Carson behind Penny in yards after contact?

toffee

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[tweet]http://twitter.com/PFF_Fantasy/status/1107717057582452737[/tweet]

Chris Carson finished just below his teammate, Rashaad Penny, in terms of yards after contact per carry in 2018

Somehow it didn’t quite feel that way? Thought Carson would have came out ahead in this category?


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IBleedBlueAndGreen

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toffee":knwarv54 said:
http://twitter.com/PFF_Fantasy/status/1107717057582452737

Chris Carson finished just below his teammate, Rashaad Penny, in terms of yards after contact per carry in 2018

Somehow it didn’t quite feel that way? Thought Carson would have came out ahead in this category?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Penny had a couple of real long runs that happened after he got hit in the backfield. Thus the higher YAContact. However Carson got consistently better YAContact if you take out the couple of big hitters.
 

Seymour

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IBleedBlueAndGreen":s8om3cyj said:
toffee":s8om3cyj said:
http://twitter.com/PFF_Fantasy/status/1107717057582452737

Chris Carson finished just below his teammate, Rashaad Penny, in terms of yards after contact per carry in 2018

Somehow it didn’t quite feel that way? Thought Carson would have came out ahead in this category?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Penny had a couple of real long runs that happened after he got hit in the backfield. Thus the higher YAContact. However Carson got consistently better YAContact if you take out the couple of big hitters.

Exactly this^^^^^
 

chris98251

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Sample size also, Carson ran more and had more short yardage situations as well, you run 250 times versus say 120 times as well as between the 20s during those 120 times versus goal line, short yardage in the shadow of your goal posts with a stacked defense to stop the run those extra yards are harder to get that Carson was asked to do.
 

Spin Doctor

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chris98251":45ii1i2o said:
Sample size also, Carson ran more and had more short yardage situations as well, you run 250 times versus say 120 times as well as between the 20s during those 100 times versus goal line, short yardage in the shadow of your goal posts with a stacked defense to stop the run those extra yards are harder to get.
Penny was also brought out in niche situations. Really his party trick was the counters, and jet sweeps in select situations. There were situations where players would barely touch him, and he would go off for a big gain. He had two really big runs that I can remember that he used some shake and bake and got some huge yardage. Carson for the most part was more of a consistent grinder. He was always good for 4 yards a pop. He could turn sure losses into 3 yard gains. He often times ran in stacked boxes, and right up the gut through crowded lanes. Penny by comparison didn't do so well in the same situations that Carson was put in. That is why he was used as more of a change up.

I remember seeing stats before we used Penny like Reggie Bush sort of character, he had the lowest yards after contact. He really needs a head of steam, and some space to do work.
 

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toffee":3ltctdup said:
I kinda remember Penny's inability to break tackles,
When he had open space, and momentum he didn't do too badly in that regard. Whenever we tried to run him up the middle, or perhaps in between the tackle and guard he was pretty awful as far as breaking tackles goes. His balance seemed off, and he did a lot of dancing around in the backfield. Usually he was brought down promptly if the defender looked at him funny. His cut move is really good, but it seems like he takes a long time to get up to full speed. I think he was playing over the weight he should have been at. Definitely didn't look comfortable going up the middle.
 

12AngryHawks

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Anyone remember PFF saying before the season that Penny was #1 in YAC coming out of college? It was for the same reason, dude ran for 2,000+ yards his final year, so he had plenty of long runs, contact can mean a simple tap on the shoulder, that's why PFF graded him #1, even though the truth in that stat is stretched.

But I still like Penny though, I was a fan of his during his senior season, and I was happy (and shocked) when Seattle chose him. The good thing is, he did get better as the season went on, he did say the game was slowing down for him, and I have good hopes for him next season, he'll have a year under his belt, and he should be in better shape. It's good to have his speed & elusiveness to pair with Carson's physicality. We might see more of those types of runs he had against the Packers & Vikings last season, those are the kind of runs that get the Clink roaring.
 

Thepeelsessions

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Penny started extremely slow last season. I expect a huge jump in production and efficiency from him this season, especially with Davis gone. He's definitely the most talented (all things considered) running back on this team. He has the build to run with authority while still having the agility and quickness he showed last year. He needs to adopt the right mindset that Carson has of being a punishing runner.
 

Ozzy

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Penny is better than people in here give him credit for. He is probably the future. I was disappointed in the draft pick and I still am when factoring in cost but I do think Penny can be a very good player and I love Carson.
 

mistaowen

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Spin Doctor":3ugkv09g said:
toffee":3ugkv09g said:
I kinda remember Penny's inability to break tackles,
When he had open space, and momentum he didn't do too badly in that regard. Whenever we tried to run him up the middle, or perhaps in between the tackle and guard he was pretty awful as far as breaking tackles goes. His balance seemed off, and he did a lot of dancing around in the backfield. Usually he was brought down promptly if the defender looked at him funny. His cut move is really good, but it seems like he takes a long time to get up to full speed. I think he was playing over the weight he should have been at. Definitely didn't look comfortable going up the middle.

On this, it was clear they started calling specific plays to get him outside when he was on the field. That is where he had all his big runs in college (and had success in the NFL), I remember watching his highlights and often times it was beat 1 man to the corner and go 70+ yards relatively untouched. Not much of his game was grind it out, up the middle 4 yard gains, which is a staple of this offense. He does have some pretty good explosion, might just need a full offseason of weight training and diet.
 
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toffee

toffee

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mistaowen":2c5ifot8 said:
Spin Doctor":2c5ifot8 said:
toffee":2c5ifot8 said:
I kinda remember Penny's inability to break tackles,
When he had open space, and momentum he didn't do too badly in that regard. Whenever we tried to run him up the middle, or perhaps in between the tackle and guard he was pretty awful as far as breaking tackles goes. His balance seemed off, and he did a lot of dancing around in the backfield. Usually he was brought down promptly if the defender looked at him funny. His cut move is really good, but it seems like he takes a long time to get up to full speed. I think he was playing over the weight he should have been at. Definitely didn't look comfortable going up the middle.

On this, it was clear they started calling specific plays to get him outside when he was on the field. That is where he had all his big runs in college (and had success in the NFL), I remember watching his highlights and often times it was beat 1 man to the corner and go 70+ yards relatively untouched. Not much of his game was grind it out, up the middle 4 yard gains, which is a staple of this offense. He does have some pretty good explosion, might just need a full offseason of weight training and diet.

Key point is conditioning and training. I suspect going up the middle in between tackles also requires different mind set, hoping Penny will learn from watching Carson.
 

chris98251

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toffee":2w1m2uow said:
mistaowen":2w1m2uow said:
Spin Doctor":2w1m2uow said:
toffee":2w1m2uow said:
I kinda remember Penny's inability to break tackles,
When he had open space, and momentum he didn't do too badly in that regard. Whenever we tried to run him up the middle, or perhaps in between the tackle and guard he was pretty awful as far as breaking tackles goes. His balance seemed off, and he did a lot of dancing around in the backfield. Usually he was brought down promptly if the defender looked at him funny. His cut move is really good, but it seems like he takes a long time to get up to full speed. I think he was playing over the weight he should have been at. Definitely didn't look comfortable going up the middle.

On this, it was clear they started calling specific plays to get him outside when he was on the field. That is where he had all his big runs in college (and had success in the NFL), I remember watching his highlights and often times it was beat 1 man to the corner and go 70+ yards relatively untouched. Not much of his game was grind it out, up the middle 4 yard gains, which is a staple of this offense. He does have some pretty good explosion, might just need a full offseason of weight training and diet.

Key point is conditioning and training. I suspect going up the middle in between tackles also requires different mind set, hoping Penny will learn from watching Carson.

Yes it does, I call it running violently daring someone to try and tackle you, inflicting rather then accepting punishment.
 

NorthDallas40oz

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The bottom line here is that they're both quite good runners after contact. It can be left at that.
 

Spin Doctor

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NorthDallas40oz":3nton9ah said:
The bottom line here is that they're both quite good runners after contact. It can be left at that.
I don't necessarily think Penny is so good after contact. His numbers are very deceptive. He was only good there in niche situations where he could get a full head of steam. Most of the time he went down if the defender looked at him funny. If he doesn't diversify his skill set he's going to be nothing but a change of pace back/3rd down player in the NFL. I mean, those role players are important, but I would hope he becomes more than that given what we paid.
 

KiwiHawk

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Penny is a guy who can win the corner and take it for a big gain. Carson is a guy who will go through the middle for 5 yards and a cloud of dust (or ground rubber). Completely different beasts.
 

Tical21

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Tbf, I don't think Penny ran much counter, and am darn sure he never ran a jet sweep.
 
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