O-line

oldhawkfan · Feb 9, 2014

With the Super Bowl win now a week in my rear view mirror I am starting to get into offseason GM thinking mode. It is obvious to me that the o-line will be the offseason priority much like the d-line was last year. What looked like a late season struggle for Russell can really be attributed to who he was playing. SF, Arizona, Stl all have elite level defenses. NO is also capable of laying elite level defense. The talk surrounding the end of the season both nationally and locally was that he was struggling. One only needs to look at the Super Bowl and his performance against a pedestrian mediocre defense. He was not sacked. He through darts from the pocket and had total command.

People state emphatically that this is a running team. That is by both desire and design. I told numerous people before XLVIII that Seattle could do whatever they wanted on that game because they are not primarily a running team. PC wants to be but with RW in charge they really can do whatever the defense gives them.

Where they had their late season struggles was with an o-line that had matchup problems with elite defenses or essentially elite front fours. This is why I see the o-line being dramatically different next season. I'm not even going to try to predict how it might look. I do believe they will want to upgrade LG and possibly RT. the question is how much concern do they have at LT and durability issues?

Grahamhawker · Feb 9, 2014

It will be interesting to see what happens o-line wise. I don't think it's going out on a limb to predict that's the area most likely to see some significant change.

seahawk12thman · Feb 9, 2014

Resign Breno, (bigger priority than Baldwin or Tate but not as important as Bennett).
Find a left guard and we are good. I am much higher on our oline than most on this board.

Mistashoesta · Feb 9, 2014

Imo both guard positions (mainly the left side) need to be worked on.

seahawk12thman · Feb 9, 2014

Mistashoesta":2mchftfl said:
Imo both guard positions (mainly the left side) need to be worked on.

I love Sweezy at right guard. I thought he did the job second half of season, I have been very impressed.

Penman96 · Feb 9, 2014

Some good points there, we did play a string of elite defenses at the end of the season and that limited our offensive production. We don't have to look very far to see what an elite defence can do - look what happened to Payton Manning and the supposed best offense to ever play!

Russell and the rest of our offense can't totally escape the blame however. Russ was blowing hot and cold for a few games there. Against the Cards in particular he looked like he had a poor game. That's perfectly OK for a second year QB to have, mind. He's still learning his craft, it's his sophomore season so who wasn't expecting a few ups and downs.

Part of the issue were our receivers, none of our guys really merited a double team and opponents covered them one-on-one on a lot of plays. That sometimes resulted in a extra man stacking the box to stop the run and get after Russ quicker, stopping him from rolling out. The one-on-one match-ups were enough to provide good coverage, Russ had limited options. This all changes when we have Percy Harvin on the field, he opens up the game for Russ, Marshawn, the OL and most importantly Bevell. He was a game changer in the SuperBowl.

Another supposed OL issue was injuries, both Okung and Unger were dinged up. I wonder about LT durability as well, Okung is a pro-bowl player when healthy all year but when is he healthy all year. We have little choice but to stick with him next year. I believe in Unger's case that he's a true pro-bowl player, but he was playing hurt. Breno is a serviceable RT. At guard we need help - but maybe we will have it through the draft, the guys coming up from last year like Alvin Bailey and Michael Bowie, and a reasonably priced FA or two.

FlyingGreg · Feb 9, 2014

seahawk12thman":15otypol said:
Mistashoesta":15otypol said:

Imo both guard positions (mainly the left side) need to be worked on.

Click to expand...

I love Sweezy at right guard. I thought he did the job second half of season, I have been very impressed.

Run blocking, yes. Not so much holding ground against the pass rush.

LudwigsDrummer · Feb 9, 2014

I am intrigued at the possibilities along our OL.
Breno's cap hit last year was $4.75M and McQ's was $3.375. Both are UFA's this year.
Current $ situation for 2014...
Okung $11.2M cap, $4.5M dead $ if cut, 2 years left. An outrageous contract for a guy who held out and misses so many games. He also gets his fair share of senseless offensive penalties.
Max $6.1M cap, $3.3M dead if cut. 3 years left. A keeper contract even though his production tapered off `13 vs `12.
Carp $2.4 cap, $1.0 dead $ if cut, 1 year left. Has never played to his draft status.

IMO, let McQ leave and I appreciate his efforts while a Seahawk. Consider a 1 or 2 year contract for Breno as we draft and groom his replacement this year. If he isn't realistic on the $, he goes away and I replace him this year via draft or FA. Let Sweezy stay and hopefully prosper. He is playing above his contract and his cap is less than $600k.
Really, the tough call is Okung. His contract is prohibitive for a guy that misses that many games. His cap hit does drop about $3.5M in the final year (next year) of his contract to $7.3M, but his dead $ this year is huge. If I was the boss, I would ask for him to restructure. If he doesn't I most likely would ride with him this year and dust him next year. That gives me a year and a half to find his replacement. That is an unfriendly contract though. How much better would it be to have his hit at $7.3M this year and $11.2 next year?

Lynch Mob · Feb 9, 2014

I think if they don't get a cap friendly deal(vet min) from Giacomini then I think you go to the draft. If Seattle came away with either "Tiny" Richardson or Jawuan James in the NFL draft it would make things very interesting on the O-line. Then I think you can bump Bowie inside to LG and if Bailey has come along physically in the off season then put him in at RG. Carpenter could step in for Bailey if he is not physically ready to start but I like Bailey and Bowie as Guards. If next years O-line starters are Okung,Bowie,Unger,Bailey,and Richardson or James at RT I would be encouraged with the youth and price tag of the new O-line.

Seafan · Feb 9, 2014

Okung, Bowie, Under, Sweezy, Bailey. I don't see a real need but if they think they need to find others then I'm sure they'll do the right thing.

Grahamhawker · Feb 9, 2014

From the off-season plan thread: " I am extremely curious to see how much of the line shuffling late in the year was tied to seeing who they want to keep. "

Mtjhoyas · Feb 9, 2014

Simple question, where do you find the upgrade?

And secondly, does this really guarantee anything against elite front 7s?

Don't get me wrong, I'd love to see an improvement, I just don't think it's easy and/or cost efficient (cap space & draft capital). Additionally, elite front 7s are far more athletic than the best OL you can put together.

If you can clearly upgrade without breaking the bank, do it. Otherwise, continue to develop all facets of the offense and create more mismatches all over the field. I think it's a pretty simple concept that the more of the field you threaten offensively, the less a defense is going to be able to pin their ears back. I trust this more than finding a guy who can singlehandedly shut down Quinn or Aldon. It's just a different caliber of athlete on the defensive side of the ball these days.

Anthony! · Feb 9, 2014

oldhawkfan":3balfriq said:
With the Super Bowl win now a week in my rear view mirror I am starting to get into offseason GM thinking mode. It is obvious to me that the o-line will be the offseason priority much like the d-line was last year. What looked like a late season struggle for Russell can really be attributed to who he was playing. SF, Arizona, Stl all have elite level defenses. NO is also capable of laying elite level defense. The talk surrounding the end of the season both nationally and locally was that he was struggling. One only needs to look at the Super Bowl and his performance against a pedestrian mediocre defense. He was not sacked. He through darts from the pocket and had total command.

People state emphatically that this is a running team. That is by both desire and design. I told numerous people before XLVIII that Seattle could do whatever they wanted on that game because they are not primarily a running team. PC wants to be but with RW in charge they really can do whatever the defense gives them.

Where they had their late season struggles was with an o-line that had matchup problems with elite defenses or essentially elite front fours. This is why I see the o-line being dramatically different next season. I'm not even going to try to predict how it might look. I do believe they will want to upgrade LG and possibly RT. the question is how much concern do they have at LT and durability issues?

While I agree we need to improve the o-line a lot of the so called struggles was conservative play calling per PC who even said as much. IN the SB PC allowed them to open it up and you see what happens when you allow Rw to be RW.

RolandDeschain · Feb 9, 2014

I'm saying the same thing I've said every off-season for the last like, four years. Draft O-line high.

Anthony! · Feb 9, 2014

Penman96":2t3qcqc1 said:
Some good points there, we did play a string of elite defenses at the end of the season and that limited our offensive production. We don't have to look very far to see what an elite defence can do - look what happened to Payton Manning and the supposed best offense to ever play!

Russell and the rest of our offense can't totally escape the blame however. Russ was blowing hot and cold for a few games there. Against the Cards in particular he looked like he had a poor game. That's perfectly OK for a second year QB to have, mind. He's still learning his craft, it's his sophomore season so who wasn't expecting a few ups and downs.

Part of the issue were our receivers, none of our guys really merited a double team and opponents covered them one-on-one on a lot of plays. That sometimes resulted in a extra man stacking the box to stop the run and get after Russ quicker, stopping him from rolling out. The one-on-one match-ups were enough to provide good coverage, Russ had limited options. This all changes when we have Percy Harvin on the field, he opens up the game for Russ, Marshawn, the OL and most importantly Bevell. He was a game changer in the SuperBowl.

Another supposed OL issue was injuries, both Okung and Unger were dinged up. I wonder about LT durability as well, Okung is a pro-bowl player when healthy all year but when is he healthy all year. We have little choice but to stick with him next year. I believe in Unger's case that he's a true pro-bowl player, but he was playing hurt. Breno is a serviceable RT. At guard we need help - but maybe we will have it through the draft, the guys coming up from last year like Alvin Bailey and Michael Bowie, and a reasonably priced FA or two.

It was less about RW and more about play calling and being to reserve, you want less struggles stop calling conservative game plans.

WestcoastSteve · Feb 9, 2014

I think because Sweezy is cheap he remain the RG -- is he the best RG? No but his value at his salary is pretty good.

I think because Breno makes a decent salary they will try to upgrade at his position. If you're going to pay a RT decent money you might as well get a top 10 one right?

WestcoastSteve · Feb 9, 2014

Anthony!":1oj9ci7o said:
oldhawkfan":1oj9ci7o said:

With the Super Bowl win now a week in my rear view mirror I am starting to get into offseason GM thinking mode. It is obvious to me that the o-line will be the offseason priority much like the d-line was last year. What looked like a late season struggle for Russell can really be attributed to who he was playing. SF, Arizona, Stl all have elite level defenses. NO is also capable of laying elite level defense. The talk surrounding the end of the season both nationally and locally was that he was struggling. One only needs to look at the Super Bowl and his performance against a pedestrian mediocre defense. He was not sacked. He through darts from the pocket and had total command.

People state emphatically that this is a running team. That is by both desire and design. I told numerous people before XLVIII that Seattle could do whatever they wanted on that game because they are not primarily a running team. PC wants to be but with RW in charge they really can do whatever the defense gives them.

Where they had their late season struggles was with an o-line that had matchup problems with elite defenses or essentially elite front fours. This is why I see the o-line being dramatically different next season. I'm not even going to try to predict how it might look. I do believe they will want to upgrade LG and possibly RT. the question is how much concern do they have at LT and durability issues?

Click to expand...

While I agree we need to improve the o-line a lot of the so called struggles was conservative play calling per PC who even said as much. IN the SB PC allowed them to open it up and you see what happens when you allow Rw to be RW.

The Seahawks were last in the NFL in sacks allowed per dropback. I'm not saying the offense wasn't conservative but they definitely had issues protecting the QB at times.

rcaido · Feb 9, 2014

Okung & Breno were studs when they were healthy. It was a nightmare watching our other o-line without them there this year, they were like high school students playing w/ all pros. Didn't help Bevell didn't call for any screen passes to stop the blitz...Im surprise Wilson wasn't seriously injured. We need to draft high on one guard this draft. McQuistan & Bowie just aren't talented enough. Bowie did have that one good game against the Saints though but i question his effort during games. Bailey look good too.

EverydayImRusselin · Feb 9, 2014

Seafan":3f0a44ey said:
Okung, Bowie, Under, Sweezy, Bailey. I don't see a real need but if they think they need to find others then I'm sure they'll do the right thing.

I like this. Only thing is I hope we re-sign Breno for a reasonable deal $3-4m/yr and plug him in at RT. That gives us a solid starting OL and Bailey has shown a lot of versatility to plug in holes. If we bring back LJP as well, we'd have a nice solid top 7 as long as we don't have 3 starters injured again.

Anthony! · Feb 9, 2014

WestcoastSteve":1z3ttpke said:
Anthony!":1z3ttpke said:

oldhawkfan":1z3ttpke said:

With the Super Bowl win now a week in my rear view mirror I am starting to get into offseason GM thinking mode. It is obvious to me that the o-line will be the offseason priority much like the d-line was last year. What looked like a late season struggle for Russell can really be attributed to who he was playing. SF, Arizona, Stl all have elite level defenses. NO is also capable of laying elite level defense. The talk surrounding the end of the season both nationally and locally was that he was struggling. One only needs to look at the Super Bowl and his performance against a pedestrian mediocre defense. He was not sacked. He through darts from the pocket and had total command.

People state emphatically that this is a running team. That is by both desire and design. I told numerous people before XLVIII that Seattle could do whatever they wanted on that game because they are not primarily a running team. PC wants to be but with RW in charge they really can do whatever the defense gives them.

Where they had their late season struggles was with an o-line that had matchup problems with elite defenses or essentially elite front fours. This is why I see the o-line being dramatically different next season. I'm not even going to try to predict how it might look. I do believe they will want to upgrade LG and possibly RT. the question is how much concern do they have at LT and durability issues?

Click to expand...

While I agree we need to improve the o-line a lot of the so called struggles was conservative play calling per PC who even said as much. IN the SB PC allowed them to open it up and you see what happens when you allow Rw to be RW.

Click to expand...

The Seahawks were last in the NFL in sacks allowed per dropback. I'm not saying the offense wasn't conservative but they definitely had issues protecting the QB at times.

I am not disagreeing with you, RW was the most hit, sacked, and hurried QB in the league.

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