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Lets talk Kick off returns

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Lets talk Kick off returns
Mon Nov 05, 2018 3:07 pm
  • Ok with all the complaining about returns I just wanted to think about this a moment.

    They changed the rules and watching games players are not getting that 10 to 15 yard clear view of the oncoming team, they defenders are also getting there faster with the shorter separation and you no longer have a wedge or wall.


    I know that Pete had said they need to see things to figure out how to approach it.

    Seems that most teams that try to run it out rarely make it to the 25, in fact many barely get to the 20, oh yeah the occasional 25 to 35 yard return happens but it's occasional. You rarely hear about a return for a Touchdown anymore, where in years past you usually get one or two a weekend.

    I would bet that on average if you take the knee and start at the 25 you would be ahead of the math for field position based on average return yards at this point.

    I think you also need a quick twitch guy if you want any chance to return anything consistently, speed and quickness and change of direction, you have to make the first guy miss accelerate and change direction and then explode to daylight, blockers are spread out all over now as well so setting up a path is a lot harder also.

    I am sure some coach will figure something out to scheme around the situation, but as of today I have not seen anyone really get ahead of the rules here.

    Thoughts?
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    chris98251
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Re: Lets talk Kick off returns
Mon Nov 05, 2018 4:44 pm
  • Teams know this and kick inside the field of play to make the returner run it. I don't think kickers have much difficulty kicking it out of the endzone otherwise.
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Re: Lets talk Kick off returns
Mon Nov 05, 2018 4:53 pm
  • I think putting a 2nd guy back there to pick the path and lead block may help some. Surprised we haven't seen this yet actually. One other thing is I haven't seen many if any worse than Penny on a regular basis either.
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    Seymour
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Re: Lets talk Kick off returns
Mon Nov 05, 2018 5:11 pm
  • We've been experimenting with a few things trying to get more height on kickoffs in order to get our guys down there. I believe the end goal is to make the kickoff a contestable event - to get our guys down there in position to catch the kickoff. I would not at all be surprised to see us chipping it higher and shorter - say the 10 yard line - in order to get our guys there.

    The main problem is the fair catch rule. We cannot interfere with the receiver or the path of the ball, which means if they call for a fair catch we can't legally intercept it. So we can't kick it as short as the 25 or we get no real benefit if they fair-catch. We have to kick it deep enough to make them not want to use a fair catch, but short enough that our guys can still recover the kick.

    Of course all that blows up if our gunners can't get there in time.

    On the receiving side, if we take a touchback we guarantee the spot, but eliminate the potential for a big play. Pete generally won't accept eliminating the chance of a big play. Think of how we all knew the Super Bowl was sealed when Harvin returned the 2nd-half kickoff. The Broncos knew it too - it was completely demoralizing to them.

    If you can win a game on a kick, you take the shot.
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Re: Lets talk Kick off returns
Mon Nov 05, 2018 5:18 pm
  • Dont return kicks if you play for Erin Rodgers.

    best thing to do is just down it all the time. the way the refs can control the game its not worth having bad field position. Lockett and penny have been pedestrian/awful most of the time. take the 25
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Re: Lets talk Kick off returns
Mon Nov 05, 2018 5:22 pm
  • rcaido wrote:Dont return kicks if you play for Erin Rodgers.

    best thing to do is just down it all the time. the way the refs can control the game its not worth having bad field position. Lockett and penny have been pedestrian/awful most of the time. take the 25


    They are kicking short of the goal line at times on purpose, at least once they did to Penny. He has to run from there.
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Re: Lets talk Kick off returns
Mon Nov 05, 2018 5:30 pm
  • The only way to take advantage of it in my eyes as a receiving team, would be to put 2 people back there at different locations. The one with the best vantage point to run gets the ball. This could mean a lateral back in way of a cross the field pass after a 6 or 9 yard fake attempt to run the ball which would definitely miscue the defense. Or it could mean taking the ball himself/herself and running until he/she gets tackled. It would have to be a decision made at the time of reception and adjusting for play vision options. Just an opinion.
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Re: Lets talk Kick off returns
Tue Nov 06, 2018 8:41 am
  • let Prosise run it out...Penny is slow...Prosise has nothing else to do anyway.
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Re: Lets talk Kick off returns
Tue Nov 06, 2018 10:28 pm
  • Seems to me that Seabass's kickoffs are kinda low line drives nor giving the defenders much time to get down there.
    Don't remember too many touchbacks either.
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Re: Lets talk Kick off returns
Wed Nov 07, 2018 9:31 am
  • There is a lot more to the changes made to the kickoff rules. Heard on NFL radio on sirius, so no link, that the average weight of players on kickoff teams is down by 7 lbs. This is due to the need for speed. This was also part of their intentions. Another byproduct of the speed-need was that there is less use of linebackers which results in less violent collisions.

    I think overall we are going to see it settle down to exactly the way it is. A lot less returns with 1st & 10 from the 25. It's what they want. I truly believe they wanted to get rid of it altogether but that would have caused too much of a stir.
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Re: Lets talk Kick off returns
Wed Nov 07, 2018 1:47 pm
  • I thought this thread was going to be about how terrible Penny is at returning. To slow and no twitch.
    Russell has some stats that aren't Superb? Ow! Love his balls anyways!

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