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Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!

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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Sun Jul 26, 2020 9:32 pm
  • The reason we don't draft well in the first round is because we draft outside the top-20 players, which is because we make the playoffs pretty much every year under Pete Carroll.

    And we're not just out of the top 20 in the first round. Every round we draft is like we're drafting down a round.

    I'm OK with that, because it's the cost of success.
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Sun Jul 26, 2020 9:36 pm
  • KiwiHawk wrote:The reason we don't draft well in the first round is because we draft outside the top-20 players, which is because we make the playoffs pretty much every year under Pete Carroll.

    And we're not just out of the top 20 in the first round. Every round we draft is like we're drafting down a round.

    I'm OK with that, because it's the cost of success.


    True, but more likely and I"ve heard JS mention numerous times.. like after or before the draft, that they have categorized players worthy of being true #1's and once that list is gone, it's a crap shoot so they take, regardless of other reports who they think can fit what they want.. and it usually means trading down since they usually feel they can get them later in the round.
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Sun Jul 26, 2020 11:26 pm
  • The difference between a divisional round loss and a Superbowl opportunity is stuff like this, going all in. Draft picks are essential, yes, but at some point you have to make moves and live for the now. Accumulating draft picks and playing it conservative just makes you the Jaguars, Jets, Bengals, and Dolphins, always in rebuild mode.


    KC traded for Clark as their missing piece. The 2018 Rams, while they failed in the SB, got there by going all in on FA with a QB on a rookie deal. I'd argue they went a bit overboard, but it at least let them shoot the shot.

    I'm convinced the offense is top 5. When you know you have a good squad and awesome QB, you go out and find that missing piece to put you over the top.

    Grade for me is a B+ and I'm feeling a solid 8 out of 10.
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Sun Jul 26, 2020 11:34 pm
  • This makes the Dunbar situation that much more depressing. Can you imagine what our secondary could be if Dunbar, Adams, and Griffin were all on the field? I feel like we still need some pass rush, but time will tell!
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Sun Jul 26, 2020 11:44 pm
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 12:56 am
  • With all the stuff going on I doubt we have any court proceedings for some time with Dunbar, he more then likely will be under a microscope but like Kendrick's have many legal things to sort out before any trial is set if it gets to that.

    He will be able to play until there is an actual conviction, unless the NFL decides to get involved, but they have bigger issues at the moment as well also.
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 3:44 am
  • pittpnthrs wrote:
    Maelstrom787 wrote:
    pittpnthrs wrote:Its official, our front office is a disaster. Gave up the world for a player we didnt need while the glaring holes we have still remain. This move will handicap the team for years to come. As for the people defending this move by saying our first rounders never pan out anyways,,,,,,think about what your saying. If that doesnt define ineptitude, I dont know what does.


    This is a crap take. The team needed a blue chip talent to remain competitive. Adams will be a leader for years to come and is as versatile of a defender as you can find.

    You generally just don't find guys like that outside of the top of the draft. This trade haul is similar to a trade up to the top 10 in the draft... except Adams is a proven blue chip. This is absolutely not as bad as it looks when you consider where the picks would likely be in the draft order.


    Its not a crap take. Seriously they havent had a good draft in like 7 years (2015 was mediocre). Our biggest weaknesses are offensive and defensive line and they have done nothing to fix it. Wilson staying healthy has been the luckiest thing in the world. One day our luck is going to run out. Adams will handicap our cap space for years to come. This is yet another luxury take when we cant afford it. This FO is so criminally overatted its sad.


    Sorry, but it is totally a crap take. None of the things you have listed are good reasons to pass up on obtaining one of the leagues true blue chip players at 24 years old.

    If you look at where the selections they traded away would be, you'd realize that it is a near certainty that those 2 players would not add up to 1 Jamal Adams worth of talent. Yes, Seattle will have to pay him... but not immediately, and you shouldn't be opposed to paying legitimate cornerstones anyway, which Adams is.

    Also, saying the team has done nothing to address the lines is wrong. Starting with the obvious - improving pass coverage does a ton to help the defensive line. Adams provides flexibility and prowess in the defensive backfield, which will do wonders for pass coverage and therefore the defense as a whole. Also, the team drafted two guys for juice off the edge, signed Irvin, and will likely sign another guy - hard to say there has been no effort to improve the line.

    The offensive line portion is wholly irrelevant to the conversation, but they made some good signings there as well.

    This team obviously needed something more to get them back to the big dance. Jamal Adams has a much higher chance of pushing them closer to that goal than 2 late first rounders do.
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 5:30 am
  • Yeah, getting one of the best players in football.....oh the horror. Proven top tier players > draft picks that likely don't pan out anyway (see recent 1st rd. picks for Seattle)
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 5:37 am
  • Maelstrom787 wrote:
    pittpnthrs wrote:
    Maelstrom787 wrote:
    pittpnthrs wrote:Its official, our front office is a disaster. Gave up the world for a player we didnt need while the glaring holes we have still remain. This move will handicap the team for years to come. As for the people defending this move by saying our first rounders never pan out anyways,,,,,,think about what your saying. If that doesnt define ineptitude, I dont know what does.


    This is a crap take. The team needed a blue chip talent to remain competitive. Adams will be a leader for years to come and is as versatile of a defender as you can find.

    You generally just don't find guys like that outside of the top of the draft. This trade haul is similar to a trade up to the top 10 in the draft... except Adams is a proven blue chip. This is absolutely not as bad as it looks when you consider where the picks would likely be in the draft order.


    Its not a crap take. Seriously they havent had a good draft in like 7 years (2015 was mediocre). Our biggest weaknesses are offensive and defensive line and they have done nothing to fix it. Wilson staying healthy has been the luckiest thing in the world. One day our luck is going to run out. Adams will handicap our cap space for years to come. This is yet another luxury take when we cant afford it. This FO is so criminally overatted its sad.


    Sorry, but it is totally a crap take. None of the things you have listed are good reasons to pass up on obtaining one of the leagues true blue chip players at 24 years old.

    If you look at where the selections they traded away would be, you'd realize that it is a near certainty that those 2 players would not add up to 1 Jamal Adams worth of talent. Yes, Seattle will have to pay him... but not immediately, and you shouldn't be opposed to paying legitimate cornerstones anyway, which Adams is.

    Also, saying the team has done nothing to address the lines is wrong. Starting with the obvious - improving pass coverage does a ton to help the defensive line. Adams provides flexibility and prowess in the defensive backfield, which will do wonders for pass coverage and therefore the defense as a whole. Also, the team drafted two guys for juice off the edge, signed Irvin, and will likely sign another guy - hard to say there has been no effort to improve the line.

    The offensive line portion is wholly irrelevant to the conversation, but they made some good signings there as well.

    This team obviously needed something more to get them back to the big dance. Jamal Adams has a much higher chance of pushing them closer to that goal than 2 late first rounders do.


    The draft picks arent the issue here, its the position of the player taken. Lord knows the FO cant draft anyways as everybody on this board admits when trying to defend this trade. I like your optimism, but I just dont agree with it. I dont believe our secondary was as bad as people perceive. I feel they got screwed due to opposing QB's having practically all day to pass due to,,,,,,wait for it,,,,an awful pass rush. You feel Irvin is going to be a difference maker, I dont. If anything, the Adams trade looks like desperation due to realizing the pass rush is going to suck. Instead of fixing the actual problem, they try to mask the issue with a very expensive band-aid. People keep bringing up Adams sack numbers. Do you honestly believe Nortons going to implement a scheme to take advantage of that? I dont.

    The offensive line irrelevant? Its the biggest weakness on the team and has been for years. There is one person on the team that is the sole difference between the team making the playoffs and winning maybe 4 games and nobody seems to care about him. Its baffling. Resources spent on that shiny new safety should have been spent on protecting the one guy that truly matters, but no, lets roll the dice for another season. Why not, they've been lucky so far. Good signings to improve the line? If anything, it looks worse with those signings. Again, I like your optimism.

    To get back to the big dance, the team needs to fix the actual problems at hand (offensive and defensive lines) and not improving on areas that were already competent to start with. At the end of the day, Jamal Adams is a safety. A safety. The Jets fleeced us.
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 5:43 am
  • It's still July, plenty can be done before the season. Clowney or Griffin will be added. Huge need filled.
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 6:40 am
  • It is reasonable to expect that the two ones would have been Late rounders. There are no sure shots there, so its also reasonable to expect we would have gotten two good level squad players. Would you trade that to an absolute superstar who has proven his skills and has two years left in his rookie deal? I know I would.
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 6:51 am
  • One of the best in the league over crap shoot draft picks, every single time.
    Did they give up too much? Sure. But oh well. All we hear is people complain that they never add to a crap defense. Well, this team just got a lot better because of this addition. And he's all of 24.
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 7:32 am

Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 8:00 am
  • So here it is.

    https://twitter.com/TomPelissero/status ... 31489?s=09

    Adams will play the season that is about to get cancelled ( see MLB who is cancelling two games today after less than a week). Then he has promised nothing. Clearly plans to holdout and complain in the media unless a deal is made.

    Seahawks will be forced to overpay as they gave up all the picks.

    Love the deal - hate that an extension was not in place, understand why you don't do a blockbuster extension in a pandemic year....
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 8:08 am
  • Well, this has been an interesting thread since the trade. A lot of opinions on both sides of the fence.

    I for one have already stated that it was a very important add. Face it our FO has no clue how to draft well. There misses in the first and even high second round for 6 years has put us in this type of position. We have no real All-Pro caliber players drafted in this six years. In addition, almost no real pro bowl players as well. When you swing that many times a the draft board and come up missing it's clear you suck at draft player evaluation.

    Our lines are a mess. I don't think there is anyone who disagrees with that statement. No one player that this team could trade for will change that dynamic on either side of the line. Other teams aren't giving away their high quality line players to us. Most aren't even willing to trade them. So thinking we could make a major move to fix either line with All Pro or even Pro Bowl caliber players is just not realistic.

    So what is our next best option. Find a player that is a young, All Pro talent that can transform a competent area into a dominant group. That is what Adams does for this team. The difference between McDougald and Adams is stunning. The ability to put Adams in different positions on our defense is something we haven't had in a long time. Opposing offenses will have to revamp their strategy with him on the field. Our other D players will feed off him. That is what our defense needs. And we have the financial resources to still help find Line talent before the start of the season. We can also still make trades.

    It's clear this is an all in strategy for PC to get this team back to a Super Bowl before he retires. If we get another SB win then it is more than worth it to me. Just saying. :2thumbs:
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 8:33 am
  • kf3339 wrote:Well, this has been an interesting thread since the trade. A lot of opinions on both sides of the fence.

    I for one have already stated that it was a very important add. Face it our FO has no clue how to draft well. There misses in the first and even high second round for 6 years has put us in this type of position. We have no real All-Pro caliber players drafted in this six years. In addition, almost no real pro bowl players as well. When you swing that many times a the draft board and come up missing it's clear you suck at draft player evaluation.

    Our lines are a mess. I don't think there is anyone who disagrees with that statement. No one player that this team could trade for will change that dynamic on either side of the line. Other teams aren't giving away their high quality line players to us. Most aren't even willing to trade them. So thinking we could make a major move to fix either line with All Pro or even Pro Bowl caliber players is just not realistic.

    So what is our next best option. Find a player that is a young, All Pro talent that can transform a competent area into a dominant group. That is what Adams does for this team. The difference between McDougald and Adams is stunning. The ability to put Adams in different positions on our defense is something we haven't had in a long time. Opposing offenses will have to revamp their strategy with him on the field. Our other D players will feed off him. That is what our defense needs. And we have the financial resources to still help find Line talent before the start of the season. We can also still make trades.

    It's clear this is an all in strategy for PC to get this team back to a Super Bowl before he retires. If we get another SB win then it is more than worth it to me. Just saying. :2thumbs:


    You've nailed why we continue to keep giving up draft capital to go out and get All Pro free agents.

    - Adams
    - Clowney
    - Brown

    Three in the past three years with what, 7-8 draft picks given up?

    While I love getting elite free agents, it's not a sustainable way to build a SB contender. It's a short term fix for a long term problem. In this case the long term problem is just what you said, the inability to draft elite game changing talent.

    For every DK Metcalf, there's been too many Lano Hills, Ifedi's, Colliers, McDowells and Tedrick Thompsons.

    I've always loved Pete and John's go for broke style of wheeling and dealing, so I'm fine with the trade. But make no mistake, these are becoming more and more signs of desperation due to poor drafts then the wheeling and dealing to find that one final missing piece like they used to do.
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 8:36 am
  • It is no surprise we have not been able to make our #1s into star players. You get better at the things you strive for. As an organization, you move people and resources toward the goals set. This team has not made making #1s into great players a priority for some time.

    Generally, we would prefer 3 players with a 30% chance of being a star - to one player with an 80% chance of being a starter. That has been our philosophy for some time. Draft for upside. To do this, you give yourselves as many spins of the wheel as possible. But it is very different from drafting players to reliably be starters.

    It was costly, but not as costly to us as other teams - because we do not depend on our #1s working out. We just need good players from the aggregate pool of draft picks. And we generally manage to do this.

    (BTW, how much of missed opportunity was it not to get Minkah Fitzpatrick? We came one goal line opportunity away from getting home field advantage from the 49ers, who eventually went to the SB. While Minkah isn't Adams, he can play strong and free safety. We now have Adams, but we could have filled this hole for much cheaper last year.)

    On the these these 'big player moves', they rarely work for us. Whether Harvin, Graham, Sheldon Richardson, or the like - we tend to rarely get the results we coveted. And we lose people we needed. Duane Brown stands out as a possible exception.

    Also we overpay on trades and tend not to keep people we overpay for. Clowney is a potential example. We trade for people we hope to resign but then don't. I am worried we might face a Clowneyish situation w/ Adams in a year or two.

    But...



    Carroll is likely only here for 3 more years, less perhaps, most optimistic projection I've seen is 5 years. We have to win now. There is little chance we will get a better coach when he steps down. Likely much worse. We have to win more now.

    Our defense depends on safety play. And Adams can play FS, SS, and LB. We should be much better on defense vs both run & pass.

    We almost had to make this move.
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 9:11 am
  • mikeak wrote:So here it is.

    https://twitter.com/TomPelissero/status ... 31489?s=09

    Adams will play the season that is about to get cancelled ( see MLB who is cancelling two games today after less than a week). Then he has promised nothing. Clearly plans to holdout and complain in the media unless a deal is made.

    Seahawks will be forced to overpay as they gave up all the picks.

    Love the deal - hate that an extension was not in place, understand why you don't do a blockbuster extension in a pandemic year....


    Pretty much this. Adams is going to demand somewhere in the $18 million per year range and what choice will the organization have? Giving up that much for a player, they'll have to pay him. In a few years, be ready to welcome in a decade or so of mediocrity because its coming due to moves like this.
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 9:16 am
  • pittpnthrs wrote:
    mikeak wrote:So here it is.

    https://twitter.com/TomPelissero/status ... 31489?s=09

    Adams will play the season that is about to get cancelled ( see MLB who is cancelling two games today after less than a week). Then he has promised nothing. Clearly plans to holdout and complain in the media unless a deal is made.

    Seahawks will be forced to overpay as they gave up all the picks.

    Love the deal - hate that an extension was not in place, understand why you don't do a blockbuster extension in a pandemic year....


    Pretty much this. Adams is going to demand somewhere in the $18 million per year range and what choice will the organization have? Giving up that much for a player, they'll have to pay him. In a few years, be ready to welcome in a decade or so of mediocrity because its coming due to moves like this.


    I highly doubt John and Pete gave up the draft capital they gave up without knowing what Adam's and his agent want for an extension.

    This has been going on for months, so we don't make this trade if we're unsure Adam's will sign a long term deal. Might take a while because it's a monster extension. But it'll happen.
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 9:19 am
  • pittpnthrs wrote:
    Maelstrom787 wrote:
    pittpnthrs wrote:
    Maelstrom787 wrote:
    This is a crap take. The team needed a blue chip talent to remain competitive. Adams will be a leader for years to come and is as versatile of a defender as you can find.

    You generally just don't find guys like that outside of the top of the draft. This trade haul is similar to a trade up to the top 10 in the draft... except Adams is a proven blue chip. This is absolutely not as bad as it looks when you consider where the picks would likely be in the draft order.


    Its not a crap take. Seriously they havent had a good draft in like 7 years (2015 was mediocre). Our biggest weaknesses are offensive and defensive line and they have done nothing to fix it. Wilson staying healthy has been the luckiest thing in the world. One day our luck is going to run out. Adams will handicap our cap space for years to come. This is yet another luxury take when we cant afford it. This FO is so criminally overatted its sad.


    Sorry, but it is totally a crap take. None of the things you have listed are good reasons to pass up on obtaining one of the leagues true blue chip players at 24 years old.

    If you look at where the selections they traded away would be, you'd realize that it is a near certainty that those 2 players would not add up to 1 Jamal Adams worth of talent. Yes, Seattle will have to pay him... but not immediately, and you shouldn't be opposed to paying legitimate cornerstones anyway, which Adams is.

    Also, saying the team has done nothing to address the lines is wrong. Starting with the obvious - improving pass coverage does a ton to help the defensive line. Adams provides flexibility and prowess in the defensive backfield, which will do wonders for pass coverage and therefore the defense as a whole. Also, the team drafted two guys for juice off the edge, signed Irvin, and will likely sign another guy - hard to say there has been no effort to improve the line.

    The offensive line portion is wholly irrelevant to the conversation, but they made some good signings there as well.

    This team obviously needed something more to get them back to the big dance. Jamal Adams has a much higher chance of pushing them closer to that goal than 2 late first rounders do.


    The draft picks arent the issue here, its the position of the player taken. Lord knows the FO cant draft anyways as everybody on this board admits when trying to defend this trade. I like your optimism, but I just dont agree with it. I dont believe our secondary was as bad as people perceive. I feel they got screwed due to opposing QB's having practically all day to pass due to,,,,,,wait for it,,,,an awful pass rush. You feel Irvin is going to be a difference maker, I dont. If anything, the Adams trade looks like desperation due to realizing the pass rush is going to suck. Instead of fixing the actual problem, they try to mask the issue with a very expensive band-aid. People keep bringing up Adams sack numbers. Do you honestly believe Nortons going to implement a scheme to take advantage of that? I dont.

    The offensive line irrelevant? Its the biggest weakness on the team and has been for years. There is one person on the team that is the sole difference between the team making the playoffs and winning maybe 4 games and nobody seems to care about him. Its baffling. Resources spent on that shiny new safety should have been spent on protecting the one guy that truly matters, but no, lets roll the dice for another season. Why not, they've been lucky so far. Good signings to improve the line? If anything, it looks worse with those signings. Again, I like your optimism.

    To get back to the big dance, the team needs to fix the actual problems at hand (offensive and defensive lines) and not improving on areas that were already competent to start with. At the end of the day, Jamal Adams is a safety. A safety. The Jets fleeced us.


    The offensive line is irrelevant to discussion about Adams is what I was saying. Also, I am not bringing up Adams sack numbers, so I'm not sure if that's a rebuttal to anything I've said.

    Theoretically, there is more than 1 way to improve your pass rush - one of which is giving them more time to get to the quarterback. I'd like to think that an Adams acquisition allows Seattle to have their corners press more and back off less, which may very well increase their performance pressure-wise. Also, again, they've added rotational guys and drafted two promising edge rushers... hard to say that nothing is being done about the defensive line. We'll see how the rotational guys who are familiar with the scheme perform, and we'll see how the new guys develop.

    It's obvious that the identity of a Carroll team flows through the secondary. Having an elite secondary is worth two late firsts. It just is. Jamal Adams could very easily be a future Hall of Famer, and we got him at 24 years old for less draft capital than his original draft slot. I am flabbergasted that people are finding a way to be upset about this. A team is always going to have holes here and there, and folks get angry over any acquisition or trade because it doesn't fix every hole at once. Here's a theory - filling holes like you would with a roster breakdown sheet on Madden doesn't work, what does work is getting blue chip cornerstones on your roster that you can build around for years to come. Jamal Adams is bold, has swag, is versatile, makes plays, and has the rare it factor. You'd be hard pressed to find that at pick 27 any year.

    Sorry, but rare talent is rare talent. Adams fits the identity of the team, and that counts for something. What counts for even more is that he is a bona fide superstar, and he's worth more than Seattle gave up.
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 9:55 am
  • Maelstrom787 wrote:A team is always going to have holes here and there, and folks get angry over any acquisition or trade because it doesn't fix every hole at once.


    That's a glib way to avoid the fact that you need a complete team to seriously compete for the big dance, that two first-rounders is a potentially franchise-changing chunk of collateral, and that the biggest weakness of the team is also one of the most closely connected to success. If we were short on linebackers, I wouldn't be as worried.

    Any player has the potential to be just too costly. Say Adams gets injured. What are you left with? A couple of raw sophomore projects - that's it. Sure, you can't let the risk of injury paralyze you and keep you from making moves. But what if they'd kept McDougald and HE got injured? Then you have a couple of raw sophomore projects and two first round picks to address the position if he doesn't work out. With this trade, Pete and John have stuck their neck far further out over the injury cliff - a cliff that hasn't treated them well since 2016.

    It isn't about what Adams is. Everyone knows what Adams is. It's about the fact that the position was already capably filled and the trade damaged our ability to address a different, VERY crucial position that needs that first-round collateral in precisely the next couple years. It was not a good one.
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 10:20 am
  • MontanaHawk05 wrote:
    Maelstrom787 wrote:A team is always going to have holes here and there, and folks get angry over any acquisition or trade because it doesn't fix every hole at once.


    That's a glib way to avoid the fact that you need a complete team to seriously compete for the big dance, that two first-rounders is a potentially franchise-changing chunk of collateral, and that the biggest weakness of the team is also one of the most closely connected to success. If we were short on linebackers, I wouldn't be as worried.

    Any player has the potential to be just too costly. Say Adams gets injured. What are you left with? A couple of raw sophomore projects - that's it. Sure, you can't let the risk of injury paralyze you and keep you from making moves. But what if they'd kept McDougald and HE got injured? Then you have a couple of raw sophomore projects and two first round picks to address the position if he doesn't work out. With this trade, Pete and John have stuck their neck far further out over the injury cliff - a cliff that hasn't treated them well since 2016.

    It isn't about what Adams is. Everyone knows what Adams is. It's about the fact that the position was already capably filled and the trade damaged our ability to address a different, VERY crucial position that needs that first-round collateral in precisely the next couple years. It was not a good one.


    Fair enough. The trade does limit their options in that regard - but I'd rather have a game changing player in the defensive backfield. He's likely going to improve the entire defense with his presence, and could very well be the piece that gets Seattle to the Super Bowl in 2021.

    The position was capably filled, sure. Bradley was good, not great. After years of watching bad safety play, we've seen just how much it affects this defense. Now it's the best safety duo in the NFL. This counts for more than people want to acknowledge.

    Anyway, trade is done and Seattle has come away with a likely hall of famer in his youth. Adams is a legitimate building block and team leader - Bradley was not, as much as I loved him. This is going to end up being an excellent move that puts this defense back into "feared" territory.

    It's a Pete Carroll team, man. It just works better with a great secondary, and I'm fine paying a high price for a truly great player. The other needs, sure, they'll have to get creative or scheme to minimize their detriment. No denying that.
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 10:35 am
  • Just curious, if we didn't make this trade - how does that fix the pass rush or DL that you see so much handwringing about?

    We certainly were not going to get a pass rusher in the draft, and much less a DT that puts pressure on the passer.

    And instead of this trade, were there any teams willing to offer pass rushers or DTs that tilt the field? Not that I am aware. EVERY team wants stud DTs and great pass rushers. They are much more expensive than safeties.

    Considering we were in the bottom half of the league in terms of QBR for opposing QBs. At least fixing our secondary solves a huge problem for us. If you cannot rush the passer, you better learn to defend the pass or cover.
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 10:41 am
  • MontanaHawk05 wrote:
    Maelstrom787 wrote:A team is always going to have holes here and there, and folks get angry over any acquisition or trade because it doesn't fix every hole at once.


    That's a glib way to avoid the fact that you need a complete team to seriously compete for the big dance, that two first-rounders is a potentially franchise-changing chunk of collateral, and that the biggest weakness of the team is also one of the most closely connected to success. If we were short on linebackers, I wouldn't be as worried.

    Any player has the potential to be just too costly. Say Adams gets injured. What are you left with? A couple of raw sophomore projects - that's it. Sure, you can't let the risk of injury paralyze you and keep you from making moves. But what if they'd kept McDougald and HE got injured? Then you have a couple of raw sophomore projects and two first round picks to address the position if he doesn't work out. With this trade, Pete and John have stuck their neck far further out over the injury cliff - a cliff that hasn't treated them well since 2016.

    It isn't about what Adams is. Everyone knows what Adams is. It's about the fact that the position was already capably filled and the trade damaged our ability to address a different, VERY crucial position that needs that first-round collateral in precisely the next couple years. It was not a good one.


    I would make this trade in a heart beat. On the surface, the (2) 1st round picks seem like a lot, but the upside is that they signed a pro-bowl talent DB for only $3.59 mil for the first season and less than $10 mil in the second season. That is pretty much a steal in regards to cap space.

    Yes, he could get hurt, but so can every player in the NFL. You can not consider that possibility when bringing in players. If you do, then you would never take a chance with anybody. If Adams plays at the same talent level that he has in the past, this will look like a great move by JS/PC. If he does not, it will be seen as a dumb move. There is no reason to suspect he will not continue playing at the level he has played at in the past. He has proven he is a very talented player.
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 10:58 am
  • TwistedHusky wrote:Just curious, if we didn't make this trade - how does that fix the pass rush or DL that you see so much handwringing about?

    We certainly were not going to get a pass rusher in the draft, and much less a DT that puts pressure on the passer.

    And instead of this trade, were there any teams willing to offer pass rushers or DTs that tilt the field? Not that I am aware. EVERY team wants stud DTs and great pass rushers. They are much more expensive than safeties.

    Considering we were in the bottom half of the league in terms of QBR for opposing QBs. At least fixing our secondary solves a huge problem for us. If you cannot rush the passer, you better learn to defend the pass or cover.


    Adams would have led the defense in sacks last year with 6.5, so he is a SS that drops down into the box often to rush the passer.

    I assume we will use him as the Jets used him, a box safety to stuff the run and blitz.

    So does it fix our D-line problem directly? No, but just as we saw with Diggs how the defense played much better as a whole, Adams should do that even more, as he is one of the best defensive players in the entire league.

    I also think there's another D-line signing in the works. Both Clowney and Griffen are still out there, so I think we sign one of these guys before camp, or maybe a week into.
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 11:14 am
  • MontanaHawk05 wrote:
    Northwest Seahawk wrote:Also anyone that thinks Seattle's secondary was fine was not watching the same games i was last year our coverage was putrid .


    None of which was the fault of McDougald.

    And it actually wasn't as bad as you've been led to believe.


    I wasn't led anywhere i watched the freaking games all of them. McDougald wasn't great last year either .
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 11:17 am
  • FortWorthSeahawk wrote:Really smart kid as well..you'll likely have to go to YouTube to watch this, but well worth the time.



    Well worth watching.

    He's a smart player.
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 11:34 am
  • jammerhawk wrote:
    FortWorthSeahawk wrote:Really smart kid as well..you'll likely have to go to YouTube to watch this, but well worth the time.



    Well worth watching.

    He's a smart player.


    Brock Huard called him the most instinctive safety he's seen since Ed Reed, and that includes Earl.
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 11:38 am
  • Adams > Fitzpatrick. Seahawks made a run at Fitzpatrick, the Dolphins decided to take the Steelers offer. It happens. Therefore Diggs is a Seahawk. Had they got Fitz, no Diggs. Adams is a Seahawk for the next two seasons at a minimum and that’s a good thing.
    hawkfan68
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 11:40 am
  • TwistedHusky wrote:Just curious, if we didn't make this trade - how does that fix the pass rush or DL that you see so much handwringing about?


    For what they gave up, they probably could have signed Griffen and Clowney. Whatever, the deals been made. I hate the deal and I hope he's not just another high profile FA that comes to Seattle and underachieves, but i'll have to wait and see. Also, I feel sorry for Russ as its apparent they just arent going to fix the offensive line. He deserves better.
    pittpnthrs
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 11:42 am
  • Clayton just said that Adams is playing under his rookie deal in 2020 and they will talk contract extension after the season. That certainly helps.
    SoulfishHawk
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 11:59 am
  • jammerhawk wrote:
    FortWorthSeahawk wrote:Really smart kid as well..you'll likely have to go to YouTube to watch this, but well worth the time.



    Well worth watching.

    He's a smart player.


    Terrific video insite. Thanks for posting :2thumbs:
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 12:14 pm
  • pittpnthrs wrote:
    TwistedHusky wrote:Just curious, if we didn't make this trade - how does that fix the pass rush or DL that you see so much handwringing about?


    For what they gave up, they probably could have signed Griffen and Clowney. Whatever, the deals been made. I hate the deal and I hope he's not just another high profile FA that comes to Seattle and underachieves, but i'll have to wait and see. Also, I feel sorry for Russ as its apparent they just arent going to fix the offensive line. He deserves better.


    Not even close. $3.59 million in 2020 and $9.86 million in 2021.
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 12:17 pm
  • I had to think long and hard about why the organization would do something so seemingly stupid, then it hit me. They're not expecting a lot of high quality players in the top of the next couple drafts, due to COVID-19.
    SmokinHawk
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 12:43 pm

Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 12:45 pm
  • Draft pick points:

    1st round, 6th pick = 1600 points (Adam's pick by Jets)

    1st Round, 22 pick = 780 points (2021 draft)
    1st Round, 22 pick = 780 points (2022 draft)
    3rd round, 22 pick = 160 points (2021 draft
    TOTAL = 1720 points

    So basically, it looks like the Seahawks broke even in the draft department. If they rank later than 22, then the deal becomes better (per draft points) for the Seahawks. If they rank earlier than 22, then the deal becomes worse.

    http://www.mynfldraft.com/nfl-draft-pick-points-chart/

    Cap Space:

    McDougald, 8 year vet, 2020 Cap hit = $4.1 million cap hit. McDougald becomes a UFA after 2020.
    Adams = reported as a $3.6 mil cap hit in 2020 and $9.8 mil in 2021

    So, basically, the Seahawks got Adams $500k cheaper than McDougald for 2020, though likely more expensive in 2021. However, if he is all he is suppose to be, it will be well worth it.

    The more I look into this trade, the more I like. On the surface it looked bad, but deep down, I think it was a great trade.

    https://www.seattletimes.com/sports/sea ... ad%20money.

    https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/new-york-je ... ald-12835/
    Last edited by Nunya on Mon Jul 27, 2020 12:49 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 12:45 pm
  • Yeah right, they weren't interested in maybe the best safety in football. Got it...….
    SoulfishHawk
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 1:07 pm
  • Skip Bayless thinks Seahawks made a foolish trade...therefore using my 'whatever Bayless says, the opposite must be true' logic, it was a brilliant trade.



    Update: Marcellus Wiley thinks it a bad trade, doubling my assurance it's a good deal
    Last edited by TreeRon on Mon Jul 27, 2020 7:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 1:07 pm
  • MontanaHawk05 wrote:It's about the fact that the position was already capably filled and the trade damaged our ability to address a different, VERY crucial position that needs that first-round collateral in precisely the next couple years. It was not a good one.

    The other argument here is that we have put a lot of resources into the defensive line lately and the investment return hasn't been good. Perhaps we are simply coming up short on those personnel gambles, but I don't think it hurts to consider different ways to approach the issue.

    Our defensive line appeared to completely dominate one game last season (@SF), which happened to coincide with SF having their key receiving targets injured. That's one good indication that our secondary play impacts the defensive line outcomes significantly and the causation last year went from back to front much of the time.
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 1:25 pm
  • TreeRon wrote:Skip Bayless thinks Seahawks made a foolish trade...therefore using my 'whatever Bayless says, the opposite must be true' logic, it was a brilliant trade.


    I would say you have a fool-proof system....well except it does involve a fool named "Skip".
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 1:37 pm

Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 1:43 pm
  • Skip Bayless? Oh brother, not even 1 percent of what he says makes a difference. Dude is the ultimate tool.
    SoulfishHawk
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 1:44 pm
  • TreeRon wrote:Skip Bayless thinks Seahawks made a foolish trade...therefore using my 'whatever Bayless says, the opposite must be true' logic, it was a brilliant trade.


    Bayless would be singing a different tune if his Cowboys got Adams. He's full of sour grapes cause Adams went to a better team. Not all media members are mediots but Bayless fits the definition of a mediot perfectly.
    hawkfan68
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 2:51 pm
  • SoulfishHawk wrote:Yeah right, they weren't interested in maybe the best safety in football. Got it...….


    It didn't say they weren't interested. It says they never made a call on him. I don't think it would be possible for the 49ers to fit him in to the overall picture with the new contracts that are coming up and the possible contracture of the salary cap post COVID. I also think they are happy with what our SS Tartt can bring when healthy. Lynch is not one to lie about what his activities were. He has acknowledged the interest they had in Odell Beckham in the past and that they considered Tom Brady this offseason.
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 2:51 pm
  • pmedic920 wrote:
    flv wrote:Great player. NFL position of low importance. NFL position of low Seahawks need. Big overpay. Looks like 1 more win in 2020, neutral in 2021, and 1 less win per year in the following 3 years.


    “Low importance”?

    Are you sure about that?


    I’d say if you have a mediocre D line and pass rushing specialist, DBs become VERY IMPORTANT.

    I'm absolutely sure. I'd take 3 DL, MLB, and 2 CBs ahead of the other 5 defensive positions. There's more than 1 way to win but historically being good/great at football's key positions has been more valuable than being good/great at the less important positions. Now if a team can be good/great at those lesser value positions without using large amounts of additional resources over being mediocre there then that's obviously a big plus. It comes down to resource management.

    If I had a mediocre D line and pass rushing specialist, i'd prioritise improving them over improving the S position.
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 2:57 pm
  • It's July 27th :?
    SoulfishHawk
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 2:59 pm
  • CPHawk wrote:The safety is the lynch pen for Pete's defenses. Maybe Safety is "low" impotence other places, but here he is the key.

    Maybe Pete's defense isn't getting the best out of what's available. :|
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 3:28 pm
  • :roll:
    There is still over a MONTH before the season even starts. And they just cleared up more cap space. Something is about to go down, regardless how negative you want to spin it. They are going to add to this roster, and soon. Clowney or Everson G.
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 3:48 pm
  • Two late first round picks are like those unopened Star Wars action figures worth Thousands!
    Smellyman
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Re: Jamal Adams Traded to Seattle!
Mon Jul 27, 2020 5:01 pm
  • pmedic920 wrote:
    flv wrote:Great player. NFL position of low importance. NFL position of low Seahawks need. Big overpay. Looks like 1 more win in 2020, neutral in 2021, and 1 less win per year in the following 3 years.


    “Low importance”?

    Are you sure about that?


    I’d say if you have a mediocre D line and pass rushing specialist, DBs become VERY IMPORTANT.


    You're exactly right pmed, all one has to do is go back to last Season to see how much just adding Quandre Diggs to the Defense...Now with the addition of Jamal Adams!?!, this is a VERY smart move on Pete & John's part :irishdrinkers:
    Not enough credit is given to Coaches who recognize Football instincts, and knows how to get the most out of those gifted players....Pete Carroll is one of the best at it.
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