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How much $$$ would you spend to keep Baldwin?

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  • The thread on Paul Richardson got me wondering how much fans think Doug Baldwin continues to be worth for us.

    The Seahawks didn't resign Richardson, and he got $8mil/year. Doug is currently at $11mill/year or so with the top WRs commanding close to $17mil. At what point does Doug end up costing more than he's worth? Or is his chemistry with Russ worth a top-tier contract while we fill out the rest of the WR ranks with rookies and low-tier FA signings?

    I love his attitude, his work-ethic, and skills. Yet I have a hard time reconciling that with $17mil/year for a WR.

    There are probably better sites for Contract info, but some of DB's contract info here: https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/seattle-seahawks/doug-baldwin-8526/

    WR contracts are listed here by average/year: https://overthecap.com/position/wide-receiver/
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    Ad Hawk
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  • A lot of the discussion on a fan board is limited to something akin to a go no go gauge.

    It is much harder for us on the outside to put a number on someone who sees the big picture and processes all the important and critical intangibles that glue a team together.

    The extraordinary super athlete with narrow focus in pursuit of fame and fortune is much easier for most to put a number on. Although, if a superstar is brought in from the outside and handed a huge contract before ever stepping foot on a practice field, it can result in great harm to team health and chemistry. Team damage and resentment can persevere for years ..... as we have seen in Seattle.

    Many of us, at times, continue to miss the critical importance of resigning the likes of Baldwin, KJ and Chancellor to second contracts. Vision and understanding of outside observers is typically of limited bandwidth.
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  • I think you spend what the market dictates for a guy like Baldwin. The guy is as dependable as they come in the slot position and just doesn't drop the ball. He knows how to stay healthy and not take big hits, has great leadership, work ethic and is a competitor. His skill set and production have not declined nor do they look like they are going to. Lynch is the only player brought in that I can think of that really has played above or at expectation. I really don't see a comparable player on our roster to Baldwin. Richardson was mentioned, but Lockett is his replacement.You keep Doug he is legit!!
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  • Doug can play all three WR positions, Richardson was more of just the outside guy, that's a big difference, Yes Richardson could return Kicks as well but Lockett made that less then a difference maker.
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    chris98251
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  • Very good point. Doug can get it done in the slot AND outside, easily. Put him anywhere on the field and he gets it done.
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  • chris98251 wrote:Doug can play all three WR positions, Richardson was more of just the outside guy, that's a big difference, Yes Richardson could return Kicks as well but Lockett made that less then a difference maker.


    Agree, I would also add in the injury concern with Richardson, while Baldwin has been healthy, and then add in the relationship with Wilson. Doug is a top WR Richardson is TBD still.
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    Hawk1217
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  • Interesting question. As a fan, the first reaction is "pay him, keep him, somehow make it happen."

    I believe this would be Doug's 3rd contract. He started as a UDFA, then re-signed a couple of years ago. He doesn't seem to be slowing down, and much like Largent he isn't the fastest guy on the field, but he might be the smartest. Certainly a hard working man, who has earned a lot, and deserves a huge dose of benefit of the doubt, especially when you think about his rapport with Russell Wilson.

    One thing I would note about contracts. Fans tend to complain when they think the team "overpays" for talent. One thing to remember is that the large signing bonuses are really rewards for past performance, and not necessarily a predictor of future value. That's why the complex structure of some deals.

    Baldwin is approaching iconic status, where it is really difficult to imagine the team without him. He seems to be the ultimate team guy, but I wouldn't expect the team to insult him by low-balling a deal. One thing Baldie has to deal with is that he probably won't have top tier value on the open market. His best deal will probably be here.
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  • Completely agree!

    Doug is a smart man though and he will understand the market for him better than anyone else.

    He will be well paid, but will want to stay with Wilson here in Seattle as the state tax situation and his connection with Wilson offer him the best shot at continued high level pay and play.
    Until we develop a pass rush that will cause opposing teams to be forced to scheme to defend it we will never be able to consistently take the final step. The interior rush needs improvement. The OLine clearly still needs work.

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  • As much as I'm happy we're not handing out massive extensions to older players like Tic Tacs anymore, I put three people in a different category when it comes to this conversation.

    Russell
    Bobby
    Doug

    Doug means so much more to this team than just "how much."

    - He embodies Pete's philosophy
    - He plays selflessly
    - He's a team leader, on and off the field
    - He has ZERO injury history to be worried about his production falling off

    So IMO if we're going to give out a 3rd contract to any existing player, it's Doug. I'd be OK with bumping him from 11-12M to 13-15M for another 4-5 years.
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    Sgt. Largent
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  • Whatever the guy wants. He has proven himself to be a bonafide number 1 receiver. We essentially have the new Steve Smith. He can play every WR position, which makes him a nightmare to defend. I don't think there is a receiver that can adjust to Wilson's improv better than him in the entire league either. He is very cognizant of situations, a very heady player. He is also the type of receiver that can be effective into his late 30s. The guy doesn't rely on athleticism, and instead exploits defenses through strong fundamentals, and route running. His hands are also some of the best in the league. What we got folks is a mini Largent.

    You don't get rid of guys like this who have chemistry with your franchise Quarterback. If he were to leave us I can guarantee that a team like the Patriots would throw obscene amounts of money at him. He fits the MO of player they really like for sure. A Wes Welker on steroids.
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  • Spin Doctor wrote:I don't think there is a receiver that can adjust to Wilson's improv better than him in the entire league either

    This is the crucial part. We know our QB goes off-script - for a variety of reasons - all the time. There is no one else who can adapt to that as well as Baldwin does. He works continuously to make space while presenting a target to bail out his QB.

    Baldwin understands his position and what it means to the greater team. He is content to block all day long and never catch a pass if that means the team wins. I have never heard him complain one bit about how many balls are thrown his way, he just gets the job done and takes pride in doing it well.

    That raises problems in that his market value remains on the low side even though he has the chops to be topping the NFL and proved that when he and Wilson were lighting up the league for a 5-game stretch.

    However, he's a smart guy, and I believe that he will accept a fair deal, because when it comes down to it there are two kinds of players: The guy who spends all of his money, in which case paying him more just means more money pissed away, and the guy who is responsible with his money, in which case another million or two on his contract has no real meaning because he already has more money than he will ever spend. Baldwin is a smart guy - he should be in the latter group.
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  • He is going to be 30 this year. I would let him walk as I know he is going to ask for more than he is making right now. Im thankful for his contributions but I don't like the idea of giving an aging WR a payday. :irishdrinkers:
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  • ImTheScientist wrote:He is going to be 30 this year. I would let him walk as I know he is going to ask for more than he is making right now. Im thankful for his contributions but I don't like the idea of giving an aging WR a payday. :irishdrinkers:

    I disagree with that opinion. I think Doug has at least 3-4 more good years.

    And like I said above, the bonus money is really about what he did in the past, not future value.

    If we want the best possible people around Russ, then we need to keep his favorite and most prolific target from the last 5 years.
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  • Against 3rd contracts...Doug got paid.

    I like the player......not at the rate he wants. If he came down to 6 a year for three years half guaranteed.......Im in.
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  • Cooks just signed with LA 5 yrs 81 million 50 gtd. No way Doug accepts 6 a yr 3 yrs.
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  • ImTheScientist wrote:He is going to be 30 this year. I would let him walk as I know he is going to ask for more than he is making right now. Im thankful for his contributions but I don't like the idea of giving an aging WR a payday. :irishdrinkers:

    Who do you suggest we replace him with? What is your answer? We have nobody other than Baldwin capable of being a number 1 receiver. We have no choice, BUT to sign him when the time comes. Furthermore, Baldwin is the type of guy that ages well. Even if he loses a step he can still produce in the slot, and be a contributor. I think he's going to be the type of guy that has a long and productive career into his late 30s.

    If you're banking on Darboh, and Lockett you're going to be in for a rude awakening. Russ has no chemistry with either of them, and both are unproven commodities.
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  • Lets bring a little perspective to this thread. Extending Doug Baldwin is neither a priority nor a need for 2018 ......

    !. He was just signed to his second extension in 2017.
    2. Doug is under contract thru 2020 and thru his 32nd birthday.
    3. He has already collected over 31 million dollars and is scheduled to collect a total of over 60 million thru 2020.
    4. As a self made workman, Doug has gone from un-drafted rookie to pro bowl receiver.
    5. He is the best trail blazing role model they have for youngsters and free agents trying to make this team.
    6. He exemplifies much of what Pete Carroll's program is about.
    7. So don't worry .... be happy about another year with Doug!
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  • Spin Doctor wrote:
    ImTheScientist wrote:He is going to be 30 this year. I would let him walk as I know he is going to ask for more than he is making right now. Im thankful for his contributions but I don't like the idea of giving an aging WR a payday. :irishdrinkers:

    Who do you suggest we replace him with? What is your answer? We have nobody other than Baldwin capable of being a number 1 receiver. We have no choice, BUT to sign him when the time comes.
    .


    Looks like the time to cut him or ask to renegotiate would be 2020 at the age of 32. If he doesn't I cut him. Depending on health thats an option in 2019 as the cap hit is somewhat low. So NO WAY we give him another contract.
    https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/seattle-sea ... dwin-8526/

    RE: Who do you suggest we replace him with? What is your answer?
    You need to spend draft capital on a player next year and do not sign back Tyler Lockett unless he asks for a reasonable contract.
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  • After what Cooks just got from LA and the barometer being only AB was the other player to have 7 TD's/1000 the past 3 seasons with ADB being 9yds short of being the 3rd player.
    This raises a very interesting question.
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  • He hasn't shown much decline in his game, but MAN do receivers fall off the cliff around the same time.

    I think he's got Steve Smith longevity and, frankly, I don't think Russell can afford to lose him. So I'd pay him like the number one he's proving to be, but man, it's a gamble.
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  • But look how long Larry Fitz. has remained productive. He's stayed in the league, taken lower pay, but still is a threat because of his awareness of the field and catch radius. Doug is close to this now.
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  • Atradees wrote:If he came down to 6 a year for three years half guaranteed.......Im in.

    This is literally insulting to him.
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  • Doug needs to retire a Hawk. Period.
    His value to this community is SOOOOOO much bigger than the AWESOME he provides on the field.
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  • A lot.
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  • Doug is the perfect wide receiver for this offense. His release skills are astounding - second to none.

    I would pay him whatever the market dictates he should receive for the next few years. He is not easily replaceable.

    However, Baldwin is getting older, and unless Schneider and Carroll can repeat their success in finding a gem like Baldwin in the UDFA process, they're going to need to start spending significant draft capital on quality receiving weapons.
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  • If he's playing as well as he is now with no injury concerns, pay him whatever he wants. I really don't get why some people don't want to hand out top of the market contracts. Are we supposed to field a team with bargain-bin FAs and rookies? If the guy is a top-tier player, pay him top-tier money. Same with third contracts. It didn't work out with Kam and Bennett, but that doesn't mean it won't work out with Doug.
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  • Sgt. Largent wrote:As much as I'm happy we're not handing out massive extensions to older players like Tic Tacs anymore, I put three people in a different category when it comes to this conversation.

    Russell
    Bobby
    Doug

    Doug means so much more to this team than just "how much."

    - He embodies Pete's philosophy
    - He plays selflessly
    - He's a team leader, on and off the field
    - He has ZERO injury history to be worried about his production falling off

    So IMO if we're going to give out a 3rd contract to any existing player, it's Doug. I'd be OK with bumping him from 11-12M to 13-15M for another 4-5 years.



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  • Yep. Well said.
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    brimsalabim
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  • Pay him what it takes. Right now, imo, there are 4 guys on this team I really, really want to see retire a Hawk. Russ, Doug, Bobby and kj. Was going to type out a long description as to why, but nah. It speaks for itself. As they say, if you don't know, you never will, lmao.
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