OL '20

toffee · Aug 12, 2020

Any thoughts on our OL? Being that the offense probably have to carry the defense some this year, we have Russ, Lockett and DK, possibly Gordon, two 1000 yards RBs, and a decent TE group.

OL? Our LT and LG are a year older, comes with age, injuries, longer recovery time. Our starting and backup C of last season are gone. RG likely to be a rookie, not even sure about who will start at RG. Will Jamarco compete for starting RT?

If our OL sucks again, all our other off-season moves could be wastes.

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Spin Doctor · Aug 13, 2020

This position easily had the worst offseason of any group on the Seahawks and that is including the defensive line. It's going to be an issue going forward. Our starting center is likely a career backup in his first year with Seattle's system. Our guard positions are weaker than last year as well. Iupati is another year older and a huge injury concern, no Fluker, our other starting guard opted out due to COVID. What is worse is our LT is living on borrowed time. Brown has been our best LT since Walter Jones, but he's now one of the oldest starting LT in the league. Chances of injury, or just flat out decline is much greater now. We don't have a replacement or even good backup for Brown either.

The offensive line really has the chance to derail our entire season. We went bargain bin shopping here this offseason. Brown is the only one of these lineman that are even passable in pass pro.

xray · Aug 13, 2020

How many seasons has this been a weak area ? The problem is that high quality OLineman are not available very often . When teams have them they pay them to stay . The draft is the answer for the future , but the Hawks just gave the Jets 2-1st round picks .

chrispy · Aug 13, 2020

Russ was asking for AB not for Linemen.... He's more worried about catching than blocking.

pittpnthrs · Aug 13, 2020

chrispy":3lncxln6 said:
Russ was asking for AB not for Linemen.... He's more worried about catching than blocking.

Russ knows theres a better chance of getting AB than a competent offensive lineman.

Thoughts on the OL in 2020? Its going to stink as usual.

Ruminator · Aug 13, 2020

If it weren't for RW being able to throw on the run and while under duress, it wouldn't matter how good our WRs and TEs are. Good thing he can.

jammerhawk · Aug 13, 2020

I wrote this about the OLine in the roster thread.

The annual refrain grumbling about the OLine being awful or inadequate goes on every season. No rocks are being thrown. For the team decisions have to be made about roster spots that involve a balancing of paying guys or developing our own. Cable was demonstrably not good at developing players but I have a lot of faith in Coach Solari who has a player type he likes and seems to be better at making them perform.

Brown is a top level LT. I'm uncertain about the depth behind him, will it be Ogbeuhi or Jones? Both have experience starting and have yet to prove they can regularly.

Iupati is a good LG when healthy. The depth behind him is solid in the winner between Haynes who was a college monster and Simmons who demonstrably can play. They also have Pocic to relieve if needed.

Finney likely isn't as good as Britt but is better than Hunt and likely far better than Pocic. However, Pocic may at last have a shot at a starter's job as a C, just in time. At C they will start the season better than they finished last season. This is a plus.

Lewis is a question mark at RG but could be one of the true steals of the draft if he performs like he did at Mobile during the Senior Bowl. Simmons was a solid backup last season.

Shell can't be worse than Ifedi was at RT and could easily in our scheme be a refreshing improvement. The numerous really awful drive killing penalties will hopefully end or be cut back significantly. I suspect th right side of the line could be stronger than it was last season.

There is some interesting depth at each position including a draft pick from last year in LG- Fuller who could find a starters job if that opportunity opens if there is an injury to an inside player. We've seen Simmons play and he is worth keeping on the roster if he can stay healthy. The others are backup quality though several of them have good pedigrees and have started so the depth is not lacking.

I'm optimistically curious about both Shell and Finney and suspect the negativity of a few here is misplaced about this Oline group. They could be a lot better than we presently expect.

There are of course the opposing views that none of these guys are much good, are too old, have injury histories making them unreliable, etc., etc.. We will see, but I think they will be a strong run blocking OLine and adequate pass blocking. The dumb mind numbing penalties could be significantly reduced. RW is RW, a great mobile QB, that being so why doesn't it make sense to have a solid run blocking OLine that can pass protect adequately?

John63 · Aug 13, 2020

I think from a run blocking perspective they will be fine. From a pass blocking it will be the same bottom 5-10 and Wilson will run for his life again. Non of the pickup are good pass blockers. As to the offense holding up the defense, probably not as that is not the PC way. Barring a minor tweak in philosophy this year will be the same as always, we will run, and be predictable for 3 qtrs and then beg Wilson to save us. Now if we get down big early we will have to go to the Wilson save us earlier and hope he can. PC has said he wants a close game and win in the end.

So there you go. Oline will be good run, bad pass, and no it will not carry the defense, not because it can't, but because it will not be allowed to.

poly1274 · Aug 13, 2020

Ruminator":3oufm3at said:
If it weren't for RW being able to throw on the run and while under duress, it wouldn't matter how good our WRs and TEs are. Good thing he can.

Each and every year, he's adding some more pounds, and his age, keeps getting older. He's getting slower by slower every year.

Also would like to add since there's no pre-season games, PC can't do any experiment on the OL line, and that would hurt the team.

SoulfishHawk · Aug 13, 2020

He had an MVP level season :roll:

John63 · Aug 13, 2020

SoulfishHawk":2fk77tjr said:
He had an MVP level season :roll:

MVP level but not even MVP vote getting, imagine if he had an avg pass blocking oline wow.

Jville · Aug 13, 2020

I read a couple of posts that actually address the offensive line as a topic. Accompanied by others that are repetitive worn out narratives and regurgitated grievances.

Brown is the only hold over from the recent pre Mike Solari era. This is Mike's 32an year and his third with Seattle this time around. He's collected thirteen linemen who fit what he wants to do. And they are just getting started at competing for roster spots.

This is shaping up to be Mike Solari's year.

Spin Doctor · Aug 14, 2020

Jville":1wktkzgv said:
I read a couple of posts that actually address the offensive line as a topic. Accompanied by others that are repetitive worn out narratives and regurgitated grievances.

Brown is the only hold over from the recent pre Mike Solari era. This is Mike's 32an year and his third with Seattle this time around. He's collected thirteen linemen who fit what he wants to do. And they are just getting started at competing for roster spots.

This is shaping up to be Mike Solari's year.

That narrative is fine and all, but Solari hasn't been given a lot of ammunition to work with. He's shown he is a good coach, but we have to face the facts that most of the guys on our line have really iffy track records and are really the seconds from other teams. In addition to this we've got a lot of new guys on the line that don't exactly have much time in camp to get the new system down. We went bargain shopping on the offensive line. In addition to this we lost two of our most productive lineman.

Brown and Iupati are also problematic due to age concerns. Iupati especially has a history of missing games. Brown is also getting old in age with no real heir, if he goes down or declines we're in trouble.

I get wanting to be optimistic about the Seahawks, but if there is one thing Pete Carroll has proven over his tenure in Seattle is that he doesn't have a great track record of building offensive lines. Or rather, Carroll doesn't seem to feel the need to invest much money or resources here.

In the end I could be wrong, wouldn't be the first time I was wrong -- but I do think there is much to be worried about on the offensive and defensive line this season. There are too many unknowns or counting on guys breaking out.

Jville · Aug 14, 2020

Spin Doctor":1jxaulhj said:
Jville":1jxaulhj said:

I read a couple of posts that actually address the offensive line as a topic. Accompanied by others that are repetitive worn out narratives and regurgitated grievances.

Brown is the only hold over from the recent pre Mike Solari era. This is Mike's 32an year and his third with Seattle this time around. He's collected thirteen linemen who fit what he wants to do. And they are just getting started at competing for roster spots.

This is shaping up to be Mike Solari's year.

Click to expand...

That narrative is fine and all, but Solari hasn't been given a lot of ammunition to work with. He's shown he is a good coach, but we have to face the facts that most of the guys on our line have really iffy track records and are really the seconds from other teams. In addition to this we've got a lot of new guys on the line that don't exactly have much time in camp to get the new system down. We went bargain shopping on the offensive line. In addition to this we lost two of our most productive lineman.

Brown and Iupati are also problematic due to age concerns. Iupati especially has a history of missing games. Brown is also getting old in age with no real heir, if he goes down or declines we're in trouble.

I get wanting to be optimistic about the Seahawks, but if there is one thing Pete Carroll has proven over his tenure in Seattle is that he doesn't have a great track record of building offensive lines. Or rather, Carroll doesn't seem to feel the need to invest much money or resources here.

In the end I could be wrong, wouldn't be the first time I was wrong -- but I do think there is much to be worried about on the offensive and defensive line this season. There are too many unknowns or counting on guys breaking out.

Respect your view and appreciate your thoughtful reply,

My own perspective processes little fear of venturing out and experimenting. For me there is a great deal to be learned thru both success and failure. It's the annual journey of front office and coaching staff and players that are most interesting and instructive ..... not the season ending accolades.

Pete Carroll's handling of offensive and defensive lines as a reflection of his sense of position priority. Many fans express a poor understanding and appreciation of Pete's priorities. For me, the annual turn over of linemen keeps things interesting and open for player development. The eye of most fans is drawn away from watching line play. Understandably, most don't understand what is very low on their game day priorities. So focused on a celebrated skill players, other discussions are constantly bombarded with repetitive off topic diversions such as thank goodness for this or that marquee player. The Russell Wilson hijack is is among the most popular killer of thread topics. Pre-existing Russell Wilson threads are constantly on page one. And yet, hijacks continue ..... It's ridiculous.

There are times when the forum takes on the back and forth feel of something akin to a tennis forum rather than a team oriented football forum ...... lacking appreciation for what makes up of team and team work. Perhaps if a moderators became more active about moving and editing or outright deleting off topic posts, the forum could expand the scope of meaningful discussion to include all skill positions and all position coaches.

There may come a time when this forum can sustain a discuss about linemen. That's not the case as things stand today ..... we are all the poorer for it. The state of discussion on this forum could become far more expansive and richer than what we are confined to today.

Jville · Aug 15, 2020

Focusing on the subject of the offensive line ................................

Duane Brown made specific comments about transitioning his off season conditioning program from strength building to building greater flexibility as a hedge for injury resistance. Also, recall that the previous off season saw huge personnel changes to the strength and conditioning staff. The impact of those changes should make themselves much more evident in 2020.

Program adjustments are being made to this transitioning offensive line. Assembling an offensive line that can hold up to the violence along an NFL line of scrimmage has clearly moved up the ladder of team priorities.

Holding up under combat is the prerequisite for continuity along the line of scrimmage.

Jazzhawk · Aug 15, 2020

Personally, I need to see these guys play together a game or tow before I start pontificating on their effectiveness or lack thereof. I'm intrigued by some of the pieces, and frankly, they don't have to be great, just better, which might just happen.

Appyhawk · Aug 15, 2020

Russ, always upbeat. may have revealed his inner feelings about the O Line in his most recent interview when he devoted a good jag of time lamenting the loss of Britt and his hopes for Lewis.
My inner feelings about our OLine hinge on Lewis, a rookie, being an all-pro performer right out of the gate. What are the odds of that happening?

toffee · Aug 15, 2020

Wondering the progress of Phil Haynes and Jordan Simmons? Could one of the two be ready as starting guard?

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jammerhawk · Aug 15, 2020

As I said earlier this is an annual refrain “the OLine will suck”. I don’t get the they are not allowed to be better type thinking. It just seems to be a baseless anti-Carroll refrain. To me if there is blame it should be focused on the need to allocate cap resources away from just spending a larger portion of it on the OLine. Simply I don’t believe it can be demonstrated absolutely that OLine quality play is directly proportionate to the amount of cap spent on the OLine. We have had very highly paid OLines here that were not worth that cap expenditure as far as their performance.

As Jazz has said: “let’s wait and see” before defaulting to this annual “they are terrible” refrain.

Just because PFF doesn’t think players will be much good doesn’t mean that they won’t be improved over what was served up by them last season. Just because the whole line is not staffed by Pro Bowl players doesn’t mean the OLine will collectively suck. To me I’m curious about these additions, along with many of the young players. The added speed at WR and potential improved talent at TE may make it easier for RW to find an open receiver than it was last season, while making opposing D’s respect the run with play action and effective run blocking. After all the O is truly a sum of all it’s parts.

I stand on my above post they will be solid at run blocking and potentially stronger in pass pro. Alternatively just improved would be fine as well.

Again I ask the question: If you have a QB who is brilliant when he is mobile and an OLine that is demonstrably good run blocking, doesn’t the OLine just need to be adequate in pass protection when they are assisted by this brilliant mobile QB?

Jville · Aug 15, 2020

Intriguing fan unknowns for most of us. Phil Haynes and Jordan Simmons are understudies who have revealed little to none in the way of NFL combat. But when it comes to Solari guards, these manhandling guards certainly look the part.

Damien Lewis possesses the low man center of gravity that helps sustain proper pad level as fatigue sets in late in a contest. Intriguing collection of unknowns who will benefit from Solari with rock solid veteran manhandling technician Mike Iupati showing the way

Looking forward to scrimmage reports in the coming days.

OL '20

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