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Pick #120 TE Will Dissly

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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sat Apr 28, 2018 6:19 pm
  • Jville wrote:Yes indeed, Miller came out of college a little more explosive and further along as a receiver. But, I don't see Dissly as a niche player or specialist. His will and ability to be very versatile and line up in multiple pre-snap positions is going to pay big dividends going forward IMO.


    About as versatile as Ed Dickson who of which he will be behind on the depth chart.

    He will be the backup to the backup, of a not so stellar TE group. Sorry if I'm not blown away by this pick. All in all Seattle had an awesome draft, but this pick is the only actual "reach" of their draft.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sat Apr 28, 2018 6:33 pm
  • Fade wrote:
    Jville wrote:Yes indeed, Miller came out of college a little more explosive and further along as a receiver. But, I don't see Dissly as a niche player or specialist. His will and ability to be very versatile and line up in multiple pre-snap positions is going to pay big dividends going forward IMO.


    About as versatile as Ed Dickson who of which he will be behind on the depth chart.

    He will be the backup to the backup, of a not so stellar TE group. Sorry if I'm not blown away by this pick. All in all Seattle had an awesome draft, but this pick is the only actual "reach" of their draft.


    Fair enough. Although, I do think the difference can be found in the contrasting what you like at tight end with what Pete and John value and are building at that position group.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sat Apr 28, 2018 6:40 pm
  • nategreat wrote:Can I request to have my user name changed? I don't want to be confused with this other Nate the Great guy and his outlandish thoughts which I in no way agree with.


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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sat Apr 28, 2018 6:41 pm
  • I didn't watch Dissly with much intent last UW season. After reading his draft profiles, the summary conclusion is that he has "tremendous strength" as a blocker, with nice soft hands as an improving pass catcher- basically an OLman @TE.

    I think P&J probably saw that he really might be that much better as a blocker than any other TE, so they just went and got him. Gettin serious about the run game.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sat Apr 28, 2018 7:09 pm
  • Don't know why a all around TE finally would be called a niche guy, Graham was a niche guy, blockers that can't catch are niche guys.

    He has soft hands so can get better at receiving and route running, Baldwin working with him alone can improve that, willingness to hit people and block is harder to find and teach.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sat Apr 28, 2018 7:19 pm
  • Seattle wants a vertical TE as well, and Dissly can be a great compliment to that.

    Unfortunately you can only fix so much in one off-season. O-Line and playmakers at WR & TE will come next year.

    This year the clear emphasis was getting more physical run blockers, and a better running back.

    I get it, and am on board with the plan. 3rd string TE in the 4th rd, with a future of being the backup doesn't scream great value in the 4th rd to me. If you think he can be a starter then you have to do a lot of projecting because he isn't there yet. The definition of a reach.

    It's the 4th rd curse, E.J. Wilson, Kris Durham, Chris Harper, Kevin Norwood, Mark Glowinski, Rhees Odihambo (last 3rd didn't have a 4th that year.) Tedric Thompson (still early on him, I don't like him at FS personally. Not enough speed.)

    I chalk it up to a quirk on how JS does his draft board. The way he sets it up leads to having reaches in the 4th rd.
    He has a horizontal board. He looks at the position of need that has the fewest players remaining in the 4th, and that is who he drafts.

    Which leads to these results.

    After you get passed the 4th, and have taken your "reach" player the horizontal board opens up, and you can just take who you like, and that is why their 5th rounders almost always end up better than their 4th rounders.

    I keep waiting for JS to adjust this... but nope, it continues.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sat Apr 28, 2018 7:29 pm
  • So, I'm not going to debate anyone on when Dissly was drafted. I'm not going to be debate anyone that Zach Miller was a very good pass catching TE when he played with the Raiders.

    Because, I don't care. What I care is finding players with specific abilities they're good at, so they don't have to think. They just play fast. They practice fast.

    Do you know how many receptions Miller had the year we won the SB? 33. That's it. Just 33 receptions. Beastmode had more with 36. We won the Super Bowl because we were a run first, play action pass team second. Everyone knew we were going to run the ball and Miller could be considered the sixth linemen.

    How many times did you shake your head when you saw Graham or Willson whiff on a block or get manhandled on a run play? Not anymore with Dickson or Dissly on the field. So I don't think anyone is going to complain that Dissly was selected in the fourth round when his block opens a hole for Carson or Penny.

    I don't know about you, but I want to be the team that imposed their will on the opposing team. I liked the ground and pound, bullies on the field team and if Dissly ability to run block helps build that type of presence. Great.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sat Apr 28, 2018 7:44 pm
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sat Apr 28, 2018 7:53 pm
  • truehawksfan wrote:So, I'm not going to debate anyone on when Dissly was drafted. I'm not going to be debate anyone that Zach Miller was a very good pass catching TE when he played with the Raiders.

    Because, I don't care. What I care is finding players with specific abilities they're good at, so they don't have to think. They just play fast. They practice fast.

    Do you know how many receptions Miller had the year we won the SB? 33. That's it. Just 33 receptions. Beastmode had more with 36. We won the Super Bowl because we were a run first, play action pass team second. Everyone knew we were going to run the ball and Miller could be considered the sixth linemen.

    How many times did you shake your head when you saw Graham or Willson whiff on a block or get manhandled on a run play? Not anymore with Dickson or Dissly on the field. So I don't think anyone is going to complain that Dissly was selected in the fourth round when his block opens a hole for Carson or Penny.

    I don't know about you, but I want to be the team that imposed their will on the opposing team. I liked the ground and pound, bullies on the field team and if Dissly ability to run block helps build that type of presence. Great.


    He got Bevell'd. Zach would of had 50 receptions that year with a different OC.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sat Apr 28, 2018 7:56 pm
  • truehawksfan wrote:So, I'm not going to debate anyone on when Dissly was drafted. I'm not going to be debate anyone that Zach Miller was a very good pass catching TE when he played with the Raiders.

    Because, I don't care. What I care is finding players with specific abilities they're good at, so they don't have to think. They just play fast. They practice fast.

    Do you know how many receptions Miller had the year we won the SB? 33. That's it. Just 33 receptions. Beastmode had more with 36. We won the Super Bowl because we were a run first, play action pass team second. Everyone knew we were going to run the ball and Miller could be considered the sixth linemen.

    How many times did you shake your head when you saw Graham or Willson whiff on a block or get manhandled on a run play? Not anymore with Dickson or Dissly on the field. So I don't think anyone is going to complain that Dissly was selected in the fourth round when his block opens a hole for Carson or Penny.

    I don't know about you, but I want to be the team that imposed their will on the opposing team. I liked the ground and pound, bullies on the field team and if Dissly ability to run block helps build that type of presence. Great.


    Exactly! Do your job and block and get maybe 3-4 balls thrown your way. Catch those balls for 1st downs.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sat Apr 28, 2018 7:58 pm
  • Fade wrote:
    truehawksfan wrote:So, I'm not going to debate anyone on when Dissly was drafted. I'm not going to be debate anyone that Zach Miller was a very good pass catching TE when he played with the Raiders.

    Because, I don't care. What I care is finding players with specific abilities they're good at, so they don't have to think. They just play fast. They practice fast.

    Do you know how many receptions Miller had the year we won the SB? 33. That's it. Just 33 receptions. Beastmode had more with 36. We won the Super Bowl because we were a run first, play action pass team second. Everyone knew we were going to run the ball and Miller could be considered the sixth linemen.

    How many times did you shake your head when you saw Graham or Willson whiff on a block or get manhandled on a run play? Not anymore with Dickson or Dissly on the field. So I don't think anyone is going to complain that Dissly was selected in the fourth round when his block opens a hole for Carson or Penny.

    I don't know about you, but I want to be the team that imposed their will on the opposing team. I liked the ground and pound, bullies on the field team and if Dissly ability to run block helps build that type of presence. Great.


    He got Bevell'd. Zach would of had 50 receptions that year with a different OC.


    So an extra 1 per game?
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sat Apr 28, 2018 8:13 pm
  • Loving all the solid posts in this thread, point, counter-point, about FOOTBALL STUFF that MATTERS, and what it reveals about where this team is going.

    The main thing I noticed about Dissley was what Fade also brought out, Dissley had a vert of 28, while Miller had a vert of 34. All their other speed and agility numbers are so similar, it's like they're the same guy but with slightly different timings from run to run.

    Miller's vertical of 34 inches vs. Dissly's vertical of 28 inches... 6 inches LESS than Miller--that strikes me as a BIG athletic difference. Does Miller (in his prime) really have that much more vertical explosiveness than Dissley?
    If so, what plays will it matter on, that MIller could make, going up for and bringing down a ball that Dissley wouldn't get, and might go over his head for a pick?

    Or, do people think that 6 inch difference was just a measurement/test taking/test coaching issue, where Dissley bungled the test and there really may not be more than an inch or so "true" difference in their verts?

    FWIW, I noticed Luke Willson consistently had major trouble catching balls where he had to reach back and and up a little bit, on routes to the sideline. Russell had to make and adjustment to not throw it to that location. (Similar to the catch Foles made for a TD in the Super Bowl, but harder)
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sat Apr 28, 2018 8:19 pm
  • This pick will do wonders for the RO. Looking forward to a new OC that will enlist subterfuge.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sat Apr 28, 2018 8:25 pm
  • If they want to try a jump ball in the red zone, Vannett & Dickson would probably be better options.

    They could have used a big WR.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sat Apr 28, 2018 8:31 pm
  • olyfan63 wrote:Loving all the solid posts in this thread, point, counter-point, about FOOTBALL STUFF that MATTERS, and what it reveals about where this team is going.

    The main thing I noticed about Dissley was what Fade also brought out, Dissley had a vert of 28, while Miller had a vert of 34. All their other speed and agility numbers are so similar, it's like they're the same guy but with slightly different timings from run to run.

    Miller's vertical of 34 inches vs. Dissly's vertical of 28 inches... 6 inches LESS than Miller--that strikes me as a BIG athletic difference. Does Miller (in his prime) really have that much more vertical explosiveness than Dissley?
    If so, what plays will it matter on, that MIller could make, going up for and bringing down a ball that Dissley wouldn't get, and might go over his head for a pick?

    Or, do people think that 6 inch difference was just a measurement/test taking/test coaching issue, where Dissley bungled the test and there really may not be more than an inch or so "true" difference in their verts?

    FWIW, I noticed Luke Willson consistently had major trouble catching balls where he had to reach back and and up a little bit, on routes to the sideline. Russell had to make and adjustment to not throw it to that location. (Similar to the catch Foles made for a TD in the Super Bowl, but harder)



    Jumping high isn't what TE's normally do, vertical also is important to explosiveness out of a stance however and drive engagement, now as you said he may just be a guy that simply can't jump standing still and blew it but has good explosive stance, if his blocking was bad I would say we blew it because he has to get out of his stance to engage as a blocker, but that is not the case.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sat Apr 28, 2018 8:39 pm
  • Taking a runblocking TE in the 4th, is like taking a center with the 1st overall pick. Even if he is a stud, it is the wrong choice due to positional value, and the ability to find great players at that position much later in the draft.

    This was a scarcity pick due to how John Schneider sets up his draft board. Nothing more, nothing less.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sat Apr 28, 2018 8:51 pm
  • Fade wrote:Taking a runblocking TE in the 4th, is like taking a center with the 1st overall pick. Even if he is a stud, it is the wrong choice due to positional value, and the ability to find great players at that position much later in the draft.

    This was a scarcity pick due to how John Schneider sets up his draft board. Nothing more, nothing less.


    Supply was nonexistent for good blocking TEs. The position continues to become more and more finesse at the college level.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sat Apr 28, 2018 9:00 pm
  • That's the trend the league keeps talking about.

    What I keep hearing is that there is now a scarcity of well rounded tight ends coming out of college that can both block and catch. Most that are drafted are just big receivers teams hope they can motivate to block.

    Well rounded tight ends are a scarcity pick. So any team that wants a well rounded tight end is going to have to pay.

    EDIT: By the way ..... Will Dissly is listed at 6-foot-4 and 265 pounds. That is an outstanding match up size for a team that wants to assert it's physical will on an opponent.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sat Apr 28, 2018 9:28 pm
  • chris98251 wrote:Don't know why a all around TE finally would be called a niche guy, Graham was a niche guy, blockers that can't catch are niche guys.

    He has soft hands so can get better at receiving and route running, Baldwin working with him alone can improve that, willingness to hit people and block is harder to find and teach.


    I would like to remind you that this is a drug free environment, and I would hate to question your integrity.

    But could you direct me to the scouting reports that have him as an all around TE?

    All I've read is excellent runblocker, #2 TE potential, lacks athleticism, special teamer. 6-7 rd.

    Show me the receipts please.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sat Apr 28, 2018 9:31 pm


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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sat Apr 28, 2018 9:34 pm
  • I like this pick. I think reestablishing the run game was #1 priority this offseason. This helps tremendously. Could you image if Dixon got hurt. Vannett and Swoops around have been a huge weakness.

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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sat Apr 28, 2018 9:37 pm
  • Dissly has great hands. He'll fit in well. 4th rated TE in a great TE class. Good pick but also a real need. From what Pete and JS have been saying they want players on the field who can do everything. No more broadcasting to the defense what's coming. The RBs will all be able to run, block and catch. Same with the TEs.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sat Apr 28, 2018 9:54 pm
  • hawknation2018 wrote:
    Supply was nonexistent for good blocking TEs. The position continues to become more and more finesse at the college level.


    Based on that logic they should have loaded up on O-Lineman as that position group talent wise is near non-existant.

    In other words, a reach is still a reach. regardless of scarcity.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sat Apr 28, 2018 10:11 pm
  • If he can turn out to be Zach Miller II....I'm thinking that we might have a good chance to be on top in our Division.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sat Apr 28, 2018 10:28 pm
  • Fade wrote:
    hawknation2018 wrote:
    Supply was nonexistent for good blocking TEs. The position continues to become more and more finesse at the college level.


    Based on that logic they should have loaded up on O-Lineman as that position group talent wise is near non-existant.

    In other words, a reach is still a reach. regardless of scarcity.


    Of course they should have drafted offensive linemen higher. It's the weakest position group on the team, good offensive linemen are in small supply (though there are more good offensive linemen than blocking TEs), and Connor Williams was available for the taking. Dumb decision, IMO, very reminiscent of the miss on Ryan Ramczyk last year.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sat Apr 28, 2018 10:53 pm
  • hawknation2018 wrote:
    Fade wrote:
    hawknation2018 wrote:
    Supply was nonexistent for good blocking TEs. The position continues to become more and more finesse at the college level.


    Based on that logic they should have loaded up on O-Lineman as that position group talent wise is near non-existant.

    In other words, a reach is still a reach. regardless of scarcity.


    Of course they should have drafted offensive linemen higher. It's the weakest position group on the team, good offensive linemen are in small supply (though there are more good offensive linemen than blocking TEs), and Connor Williams was available for the taking. Dumb decision, IMO, very reminiscent of the miss on Ryan Ramczyk last year.


    So you would swap out Rashaad Penny for Connor Williams picked 50th? Wow. I'm glad you're not the GM.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sat Apr 28, 2018 10:54 pm
  • Fade wrote:
    hawknation2018 wrote:
    Fade wrote:
    hawknation2018 wrote:
    Supply was nonexistent for good blocking TEs. The position continues to become more and more finesse at the college level.


    Based on that logic they should have loaded up on O-Lineman as that position group talent wise is near non-existant.

    In other words, a reach is still a reach. regardless of scarcity.


    Of course they should have drafted offensive linemen higher. It's the weakest position group on the team, good offensive linemen are in small supply (though there are more good offensive linemen than blocking TEs), and Connor Williams was available for the taking. Dumb decision, IMO, very reminiscent of the miss on Ryan Ramczyk last year.


    So you would swap out Rashaad Penny for Connor Williams picked 50th? Wow. I'm glad you're not the GM.


    I'm not as high on Penny as you are. I would have traded down again into the 2nd round, if that was feasible, for Connor Williams & added a couple more picks.

    On the bright side, people get to continue complaining about Ifedi at RT and the dearth of quality guards on the roster.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sat Apr 28, 2018 10:58 pm
  • hawknation2018 wrote:
    Fade wrote:
    hawknation2018 wrote:
    Fade wrote:
    Based on that logic they should have loaded up on O-Lineman as that position group talent wise is near non-existant.

    In other words, a reach is still a reach. regardless of scarcity.


    Of course they should have drafted offensive linemen higher. It's the weakest position group on the team, good offensive linemen are in small supply (though there are more good offensive linemen than blocking TEs), and Connor Williams was available for the taking. Dumb decision, IMO, very reminiscent of the miss on Ryan Ramczyk last year.


    So you would swap out Rashaad Penny for Connor Williams picked 50th? Wow. I'm glad you're not the GM.


    I'm not as high on Penny as you are. I would have traded down again into the 2nd round, if that was feasible, for Connor Williams & added a couple more picks.

    On the bright side, people get to continue complaining about Ifedi at RT and the dearth of quality guards on the roster.

    Conor Williams is going to play Guard for the Cowboys, he can't play tackle. Why not go with a mauler like Will Hernandez?
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sat Apr 28, 2018 11:01 pm
  • Fade wrote:
    hawknation2018 wrote:
    Fade wrote:
    hawknation2018 wrote:
    Of course they should have drafted offensive linemen higher. It's the weakest position group on the team, good offensive linemen are in small supply (though there are more good offensive linemen than blocking TEs), and Connor Williams was available for the taking. Dumb decision, IMO, very reminiscent of the miss on Ryan Ramczyk last year.


    So you would swap out Rashaad Penny for Connor Williams picked 50th? Wow. I'm glad you're not the GM.


    I'm not as high on Penny as you are. I would have traded down again into the 2nd round, if that was feasible, for Connor Williams & added a couple more picks.

    On the bright side, people get to continue complaining about Ifedi at RT and the dearth of quality guards on the roster.

    Conor Williams is going to play Guard for the Cowboys, he can't play tackle. Why not go with a mauler like Will Hernandez?


    Williams would be a stud at either right tackle or guard. Hernandez is a decent prospect but he doesn't have the length, explosiveness or athleticism of WIlliams.

    Anyway, they didn't take either player. The offensive line is now Brown & Britt, plus three question marks.

    Pocic was awful last year. He has gained weight, but how much can he reasonably improve with his limited athleticism?

    Fluker is not explosive and has really slow feet. Not a good guard prospect.

    Ifedi is playing out of position at RT.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sat Apr 28, 2018 11:25 pm
  • My point still stands loading up on a bunch of over valued O-Lineman due to scarcity makes your team worse.

    ie drafting 3rd rd O-Lineman in the 1st etc.

    Would you rather have Myles Jack, Derrick Henry, Deon Jones, Michael Thomas, Kevin Byard, Yannick Ngakoue, or Germaine Ifedi on the football team? but... but... need. Thay passed on at least 6 studs to select Germaine Ifedi.

    Would you rather have Dak Prescott, Pharoah Cooper, Sheldon Day, Joe Schobert, or really anyone over Rhees Odhiambo selected in the 3rd rd. Who was a 5th rounder at best going into that draft. but... but... need.


    Seattle applied the same logic to a blocking TE in this instance. He is a nice player to get in the 6th-7th rd, but at pick 120 that is high for him. Let us cross our fingers and hope he morphs into Zach Miller.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sat Apr 28, 2018 11:30 pm
  • Fade wrote:My point still stands loading up on a bunch of over valued O-Lineman due to scarcity makes your team worse.

    ie drafting 3rd rd O-Lineman in the 1st etc.

    Would you rather have Myles Jack, Derrick Henry, Deon Jones, Michael Thomas, Kevin Byard, Yannick Ngakoue, or Germaine Ifedi on the football team? but... but... need. Thay passed on at least 6 studs to select Germaine Ifedi.

    Would you rather have Dak Prescott, Pharoah Cooper, Sheldon Day, Joe Schobert, or really anyone over Rhees Odhiambo selected in the 3rd rd. Who was a 5th rounder at best going into that draft. but... but... need.


    Seattle applied the same logic to a blocking TE in this instance. He is a nice player to get in the 6th-7th rd, but at pick 120 that is high for him. Let us cross our fingers and hope he morphs into Zach Miller.


    Dallas has demonstrated once again how to draft offensive linemen. The Seahawks have NOT figured that out yet.

    But at least they finally have a TE who likes to hit.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sat Apr 28, 2018 11:56 pm
  • hawknation2018 wrote:
    Fade wrote:My point still stands loading up on a bunch of over valued O-Lineman due to scarcity makes your team worse.

    ie drafting 3rd rd O-Lineman in the 1st etc.

    Would you rather have Myles Jack, Derrick Henry, Deon Jones, Michael Thomas, Kevin Byard, Yannick Ngakoue, or Germaine Ifedi on the football team? but... but... need. Thay passed on at least 6 studs to select Germaine Ifedi.

    Would you rather have Dak Prescott, Pharoah Cooper, Sheldon Day, Joe Schobert, or really anyone over Rhees Odhiambo selected in the 3rd rd. Who was a 5th rounder at best going into that draft. but... but... need.


    Seattle applied the same logic to a blocking TE in this instance. He is a nice player to get in the 6th-7th rd, but at pick 120 that is high for him. Let us cross our fingers and hope he morphs into Zach Miller.


    Dallas has demonstrated once again how to draft offensive linemen. The Seahawks have NOT figured that out yet.

    But at least they finally have a TE who likes to hit.


    And Dallas will once again miss the playoffs. :mrgreen: shows you the value in having a great O-line. Zeke Elliot is the difference maker on that team, a 1st rd runningback not their O-Line. You sure love getting destroyed don't you.

    That TE who likes to hit will be playing behind Nick Vannett & Ed Dickson. Reach.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sun Apr 29, 2018 12:10 am
  • Fade wrote:
    hawknation2018 wrote:
    Fade wrote:My point still stands loading up on a bunch of over valued O-Lineman due to scarcity makes your team worse.

    ie drafting 3rd rd O-Lineman in the 1st etc.

    Would you rather have Myles Jack, Derrick Henry, Deon Jones, Michael Thomas, Kevin Byard, Yannick Ngakoue, or Germaine Ifedi on the football team? but... but... need. Thay passed on at least 6 studs to select Germaine Ifedi.

    Would you rather have Dak Prescott, Pharoah Cooper, Sheldon Day, Joe Schobert, or really anyone over Rhees Odhiambo selected in the 3rd rd. Who was a 5th rounder at best going into that draft. but... but... need.


    Seattle applied the same logic to a blocking TE in this instance. He is a nice player to get in the 6th-7th rd, but at pick 120 that is high for him. Let us cross our fingers and hope he morphs into Zach Miller.


    Dallas has demonstrated once again how to draft offensive linemen. The Seahawks have NOT figured that out yet.

    But at least they finally have a TE who likes to hit.


    And Dallas will once again miss the playoffs. :mrgreen: shows you the value in having a great O-line. Zeke Elliot is the difference maker on that team, a 1st rd runningback not their O-Line. You sure love getting destroyed don't you.

    That TE who likes to hit will be playing behind Nick Vannett & Ed Dickson. Reach.


    The Eagles just won the Super Bowl with defense and the best offensive line in football. Cowboys' problem is defense. Their offensive line makes Zeke Elliot look a lot better than he really is. That's the importance of a strong offensive line. Eagles' offensive line made the statue, known as Nick Foles, look good.

    Are you really arguing that having a strong offensive line isn't important? LOL.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sun Apr 29, 2018 12:32 am
  • hawknation2018 wrote:
    Fade wrote:
    hawknation2018 wrote:
    Fade wrote:My point still stands loading up on a bunch of over valued O-Lineman due to scarcity makes your team worse.

    ie drafting 3rd rd O-Lineman in the 1st etc.

    Would you rather have Myles Jack, Derrick Henry, Deon Jones, Michael Thomas, Kevin Byard, Yannick Ngakoue, or Germaine Ifedi on the football team? but... but... need. Thay passed on at least 6 studs to select Germaine Ifedi.

    Would you rather have Dak Prescott, Pharoah Cooper, Sheldon Day, Joe Schobert, or really anyone over Rhees Odhiambo selected in the 3rd rd. Who was a 5th rounder at best going into that draft. but... but... need.


    Seattle applied the same logic to a blocking TE in this instance. He is a nice player to get in the 6th-7th rd, but at pick 120 that is high for him. Let us cross our fingers and hope he morphs into Zach Miller.


    Dallas has demonstrated once again how to draft offensive linemen. The Seahawks have NOT figured that out yet.

    But at least they finally have a TE who likes to hit.


    And Dallas will once again miss the playoffs. :mrgreen: shows you the value in having a great O-line. Zeke Elliot is the difference maker on that team, a 1st rd runningback not their O-Line. You sure love getting destroyed don't you.

    That TE who likes to hit will be playing behind Nick Vannett & Ed Dickson. Reach.


    The Eagles just won the Super Bowl with defense and the best offensive line in football. Cowboys' problem is defense. Their offensive line makes Zeke Elliot look a lot better than he really is. That's the importance of a strong offensive line.


    So you're going with recency bias?

    You're on the ropes right now. Let me give you some advice. Hit the one in the middle.

    The eagles had the deepest backfield in the sport. Which of course feel free to ignore.

    4 of the 5 previous Superbowl champs Seattle, New England x2, Denver did not have ideal O-Lines. Traditionally over the last 20 yrs, teams haven't needed great O-Lines to win Superbowls. Otherwise teams like Oakland, Dallas, Cleveland, Tennessee, etc, would be perennial playoff teams competing for titles.

    And no response to Dissly being 3rd string, despite being taking in the 4th, with not having any stiff competition? Which is the main point. Reach.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sun Apr 29, 2018 12:35 am
  • Love that they got a good blocking TE, but Josh Sweat, Mo Hurst, Kalan Ballage were still on the board.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sun Apr 29, 2018 12:40 am
  • Fade wrote:
    hawknation2018 wrote:
    The Eagles just won the Super Bowl with defense and the best offensive line in football. Cowboys' problem is defense. Their offensive line makes Zeke Elliot look a lot better than he really is. That's the importance of a strong offensive line.


    So you're going with recency bias?

    You're on the ropes right now. Let me give you some advice. Hit the one in the middle.

    The eagles had the deepest backfield in the sport. Which of course feel free to ignore.

    4 of the 5 previous Superbowl champs Seattle, New England x2, Denver did not have ideal O-Lines. Traditionally over the last 20 yrs, teams haven't needed great O-Lines to win Superbowls. Otherwise teams like Oakland, Dallas, Cleveland, Tennessee, etc, would be perennial playoff teams competing for titles.

    And no response to Dissly being 3rd string, despite being taking in the 4th, with not having any stiff competition? Which is the main point. Reach.


    So that's what you're saying? You don't think strong offensive line play is important. I think that's RIDICULOUS, but at least I see where you are coming from. The Seahawks have been hamstrung by their offensive line for the last THREE YEARS. Yet some remain blind.

    With regards to Dissly, his ceiling is higher than Vannett & Dickson because he is stronger, more physical, and has the potential to be an all-around TE.

    I don't know how that will play out in his rookie year. Dickson is highly experienced and a solid pass blocker. Vannett is an average/slightly below average blocker and possibly average/above average receiver. Dissly is still learning the position.

    Like a lot of 4th round picks, it may take Dissly some time to move into a starting role. But I'm certainly happy to have a TE with that sort of physicality and all-around potential. Poor blocking at the TE position has also big a huge issue over the last three seasons.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sun Apr 29, 2018 12:48 am
  • Dissly is not expected to stretch the field, he is a option as a check down guy, he knows how to create space to catch the ball and is considered to be average based on several scouting reports with room to improve. 4th rounder's are considered guys that can develop or contribute. Most mocks and scouting guys thought he was a 4th or 5th rounder so not a reach.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sun Apr 29, 2018 1:02 am
  • hawknation2018 wrote:
    Fade wrote:
    hawknation2018 wrote:
    The Eagles just won the Super Bowl with defense and the best offensive line in football. Cowboys' problem is defense. Their offensive line makes Zeke Elliot look a lot better than he really is. That's the importance of a strong offensive line.


    So you're going with recency bias?

    You're on the ropes right now. Let me give you some advice. Hit the one in the middle.

    The eagles had the deepest backfield in the sport. Which of course feel free to ignore.

    4 of the 5 previous Superbowl champs Seattle, New England x2, Denver did not have ideal O-Lines. Traditionally over the last 20 yrs, teams haven't needed great O-Lines to win Superbowls. Otherwise teams like Oakland, Dallas, Cleveland, Tennessee, etc, would be perennial playoff teams competing for titles.

    And no response to Dissly being 3rd string, despite being taking in the 4th, with not having any stiff competition? Which is the main point. Reach.


    So that's what you're saying? You don't think strong offensive line play is important. I think that's RIDICULOUS, but at least I see where you are coming from. The Seahawks have been hamstrung by their offensive line for the last THREE YEARS. Yet some remain blind.

    With regards to Dissly, his ceiling is higher than Vannett & Dickson because he is stronger, more physical, and has the potential to be an all-around TE.

    I don't know how that will play out in his rookie year. Dickson is highly experienced and a solid pass blocker. Vannett is an average/slightly below average blocker and possibly average/above average receiver. Dissly is still learning the position.

    Like a lot of 4th round picks, it may take Dissly some time to move into a starting role. But I'm certainly happy to have a TE with that sort of physicality and all-around potential. Poor blocking at the TE position has also big a huge issue over the last three seasons.


    I will give you an "A" for effort, but an "F" for arguing against facts.

    Strong offensive line play has not correlated into championships in the last 20 yrs. Defenses & Franchise QBs are the catalysts. These are the facts, regardless of how you feel about it.

    Dissly isn't that great of prospect if he can't beat out Ed Dickson & Nick Vannett.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sun Apr 29, 2018 1:03 am
  • Fade wrote:
    Strong offensive line play has not correlated into championships in the last 20 yrs.


    That is a mathematical statement of fact. Do you have any statistical analysis to support this assertion or just what you pulled out of your behind? :P
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sun Apr 29, 2018 1:09 am
  • Stop with the sidetracking of the thread. If you want to talk about OL's and past superbowls, start a new thread of your own.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sun Apr 29, 2018 1:15 am
  • KitsapGuy wrote:Stop with the sidetracking of the thread. If you want to talk about OL's and past superbowls, start a new thread of your own.


    Will Do, I will PM him.

    EDIT: PM SENT.
    Last edited by Fade on Sun Apr 29, 2018 1:47 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sun Apr 29, 2018 1:23 am
  • Fade wrote:
    Dissly isn't that great of prospect if he can't beat out Ed Dickson & Nick Vannett.


    He was a 4th round pick who brings something to the field that Vannett/Dickson can't: the willingness and power to be a strong blocker.

    Most 4th round picks do not see the field as rookies. I expect Dissly will see the field because of his run blocking. And I wouldn't be surprised if he progresses enough at the position to become a starter at some point.

    The modus operandi of the Bevell offense was finesse, which included phasing out the FB position and using TEs who were not strong blockers. Under Bevell, there was a lot of trying to squeeze square pegs into round holes. The new M.O. is about overwhelming the opponent with the strength and power of a diverse offensive attack.

    Both the Penny & Dissly picks are emblematic of this philosophical shift. They have also signed a veteran FB, who is a great blocker, and added two physical fullbacks in undrafted free agency. I'm excited to see good blocking at TE & FB. It will give the offense a fighting chance to become a well-oiled machine.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sun Apr 29, 2018 2:00 am
  • what if this dissly also lines up at fullback once in awhile? boom!
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sun Apr 29, 2018 2:02 am
  • hawknation2018 wrote:
    He was a 4th round pick who brings something to the field that Vannett/Dickson can't: the willingness and power to be a strong blocker.

    That something isn't valued in the 4th rd. Reach.

    hawknation2018 wrote:Most 4th round picks do not see the field as rookies. I expect Dissly will see the field because of his run blocking. And I wouldn't be surprised if he progresses enough at the position to become a starter at some point.


    Most 4th rd rookies don't have the opportunity to compete against backups.

    hawknation2018 wrote:The modus operandi of the Bevell offense was finesse, which included phasing out the FB position and using TEs who were not strong blockers. Under Bevell, there was a lot of trying to squeeze square pegs into round holes. The new M.O. is about overwhelming the opponent with the strength and power of a diverse offensive attack.


    Explain 2011-2014 to me, 4 seasons with Bevell as the OC.

    hawknation2018 wrote:Both the Penny & Dissly picks are emblematic of this philosophical shift. They have also signed a veteran FB, who is a great blocker, and added two physical fullbacks in undrafted free agency. I'm excited to see good blocking at TE & FB. It will give the offense a fighting chance to become a well-oiled machine.


    And yet you're disappointed because they didn't load up and reach on a bunch of O-Lineman because the position is scarce. You're not a fan of Penny, remember?

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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sun Apr 29, 2018 2:04 am
  • Blocking
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    Catching
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sun Apr 29, 2018 2:13 am
  • Fade wrote:
    hawknation2018 wrote:
    He was a 4th round pick who brings something to the field that Vannett/Dickson can't: the willingness and power to be a strong blocker.

    That something isn't valued in the 4th rd. Reach.

    hawknation2018 wrote:Most 4th round picks do not see the field as rookies. I expect Dissly will see the field because of his run blocking. And I wouldn't be surprised if he progresses enough at the position to become a starter at some point.


    Most 4th rd rookies don't have the opportunity to compete against backups.

    hawknation2018 wrote:The modus operandi of the Bevell offense was finesse, which included phasing out the FB position and using TEs who were not strong blockers. Under Bevell, there was a lot of trying to squeeze square pegs into round holes. The new M.O. is about overwhelming the opponent with the strength and power of a diverse offensive attack.


    Explain 2011-2014 to me, 4 seasons with Bevell as the OC.

    hawknation2018 wrote:Both the Penny & Dissly picks are emblematic of this philosophical shift. They have also signed a veteran FB, who is a great blocker, and added two physical fullbacks in undrafted free agency. I'm excited to see good blocking at TE & FB. It will give the offense a fighting chance to become a well-oiled machine.


    And yet you're disappointed because they didn't load up and reach on a bunch of O-Lineman because the position is scarce. You're not a fan of Penny, remember?

    Image


    So juvenile. I'm not as high on Penny as others. But that pick, along with the Dissly selection, shows a commitment to the running game that we have not seen in several years.

    Your argument that blocking TEs aren't "valued in the 4th rd" has two fatal flaws:

    (1) I like the fact that the Seahawks are willing to go against the grain in valuing attributes that will lead to a strong running game. That they trying to become stronger at running the ball and blocking is a good thing.

    (2) Blocking TEs are OFTEN taken in the 4th round. We are talking about halfway through the draft. Many of these picks will never develop into starters. Getting the best blocking TE in the draft -- and one of the only decent blocking TEs in this draft -- is not a "reach" in the 4th round. Just last year, Michael Roberts (who was one of the best blocking TEs in that class) was selected in the 4th round by the Detroit Lions.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sun Apr 29, 2018 2:18 am
  • hawknation2018 wrote:Blocking
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    Catching
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    And stuck behind Vannett & Dickson.
    blocking
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    catching
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sun Apr 29, 2018 2:20 am
  • Fade wrote:Image


    You consider this STRONG run blocking? It's a backside block. LOL.

    :P
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sun Apr 29, 2018 2:23 am
  • Also, Michael Roberts was like the 5h best blocker in that draft class, while Dissly is probably THE best this year.
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Re: Pick #120 TE Will Dissly
Sun Apr 29, 2018 2:29 am
  • hawknation2018 wrote:
    Fade wrote:
    hawknation2018 wrote:
    He was a 4th round pick who brings something to the field that Vannett/Dickson can't: the willingness and power to be a strong blocker.

    That something isn't valued in the 4th rd. Reach.

    hawknation2018 wrote:Most 4th round picks do not see the field as rookies. I expect Dissly will see the field because of his run blocking. And I wouldn't be surprised if he progresses enough at the position to become a starter at some point.


    Most 4th rd rookies don't have the opportunity to compete against backups.

    hawknation2018 wrote:The modus operandi of the Bevell offense was finesse, which included phasing out the FB position and using TEs who were not strong blockers. Under Bevell, there was a lot of trying to squeeze square pegs into round holes. The new M.O. is about overwhelming the opponent with the strength and power of a diverse offensive attack.


    Explain 2011-2014 to me, 4 seasons with Bevell as the OC.

    hawknation2018 wrote:Both the Penny & Dissly picks are emblematic of this philosophical shift. They have also signed a veteran FB, who is a great blocker, and added two physical fullbacks in undrafted free agency. I'm excited to see good blocking at TE & FB. It will give the offense a fighting chance to become a well-oiled machine.


    And yet you're disappointed because they didn't load up and reach on a bunch of O-Lineman because the position is scarce. You're not a fan of Penny, remember?

    Image


    So juvenile. I'm not as high on Penny as others. But that pick, along with the Dissly selection, shows a commitment to the running game that we have not seen in several years.

    Your argument that blocking TEs aren't "valued in the 4th rd" has two fatal flaws:

    (1) I like the fact that the Seahawks are willing to go against the grain in valuing attributes that will lead to a strong running game. That they trying to become stronger at running the ball and blocking is a good thing.

    (2) Blocking TEs are OFTEN taken in the 4th round. We are talking about halfway through the draft. Many of these picks will never develop into starters. Getting the best blocking TE in the draft -- and one of the only decent blocking TEs in this draft -- is not a "reach" in the 4th round. Just last year, Michael Roberts (who was one of the best blocking TEs in that class) was selected in the 4th round by the Detroit Lions.


    You love them L's, I had to give you a visual.

    6-7 rd prospect is a reach no matter how much you wish he isn't. He can't block if he isn't on the field as a 3rd stringer. Unless you suspect he will be used in a niche role. Which also proves my point, as I have said he is a niche player.

    You still haven't explained Bevell's offense in 2011-2014, understandable beause it was a lie.
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