Russ and his scrambling ability

hawknation2018":2zos493p said:

Agree with the OP. Wish he would be encouraged to run more for positives gains when he doesn’t immediately find an open receiver. His scrambling is incredibly difficult to scheme against and usually breaks the will of the defense when he shows a determination to run.

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sutz":2o5tyhw6 said:

And except that the rest of the league is on to us. Defenses are all going to more controlled pass rush, with lane discipline, designed to keep Russ in the pocket .

He's not out there on the field alone, there's a whole other team that studies his moves and schemes to compensate for them

Now, he can't suprise people any more. He'll do some of this, but not as much as before. Defenses won't let him.

Click to expand...

semiahmoo":3od0aov8 said:

sutz":3od0aov8 said:

And except that the rest of the league is on to us. Defenses are all going to more controlled pass rush, with lane discipline, designed to keep Russ in the pocket .

He's not out there on the field alone, there's a whole other team that studies his moves and schemes to compensate for them

Now, he can't suprise people any more. He'll do some of this, but not as much as before. Defenses won't let him.

Click to expand...

100% correct.

In the 'glory years' RW had some things really going for him.

-Still an unknown commodity.
-Beast Mode
-World Class Defense

He's now older, a little slower, but most important, teams are as you say fully prepared for his scrambling which has more fully exposed his QB weaknesses of which there are many.

Hoping Carson can continue to blossom as a back because RW really needs to be able to play with a legit run threat to keep defenses honest.

Click to expand...

hawkpride":ckonlvfw said:

So we all know, RW is known for his play action / scrambling ability to extend plays, with some great results in the past. I know the current OC wants RW to stay in the pocket and become that kind of QB. But watching the game today there were several times he could have scrambled for big gains and instead just would throw to a receiver that was most likely in the play call, and several times for a minimum gain (if any) compared to the open field RW had in front of him. I wish he had the option of doing that again, it appears the coaching staff after all this time still does not allow RW to call something other than the play called by the OC.


Thoughts

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Mad Dog":2d7vmgnc said:

semiahmoo":2d7vmgnc said:

sutz":2d7vmgnc said:

And except that the rest of the league is on to us. Defenses are all going to more controlled pass rush, with lane discipline, designed to keep Russ in the pocket .

He's not out there on the field alone, there's a whole other team that studies his moves and schemes to compensate for them

Now, he can't suprise people any more. He'll do some of this, but not as much as before. Defenses won't let him.

Click to expand...

100% correct.

In the 'glory years' RW had some things really going for him.

-Still an unknown commodity.
-Beast Mode
-World Class Defense

He's now older, a little slower, but most important, teams are as you say fully prepared for his scrambling which has more fully exposed his QB weaknesses of which there are many.

Hoping Carson can continue to blossom as a back because RW really needs to be able to play with a legit run threat to keep defenses honest.

Click to expand...

QB weaknesses are many? I mean other than being a little short and occasionally holding the ball too long, what are Wilson’s “many” weaknesses?

Wilson was his usual solid efficient self today. Made throws on time. Hit some tight windows. Avoided turnovers. That’s the Wilson we want. Warts and all, apparently.

Click to expand...

Spin Doctor said:

Mad Dog":py6uu7rr said:

semiahmoo":py6uu7rr said:

sutz":py6uu7rr said:

And except that the rest of the league is on to us. Defenses are all going to more controlled pass rush, with lane discipline, designed to keep Russ in the pocket .

He's not out there on the field alone, there's a whole other team that studies his moves and schemes to compensate for them

Now, he can't suprise people any more. He'll do some of this, but not as much as before. Defenses won't let him.

Click to expand...

100% correct.

In the 'glory years' RW had some things really going for him.

-Still an unknown commodity.
-Beast Mode
-World Class Defense

He's now older, a little slower, but most important, teams are as you say fully prepared for his scrambling which has more fully exposed his QB weaknesses of which there are many.

Hoping Carson can continue to blossom as a back because RW really needs to be able to play with a legit run threat to keep defenses honest.

Click to expand...

QB weaknesses are many? I mean other than being a little short and occasionally holding the ball too long, what are Wilson’s “many” weaknesses?

Wilson was his usual solid efficient self today. Made throws on time. Hit some tight windows. Avoided turnovers. That’s the Wilson we want. Warts and all, apparently.

Click to expand...

Russell Wilson has a lot of weaknesses as a passer. Right now Schottenheimer is trying to hammer some of those out of him. If I had to pin down his weaknesses, the first would be his footwork in the pocket. This is something Schottenheimer even mentioned, and what he has been working on with Russ all offseason long. Footwork is very important for a QB, it is a vital skill set that affects a QB's ball placement and power. If a QB doesn't have proper footwork you see errant balls, and things such as over throws and under throws, both of which we have seen from Wilson when he has been confined to the pocket. His ball placement can be suspect at times as well, which this directly relates to footwork.

The second problem I've been seeing is lack of awareness in the pocket. He doesn't seem to have that same internal clock that most Quarterbacks possess. A good example of this is last week. The bears were bringing obvious blitzes, and Wilson wasn't aware when the corners were bearing down on him. The thing about Wilson is before he would just be able to scramble out of situations like that and make them pay for having one less man in coverage. The thing I've been noticing about his scramble lately, is that teams are starting to get a good idea of where he is going to go to, and where he is going to be. They're coming at him with a controlled rush and just collapsing the pocket rather than trying to jail break him. This forces him to beat teams from the pocket. It's always how teams like the Rams have had our number.

Now, that being said Russell has shown some improvement this game in these areas. Schottenheimer called a quick hit passing game. Russell didn't try to do anything cute, and he executed it. He checked down when he needed to and he had a better grasp of when people were bearing down on him. It was the first glimpse we've gotten of his work in the offseason. One play really stuck out to me. He was in the pocket, and the Seahawks had run a play action from under center. The defensive ends were closing in on him, in the past he would have retreated back into the open field and played a game of matador. Instead he simply stepped up into the pocket, and made a slick slide to set up his blockers and delivered a bullet with a guy in his face. It was the best throw Russ made all game, and it hit Lockett in stride and when he wasn't necessarily open. He was thrown open by Russell.

The significance of this routine play was how fluid Russ looked in that moment. He looked like Tom Brady manipulating the pocket. There was no wasted movement, everything was smooth. He simply stepped up and messed up the defensive ends pursuit angles. THIS is the kind of play you need if you want consistency from quarter to quarter, game to game. It is an element that was missing in Russ's game. If Schottenheimer is able to unlock his potential as a pure pocket passer and merge it with his scrambling abilities then we have another Steve Young on our hands.

Click to expand...

chris98251":3syz4j2r said:

hawknation2018":3syz4j2r said:

Agree with the OP. Wish he would be encouraged to run more for positives gains when he doesn’t immediately find an open receiver. His scrambling is incredibly difficult to scheme against and usually breaks the will of the defense when he shows a determination to run.

Click to expand...

Except they have to rebuild him in a few ways, making him read forces him to find a different skill set to improve, read and process faster and get the ball out faster, if you want Brees type numbers you need Brees type reactions.

Click to expand...

sutz":p9968z8k said:

And except that the rest of the league is on to us. Defenses are all going to more controlled pass rush, with lane discipline, designed to keep Russ in the pocket .

He's not out there on the field alone, there's a whole other team that studies his moves and schemes to compensate for them

Now, he can't suprise people any more. He'll do some of this, but not as much as before. Defenses won't let him.

Click to expand...

semiahmoo":2mz1pv0e said:

sutz":2mz1pv0e said:

And except that the rest of the league is on to us. Defenses are all going to more controlled pass rush, with lane discipline, designed to keep Russ in the pocket .

He's not out there on the field alone, there's a whole other team that studies his moves and schemes to compensate for them

Now, he can't suprise people any more. He'll do some of this, but not as much as before. Defenses won't let him.

Click to expand...

100% correct.

In the 'glory years' RW had some things really going for him.

-Still an unknown commodity.
-Beast Mode
-World Class Defense

He's now older, a little slower, but most important, teams are as you say fully prepared for his scrambling which has more fully exposed his QB weaknesses of which there are many.

Hoping Carson can continue to blossom as a back because RW really needs to be able to play with a legit run threat to keep defenses honest.

Click to expand...

Spin Doctor":1ji7i65t said:

Mad Dog":1ji7i65t said:

semiahmoo":1ji7i65t said:

sutz":1ji7i65t said:

And except that the rest of the league is on to us. Defenses are all going to more controlled pass rush, with lane discipline, designed to keep Russ in the pocket .

He's not out there on the field alone, there's a whole other team that studies his moves and schemes to compensate for them

Now, he can't suprise people any more. He'll do some of this, but not as much as before. Defenses won't let him.

Click to expand...

100% correct.

In the 'glory years' RW had some things really going for him.

-Still an unknown commodity.
-Beast Mode
-World Class Defense

He's now older, a little slower, but most important, teams are as you say fully prepared for his scrambling which has more fully exposed his QB weaknesses of which there are many.

Hoping Carson can continue to blossom as a back because RW really needs to be able to play with a legit run threat to keep defenses honest.

Click to expand...

QB weaknesses are many? I mean other than being a little short and occasionally holding the ball too long, what are Wilson’s “many” weaknesses?

Wilson was his usual solid efficient self today. Made throws on time. Hit some tight windows. Avoided turnovers. That’s the Wilson we want. Warts and all, apparently.

Click to expand...

Russell Wilson has a lot of weaknesses as a passer. Right now Schottenheimer is trying to hammer some of those out of him. If I had to pin down his weaknesses, the first would be his footwork in the pocket. This is something Schottenheimer even mentioned, and what he has been working on with Russ all offseason long. Footwork is very important for a QB, it is a vital skill set that affects a QB's ball placement and power. If a QB doesn't have proper footwork you see errant balls, and things such as over throws and under throws, both of which we have seen from Wilson when he has been confined to the pocket. His ball placement can be suspect at times as well, which this directly relates to footwork.

The second problem I've been seeing is lack of awareness in the pocket. He doesn't seem to have that same internal clock that most Quarterbacks possess. A good example of this is last week. The bears were bringing obvious blitzes, and Wilson wasn't aware when the corners were bearing down on him. The thing about Wilson is before he would just be able to scramble out of situations like that and make them pay for having one less man in coverage. The thing I've been noticing about his scramble lately, is that teams are starting to get a good idea of where he is going to go to, and where he is going to be. They're coming at him with a controlled rush and just collapsing the pocket rather than trying to jail break him. This forces him to beat teams from the pocket. It's always how teams like the Rams have had our number.

Now, that being said Russell has shown some improvement this game in these areas. Schottenheimer called a quick hit passing game. Russell didn't try to do anything cute, and he executed it. He checked down when he needed to and he had a better grasp of when people were bearing down on him. It was the first glimpse we've gotten of his work in the offseason. One play really stuck out to me. He was in the pocket, and the Seahawks had run a play action from under center. The defensive ends were closing in on him, in the past he would have retreated back into the open field and played a game of matador. Instead he simply stepped up into the pocket, and made a slick slide to set up his blockers and delivered a bullet with a guy in his face. It was the best throw Russ made all game, and it hit Lockett in stride and when he wasn't necessarily open. He was thrown open by Russell.

The significance of this routine play was how fluid Russ looked in that moment. He looked like Tom Brady manipulating the pocket. There was no wasted movement, everything was smooth. He simply stepped up and messed up the defensive ends pursuit angles. THIS is the kind of play you need if you want consistency from quarter to quarter, game to game. It is an element that was missing in Russ's game. If Schottenheimer is able to unlock his potential as a pure pocket passer and merge it with his scrambling abilities then we have another Steve Young on our hands.

Click to expand...

Optimus25":371hanph said:

chris98251":371hanph said:

hawknation2018":371hanph said:

Agree with the OP. Wish he would be encouraged to run more for positives gains when he doesn’t immediately find an open receiver. His scrambling is incredibly difficult to scheme against and usually breaks the will of the defense when he shows a determination to run.

Click to expand...

Except they have to rebuild him in a few ways, making him read forces him to find a different skill set to improve, read and process faster and get the ball out faster, if you want Brees type numbers you need Brees type reactions.

Click to expand...

I just couldn't disagree more.

Why force a square peg into a round hole?

Our offense consistently struggles against strong defenses usually until about the fourth quarter. And what we see Russ do consistently in those late drives is open up the backfield and create space, NOT camp out in and climb up the pocket for his throws a la brees.

I don't want brees type numbers, i want more than 1 super bowl. I want to feed our nuances, not repress them into a glass case we only break in case of emergency.

Click to expand...

Mad Dog":1mtpsg95 said:

Spin Doctor":1mtpsg95 said:

Mad Dog":1mtpsg95 said:

semiahmoo":1mtpsg95 said:

100% correct.

In the 'glory years' RW had some things really going for him.

-Still an unknown commodity.
-Beast Mode
-World Class Defense

He's now older, a little slower, but most important, teams are as you say fully prepared for his scrambling which has more fully exposed his QB weaknesses of which there are many.

Hoping Carson can continue to blossom as a back because RW really needs to be able to play with a legit run threat to keep defenses honest.

Click to expand...

QB weaknesses are many? I mean other than being a little short and occasionally holding the ball too long, what are Wilson’s “many” weaknesses?

Wilson was his usual solid efficient self today. Made throws on time. Hit some tight windows. Avoided turnovers. That’s the Wilson we want. Warts and all, apparently.

Click to expand...

Russell Wilson has a lot of weaknesses as a passer. Right now Schottenheimer is trying to hammer some of those out of him. If I had to pin down his weaknesses, the first would be his footwork in the pocket. This is something Schottenheimer even mentioned, and what he has been working on with Russ all offseason long. Footwork is very important for a QB, it is a vital skill set that affects a QB's ball placement and power. If a QB doesn't have proper footwork you see errant balls, and things such as over throws and under throws, both of which we have seen from Wilson when he has been confined to the pocket. His ball placement can be suspect at times as well, which this directly relates to footwork.

The second problem I've been seeing is lack of awareness in the pocket. He doesn't seem to have that same internal clock that most Quarterbacks possess. A good example of this is last week. The bears were bringing obvious blitzes, and Wilson wasn't aware when the corners were bearing down on him. The thing about Wilson is before he would just be able to scramble out of situations like that and make them pay for having one less man in coverage. The thing I've been noticing about his scramble lately, is that teams are starting to get a good idea of where he is going to go to, and where he is going to be. They're coming at him with a controlled rush and just collapsing the pocket rather than trying to jail break him. This forces him to beat teams from the pocket. It's always how teams like the Rams have had our number.

Now, that being said Russell has shown some improvement this game in these areas. Schottenheimer called a quick hit passing game. Russell didn't try to do anything cute, and he executed it. He checked down when he needed to and he had a better grasp of when people were bearing down on him. It was the first glimpse we've gotten of his work in the offseason. One play really stuck out to me. He was in the pocket, and the Seahawks had run a play action from under center. The defensive ends were closing in on him, in the past he would have retreated back into the open field and played a game of matador. Instead he simply stepped up into the pocket, and made a slick slide to set up his blockers and delivered a bullet with a guy in his face. It was the best throw Russ made all game, and it hit Lockett in stride and when he wasn't necessarily open. He was thrown open by Russell.

The significance of this routine play was how fluid Russ looked in that moment. He looked like Tom Brady manipulating the pocket. There was no wasted movement, everything was smooth. He simply stepped up and messed up the defensive ends pursuit angles. THIS is the kind of play you need if you want consistency from quarter to quarter, game to game. It is an element that was missing in Russ's game. If Schottenheimer is able to unlock his potential as a pure pocket passer and merge it with his scrambling abilities then we have another Steve Young on our hands.

Click to expand...

So basically he's short, has poor footwork and occasionally holds the ball too long. 3 weaknesses counts as many. I would say 3 counts as a few. And I'd argue that his footwork isn't as bad as you say it is. It's not as good as some QB's but it's hardly the worst in the league. But you can always get better right?

BTW God's perfect QB just threw for 133 yds 1 TD 1 INT against what many considered the worst team in the league this year. Shall we point out Brady's "many" weaknesses today.

Perfection is unattainable. Being human shouldn't be viewed as weaknesses. I don't think anyone other than NFL QB's have a clue how hard the job is and that expecting perfect footwork and pocket presence on every play when 300 lb men are set on screwing up your life big time is a ridiculously high standard.

Wilson will struggle at times when he's pressured and no one it open and will look great when he's got time and open receivers. Same as many QB's in the league. If you gave Wilson Tyreek Hill, Kareem Hunt, Travis Kelce and that Chiefs line, he'd look every bit as good as Mahomes.

Click to expand...

Spin Doctor":kkp0q6r8 said:

Mad Dog":kkp0q6r8 said:

Spin Doctor":kkp0q6r8 said:

Mad Dog":kkp0q6r8 said:

QB weaknesses are many? I mean other than being a little short and occasionally holding the ball too long, what are Wilson’s “many” weaknesses?

Wilson was his usual solid efficient self today. Made throws on time. Hit some tight windows. Avoided turnovers. That’s the Wilson we want. Warts and all, apparently.

Click to expand...

Russell Wilson has a lot of weaknesses as a passer. Right now Schottenheimer is trying to hammer some of those out of him. If I had to pin down his weaknesses, the first would be his footwork in the pocket. This is something Schottenheimer even mentioned, and what he has been working on with Russ all offseason long. Footwork is very important for a QB, it is a vital skill set that affects a QB's ball placement and power. If a QB doesn't have proper footwork you see errant balls, and things such as over throws and under throws, both of which we have seen from Wilson when he has been confined to the pocket. His ball placement can be suspect at times as well, which this directly relates to footwork.

The second problem I've been seeing is lack of awareness in the pocket. He doesn't seem to have that same internal clock that most Quarterbacks possess. A good example of this is last week. The bears were bringing obvious blitzes, and Wilson wasn't aware when the corners were bearing down on him. The thing about Wilson is before he would just be able to scramble out of situations like that and make them pay for having one less man in coverage. The thing I've been noticing about his scramble lately, is that teams are starting to get a good idea of where he is going to go to, and where he is going to be. They're coming at him with a controlled rush and just collapsing the pocket rather than trying to jail break him. This forces him to beat teams from the pocket. It's always how teams like the Rams have had our number.

Now, that being said Russell has shown some improvement this game in these areas. Schottenheimer called a quick hit passing game. Russell didn't try to do anything cute, and he executed it. He checked down when he needed to and he had a better grasp of when people were bearing down on him. It was the first glimpse we've gotten of his work in the offseason. One play really stuck out to me. He was in the pocket, and the Seahawks had run a play action from under center. The defensive ends were closing in on him, in the past he would have retreated back into the open field and played a game of matador. Instead he simply stepped up into the pocket, and made a slick slide to set up his blockers and delivered a bullet with a guy in his face. It was the best throw Russ made all game, and it hit Lockett in stride and when he wasn't necessarily open. He was thrown open by Russell.

The significance of this routine play was how fluid Russ looked in that moment. He looked like Tom Brady manipulating the pocket. There was no wasted movement, everything was smooth. He simply stepped up and messed up the defensive ends pursuit angles. THIS is the kind of play you need if you want consistency from quarter to quarter, game to game. It is an element that was missing in Russ's game. If Schottenheimer is able to unlock his potential as a pure pocket passer and merge it with his scrambling abilities then we have another Steve Young on our hands.

Click to expand...

So basically he's short, has poor footwork and occasionally holds the ball too long. 3 weaknesses counts as many. I would say 3 counts as a few. And I'd argue that his footwork isn't as bad as you say it is. It's not as good as some QB's but it's hardly the worst in the league. But you can always get better right?

BTW God's perfect QB just threw for 133 yds 1 TD 1 INT against what many considered the worst team in the league this year. Shall we point out Brady's "many" weaknesses today.

Perfection is unattainable. Being human shouldn't be viewed as weaknesses. I don't think anyone other than NFL QB's have a clue how hard the job is and that expecting perfect footwork and pocket presence on every play when 300 lb men are set on screwing up your life big time is a ridiculously high standard.

Wilson will struggle at times when he's pressured and no one it open and will look great when he's got time and open receivers. Same as many QB's in the league. If you gave Wilson Tyreek Hill, Kareem Hunt, Travis Kelce and that Chiefs line, he'd look every bit as good as Mahomes.

Click to expand...

Poor footwork can completely derail a Quarterbacks game. You're underestimating how vital it is to a Quarterback. Schottenheimer came in, and on the first day he said he wanted to work on Wilson's footwork. It is a problem that needs to be fixed. You know those easy passes that Wilson misses every game? He usually will overthrow his players or put the ball in weird places. You know what that is a result of? Poor footwork and lack of follow through. Holding the ball for two long is also a major issue. You saw how differently the offensive line looked last game, much of that was due to Wilson getting rid of the ball quickly and accurately assessing when he had to get rid of it. Many of Wilson's sacks were on Wilson himself (and many of them have always been on Russ). Refer back to my human pinata post video. Yesterday Wilson looked great with quick hits to move the chains and timing when he had to get rid of the ball.

I also mentioned his ball placement (ties in to footwork) and his lack of pocket awareness and ability to manipulate the pocket. If he masters these abilities he will be more consistent and deadly as a Quarterback. I don't understand why you're jumping down my throat. Wilson has struggled with all of the above. That still doesn't mean he is a bad QB given his unique talents. Even so he is working on those, and finally getting the guidance he needs to ascend to the next level.

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