions they were better suited to play, and with their veteran influences on some of the youngsters on the Oline, they now have an offense that can open up the gaps and creases that our running backs have lacked for so long.

Even at the end of Marshawn's days with the Seahawks, he was getting beaten up and injured trying to make something happen from nothing. Thomas Rawls, Lacy, and every other back in between now and then, has gone the same route as Lynch did, and have reaped the same dismal results as he did in his final season with us, which was injury upon injury.

The Seahawks have a long history of scouting out gems in the rough, that others have overlooked or not thought worth the time and effort to develop, and from that bunch of less than's and would be rejects, they have assembled some of the greatest offenses and defenses in the NFL. That is evidenced by other teams that try and replicate our styles of play.

We haven't gotten the opportunity to play out our running game, in recent games, because our opponents have buried us point wise, early on, and left us having to revert to our only hope, being a passing attack, to try and get the scores back under control and give ourselves a fighting chance to win. That worked a few times, but that style of play comes with a lot of inherent risks, and we have seen the evidence of that to the negative as well.

Last week was about as bad as it can get for a team. If ever there was a text book example of Murphy's Law at work, "If anything can go wrong, it will go wrong, and always at the worst possible moment", in this game make that a plural, moment's, it was a case study specimen for Mr. Murphy.

From the very first play of the game, it was obvious that the Football Gods where not going to cut us an ounce of slack, with the completed 3rd down pass that would have given us great field position, and a 1st and 10, being knocked looses from the arms of receiver, who has always demonstrated incredible ball control, it set the stage for what would come our way the rest of the game.

One damn crazy messed up play after another, and the Rams didn't wasted time capitalizing on all our screw ups. I don't know if Russell was rattled or what, only he knows the answer to that one, but he sure didn't play like his normal self, throughout the rest of the game. The harder he tried to catch up the further behind we got.

The passes to Richardson, who was running one route and Russell was throwing the ball for an completely different route. If Russell had been connecting well with other plays to his other targets, I would have to consider if Richardson just, didn't hear the play call right, and was running the wrong route, but when it happened over and over again, I dismissed that idea.

Richardson has been the most on target receiver on the team short of maybe Doug Baldwin, and followed by a close second in Tyler Lockett, who I believe, like Jimmy Graham, is still on the mend and not back at a 100% yet. Russell couldn't seem to get his rhythm, or tempo going at any point in the game.

Russell just wasn't able to pull any rabbits out of his magic hat in this game, I don't think he ever gave up, its not in his vocabulary, but he surely had to be feeling about as embarrassed and humiliated and beaten as a human being can feel, and I'm sure that it was foreign territory for him. You would have to be a piece of wood to not be rattled by what was unfolding on the field last Sunday, in order to not be affected by it.

The Saying "On any given Sunday", never rang truer than it did for the Seahawks and Rams for that matter last Sunday. We are all entitled to a bad day once in awhile, and that is what I've had to write this game, and the one before it, off to. The Seahawks obviously have the talent and skill sets to beat the best teams in the NFL and have proven that, even without Kam, Sherm, Cliff, and a few others able to play their parts.

The Seahawks are a well coached team, with an assembly of highly talented, and very capable players at every position. Does it hurt us when some of our talents go out of the game injured? sure, it does, especially so many so close together, not so much because their replacements aren't as talented or capable, than the players they are replacing, but because its a team sport, and as individuals, they need time playing as a part of a team. in order to get in sync, and be able to meet up to their own expectations of themselves, and the expectations of their coaches, teammates and fans.

I look to see the Seahawks execute and stick to a running game, through out the rest of the season, provided that our defense can hold our opponents to a minimum in scoring, and doesn't leave our offense trailing by a large margin, not saying that the offense hasn't contributed to a lot of their own demise, and find themselves, once again playing desperation catchup football.

In that frame of mine, is when all the interceptions, blown pass routes, crazy scrambles with sacks, negative yards start adding up, and leaving us with unachievable 3rd down conversion numbers, mounting holding penalties, because Russell needs more time, than any offense can reasonably give their QB, in order to set up the fail Mary sort of passes we need to convert, along with all the other maddening things that can and do go wrong when they are forced to play that kind of football.

I think that the Seahawks, at this very moment in time, are on the cusp of genuine greatness, as crazy as that might sound to some of you, their defense is solid and capable, if their minds are right, and they choose to believe in themselves and each other. The same holds true for our offense, we have some really great talent across the board, on offense, they need to pull together, trust in each other and they can do battle with the best in the game and beat any team out there when they are in the right mind set.

A lot of folks fail to recall, that the year we made it to the super bowl, and won it, and the year we made it to the super bowl and lost it, under Pete Carroll's guidance, that luck and fate played a huge role in getting us there. Its human nature to remember things through rose colored glasses, where everyone played like a super star, and forget that we caught some lucky breaks here and there, and that calls went our way, when they just as easily could have gone the other, that put us in a position to play for all the marbles. The place we are in right now isn't all that different than where we have been almost every season with Pete. Now is not the time to abandon ship, its time to unite and stay the course, until every last opportunity has passed us by.

I still believe in Pete Carroll and I still believe in this team. They have had some time to develop some cohesiveness and familiarity with each other the past few weeks. I think that with some focus, combined with a few breaks and a little luck good old fashion luck, or as I like to call it the magic of the 12th man spirit at play, we could very well find ourselves taking the field on Super Bowl Sunday in 2018. No Fear, Never Give Up, Always Believe, it's the heart and soul of the Seahawks.

Go Seahawks !

Okay your kidding right? lets see were to start oh like being 4th worst in YPC on First down, Being top 5 in hits, hurries and sacks on the QB. I can go on and on this oline is far from even avg, and a large part of it that is on cable. oh as to the last game read this https://www.fieldgulls.com/2017/12/...s-angeles-rams-russell-wilson-pass-protection
 

pittpnthrs

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pacific101":1o39qrr6 said:
I know I'm not the only one that recognizes that the Seahawks now have a viable running game, with Mike Davis and the eventual return of Chris Carson. It's been a long time coming, but I think that its apparent to most, that aren't blinded by hatred for the man, that Tom Cable has assembled a pretty capable bunch of guys, who are now playing like a complete offensive unit.

The additions of Duane Brown and Luke Joekel to our line, has allowed other players to assume the positions they were better suited to play, and with their veteran influences on some of the youngsters on the Oline, they now have an offense that can open up the gaps and creases that our running backs have lacked for so long.

Even at the end of Marshawn's days with the Seahawks, he was getting beaten up and injured trying to make something happen from nothing. Thomas Rawls, Lacy, and every other back in between now and then, has gone the same route as Lynch did, and have reaped the same dismal results as he did in his final season with us, which was injury upon injury.

The Seahawks have a long history of scouting out gems in the rough, that others have overlooked or not thought worth the time and effort to develop, and from that bunch of less than's and would be rejects, they have assembled some of the greatest offenses and defenses in the NFL. That is evidenced by other teams that try and replicate our styles of play.

We haven't gotten the opportunity to play out our running game, in recent games, because our opponents have buried us point wise, early on, and left us having to revert to our only hope, being a passing attack, to try and get the scores back under control and give ourselves a fighting chance to win. That worked a few times, but that style of play comes with a lot of inherent risks, and we have seen the evidence of that to the negative as well.

Last week was about as bad as it can get for a team. If ever there was a text book example of Murphy's Law at work, "If anything can go wrong, it will go wrong, and always at the worst possible moment", in this game make that a plural, moment's, it was a case study specimen for Mr. Murphy.

From the very first play of the game, it was obvious that the Football Gods where not going to cut us an ounce of slack, with the completed 3rd down pass that would have given us great field position, and a 1st and 10, being knocked looses from the arms of receiver, who has always demonstrated incredible ball control, it set the stage for what would come our way the rest of the game.

One damn crazy messed up play after another, and the Rams didn't wasted time capitalizing on all our screw ups. I don't know if Russell was rattled or what, only he knows the answer to that one, but he sure didn't play like his normal self, throughout the rest of the game. The harder he tried to catch up the further behind we got.

The passes to Richardson, who was running one route and Russell was throwing the ball for an completely different route. If Russell had been connecting well with other plays to his other targets, I would have to consider if Richardson just, didn't hear the play call right, and was running the wrong route, but when it happened over and over again, I dismissed that idea.

Richardson has been the most on target receiver on the team short of maybe Doug Baldwin, and followed by a close second in Tyler Lockett, who I believe, like Jimmy Graham, is still on the mend and not back at a 100% yet. Russell couldn't seem to get his rhythm, or tempo going at any point in the game.

Russell just wasn't able to pull any rabbits out of his magic hat in this game, I don't think he ever gave up, its not in his vocabulary, but he surely had to be feeling about as embarrassed and humiliated and beaten as a human being can feel, and I'm sure that it was foreign territory for him. You would have to be a piece of wood to not be rattled by what was unfolding on the field last Sunday, in order to not be affected by it.

The Saying "On any given Sunday", never rang truer than it did for the Seahawks and Rams for that matter last Sunday. We are all entitled to a bad day once in awhile, and that is what I've had to write this game, and the one before it, off to. The Seahawks obviously have the talent and skill sets to beat the best teams in the NFL and have proven that, even without Kam, Sherm, Cliff, and a few others able to play their parts.

The Seahawks are a well coached team, with an assembly of highly talented, and very capable players at every position. Does it hurt us when some of our talents go out of the game injured? sure, it does, especially so many so close together, not so much because their replacements aren't as talented or capable, than the players they are replacing, but because its a team sport, and as individuals, they need time playing as a part of a team. in order to get in sync, and be able to meet up to their own expectations of themselves, and the expectations of their coaches, teammates and fans.

I look to see the Seahawks execute and stick to a running game, through out the rest of the season, provided that our defense can hold our opponents to a minimum in scoring, and doesn't leave our offense trailing by a large margin, not saying that the offense hasn't contributed to a lot of their own demise, and find themselves, once again playing desperation catchup football.

In that frame of mine, is when all the interceptions, blown pass routes, crazy scrambles with sacks, negative yards start adding up, and leaving us with unachievable 3rd down conversion numbers, mounting holding penalties, because Russell needs more time, than any offense can reasonably give their QB, in order to set up the fail Mary sort of passes we need to convert, along with all the other maddening things that can and do go wrong when they are forced to play that kind of football.

I think that the Seahawks, at this very moment in time, are on the cusp of genuine greatness, as crazy as that might sound to some of you, their defense is solid and capable, if their minds are right, and they choose to believe in themselves and each other. The same holds true for our offense, we have some really great talent across the board, on offense, they need to pull together, trust in each other and they can do battle with the best in the game and beat any team out there when they are in the right mind set.

A lot of folks fail to recall, that the year we made it to the super bowl, and won it, and the year we made it to the super bowl and lost it, under Pete Carroll's guidance, that luck and fate played a huge role in getting us there. Its human nature to remember things through rose colored glasses, where everyone played like a super star, and forget that we caught some lucky breaks here and there, and that calls went our way, when they just as easily could have gone the other, that put us in a position to play for all the marbles. The place we are in right now isn't all that different than where we have been almost every season with Pete. Now is not the time to abandon ship, its time to unite and stay the course, until every last opportunity has passed us by.

I still believe in Pete Carroll and I still believe in this team. They have had some time to develop some cohesiveness and familiarity with each other the past few weeks. I think that with some focus, combined with a few breaks and a little luck good old fashion luck, or as I like to call it the magic of the 12th man spirit at play, we could very well find ourselves taking the field on Super Bowl Sunday in 2018. No Fear, Never Give Up, Always Believe, it's the heart and soul of the Seahawks.

Go Seahawks !

So many things here that I disagree with, but i'll only touch on a few.

Running game - No we don't have a viable running game. I don't know why people want to proclaim Carson and Davis the answers to our woes when they haven't done anything to dictate that. They are somewhat better than the rest of our hot garbage, but that's not saying much. Give me a single 100 yard rushing game from either one of them and then maybe i'll feel a little better. Our Oline still sucks also. I don't care if we had a Walter Peyton or Barry Sanders in their prime, they would struggle behind that dumpster fire.

Highly talented and very capable players at every position? Let me introduce you to our offensive line. Its truly offensive.

On the cusp of greatness? WHAT? The regression this team has taken the past 3 years is for real. Its going to get worse before it gets better. I like your enthusiasm but your going to look back after the next season or two and wonder what you were thinking.
 

Ambrose83

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The preseason ? Lol performing well then means literally nothing. It's the line and coaching... period .
 

Sports Hernia

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I think it’s a bit of everything. Coaching, scheme, O-line, players, drafting, scouting etc.
 
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