I like the draft, HATE the FA Signings!

Why have they spent so much money on Free Agents? Did we really need Greg Olsen that badly? And why did they pay Bruce Irvin so much?

Looking back, they have a tendency to over-commit to some players, and really need to reevaluate their approach to re-signing players and to free agency.


I'm with Rob Staton on this topic, and he makes some very salient points, doing so much better than I ever could:

A couple of weeks ago I questioned whether Seattle had used the $53.37m they’ve spent on veterans this year wisely.

Paying another $4m for Freeman would be another questionable decision — right up there with giving Bruce Irvin a 32% pay increase, bumping Cedric Ogbuehi’s pay from $895,000 to $2.237m, spending $3.259m on Jacob Hollister despite investing $7m in Greg Olsen then drafting two tight ends, using your first round pick on a position where you’re already committing $25m to two players or failing to invest serious resources into your biggest need (D-line) while collecting 18 offensive linemen.

More importantly though, $4m is a significant chunk of cash on a player who looks spent. Would he seriously contribute much at all — other than providing name recognition? If Carson got hurt, is Devonta Freeman going to come to the rescue?

And while many folks like to ridicule the idea of spending a high pick on a running back — it’s worth noting the four-year value teams are getting by tapping into a talented group in the 2020 draft class.

Clyde Edwards-Helaire’s cap hit this year will likely be around $1.9m. In the final year of his rookie deal his cap hit will be about $3.2m — less than the Seahawks are reportedly willing to commit to Freeman.

http://seahawksdraftblog.com/

at no point have ever been a Bruce Irvin fan, dude was consistently unable to seal the edge when he was young. now he's lost a step. He's a liability against the run.

Hmmm...he got 8.5 sacks last year on a crap defense and he's cooked?....Dude, our best sack numbers were from the departed Jefferson who only had 4,

The Irvin signing was cheap compared to other options. If you are going to question something how about the 11 OL men they signed. Maybe only Finny is a keeper.

I’m kind of tired of our free agent OL philosophy of signing a bunch of players who were disappointments for their last team. Did we learn nothing from Luke Joeckel, J’Marcus Webb, etc.? Three of our four FAs fit that description this year. I wish we had tried quality over quantity.

It's incredible to me, especially with a DL that looks like well fed people lining up at a smorgasboard.

Would you feel better if Clowney and Griffen had already signed somewhere else? I'm not a happy with the Devonta Freeman offer, but I understand why they're kicking the tires. I suspect Lynch will resign closer to the end of training camp.

Call me crazy, but I think Greg Olson will set the tone in the TE room, and I think he'll have a big overall impact (positive) on the team. Luke Willson, true team guy, may be the odd man out.

I want to see a pass rushing 3-tech DT added, but there's no real rush right now. Guys are often available after the last cutdown before the season kicks off. Pete makes decent use of veteran DL cast offs. Pete's not a traditional thinker, and I think this year's team is loaded with "potential". Hopefully, it translates to the field.

Breno Giacomini was a low level cast off, but added a ring. I think OL guys either are studs come out of college, or they need time for the lights to turn on, the game to slow down and for their man strength to develop.

I forgot to add, please cut Nick Bellore this year. Keep an extra TE / H-Back instead.

Pretty much.

These UFA signings remind me of the J'Marcus Webb, Eddy Lacey, Luke Joeckel type of signings a few years ago. Over spending for names, and overpaying JAGs.

$54M in cap space LMAO. Could've just signed Clowney, Everson Griffin, Jack Conklin, Finny, and called it good.

With Finney being more of a cap savings move to replace Britt.

The Seahawks are overspending at LBer to the detriment of their D-Line. And overspending at TE to the detriment of their O-Line.

The Seahawks will eventually cut some of their RFA's to clear out some more cap space, but that will be more of a clear room for the future, than to get more cap space to sign impact players now.

Russell Wilson can get this team to the playoffs, but if they are to do anything when they get there they need a lot of 1st & 2nd year players to take huge leaps forward.

I just don't really see this the same way as of May. Sure it could turn out poorly but is that the most likely outcome? I think history has shown over and over again that the real way to win in NFL free agency is not to overpay for the flashiest names but instead to get solid players at a decent value.

TE was an enormous hole last year after we lost Dissly and this is a team that wants to use 12 personnel a lot. I disagree that we are overspending here as only Olsen has much in the way of guaranteed dollars and the total TE group is probably going to end up at a very reasonable $10m.

OL spending was mostly limited to Shell as a replacement for Ifedi, Finney as a replacement for Britt, and Ogbuehi as a replacement for Fant. The memes about having 18 OL are silly as only five of our OL have large enough guarantees to suggest they will make the team, and that is counting Haynes and Lewis with contracts under 1m.

Meanwhile, RB does still look a bit weak if Penny is going to be missing serious time and so I'm not surprised we're talking to potential candidates.

On defense we did make a splash in the secondary trading for Dunbar. Our other positions were mainly addressed in the draft and UDFA thus far as of May, but everybody realizes that the Hawks tend to add veterans to the defense later on in the off-season.

Posters should realize that we have been bolstering the DE with early draft picks for three years in a row now and ultimately those guys are going to be busts which will be a big problem or they will develop and contribute. For those who are really anchored to the sack number and worried about it, consider that we did make a very large splash last off-season on a big name in Clowney and we still had poor sack numbers. Adding five cheap DEs this year in Irvin, Mayowa, Jackson, Taylor and Robinson could work out better to improve the overall rotation, and the team could still have further plans there.

Fade":3asbgl80 said:

Pretty much.

These UFA signings remind me of the J'Marcus Webb, Eddy Lacey, Luke Joeckel type of signings a few years ago. Over spending for names, and overpaying JAGs.

$54M in cap space LMAO. Could've just signed Clowney, Everson Griffin, Jack Conklin, Finny, and called it good.

With Finney being more of a cap savings move to replace Britt.

The Seahawks are overspending at LBer to the detriment of their D-Line. And overspending at TE to the detriment of their O-Line.

The Seahawks will eventually cut some of their RFA's to clear out some more cap space, but that will be more of a clear room for the future, than to get more cap space to sign impact players now.

Russell Wilson can get this team to the playoffs, but if they are to do anything when they get there they need a lot of 1st & 2nd year players to take huge leaps forward.

Click to expand...

While I heartily disagree with some of your points, I really appreciate the reality check nature, kind of a cold-slap-in-the-face, and "Thanks, I needed that!" (Wasn't that an old commercial?)

Eddy Can't Lace 'em, and Luke Joke, now those were two waste-of-money signings. I don't even remember the Webb character, hope we didn't give him much.

I think Pete and John are building the team for JAG DYJ depth. A lot of the time that's what wins games, our JAGs making key plays by Doing Their Job/DYJ. Tre Flowers making a tackle on 3rd down. Jordan Simmons plugging in for an injured DJ Fluker and the league-leading run game *improves*. John Ursua making a key catch. Poona Ford stuffing a running play.

For JAG DYJ guys, Bruce Irvin and Benson Mayowa are nice pickups, and our OL additions are JAGs with some upside. Carlos Hyde runs hard and bruising like Chris Carson. Dunbar, assuming he plays, great pickup. We had a really beat up OL last year, hell, every year. I think we'll have enough OL depth to play through injuries and not have a huge dropoff. We have our outside tackle position capably manned even after losing George Fant. Our TE position will be in good shape one way or another.

Basically, I think our FA JAG DYJ guys will play up to or over their contracts, we'll have some really good contributions from a couple-three rookies, and some nice Redshirt Revelation players who outplay their rookie contracts. Ultimately, it's the teams with numerous players outplaying their contracts that typically win in December and make noise in the playoffs. We won't have a lot of salary dead money; most of our payroll will be contributing on the field.

Chukarhawk":2wwfn1j0 said:

at no point have ever been a Bruce Irvin fan, dude was consistently unable to seal the edge when he was young. now he's lost a step. He's a liability against the run.

Click to expand...

He did suck at setting the edge his first two years. After that, I thought he seemed to improve to where he was reasonably capable. Then he left.

Looks like they chose Mayowa and Irvin over Everson Griffen.

Olsen (35) $7M
Irvin (33) 6M
Hyde (30) 4M
Mayowa (29) 4M

Good additions, but seem overpaid and would've rather spent the money elsewhere.

Unless Ifedi just wanted out of Seattle, not sure why they wouldn't re-sign him for what he got from the Bears instead of giving Shell all that money.

Chukarhawk":hndn7a6q said:

at no point have ever been a Bruce Irvin fan, dude was consistently unable to seal the edge when he was young. now he's lost a step. He's a liability against the run.

Click to expand...

He should have never been setting the edge. Dude had 8 sacks as a rookie on mostly 3rd down rotations. He should have never been a LB or in pass coverage. He was meant to rush the QB. They played it all wrong.

jamescasey1124":23efwgto said:

Chukarhawk":23efwgto said:

at no point have ever been a Bruce Irvin fan, dude was consistently unable to seal the edge when he was young. now he's lost a step. He's a liability against the run.

Click to expand...

He should have never been setting the edge. Dude had 8 sacks as a rookie on mostly 3rd down rotations. He should have never been a LB or in pass coverage. He was meant to rush the QB. They played it all wrong.

Click to expand...

Half of the 8 sacks his rookie year were in one game. I’ve always thought he was overrated.

massari":3uxp60e9 said:

Looks like they chose Mayowa and Irvin over Everson Griffen.

Olsen (35) $7M
Irvin (33) 6M
Hyde (30) 4M
Mayowa (29) 4M

Good additions, but seem overpaid and would've rather spent the money elsewhere.

Unless Ifedi just wanted out of Seattle, not sure why they wouldn't re-sign him for what he got from the Bears instead of giving Shell all that money.

Click to expand...

I'm good with Irvin and Mayowa as a pair over Everson Griffin. Griffin is a bit of a headcase, and trades with the Vikings for headcases haven't been huge wins in the past. Harvin? We don't really know which Griffin we'd get. With Irvin and Mayowa, the likelihood of getting the production we paid for is better.

I'm still hoping the Hawks find a way to bring back Clowney. Not sure how they'll work the cap. For me, Clowney over Griffin all day, every day.

olyfan63":3sixt9av said:

Fade":3sixt9av said:

Pretty much.

These UFA signings remind me of the J'Marcus Webb, Eddy Lacey, Luke Joeckel type of signings a few years ago. Over spending for names, and overpaying JAGs.

$54M in cap space LMAO. Could've just signed Clowney, Everson Griffin, Jack Conklin, Finny, and called it good.

With Finney being more of a cap savings move to replace Britt.

The Seahawks are overspending at LBer to the detriment of their D-Line. And overspending at TE to the detriment of their O-Line.

The Seahawks will eventually cut some of their RFA's to clear out some more cap space, but that will be more of a clear room for the future, than to get more cap space to sign impact players now.

Russell Wilson can get this team to the playoffs, but if they are to do anything when they get there they need a lot of 1st & 2nd year players to take huge leaps forward.

Click to expand...

While I heartily disagree with some of your points, I really appreciate the reality check nature, kind of a cold-slap-in-the-face, and "Thanks, I needed that!" (Wasn't that an old commercial?)

Eddy Can't Lace 'em, and Luke Joke, now those were two waste-of-money signings. I don't even remember the Webb character, hope we didn't give him much.

I think Pete and John are building the team for JAG DYJ depth. A lot of the time that's what wins games, our JAGs making key plays by Doing Their Job/DYJ. Tre Flowers making a tackle on 3rd down. Jordan Simmons plugging in for an injured DJ Fluker and the league-leading run game *improves*. John Ursua making a key catch. Poona Ford stuffing a running play.

For JAG DYJ guys, Bruce Irvin and Benson Mayowa are nice pickups, and our OL additions are JAGs with some upside. Carlos Hyde runs hard and bruising like Chris Carson. Dunbar, assuming he plays, great pickup. We had a really beat up OL last year, hell, every year. I think we'll have enough OL depth to play through injuries and not have a huge dropoff. We have our outside tackle position capably manned even after losing George Fant. Our TE position will be in good shape one way or another.

Basically, I think our FA JAG DYJ guys will play up to or over their contracts, we'll have some really good contributions from a couple-three rookies, and some nice Redshirt Revelation players who outplay their rookie contracts. Ultimately, it's the teams with numerous players outplaying their contracts that typically win in December and make noise in the playoffs. We won't have a lot of salary dead money; most of our payroll will be contributing on the field.

Click to expand...

Quality over quantity. Because if teams are doing it right, they build their depth through the draft. Instead Seattle signed a bunch of JAGs that will get in the way of the their young depth developing properly. I've seen it for 5 seasons now.

Smart teams sign a couple of depth veterans to round out their roster. Seattle is building their team around short term stopgaps. They're building their team as if it is already superstar laden. It is insane.

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.c...tars-to-help-the-seahawks-take-the-next-step/
“I think we need a couple more [players],” Wilson told ESPN, via Bob Condotta of the Seattle Times. “I think we need a couple more. [Defensive end] Jadeveon [Clowney] is a big-time guy that we would love to get back on our football team. He was so good in the locker room. He brought so many just havoc plays to the field. Hopefully, we can get a few other players there on the defense. Then also on offense, we have a great offense, but I think we can always add more pieces. I think that’s going to be the part that’s going to be great with [General Manager] John Schneider and [coach] Pete [Carroll], as well, in terms of this offseason’s free agency. Free agency is very, very key to getting those superstars on your team and try to get great players that can fill the space.”

It’s a bold statement from Wilson, who rarely ventures into any territory that remotely could be regarded as controversial.

Seattle needed "Superstars" as Wilson put it during the offseason, guys you can build around for 3-5 seasons. They have plenty of fill in guys already. They needed to add impact to the roster and had $70M+ in cap space to do just that.

Now we cross our fingers and hope a bunch of young players come out of know where, because the veteran signings were a huge waste of money, due to them being a bunch of stopgaps that will have to be plugged again next off-season with a shrinking cap. DUMB.

Half of the 8 sacks his rookie year were in one game. I’ve always thought he was overrated.[/quote]

Now go back on game pass and watch every snap he played opposite of where he should be 2013...he only rushed on third downs. Too many lb plays. I get it. He was athletic as hell and they put him out in space, but overrated is strong when you play a position mostly based on the defense and not personal skill sets. If he played line solely he would have double the numbers just in snaps alone.

He is a good signing. Guranteed he gets 5 sacks. Which is what they will pay him to do. Him and benson.

My bad I mean Irvin 2012 when he was a rookie.

With the Hyde signing the Seahawks have now spent $60M in cap space on stop gap veterans! LMAO.

Seattle needs to have a lot of young guys show their worth, and develop. Too bad they will be blocked by stop gaps to the tune of $60M and counting in 2020.

Seattle's 2020 plan reminds me of those early Cleveland Cavalier teams with LeBron James. A superstar surrounded by a bunch of veteran stop gaps. Ultimately you can get to the playoffs based on that one player's greatness, but you're not going to come close to winning a championship.

This is a 6-10 team with an average starting QB. One of the worst teams in the league with a below avg. QB.

Wilson will be dragging dead bodies over the finish line once again, and get them to 10-6, or thereabouts.

Fast forward to '21 and the cupboards are going to be bare. Unless A LOT of young guys, pop! And I mean a lot, an inordinate amount, kind of a lot!

They improved depth all the way across the board and after last years injuries that is positive, The DL is in a shambles, with them depending on June July and August to try and sort it out. About as far from ideal as possible.