Offensive Line

Since a bunch of other threads morph, and a lot of them morph into offensive line concerns, or people thinking we are totally ok there, post it here.

Personally, letting Breno go is a mistake in my world. And if Okung goes down, we have no viable replacement. We just hired a guy with very limited NFL experience. McQ is a backup at best. Carp, inconsistent. B & B were rookies that were up and down, Unger hurt almost all year, Sweezy is still making transition from D to O.

If we were starting week 1 this Sunday I would agree with you. But there is an entire offseason that this front office will use to bring in cheap, young talent that they think can either play now or think they can mold into quality offensive linemen. As long as you have your LT, I'm not too worried about them churning a good oline out.

Regarding Breno, they obviously didn't think he was worth it. Injury and age not to mention cost.-

I don't believe the Hawks will spend a dime on FA linemen. So, we are hoping for NO injuries and rookies, and 2nd year limited players.

What team has a viable/good backup LT? Heck, a lot of teams don't have a good starting one.

I get the concern, but what would you have done besides overpay for Breno? Pay a butt load for Anthony Collins? The salary cap forces teams to pick and choose who they pay. I'm not overpaying a RT if it means losing someone more valuable down the road.

Breno doesn't really have a significant injury history, and he isn't exactly old. I understand he got a payday at a price higher than JS budgeted, but I think we'll regret letting him go. I like Bowing and Bailey but they need to grow substantially if we think they can fill immediate needs, especially starting at RT. I don't like OL churn, and the simple truth is that we are absent a true starting RT and depth at 3 of 5 positions (RG and C are okay). McQ is an FA and had a horrible season, so I don't really see him as part of the solution anymore.

The good news is that there is at least a little hope for optimism with Bowie and Bailey, Carpenter is going into a contract year (I think) and might up his game, and there's still the draft, FA, etc, etc. I'm not panicking, but clearly there is work to be done here.

Breno is the player I wish we had retained the most. I'm worried about RT right now. I'm not confident in any of the guys we have on the roster right now at that spot. Keeping Breno would have let us have more flexibility in the draft, now I think we need to find our RT of the present there. I'm worried if we go into the season with either of the B&B boys as our default starter.

I followed the link so I guess I'll post this here:

That Steve Schilling guy is intriquing, so was Glove's comment in my "If Not Allen... Phillips" about Cable's perference:

"@DavisHsuSeattle: Glen Peer sent me an email talking about Cable & OL...he would rather draft & develop his own guys...he doesnt want Outside FA per Kirwan."

Click to expand...

Which leads me to ponder if Cable signed off on not want Breno back, the after all didn't even talk negotiate a re-signing and the contract that he received from the Jets would had been affordable.

So, I think JS will concede this draft to getting Cable some linemen if the value is there. Am I wrong to also think that this O-lineman class is better than the one in 2011 because I believe that one was horrible
In hindsight (and not just Seahawk players).

Which brings me back to Schilling. There is a argument in his name thread about whether Schilling might be able to figure into the Starting RT mix... and as always I love to go to the athletic comparison to gauge similarities.


BRENO GIACOMINI (STEPHEN SCHILLING)
Drafted: 2008 (2011)
Height: 6'7" (6'4)
Weight: 303 (308)
Arm Length: 32 1/8th (32 3/4ths)
Hand Size: 9 5/8th (9 1/2)
Bench Reps: 23 (30)
Vertical Jump: 26 1/2 (25 1/2)
Broad Jump: 9'00" (8'02)
40 Yrd Dash: 5.20 (5.18)
20 Yrd Dash: 2.98 (2.96)
10 Yrd Dash: 1.79 (1.80)
5-10-5 Shuttle: 4.63 (4.62)
3-Cone Drill: 7.56 (7.73)

Remember Giacomini also gained +15 pounds, so his numbers would be reduced some. On the surface, in a lot of ways these two players are nearly identical athletically with differences being Giacomini a little more agile and possessing better lower body strength. Schilling was stronger upon league entry.

Scouting Reports offered somewhat similar analysis but each varied:

Giacomini was a TE to LT convert with a single year of starting experience who excelled in pass-blocking more so than run-blocking, who need to bulk up and get stronger.

Schilling was a 4 year starter playing mostly RT and LG, considered a jack of all trades, did everything well but nothing great.

So, the question is... can Schilling figure into RT mix, I think he can if he committs himself. The one thing cable loves in his linemen is versatility to know and be comfortable at muliple poitions. Schilling sounds like he could fitright in and I guess Cable was raving about him in 2011.

Once what was Packer's trash became Seahawks treasure in Giacomini... Schilling could be the Charger's trash, and another Cable reclaimation project that he develops into a viable starter.

Who knows? Compete, compete, compete.

So where is Anthony with his suggestions about how the team can improve the OLine, what players are available and how they'd be an upgrade?

As to Schilling this player apparently may have been a guy Coach Cable liked when he was drafted.

I am curious if Breno's knee problems weren't a big reason why Seattle showed little interest in bringing him back. That knee was a pretty big concern throughout the first half of the season. But after missing some games, he came back and looked solid so it kind of became a forgotten issue. The coaches and front office might have seen it as something that was going to be an ongoing issue that needed to be closely monitored and carefully managed. Thus, they decided it was just better to go with Bowie at RT.

I think Breno wanted more than the FO were prepared to pay. It would have been nice to have kept him around but he did have his limitations and his penalty prone playing was a huge negative. Still he had attitude and brought a nasty physicality to our OLine play.

Seattle also signed 6'3 303-pound lineman Greg Van Roten when he was released by the Packers a couple weeks ago. Played tackle in college, moved to center and guard with Packers. I'm sure we'll draft a couple linemen as well.

The Seahawks got Breno off of GB's practice squad in the first place, so I'm not worried about their ability to find solid starters in various places.

They have Schilling and Van Roten to develop along with Jared Smith, Bowie and Bailey can probably both start and can both shift around the line if need be, and we've retained Jeanpierre. I am guessing they go OT or OG in the first three rounds - that is more than enough talent already.

I'd rather have Carpenter's 1.4M to throw at the Allen deal or at an extension for someone that matters like Thomas or Sherman.

I think we will draft OL in the first round unless an absolute must have at a different position drops into our laps e.g. Donald (who I recently saw at 32 in a mock).

Glad we re-signed Lemuel.

I see Sweezy becoming a mid level talent this year, he will be better.
Unger will improve with his health. Okung is solid.

I think Carpenter sucks. He is a slow, lumbering oaf, but between two former ProBowlers he can get away with it more.

RT seems to be a position that coaches don't value, that is why Avril and Bennett are so damn dominate.

Was it Bailey or Bowie that was coming in at the end of the year on jumbo packages that seemed to seal downfield blocks for Lynch?

And when Breno went out, the drop off wasn't huge.

Wouldn't mind seeing a high pick on a Cable toy.

UK_Seahawk":o9snin6x said:

I think we will draft OL in the first round unless an absolute must have at a different position drops into our laps e.g. Donald (who I recently saw at 32 in a mock).

Click to expand...

I'm sure they will draft the best player available on their board excluding QB, RB, S, & probably LB. There's a good chance that the player will be OL but I think it depends entirely on how their board shakes out.

Yeah Carp. has just not made much progress as a player but did manage to play the whole year. Maybe he will improve as a player this year?

Hell I don't know, he is a fat ass.

I think RT is a very important position with RW being right handed.

Hawk Strap":mkwhvqdn said:

Glad we re-signed Lemuel.

I see Sweezy becoming a mid level talent this year, he will be better.
Unger will improve with his health. Okung is solid.

I think Carpenter sucks. He is a slow, lumbering oaf, but between two former ProBowlers he can get away with it more.

RT seems to be a position that coaches don't value, that is why Avril and Bennett are so damn dominate.

Was it Bailey or Bowie that was coming in at the end of the year on jumbo packages that seemed to seal downfield blocks for Lynch?

And when Breno went out, the drop off wasn't huge.

Wouldn't mind seeing a high pick on a Cable toy.

Click to expand...

I don't know but I remember in the SB Bailey looked like he picked up his man and drove him 5yards back for the Marshawn score

We did well considering Okung and Breno both missed 8 games. Not to mention we played a couple games in there without our three top OLs. IMO as long as Cable is on the team we'll be good enough. If Carp and Moff had both become pro bowlers we'd likely have to let them walk anyway. The good thing is there is a good chance the Hawks can likely improve two positions on the OL this offseason.

Largent80":ryblhuex said:

Yeah Carp. has just not made much progress as a player but did manage to play the whole year. Maybe he will improve as a player this year?

Hell I don't know, he is a fat ass.

I think RT is a very important position with RW being right handed.

Click to expand...

I'll chime in and start by disagreeing that letting Breno go is an outright mistake. (edit: I forget to mention... while I get the "experience" argument, Breno had to get his opportunity to get that experience. I also don't understand how letting Breno go has much to do with any hypothetical "if" Okung goes down. Was Breno the clear cut backup LT? I don't think that was the case. The Hawks now have 2 guys who gained valuable experience in their rookie years that I fully expect will be even better in year 2.) If Bowie and Bailey hadn't shown so much promise, then maybe yeah. But, I like their potential after playing well in significant time their rookie years. Can't wait to see what contributions they make wherever they settle along that line. I'm also interested now to see if Schilling might pan out (and also there's Caylin Hauptmann whom they poached, correct?, from the Browns practice squad last season.) The Seahawks would probably love to trade out of the first round (and might have some buyers lining up, depending on players other teams covet that drop in a deep draft. That pick might be worth a bit more than in other drafts due to the depth and the names that might be available.) With success found with Sweezy, Bailey, and Bowie... I'm thinking OL isn't a high priority (nor desperate need) for a high draft pick.

LT would be more important to a right-handed QB. Blind side protection. Nevertheless, the entire line is important.

After speaking extensively with a current member of the Offensive Line last spring (before the draft)... what I took from comments is that Carpenter's ability is held in high regard. (At that time, he said they needed to add a Tackle.) Staying on the field in 2013 was at least a first step in the right direction for his career. A year later there's obviously more there to evaluate. I'm with most 12's, though, and don't know exactly what to think of Carpenter. But, optimistic that if he can remain healthy, we might see continued improved play and the dominant force hoped for in drafting him. (I would love to be able to speak with that player again and find out what mood and outlook is for the line now before the 2014 draft.)