Jordan Hill and the D line

Where the heck has this guy been? The only position group that seems to lacking depth is D-line. I am concerned if we lost Mebane for any reason. Are we OK there?

Not worried one bit about the D Line, they are pretty deep. Plenty of guys who can get the job done.

Has this guy even played? Seems like a non factor to me.

Both Hill and Williams have been huge disappointments so far.

I understand they've been injured, but this was both their year's to step up and provide much needed depth and prove they belong in this league. Neither has impressed, even when healthy.

Sgt. Largent":pq091pn2 said:

Both Hill and Williams have been huge disappointments so far.

I understand they've been injured, but this was both their year's to step up and provide much needed depth and prove they belong in this league. Neither has impressed, even when healthy.

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I didn't have any expectations for Williams but Hill should be in the mix. Scruggs hasn't done a lot to impress either, I would say he has been OK.

Sgt. Largent":2k4eprp4 said:

Both Hill and Williams have been huge disappointments so far.

I understand they've been injured, but this was both their year's to step up and provide much needed depth and prove they belong in this league. Neither has impressed, even when healthy.

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Odd, I have heard people saying Williams has been good.

ImTheScientist":1t6qicd0 said:

Sgt. Largent":1t6qicd0 said:

Both Hill and Williams have been huge disappointments so far.

I understand they've been injured, but this was both their year's to step up and provide much needed depth and prove they belong in this league. Neither has impressed, even when healthy.

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Odd, I have heard people saying Williams has been good.

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Kevin Williams, yes.

Jesse, no... and now he's hurt again.

Can you really take much from how a DT plays in preseason?

Jordan Hill hasn't played much in the first two games, but when he's been out there I've seen some good things from him. His punch is more violent than before and his get-off has improved. He's always been a DT who generates most of his value from the "splash play," which means he's going to have hot streaks and cold streaks.

I can't comment on his run defense the last two weeks but in 2013 and in college he had a sub-par anchor. He will play 1-tech on pure pass rushing downs but that doesn't make him any more of a true one tech than Craig Terrell was.

Hill's always been a low upside player. I do like him, but someone after the draft mentioned him in the same breath as Geno Atkins and I just laughed and laughed. No way in hell.

If Seattle uses him right, he's basically a league average rotational DT. Almost no room for growth either. He is what he is. But remember, only something like 10% of 3rd round picks ever make a pro-bowl. John Moffitt and DeAnthony Smith were 3rd rounders too. Home runs like Russell Wilson and Navarro Bowman are freak occurrences.

Last year I believe they were largely a 7 man rotation on game days (Red, Mebane,McDaniel,Clem, Bennett, Avril and Mcdonald) with Irvin and Schofield mixed in occasionally as edge rushers with Hill and Mayowa as the inactives.

Again, this season I believe it will largely be a 7 man rotation (Bennett,Mebane,Williams,Avril,McDaniel, Scruggs, and Marsh) with Irvin and Schofield mixed in as edge rushers with Hill and Mayowa as the inactives.

I actually think the dline could be better this season. If you ask me if I would rather have Clem/Red/McDonald or K Williams/Marsh/Scruggs, I think I'd opt for the latter and role the dice on the unknown. Keep in mind that Clem/Red/McDonald weren't they players they turned out to be until this staff went to work with them.

Thanks doctor K. I am going to watch for him now based on this thread.

Jordan Hill is currently the #2 NT behind Mebane, though admittedly if something happened to Mebane then I'd expect Kevin Williams and Tony McDaniel to be the two DT's in the base D.

I DVR'd the game against the Chargers and re-watched it a few times, focusing specifically on both lines and watching each play several times to focus in on a different player each time. I found that Hill actually got a lot of really good penetration and pressure up the middle throughout the game, but the ball simply went away from him in most cases. Considering that he's still ostensibly the NFL's version of a redshirt freshman, there's no reason for pessimism yet. Keep in mind that D-linemen often take awhile to 'break out' at the NFL level......Exhibit A: Michael Bennett, who had a grand total of 18 tackles and 2 sacks in his first TWO FULL SEASONS in the NFL. That's only a half-sack more than Hill had in just 4 games last season.

Basis4day":1ls51zs9 said:

Can you really take much from how a DT plays in preseason?

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A proven starter? Not really.

But preseason is where guys like Hill and Williams are suppose to be impressing their coaches to the point of cracking the D-Line rotation. So yes, we can take the fact that he hasn't done crap in the preseason as a sign that he's not doing enough for Pete to trust him in the regular season.

I guarantee you guys like Coyle and Schoefiled are making Pete seriously consider them for regular season action.

kobebryant":jma4i65j said:

I actually think the dline could be better this season. If you ask me if I would rather have Clem/Red/McDonald or K Williams/Marsh/Scruggs, I think I'd opt for the latter and role the dice on the unknown. Keep in mind that Clem/Red/McDonald weren't they players they turned out to be until this staff went to work with them.

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I worry a bit about our run defense. As much as I like McDaniel as an Alan Branch type 3-tech, he's not looked all that great in the Red Bryant role so far. I think we are going to miss Red. I also think we're going to miss McDaniel the 3-tech. Losing Red downgraded two positions, IMO.

Williams is going to help Seattle this year, but not quite in the same way McDonald did. He plays with a high center of gravity a lot and can be moved in the run game, but Williams plays smart and can rush the passer. He's a nice player, but not as well rounded as McDonald was last season. McDonald was really under-rated in 2013.

I think Marsh could be a really nice 3-4 OLB or maybe a decent LEO. But playing inside as a pass rush DT he has no ability to beat double teams or to push the pocket, he can hand fight his way around single blocks but that's it. He's a good "football player" though, no doubt. He'll have a good career, though I doubt it will be in a Michael Bennett role. It's still early though. Maybe he'll bulk up in a future offseason.

Sgt. Largent":1eczmima said:

Basis4day":1eczmima said:

Can you really take much from how a DT plays in preseason?

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A proven starter? Not really.

But preseason is where guys like Hill and Williams are suppose to be impressing their coaches to the point of cracking the D-Line rotation. So yes, we can take the fact that he hasn't done crap in the preseason as a sign that he's not doing enough for Pete to trust him in the regular season.

I guarantee you guys like Coyle and Schoefiled are making Pete seriously consider them for regular season action.

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I meant more in the sense that DT is one of the most difficult positions for a casual observer to grade. Even when they're playing well they don't always show up on the stat sheet.