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To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders

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To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 1:03 pm
  • Do you guys put on your clown shoes before you go to, or after you come home from work? LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOOLOOLOLLOO LOLOOLO.

    The ones who fall in that camp, must condemn this current approach as it is completely antithetical to what they have been arguing season after season, FOR YEARS.

    As they told us running into loaded boxes repeatedly was required for Wilson to be effective. Punting in enemy territory was smart football, and throwing on early downs was bad.

    No matter how much evidence we presented to the contrary. Clowns decided to die on that hill.

    Where is the conviction!? The "Let Russ Cook" proponents never wavered, the "Pete Ball" crowd seemed to have rolled over without a fight… Pathetic. LOL



    Pete was wrong the whole time. Only when Wilson pretty much said it without saying it, that he was going to leave if things didn't change. THEN Pete folded like a lawn chair. LOL.

    "Pete Ball" is garbo. I am glad to see it is dead. It cost the team many wins over the years, higher playoff seedings, and what could have been deep playoff runs.

    The Seahawks may very well win the Superbowl this year if they keep up this aggressive, varied attack they displayed on Sunday. But more importantly it is about throwing your best punch and letting the chips fall where they may. Instead of holding back and wondering if they could've won the game had Wilson been more featured.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 1:08 pm
  • Clown shoes aren't simply something you can just take off willy nilly before or after work. They're not just footwear. They're a lifestyle, man. We eat, sleep, and snort all the hard drugs with these things on.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 1:13 pm
  • Fade wrote:Do you guys put on your clown shoes before you go to, or after you come home from work? LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOOLOOLOLLOO LOLOOLO.

    The ones who fall in that camp, must condemn this current approach as it is completely antithetical to what they have been arguing season after season, FOR YEARS.

    As they told us running into loaded boxes repeatedly was required for Wilson to be effective. Punting in enemy territory was smart football, and throwing on early downs was bad.

    No matter how much evidence we presented to the contrary. Clowns decided to die on that hill.

    Where is the conviction!? The "Let Russ Cook" proponents never wavered, the "Pete Ball" crowd seemed to have rolled over without a fight… Pathetic. LOL



    Pete was wrong the whole time. Only when Wilson pretty much said it without saying it, that he was going to leave if things didn't change. THEN Pete folded like a lawn chair. LOL.

    "Pete Ball" is garbo. I am glad to see it is dead. It cost the team many wins over the years, higher playoff seedings, and what could have been deep playoff runs.

    The Seahawks may very well win the Superbowl this year if they keep up this aggressive, varied attack they displayed on Sunday. But more importantly it is about throwing your best punch and letting the chips fall where they may. Instead of holding back and wondering if they could've won the game had Wilson been more featured.


    One game against our former DC that knows Pete's tendencies, enjoy it, that will not be the norm, we will rush more then 20 times a game going forward 80 percent of the time.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 1:13 pm
  • Both mantras are over simplified, Pete Ball, Let Russ Cook.

    What we saw Sunday is not Pete just finally unleashing Russell, it was Pete giving Russell and Schotty more freedom within the confines of the scheme, playcalling and letting Russ make timely and key in game decisions (going for it on 4th and 5).

    Saw some of that last year (Cleveland game), and that progression is continuing more this year.

    Btw, only two QB's had more TD passes in their first eight seasons than Russell, Dan Marino and Peyton Manning. So this false narrative that Russell hasn't been allowed to throw the ball more is fictional. Yep, Pete likes (and still does) balance with a punishing run game.

    If you or anyone think that's going to change, you're sorely mistaken. Pete still wants to run the ball, he's just allowing Russell and Schotty more rope on finding creative ways to do it.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 1:21 pm
  • Sgt. Largent wrote:Both mantras are over simplified, Pete Ball, Let Russ Cook.


    But how else should one swipe at those they disagree with, all while not addressing them specifically?
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 1:31 pm
  • bmorepunk wrote:
    Sgt. Largent wrote:Both mantras are over simplified, Pete Ball, Let Russ Cook.


    But how else should one swipe at those they disagree with, all while not addressing them specifically?


    Apparently by coming onto a fan site and talking crazy amounts of $h!t to your own fans?

    HAHAHA WE WON WITH OUR GREAT QB PLAYING GREAT............SUCK IT FELLOW SEAHAWK FANS YEAH!!
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 1:31 pm
  • bmorepunk wrote:
    Sgt. Largent wrote:Both mantras are over simplified, Pete Ball, Let Russ Cook.


    But how else should one swipe at those they disagree with, all while not addressing them specifically?


    A dissertation breaking down the various points of views each with their own spectrum and standard deviation to mathematically define how fully or not not one fits with their loyalty to "Pete Ball" or their willingness to attempt letting "Russ Cook."

    In other words, you swipe with words and numbers. Lots of words and numbers. Across many pages. And with charts.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 1:35 pm
  • You know what made Peyton Manning such a great Quarterback?

    His mental processing on the fly. His pre-snap reads and adjustments. Because football isn't static. It is dynamic. It constantly changers. It constantly evolves.

    Yet....the fundamentals never go away. Football is blocking and tackling. Period. On average, (House odds) If you can block and tackle significantly better than your opponent, you dominate. You dominate the turnover battle, you dominate the statistics, you dominate the scoreboard.

    Two parts here. Blocking and tackling is executed on the field by the players. Staying ahead of the evolutionary curve is typically done on the sidelines and in the coaches box. Then there are players that can master the intellectual aspects while on the field. Like Peyton Manning or Tom Brady or Russell Wilson.

    There is finally a time that a dad takes the training wheels off his little girl's bike. Some cautious fathers wait a little longer, yet the final result is the same. Training wheels are no longer being used. This is the part where you assume I am talking about Russell Wilson. I am not. I'm talking about Pete's football philosophy. This isn't about Pete's confidence in Wilson. This is about Pete's confidence in himself. It takes a man comfortable in his own skin to realize he must change and evolve and then actually implement it.

    The end result of the Pete/Russ symbiotic relationship is the Peyton Manning effect. A QB that can adeptly process rapidly changing events on the field. A man that can identify weakness, strength, tendencies, and mismatches at an almost instantaneous level. It didn't happen over night and it isn't the first time it has ever happened or will ever happen again.
    Last edited by Mick063 on Tue Sep 15, 2020 1:48 pm, edited 6 times in total.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 1:36 pm
  • Sgt. Largent wrote:Both mantras are over simplified, Pete Ball, Let Russ Cook.

    What we saw Sunday is not Pete just finally unleashing Russell, it was Pete giving Russell and Schotty more freedom within the confines of the scheme, playcalling and letting Russ make timely and key in game decisions (going for it on 4th and 5).

    Saw some of that last year (Cleveland game), and that progression is continuing more this year.

    Btw, only two QB's had more TD passes in their first eight seasons than Russell, Dan Marino and Peyton Manning. So this false narrative that Russell hasn't been allowed to throw the ball more is fictional. Yep, Pete likes (and still does) balance with a punishing run game.

    If you or anyone think that's going to change, you're sorely mistaken. Pete still wants to run the ball, he's just allowing Russell and Schotty more rope on finding creative ways to do it.
    Kind of agree.
    Running the ball is good. Being less predictable about when you do is better.
    It doesn’t mean run the ball less, it’s about being smarter about it when you do.

    ATL was stacking the box. Quinn thought the only chance he had was to stack the box to stop the run. Pete was ready for it and adjusted quickly. The only chance ATL had at winning that game was a shootout.

    I don’t know how most feel but I view most passes to RB’s as extended run plays.
    We had a lot of those in that game.
    Sports Hernia
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 1:47 pm
  • This is also the best receiving core we have had in a long time.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 1:55 pm
  • Sports Hernia wrote:
    I don’t know how most feel but I view most passes to RB’s as extended run plays.
    We had a lot of those in that game.


    Yep, if I would have told you that Carson only had six rushing attempts, you would have thought we were either playing from way behind the whole game, or he got hurt halfway through the first quarter.

    That's really what I saw Sunday, a WAY more dynamic style of playcalling. More misdirection screens, rollouts, RB flat passes, etc.

    Thus my opinion on this subject, I see Russell being given the freedom to check plays, move people around and attack more.

    I remember saying this last year after the Cleveland game where Russell's mic wasn't working for an entire drive, and he ran the offense straight down the field for a TD. My hope is that sparked something in Pete and Schotty that Russell was ready to run the show when needed.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 1:56 pm
  • Did they win? Just checking. Hard to tell sometimes when wins are downplayed so often.
    Who gives a rats a what they call it? Pete Ball, Cooking, blah blah blah......I call it winning, and they do it a LOT. Shoot, it was creative play calling and it was nice to see. Not the same thing over and over again.
    However, even when they are "boring" or "vanilla" etc. they win. Couldn't care less how they get a W, but I loved the play calling on Sunday. And they played aggressive WITH a lead, and that was also nice to see.
    It was 38-18 with 3:45 left in the game, that's a flat out blowout in my mind. It felt like 4 quarters of football, and there's nothing wrong with digging that, a LOT :irishdrinkers:
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 2:12 pm
  • I think a lot went into the Atlanta game plan. Part of it was Quinn knowing Pete would run the ball so they mixed that up. Part of it was the WR corps are freaky good. Part of it was let Russ cook and by that, cook early. Part of it might have been the best way to attack the Atlanta defense. Another part I’m wondering about but don’t really know was the offensive line. Other than Brown and Iupati, the line was all new. Maybe this line is just fundamentally better at pass blocking than run blocking. Maybe that’s by design. Maybe they discovered this in training camp.

    Week 2 should give us another glimpse into this years overall philosophy. Anyone know what NEs defensive weaknesses are? If it’s stopping the run we could see a return to “Peteball”. If that happens, some around here will have their heads explode.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 2:12 pm
  • It's not hugely unusual for Wilson to throw 35 times. What IS unusual is for him to hit on 89% of those throws. That keeps the offense on the field and provides more downs, and more throwing opportunities.

    With Atlanta stacking the box and Carson coming off an injury, I don't find it incredibly odd that they chose to get him the ball via the air instead of handing off to him, and that he split touches with Hyde.

    When you have a running back coming off injury and a backup running back who could start for most teams, and a QB having a career day, what we did just seems the logical thing to do.

    I don't mean to rain on anyone's parade, and I know people really want this to fit a narrative, but I'm going to play wait-and see with regard to Carroll completely changing his philosophy.

    Over the past two seasons (and including yesterday, so 33 games), Wilson's average for bad throws is 16.7%. Yesterday it was only 5.7%. Half the time when Wilson is that hot, he throws 34 or more passes - probably in part because he's converting 3rd downs and creating more opportunities.

    However, while Wilson was hyper-accurate, his intended air yards per pass attempt was the 4th-lowest of those 33 games at 6.1 - a full 3 yards shorter than his average over those 33 games. This isn't turning Wilson loose so much as increasing the participation of the running back and making shorter throws. Hell, we even saw a screen pass.

    So sorry to burst any bubbles, but for these hoofbeats, I am still calling horses instead of zebras.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 2:30 pm
  • That screen pass and 3 blockers waiting.....a thing of beauty. Circle and underline that play Schotty…….
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 2:31 pm
  • Fade wrote:Do you guys put on your clown shoes before you go to, or after you come home from work? LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOOLOOLOLLOO LOLOOLO.

    The ones who fall in that camp, must condemn this current approach as it is completely antithetical to what they have been arguing season after season, FOR YEARS.

    As they told us running into loaded boxes repeatedly was required for Wilson to be effective. Punting in enemy territory was smart football, and throwing on early downs was bad.

    No matter how much evidence we presented to the contrary. Clowns decided to die on that hill.

    Where is the conviction!? The "Let Russ Cook" proponents never wavered, the "Pete Ball" crowd seemed to have rolled over without a fight… Pathetic. LOL



    Pete was wrong the whole time. Only when Wilson pretty much said it without saying it, that he was going to leave if things didn't change. THEN Pete folded like a lawn chair. LOL.

    "Pete Ball" is garbo. I am glad to see it is dead. It cost the team many wins over the years, higher playoff seedings, and what could have been deep playoff runs.

    The Seahawks may very well win the Superbowl this year if they keep up this aggressive, varied attack they displayed on Sunday. But more importantly it is about throwing your best punch and letting the chips fall where they may. Instead of holding back and wondering if they could've won the game had Wilson been more featured.



    I agree with the sentiment, but not sure we needed an I told you so thread. That said. You also might be premature 1 game does not equate to a change. Let's see after 3 or 4.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 2:34 pm
  • One HUGE thing SChotty was in the booth not on the sidelines. This is HUGE!!!
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 2:35 pm
  • Or maybe we could enjoy a win just once? Who cares who was right or wrong? They won the game, that's all that matters. And good point on Schotty up in the booth, Pete said he will continue staying up there.
    We all clearly see things our own way, and that's cool. Some are very confident, some are negative, some are cautious, some are wait and see etc. We all want the same thing, wins. Even if we drive each other crazy at times.

    Anyway, it's just fun to talk about an actual game in 2020, when it was looking pretty iffy at best for a long while.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 2:49 pm
  • It is frustrating that Pete consistently leaves chips on the table come playoff time.

    However, it would be hard to argue that without Pete - we wouldn't even have a seat at the table.

    So I am thankful for what an amazing coach he has been, just always felt Wilson was one of the worst possible fits for him because he will rarely use Wilson to his potential.

    The question is why?

    Running the ball is easier. Your OL prefers it. The talent is easier to acquire.

    It limits touches by the opposing offense and rests the defense.

    Given the push to enable QBs, teams have responded by making defensive players faster and lighter. Able to play more in space, but that makes them very vulnerable to the run game.

    On the surface it all makes sense. It helps you compete against better teams than you.

    But if you are the better team? It holds you back and increases your chances of losing if something goes wrong.

    When you have the 2nd coming of Steve Young? You should use him. He literally can win playoff games for you nearly single-handedly. At that point, you find a way to make a passing game work because the player passing is one of the best in history at it....and QB has advantages over every other position.

    It makes no sense.

    The only thing I can come up with is that Carroll learned to do it that way, believes his way is right, and does not see the reason for change. Nevermind that with one of the best QBs in the league, we have underachieved in the playoffs since 2015.

    Honestly I'm baffled. We should/could have done better with the QB we have had.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 2:55 pm
  • "Pete Ball",,,,"Let Russ Cook",,,,,whatever. I'm just enjoying a win that I honestly did not think we would have.

    Now going forward, I believe the scheme we ran against Atlanta is the one that is needed to progress throughout the season, but do I feel Pete will hold onto that,,,,,,Lord no. We've just seen it to many times before to doubt this will continue, but if it does, i'll gladly be the first one to eat crow.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 2:59 pm
  • pittpnthrs wrote:"Pete Ball",,,,"Let Russ Cook",,,,,whatever. I'm just enjoying a win that I honestly did not think we would have.

    Now going forward, I believe the scheme we ran against Atlanta is the one that is needed to progress throughout the season, but do I feel Pete will hold onto that,,,,,,Lord no. We've just seen it to many times before to doubt this will continue, but if it does, i'll gladly be the first one to eat crow.



    What he said.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 3:18 pm
  • +1, hoping, but I'll believe it when I see it. Fingers crossed this is more of what we see moving forward.
    But, they go the W, now let's get a lot more of them, regardless how it looks.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 3:34 pm
  • For a first game, it was a treat. We can enjoy it.

    We won't know if change comes until the playoffs. Because that is where it matters.

    The rest is just catharsis.




    The irony of this thread is that I fully expect to see 'Pete Ball' from Bill when we play the Patriots.

    They likely will run the ball repeatedly, to keep the ball out of Wilson's hands. With the occasional deep shot to keep Adams off the LOS.

    The Pats will go big and heavy with their QB running often. So will their RB and even FB if they have it.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 3:37 pm
  • SoulfishHawk wrote:That screen pass and 3 blockers waiting.....a thing of beauty. Circle and underline that play Schotty…….


    I could not believe my eyes either!!! When was the last time we have seen that in a game? :irishdrinkers:
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 4:05 pm
  • My wife was like "FINALLY, they do something different"
    She does make a good point. Not that the formula hasn't work for years. But, switching it up, being creative and aggressive was SO good to see.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 4:05 pm
  • "Pete Ball" worked 2013-2014. But I think that's due to the elite #1 defense that we had.

    Now that's no longer the case, so you'll have to adjust. I agree its time to let Russ cook! I really hope to see that type of action come every week.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 4:07 pm
  • "LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOOLOOLOLLOO LOLOOLO ?"

    What does that mean?

    What is the point of this post? "I was right and you were wrong?"

    I think we have a ways to go before we start making any blanket statements. There are times when the running game is called for, and times when passing is better. Like when your opponents defensive backfield is garbage.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 4:13 pm
  • Pete Ball is dead. Pete admitted it in the post game presser. Wilson was in charge of what they were doing on offense all off-season (in cooperation with Schotty), and they simply transferred what they had been doing to the game. This isn't changing. This is how they are going to play.

    The days of predictably running into loaded boxes for 2 yds a carry, waiting around until the 4th quarter to then finally turn on the jets is done.

    @Kiwi
    It is not unusual for Wilson to throw 35 times in a game, yes. That is actually what he averaged last year. Like i have said many times it isn't about volume of throws versus runs. It is about variation, and coming out aggressive and playing offense for 4 quarters.

    What was different was throwing the ball on early downs all game long. Instead of running into a brick wall and spinning your wheels for 3 quarters. Then Wilson having to throw the ball 20 times in the 4th quarter in an attempt make a furious comeback.

    It is how you arrive at those 35 throws my friend.

    ====
    This isn't an "I told you so thread." It is just shining light on the hypocrisy.

    -> NeEd To EsTaBliSh tHe RuN, bEfOrE yOu CaN pAsS…
    -> dOn'T tHrOw oN eArLy dOwNs.
    -> dOn'T gO fOr It On 4Th DoWnS iN eNeMy TeRrIToRy iT iS bEtTeR tO pUnT iNsTeAd.
    -> sTaRtInG sLoW iS oKaY, tHaT iS tHe "pHiLoSoPhY."

    People who defended these things for years. Are now suddenly cool with the polar opposite. They should be pissed. it goes against their arguments they have been making for YEARS, but they are not of course. Hypocrites. :D :D
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 4:17 pm
  • I don't want Pete ball nor do I want "Let Russ Cook". Can we just have a team that imposes Belichick philosophy of winning:

    "Belichick explained that his philosophy came back to that of "The Art of War," and in the process, made coaching football sound much easier than it looks.

    "You can go all the way back to a few hundred years B.C., Sun Tzu, 'The Art of War.' Attack weaknesses, utilize strengths and figure out what the strengths are on your team. There are some things you have to protect. Find the weaknesses of your opponent, and attack.

    You can't win a war by digging a hole. You gotta attack. You have to figure out where you want to attack, how you want to attack, and that changes week to week and game to game."


    Source: https://www.businessinsider.com/bill-be ... 0situation.


    Seriously, I mean I feel like the above is a simple concept, play to your strengths but attack to your opponents weakness. If your strength happens to be the opponents strength, maybe do something else? If what you're doing is not working...Adapt.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 4:27 pm
  • Fade wrote:Do you guys put on your clown shoes before you go to, or after you come home from work? LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOOLOOLOLLOO LOLOOLO.

    The ones who fall in that camp, must condemn this current approach as it is completely antithetical to what they have been arguing season after season, FOR YEARS.

    As they told us running into loaded boxes repeatedly was required for Wilson to be effective. Punting in enemy territory was smart football, and throwing on early downs was bad.

    No matter how much evidence we presented to the contrary. Clowns decided to die on that hill.

    Where is the conviction!? The "Let Russ Cook" proponents never wavered, the "Pete Ball" crowd seemed to have rolled over without a fight… Pathetic. LOL



    Pete was wrong the whole time. Only when Wilson pretty much said it without saying it, that he was going to leave if things didn't change. THEN Pete folded like a lawn chair. LOL.

    "Pete Ball" is garbo. I am glad to see it is dead. It cost the team many wins over the years, higher playoff seedings, and what could have been deep playoff runs.

    The Seahawks may very well win the Superbowl this year if they keep up this aggressive, varied attack they displayed on Sunday. But more importantly it is about throwing your best punch and letting the chips fall where they may. Instead of holding back and wondering if they could've won the game had Wilson been more featured.



    You can blow your horn or put people down if thats what you need to do. Last year Wilson averaged over 32 passes a game according to NFL.com. 3 more passes this game really wasnt worth a rambling post. ATL let Ryan cook and was 0-4 on fourth down but carry on sniffin your own farts.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 4:51 pm
  • ivotuk wrote:and times when passing is better. Like when your opponents defensive backfield is garbage.


    That will be nearly every week. No one has a defense that can cover Olsen, Dissly, Lockett, Metcalf, Carson out of the backfield, with a sprinkle of Gordon, all while accounting for Wilson's scrambling. Good luck.


    ivotuk wrote:There are times when the running game is called for-

    When they face a garbage D-Line they feel like they can run on all day, of course they will take advantage of that. And stuff it down their throats.

    The argument isn't passing vs. running, though. But Leyman's love to boil it down to that. It's when they are passing, and when they are running, while keeping the attack varied.

    For example, running on 1st and 2nd down and throwing on 3rd down leads to the most likely scenario of punting league wide.

    While passing on 1st down, and running on both 2nd and 3rd down leads to the highest chance of conversion league wide.

    Both = 1 pass and 2 runs. But have polar opposite results.

    Why would you build an offense around run, run, pass, punt? Seattle lead the league in that play sequence by a metric ton in 2018. I don't recall where they ended up last year. But I am sure they ranked highly. This year run, run, pass, punt will be happening in the 4th quarter after they've already blown out the opponent and they are just trying to run clock. Not as their gameplan to start. HUGE difference.
    Fade
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 4:55 pm
  • I think a lot of the Pete Ball the last two years was because of the lack of playmakers on defense. Pete knew his defense would get shredded in the secondary if he got into a shootout. So he preferred to try to keep the games close and short and let it come down to Russ in the 4th quarter. And I generally will always bet on Russ in the 4th quarter.

    This year we've got some playmakers in the secondary in Diggs and Adams. We can challenge them to throw the ball and play physical and force turnovers. So sprinting out to a lead and making the other team throw plays into the teeth of our defense as currently constructed.

    I think Pete Ball will always rear its ugly head if Pete feels he can't win a track meet. His goal has always been to be balanced so that you can run when you can't throw and throw when you can't run. If you can do both on offense it's tough to stop you.

    Balance is his mantra. Along with "it's all about the ball".
    Mad Dog
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 4:56 pm
  • C.mon let's not slip too much into hyperbole here.

    There is little doubt RW was allowed to to cook in the gameplan against Atl. That was fun to watch and instead of a slow start the team starter quicker. It wasn't perfect, but it was better. Was that designed or a change-up to confound Atl.'s DC or their HC who has seen the much maligned "Pete ball"? We'll see soon enough. "Pete Ball" is a formula that has taken the team to the playoffs all but 1 season while Pete has been in charge. For me, success speaks volumes however, you be blind not to notice the opponent have done better and better defending it. I for one was happy to see change but I still want to see my team pound the other team early and often. There are a lot us here who have immense respect for Coach carroll even if some others here think he's a dinosaur. I suppose it's whatever flavour you like best, I suspect 31 other teams look at the Seahawks and see a well run team that has a winning record and has had so since Coach Carroll has been here, save the 1 season. Clown suit? Whatever.

    There are many here who want to see RW play chuck and duck for the reason that he is an accurate passer. It's understandable but the season is long and the the OLine is still to my eyes better at run blocking than they are at pass protection and the team has at least two 1000 yard RBs they can get to pound the ball and punish opposing D's. Play selection, defensive decisions, poor ST execution, are ultimately on Pete who oversees his coordinators, but faulting the team for the gameplan in the Atlanta game is just flat out wrong. There were however enough mistakes made to keep the coaches busy this week with coachable training moments, and coachable mistake correction.

    All in all I'm happy with an opening game early starting east coast road W. It was yet another in now a steady string of east coast early road games 3 time zones away and was a convincing W. Their QB Ryan throwing for 450 just indicates how one dimensional the Hawks made the Falcons. I for one am not buying that the pass D sucks. For all that yardage the Hawks D held them off the scoreboard effectively and well until garbage time. I still want to see a better pass rush.

    There certainly was a lot to be happy about and some truly fixable other stuff. I agree with Zag. I doubt Pete ball is dead just as much as RW will not be allowed to cook early and often every game. The concept is simply to win and you do that however you can.

    To me it was an encouraging start.
    jammerhawk
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 5:00 pm
  • Carroll will use whatever offense will work for each individual opponent this season . There will plenty of games when run 1st is the offense again .
    xray
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 5:02 pm
  • xray wrote:Carroll will use whatever offense will work for each individual opponent this season . There will plenty of games when run 1st is the offense again .


    I hope so...I just hope when pass first is what should work he uses that option vs all previous season...run first..run first....oh it's not working? keep running it'll open up...oh we're down 14 points with 8 minutes to go? oh crap..okay Russ go figure it out have fun.
    ZagHawk
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 5:05 pm
  • It worked. But it worked for the most part against the crappy teams.

    It was an illusion like that 100+ win Mariner team. When the field narrows and you face better opponents it all falls apart.

    Did it make us seem better than we were or simply hold us back? No idea.

    What I do know is we have not been a serious threat in the playoffs since our SB loss. And it was godawful ugly football. I used to purposely miss the first half FOR YEARS. Because I knew we would do nothing unless we fell behind.

    The weirdest part is it is almost the opposite of playoff winning football. You run the clock down at the end with a lead, not at the beginning with a deficit or a gooseegg.

    Sure running the football repeatedly tires out the opposing defense. So does putting 38 up on them.
    TwistedHusky
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 5:08 pm
  • Fade wrote:Do you guys put on your clown shoes before you go to, or after you come home from work? LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOOLOOLOLLOO LOLOOLO.

    The ones who fall in that camp, must condemn this current approach as it is completely antithetical to what they have been arguing season after season, FOR YEARS.

    As they told us running into loaded boxes repeatedly was required for Wilson to be effective. Punting in enemy territory was smart football, and throwing on early downs was bad.

    No matter how much evidence we presented to the contrary. Clowns decided to die on that hill.

    Where is the conviction!? The "Let Russ Cook" proponents never wavered, the "Pete Ball" crowd seemed to have rolled over without a fight… Pathetic. LOL



    Pete was wrong the whole time. Only when Wilson pretty much said it without saying it, that he was going to leave if things didn't change. THEN Pete folded like a lawn chair. LOL.

    "Pete Ball" is garbo. I am glad to see it is dead. It cost the team many wins over the years, higher playoff seedings, and what could have been deep playoff runs.

    The Seahawks may very well win the Superbowl this year if they keep up this aggressive, varied attack they displayed on Sunday. But more importantly it is about throwing your best punch and letting the chips fall where they may. Instead of holding back and wondering if they could've won the game had Wilson been more featured.


    LOLOL Okay I'll bite, what's wrong with putting your best foot forward?...The last few Seasons Defensive Secondary SUCKED & Big Balls Pete had to make silk purses out of sow's ears, now-> Some of y'all are going to have to acknowledge that Pete & Co. got real aggressive, and gave a pass to 'Big Bucks' Clowney, and then went out and FIXED the anemic Secondary by going after Dunbar & Hocking their socks AND shorts for Jamal Adams.
    The Offense got down off'n the porch and ran with the big dawgs...In other words, as a wise old Seahawks Coach use to say "You Have Play With The Hand You're Dealt"
    scutterhawk
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 5:45 pm
  • This is Russell Wilson’s team.
    Pandion Haliaetus
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 6:14 pm
  • Sgt. Largent wrote:Both mantras are over simplified, Pete Ball, Let Russ Cook.

    What we saw Sunday is not Pete just finally unleashing Russell, it was Pete giving Russell and Schotty more freedom within the confines of the scheme, playcalling and letting Russ make timely and key in game decisions (going for it on 4th and 5).

    Saw some of that last year (Cleveland game), and that progression is continuing more this year.

    Btw, only two QB's had more TD passes in their first eight seasons than Russell, Dan Marino and Peyton Manning. So this false narrative that Russell hasn't been allowed to throw the ball more is fictional. Yep, Pete likes (and still does) balance with a punishing run game.

    If you or anyone think that's going to change, you're sorely mistaken. Pete still wants to run the ball, he's just allowing Russell and Schotty more rope on finding creative ways to do it.



    I agree...

    let me add to that the Hawks almost had to run the ball last year because Wilson was getting sacked remember the first two games last year when they tried to open it up and it didn't quite work out...... But obviously at least against Atlanta they felt like they could opened it up a bit... O line played well..

    Now BB saw that what's he thinking? How is he going to attack the Hawks O... where is the weakness? Pretty solid O that can KILL you from several different positions... what a nightmare it must be to have to defend...

    Lets see what they do against the Pats... the Hawks O is a well coached diverse offense so far lets see how consistant they are...

    LTH
    LTH
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 6:20 pm
  • Fade wrote:Do you guys put on your clown shoes before you go to, or after you come home from work? LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOOLOOLOLLOO LOLOOLO.

    The ones who fall in that camp, must condemn this current approach as it is completely antithetical to what they have been arguing season after season, FOR YEARS.

    As they told us running into loaded boxes repeatedly was required for Wilson to be effective. Punting in enemy territory was smart football, and throwing on early downs was bad.

    No matter how much evidence we presented to the contrary. Clowns decided to die on that hill.

    Where is the conviction!? The "Let Russ Cook" proponents never wavered, the "Pete Ball" crowd seemed to have rolled over without a fight… Pathetic. LOL



    Pete was wrong the whole time. Only when Wilson pretty much said it without saying it, that he was going to leave if things didn't change. THEN Pete folded like a lawn chair. LOL.

    "Pete Ball" is garbo. I am glad to see it is dead. It cost the team many wins over the years, higher playoff seedings, and what could have been deep playoff runs.

    The Seahawks may very well win the Superbowl this year if they keep up this aggressive, varied attack they displayed on Sunday. But more importantly it is about throwing your best punch and letting the chips fall where they may. Instead of holding back and wondering if they could've won the game had Wilson been more featured.



    I think your missing it totally... It's not about just one thing...It's about matchups and having the tools to attack a team in multiple different ways according to what matchups the Hawks favor... This is a multi talented diverse offense that can beat you at running and passing... no this is about matching up period...

    LTH
    LTH
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 6:44 pm
  • So you think we were largely unsuccessful the past few years because we did not win it all? Do you think we will be so much better now we will be undefeated or 14-2? We were not the laughing stock of the league the last few years. Pete ball has worked for a long time. That does not mean there is not a better way to do things. Has anyone actually ever said they need to play Pete ball for Russ to be successful??? I don’t think so. Russ will be successful in whatever system he is in.
    I do hope they keep the mix they did in this game. They realized the run game was not working so they went the other way. I like it. does that mean we will win it all if we play this way all year. Maybe maybe not. It was only one game. Does that mean we can’t win a game by running the ball? Nope. If we can run the ball successfully they will do it. I don’t mind it at all. This was nice game and I liked watching Russ control things a defense that was harder hitting and flying to the ball.
    Year of The Hawk
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 6:54 pm
  • xray wrote:Carroll will use whatever offense will work for each individual opponent this season . There will plenty of games when run 1st is the offense again .



    Agreed!
    LTH
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 6:56 pm
  • Fade wrote:Do you guys put on your clown shoes before you go to, or after you come home from work? LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOOLOOLOLLOO LOLOOLO.

    The ones who fall in that camp, must condemn this current approach as it is completely antithetical to what they have been arguing season after season, FOR YEARS.

    As they told us running into loaded boxes repeatedly was required for Wilson to be effective. Punting in enemy territory was smart football, and throwing on early downs was bad.

    No matter how much evidence we presented to the contrary. Clowns decided to die on that hill.

    Where is the conviction!? The "Let Russ Cook" proponents never wavered, the "Pete Ball" crowd seemed to have rolled over without a fight… Pathetic. LOL



    Pete was wrong the whole time. Only when Wilson pretty much said it without saying it, that he was going to leave if things didn't change. THEN Pete folded like a lawn chair. LOL.

    "Pete Ball" is garbo. I am glad to see it is dead. It cost the team many wins over the years, higher playoff seedings, and what could have been deep playoff runs.

    The Seahawks may very well win the Superbowl this year if they keep up this aggressive, varied attack they displayed on Sunday. But more importantly it is about throwing your best punch and letting the chips fall where they may. Instead of holding back and wondering if they could've won the game had Wilson been more featured.


    Can we make this the sequel to your Russel Wilson is Elite thread?
    Sox-n-Hawks
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:16 pm
  • Fade wrote:Do you guys put on your clown shoes before you go to, or after you come home from work? LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOOLOOLOLLOO LOLOOLO.

    The ones who fall in that camp, must condemn this current approach as it is completely antithetical to what they have been arguing season after season, FOR YEARS.

    As they told us running into loaded boxes repeatedly was required for Wilson to be effective. Punting in enemy territory was smart football, and throwing on early downs was bad.

    No matter how much evidence we presented to the contrary. Clowns decided to die on that hill.

    Where is the conviction!? The "Let Russ Cook" proponents never wavered, the "Pete Ball" crowd seemed to have rolled over without a fight… Pathetic. LOL



    Pete was wrong the whole time. Only when Wilson pretty much said it without saying it, that he was going to leave if things didn't change. THEN Pete folded like a lawn chair. LOL.

    "Pete Ball" is garbo. I am glad to see it is dead. It cost the team many wins over the years, higher playoff seedings, and what could have been deep playoff runs.

    The Seahawks may very well win the Superbowl this year if they keep up this aggressive, varied attack they displayed on Sunday. But more importantly it is about throwing your best punch and letting the chips fall where they may. Instead of holding back and wondering if they could've won the game had Wilson been more featured.


    I think the old Pete ball was based on a dominant OL.. and a dominant defense.. he had neither.
    Bobblehead
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 7:51 pm
  • Least pete didnt and russ didnt quit on the team 85% into the season.
    Shanegotyou11
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 8:44 pm
  • This thread won't age well, want to see where Fade is in his position when Pete gets pissed off with a in opportune turnover and tells Schotty less deep and more run like he did with Jeremy Bates.
    chris98251
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 9:23 pm

Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 9:45 pm
  • Wenhawk wrote:Florio said he heard Russ demanded this change or he may have been on his way out.

    https://sports.yahoo.com/report-russell ... 52625.html


    It has been established Florio is a Click bait guy and will say anything, he doesn't like Seattle and would love to stir the Pit here and see infighting, he has leaked so called stories before that were false.
    chris98251
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 15, 2020 11:56 pm
  • I defend Peteball from time to time, but I'm fully aware it's pretty much solely because of my reverence for Carroll as one of my idols.

    For some reason, I respect the fact that he wasn't just winning, he was winning HIS way and that it made victory sweeter.

    I admire his conviction and his adherence to philosophy. Letting Russ cook is obviously the better approach, and I hope that he continues with it for the most part, but Carroll has pretty much infinite leeway with me. I'll disagree with his decisions from time to time, but I'll like him anyway because he wins.
    Maelstrom787
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Wed Sep 16, 2020 4:10 am
  • Oh give over. We run to force teams to simplify their coverage and run man, which Russ is far more comfortable with. The Falcons, who have quite possibly the worst defense we will see all year, stayed in man all game despite getting torched (Russ was 22/23 against man). We had Carson on a strict pitch count and it worked out beautifully. I'll prefer Russ throws 50 times if we get to see man all game.

    We know what happens when we don't feature the run. But some choose to forget we've played this game before.
    Tical21
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