Does anyone happen to know how many draft picks the Niners have this year? Also their Cap Number? Thanks



Just wondering as we are discussing possible trade talks about Earl Thomas and wonder if they have a Strong Safety that is worth his value for trade discussion.

They have about 115 million in cap room because they've been carrying over the maximum amount every year.

They have their own first at #9 or 10 (coin flip still to come), the Saints 2nd, their 3rd and Chicago's 3rd, the Steelers' 4th, the Jets' 5th, their own 6th and 7th and the Chiefs' 7th. They won't get any comp picks.

I don't think the Hawks will be dumb enough to trade the best FS in the game right in the heart of his prime, let alone to a division rival that seems to be improving.

They have Jimmie Ward (who they really like but who is always injured) and Adrian Colbert (who has played really, really well, but is going into his second year and was a UDFA) at FS.

I'm sure they'd jump at the chance to get ET3, I just think the chance of the Hawks sending him to SF is effectively zero.

That would be like the Yankees sending Reggie Jackson to the Red Sox.

Popeyejones wrote:They have about 115 million in cap room because they've been carrying over the maximum amount every year.

They have their own first at #9 or 10 (coin flip still to come), the Saints 2nd, their 3rd and Chicago's 3rd, the Steelers' 4th, the Jets' 5th, their own 6th and 7th and the Chiefs' 7th. They won't get any comp picks.

I don't think the Hawks will be dumb enough to trade the best FS in the game right in the heart of his prime, let alone to a division rival that seems to be improving.

They have Jimmie Ward (who they really like but who is always injured) and Adrian Colbert (who has played really, really well, but is going into his second year and was a UDFA) at FS.

I'm sure they'd jump at the chance to get ET3, I just think the chance of the Hawks sending him to SF is effectively zero.

Thank you man. Appreciate it.

^^^^

And as I hope is clear from my post, I'd LOOOOOOOOOOOOVE for the 9ers to get their hands on ET3. He's just awesome, and is obviously a great, great scheme fit for the defense.

Guys like that don't just come available though. He's the JJ Watt/Aaron Rodgers/Joe Thomas/Julio Jones of his position.

The 49ers have Tartt, who they love, Colbert, who played very well, Ward, who they like but will have to pay a lot to keep, and Eric Reid (assuming he resigns). As good as Thomas is, I think the 49ers consider both safety positions filled. Note: all 4 of them have played both safety positions.

Whether as a Seahawk cap casualty or a trade, he’s probably simply too expensive based on what they currently have.

5_Golden_Rings wrote:The 49ers have Tartt, who they love, Colbert, who played very well, Ward, who they like but will have to pay a lot to keep, and Eric Reid (assuming he resigns). As good as Thomas is, I think the 49ers consider both safety positions filled. Note: all 4 of them have played both safety positions.

Whether as a Seahawk cap casualty or a trade, he’s probably simply too expensive based on what they currently have.

Thank you.

Popeyejones wrote:They have about 115 million in cap room because they've been carrying over the maximum amount every year.

They have their own first at #9 or 10 (coin flip still to come), the Saints 2nd, their 3rd and Chicago's 3rd, the Steelers' 4th, the Jets' 5th, their own 6th and 7th and the Chiefs' 7th. They won't get any comp picks.

I don't think the Hawks will be dumb enough to trade the best FS in the game right in the heart of his prime, let alone to a division rival that seems to be improving.

They have Jimmie Ward (who they really like but who is always injured) and Adrian Colbert (who has played really, really well, but is going into his second year and was a UDFA) at FS.

I'm sure they'd jump at the chance to get ET3, I just think the chance of the Hawks sending him to SF is effectively zero.

Earl going to anyone in our division would be very depressing.

...yeah, just to piggyback what Popeye said, I don't see Earl Thomas in SF.

They have players they like at both FS and SS and I can't see the 'Hawks trading him in division. If he were released, it surely would be a conversation and the Niners would have a ton of money, but I think they'd have other priorities (which is also why they wouldn't likely give up picks even if Seattle were willing to trade him in division).

I respect the hell out of the guy so don't take it as an affront to the player, but I just don't see him in SF anytime soon.

Jimmy Graham on the other hand might make a lot of sense in SF...tho they have some young guys there as well so they wouldn't break the bank on that one either.

In other words, lil' Jed York has been spending the LEAST he possibly can over the last several years, while cashing in on huge PSL money and government subsidies and screwing over just about everyone (including LYING to the neighboring kids soccer clubs and reneging on a promise to refurbish their soccer fields that were taken from them to create parking lots for the stadium).

Marvin49 wrote:...yeah, just to piggyback what Popeye said, I don't see Earl Thomas in SF.

They have players they like at both FS and SS and I can't see the 'Hawks trading him in division. If he were released, it surely would be a conversation and the Niners would have a ton of money, but I think they'd have other priorities (which is also why they wouldn't likely give up picks even if Seattle were willing to trade him in division).

I respect the hell out of the guy so don't take it as an affront to the player, but I just don't see him in SF anytime soon.

Jimmy Graham on the other hand might make a lot of sense in SF...tho they have some young guys there as well so they wouldn't break the bank on that one either.

Thanks Marvin. I was just considering all the complications of a move....and wanted input from some wise individuals as you all are. You 3 to 10 here that monitor this site are what makes us more intelligent in what your team thinks and what wavelength your team is on.

hawknation2018 wrote:In other words, lil' Jed York has been spending the LEAST he possibly can over the last several years, while cashing in on huge PSL money and government subsidies and screwing over just about everyone (including LYING to the neighboring kids soccer clubs and reneging on a promise to refurbish their soccer fields that were taken from them to create parking lots for the stadium).

Yer funny.

1) They aren't spending money because sadly they have few drafted players to spend the money on. How much of the Seahawks Cap Space is used on players they drafted and extended? The 49ers don't get to keep those dollars. The CBA precludes that.

2) "Cashing in on huge PSL money". Totally false. The stadium was financed with a public/private partnership and the money was borrowed by the 49ers Stadium Authority. The Authority is an entity composed of the 49ers and the Board of the City of Santa Clara. Its is a third entity. The SBLs are/were sold to pay off the loan taken out by that stadium authority, IE the SBL money pays down the build loan, not line Jeds pockets. Thats not to say he isn't making money. He's making a ton of it on concessions, etc and hosting NON NFL games (College Championships, Concerts, etc).

3) The Soccer fields you are so concerned about are STILL THERE. Those fields have never been used for parking and the Soccer leagues still play on them. Thats them in the upper right corner BTW.


Jed has done enough to screw up the team by firing Harbaugh, not firing Baalke, and hiring Tomsula and Kelly. There is no need to make sh*t up as well.

Seahawkfan80 wrote:

Marvin49 wrote:...yeah, just to piggyback what Popeye said, I don't see Earl Thomas in SF.

They have players they like at both FS and SS and I can't see the 'Hawks trading him in division. If he were released, it surely would be a conversation and the Niners would have a ton of money, but I think they'd have other priorities (which is also why they wouldn't likely give up picks even if Seattle were willing to trade him in division).

I respect the hell out of the guy so don't take it as an affront to the player, but I just don't see him in SF anytime soon.

Jimmy Graham on the other hand might make a lot of sense in SF...tho they have some young guys there as well so they wouldn't break the bank on that one either.

Thanks Marvin. I was just considering all the complications of a move....and wanted input from some wise individuals as you all are. You 3 to 10 here that monitor this site are what makes us more intelligent in what your team thinks and what wavelength your team is on.

Marvin49 wrote:

hawknation2018 wrote:In other words, lil' Jed York has been spending the LEAST he possibly can over the last several years, while cashing in on huge PSL money and government subsidies and screwing over just about everyone (including LYING to the neighboring kids soccer clubs and reneging on a promise to refurbish their soccer fields that were taken from them to create parking lots for the stadium).

Yer funny.

1) They aren't spending money because sadly they have few drafted players to spend the money on. How much of the Seahawks Cap Space is used on players they drafted and extended? The 49ers don't get to keep those dollars. The CBA precludes that.

2) "Cashing in on huge PSL money". Totally false. The stadium was financed with a public/private partnership and the money was borrowed by the 49ers Stadium Authority. The Authority is an entity composed of the 49ers and the Board of the City of Santa Clara. Its is a third entity. The SBLs are/were sold to pay off the loan taken out by that stadium authority, IE the SBL money pays down the build loan, not line Jeds pockets. Thats not to say he isn't making money. He's making a ton of it on concessions, etc and hosting NON NFL games (College Championships, Concerts, etc).

3) The Soccer fields you are so concerned about are STILL THERE. Those fields have never been used for parking and the Soccer leagues still play on them. Thats them in the upper right corner BTW.


Jed has done enough to screw up the team by firing Harbaugh, not firing Baalke, and hiring Tomsula and Kelly. There is no need to make sh*t up as well.

Was curious if you were gonna take that bait again.

Popeyejones wrote:

Marvin49 wrote:

hawknation2018 wrote:In other words, lil' Jed York has been spending the LEAST he possibly can over the last several years, while cashing in on huge PSL money and government subsidies and screwing over just about everyone (including LYING to the neighboring kids soccer clubs and reneging on a promise to refurbish their soccer fields that were taken from them to create parking lots for the stadium).

Yer funny.

1) They aren't spending money because sadly they have few drafted players to spend the money on. How much of the Seahawks Cap Space is used on players they drafted and extended? The 49ers don't get to keep those dollars. The CBA precludes that.

2) "Cashing in on huge PSL money". Totally false. The stadium was financed with a public/private partnership and the money was borrowed by the 49ers Stadium Authority. The Authority is an entity composed of the 49ers and the Board of the City of Santa Clara. Its is a third entity. The SBLs are/were sold to pay off the loan taken out by that stadium authority, IE the SBL money pays down the build loan, not line Jeds pockets. Thats not to say he isn't making money. He's making a ton of it on concessions, etc and hosting NON NFL games (College Championships, Concerts, etc).

3) The Soccer fields you are so concerned about are STILL THERE. Those fields have never been used for parking and the Soccer leagues still play on them. Thats them in the upper right corner BTW.


Jed has done enough to screw up the team by firing Harbaugh, not firing Baalke, and hiring Tomsula and Kelly. There is no need to make sh*t up as well.

Was curious if you were gonna take that bait again.

...its an affliction.

"Loyal" and "Faithful"

..............................when they are winning

SoulfishHawk wrote:"Loyal" and "Faithful"

..............................when they are winning

?

Every time you look at shots of games there, it's half empty

SoulfishHawk wrote:Every time you look at shots of games there, it's half empty

ah...no idea at what portion of the game that pic was taken but judging from signage I think that was the first season at Levis.

Yup...Bay Area fans are fickle....when the team blows it doesn't fill up. No use saying they aren't.

It makes no sense though, with the history of that team and 5 rings etc. You would think they could pack the house at all times.

Candlestick was always packed even in the pre-Harbaugh dark ages but after the move to Levis and the firing of Harbaugh, fans just lost interest and they stopped buying tickets. Jimmy G is gonna sell tickets though definitely

SoulfishHawk wrote:It makes no sense though, with the history of that team and 5 rings etc. You would think they could pack the house at all times.

Not really.

Remember all the shots of the Clink emptying out by the end of the 3rd quarter against the Rams this year? And that was after two Super Bowl appearances in the last four years, and eleven playoff appearances in the last fifteen years.

A lot of fans are fickle as heck dude.

After Brady and Belichick retire pats games are gonna go back to being empty. The same is gonna happen to the Warriors too.

SF49r wrote:Candlestick was always packed even in the pre-Harbaugh dark ages

Definitely not the way I remember it. A full stadium cheering on Tim Rattay? No way, man.

If Marv had season tickets back then he could make the best comparison to Levi's though (I don't live in the bay anymore and still haven't been)

I've been to a handful of games between 2002-2010 they all seemed packed to me. Marvin would probably know better than me since he's a season ticket holder.

SF49r wrote:I've been to a handful of games between 2002-2010 they all seemed packed to me. Marvin would probably know better than me since he's a season ticket holder.

Well you have to look at other then Seahawks games

Popeyejones wrote:

SoulfishHawk wrote:It makes no sense though, with the history of that team and 5 rings etc. You would think they could pack the house at all times.

Not really.

Remember all the shots of the Clink emptying out by the end of the 3rd quarter against the Rams this year? And that was after two Super Bowl appearances in the last four years, and eleven playoff appearances in the last fifteen years.

A lot of fans are fickle as heck dude.

After Brady and Belichick retire pats games are gonna go back to being empty. The same is gonna happen to the Warriors too.

Wasn't there a game at the Clink last year where the fans walked out because the thought the games was too far gone, then when the Hawks started coming back they all wanted back in? I remeber the pics of all the fans trying to get back in but were locked out.

It can and does happen to all teams, they all have fair weather fans. Just look at the influx of "12s" since 2012

Wrong, Hawks have been packing the house for years, win or lose. You are probably thinking of the NFC Championship. SOME fans left, but the media made it sound like thousands, it wasn't even close to that. Santa Clara has a half empty stadium every time you see them on TV.

I am a season ticket holder now but I wasn't at Candlestick. I did go to several games though...at least one or 2 a year.

I'd say there was a bigger crowd at Candlestick, but one of the biggest reasons for that is that because the building was so ancient and run down it was one of the cheaper tickets in the NFL.

They would run plans to like take 4 people to 2 games in a year with a free hot dog and soda for 20 bucks apiece.

That doesn't exist at Levis.

Higher price point, smaller crowd particularly when the team started to suck.

In fairness, the section of the crowd that most often gets caught on TV is a club section (between the 20's) on the visitor side of the stadium...in the sun. Early in the year that sun can be blistering. Since those people have club seats, they also have access to the air conditioned club that sits behind the section.

Now I'm not going to make the case that its actually a packed house and everyone is escaping the sun, but there is a lot of that particularly when the game starts and after halftime.

I'll also say this...late in the season this year with games vs the Titans and Jags....that place had a lot more heads in it and was louder than I've ever heard it before.

I've been sayin' this for a long time. There are a lot of peeps out here who can't stand Levis and love to talk about the good old days at the 'stick.

Ya know what. I loved the 'stick, but lets be real for a sec. Physically, the place was a hole. It smelled like urine and was NEVER a nice NFL stadium. NEVER.

What made it so special were the memories in that building. 5 Lombardis, countless playoff games...etc, etc. What was cool is the old girl got a few more big games and moments in her final few years (Niners-Saints playoff game, Niners-Packers Playoff game, Final game ever at the 'stick with Navarro Bowmans "Pick at the 'Stick").

What Levis needs is its own history. If they get a winner there and have a few huge moments in that building, Levis will be much better thought of and the crowds will return. Jimmy G is a BIG step in the right direction.

I went to a couple Hawks games out at the Stick. It certainly was a hole, kind of cold etc. But I still enjoyed the atmosphere overall. Funniest thing was when my wife says "They play HERE? That doesn't make sense, don't they have a bunch of rings?"
She makes a good point.
As far as Levi goes, how far from Candlestick is it, 30-45 minutes? Is it in a decent location, or middle of nowhere?
I do hear a lot of complaints about the sun beating down as well.
Hoping make a trip out there again, plus San Fran is one hell of a great city.

SoulfishHawk wrote:I went to a couple Hawks games out at the Stick. It certainly was a hole, kind of cold etc. But I still enjoyed the atmosphere overall. Funniest thing was when my wife says "They play HERE? That doesn't make sense, don't they have a bunch of rings?"
She makes a good point.
As far as Levi goes, how far from Candlestick is it, 30-45 minutes? Is it in a decent location, or middle of nowhere?
I do hear a lot of complaints about the sun beating down as well.
Hoping make a trip out there again, plus San Fran is one hell of a great city.

It depends on who you ask in terms of location.

If you ask people not too familiar with the Bay Area they'd lead you to believe its in the middle of nowhere. Thats incorrect.

Levis stadium sits in the middle of Silicon Valley. Santa Clara neighbors San Jose which is bigger in both size and population than SF. In fact, Santa Clara and San Jose are in Santa Clara County. This wasn't a case of the team looking for a location in the middle of nowhere. They were looking for a location near all the money. Apple, Intel, AMD, Cisco, EBay, Google, and hundreds more....all have campuses within a few short miles. They have also had their headquarters in SC for 2 or 3 decades. They built the stadium in a parking lot next to their existing HQ.

As I write this message, I'm sitting at work 1.3 miles away from Levis and can see it out the window (I'm on the 6th floor).

Now the South Bay doesn't have the same recognition of SF. Few places do. Its a storied American City (that I rarely visit because I hate to drive there...lol). However, anyone who tells you that Levis is in the middle of nowhere doesn't have the first clue what they are talking about.

SoulfishHawk wrote:Wrong, Hawks have been packing the house for years, win or lose. You are probably thinking of the NFC Championship. SOME fans left, but the media made it sound like thousands, it wasn't even close to that. Santa Clara has a half empty stadium every time you see them on TV.

Nah, as I recall it was the Rams game at the Clink this year. By the 4th quarter the most packed places in the stadium were the aisles as people were scrambling to leave. IIRC it was enough for the announcers to even comment on it while the cameras cut to it.

Hawks fans are the best and most loyal and so on and so on, I know, but my point is just that EVERY fanbase expands when a team is good, and retracts when a team is bad.

Marvin49 wrote:

SoulfishHawk wrote:I went to a couple Hawks games out at the Stick. It certainly was a hole, kind of cold etc. But I still enjoyed the atmosphere overall. Funniest thing was when my wife says "They play HERE? That doesn't make sense, don't they have a bunch of rings?"
She makes a good point.
As far as Levi goes, how far from Candlestick is it, 30-45 minutes? Is it in a decent location, or middle of nowhere?
I do hear a lot of complaints about the sun beating down as well.
Hoping make a trip out there again, plus San Fran is one hell of a great city.

It depends on who you ask in terms of location.

If you ask people not too familiar with the Bay Area they'd lead you to believe its in the middle of nowhere. Thats incorrect.

Levis stadium sits in the middle of Silicon Valley. Santa Clara neighbors San Jose which is bigger in both size and population than SF. In fact, Santa Clara and San Jose are in Santa Clara County. This wasn't a case of the team looking for a location in the middle of nowhere. They were looking for a location near all the money. Apple, Intel, AMD, Cisco, EBay, Google, and hundreds more....all have campuses within a few short miles. They have also had their headquarters in SC for 2 or 3 decades. They built the stadium in a parking lot next to their existing HQ.

As I write this message, I'm sitting at work 1.3 miles away from Levis and can see it out the window (I'm on the 6th floor).

Now the South Bay doesn't have the same recognition of SF. Few places do. Its a storied American City (that I rarely visit because I hate to drive there...lol). However, anyone who tells you that Levis is in the middle of nowhere doesn't have the first clue what they are talking about.

Yeah, really good point. Just because of how much recognition different places get I think people not from the Bay Area seriously don't realize where people actually live.

You hear about San Francisco all the time so you think there's got to be a ton of people there, but there just isn't.

The 9ers draw fans from San Francisco (850K) the East Bay (2.5 million), the South Bay (3 million and where they now are), and the North Bay (750K).

They're basically now closer to 3 million people who make up their fanbase, the same distance from 2.5 million people, and farther away from 1.6 million.

I was there, I get it. Many people left early for the Rams game. But there is no comparison to how empty a Niners game is, the entire game.

SoulfishHawk wrote:But there is no comparison to how empty a Niners game is, the entire game.

Very unsure where I said there was. I think you might be arguing with a ghost.

My only point is that the force of every fan base is tied to hope.

As for no comparisons, there's tons of ways to do it:

1) There's no comparison to how empty and quiet Levi's was when the team was toward the end of a 9 game losing streak to how loud and packed it was toward the end of a 6 game win streak.

2) There's no comparison to how empty and quiet the Clink was at the end of the Hawks being blown out by the Rams to how packed and loud it was at the end of the Hawks blowing out the 9ers back when that mattered.

Fair enough. They have had an empty stadium for years. Especially come 2nd half of a game when it's literally not even 40 percent full. And over half of what it left is opposing fans.

SoulfishHawk wrote:Fair enough. They have had an empty stadium for years. Especially come 2nd half of a game when it's literally not even 40 percent full. And over half of what it left is opposing fans.

Well....

....just imagine....

Seahawks move into brand new building and effectively double or more ticket prices depending on seat location...

Then they go 8-8 in their first season and fire Carroll over arguments with the GM and front office. They then have a revolving door a HC while going 5-11, 2-14, and then were 1-10 through 11 weeks.

Yeah....might just see a dip in attendance.

The 49ers last winning season came at Candlestick and ended with the NFC Championship in Seattle. They have been mediocre to bad to awful every year at a higher ticket price point. Not only that, but that had an insane stretch of great players and ticket draws either leaving as free agents (Frank Gore), Retiring (Patrick Willis, Justin Smith), and going bonkers (Aldon Smith, Ray McDonald). I mean seriously...look at that front 7 alone. Willis - Gone. Bowman - Never the same. Aldon - batsh*t nuts. Justin Smith - Gone.

It wasn't just ownership. That team started falling apart before Harbaugh left. Thats why they went 8-8 in his last year.

49er fans want so badly to come back and to have something to cheer for...they just hadn't seen anything in the history of Levis until one Jimmy Garoppolo.

Yeah, that was a hell of a trade for you guys. He looks like the real deal for sure.

SoulfishHawk wrote:Yeah, that was a hell of a trade for you guys. He looks like the real deal for sure.

Sure hope so. Love what I've seen so far and the hype train is in full gear, but we'll see what happens.

Marvin49 wrote:

SoulfishHawk wrote:Yeah, that was a hell of a trade for you guys. He looks like the real deal for sure.

Sure hope so. Love what I've seen so far and the hype train is in full gear, but we'll see what happens.

Out of curiosity, and because I'm a pessimist, how would you rank order (from most to least worried) the following four JGQ worries:

1) Inability to work out a long-term deal.
2) Injury (either due to fragility or hot garbage interior line play)
3) Deep passes outside the hashes aren't a small sample size thing, they're a player ability thing, and if true and that gets figured out, overage on middle depth passes within the hashes is going to tighten up more and more.
4) The Favre Effect (i.e. over-trusting of the arm and long-term interception issues)


For me I'd probably go #2, #3, #4, #1.

When I went to the game on the first of the year a couple seasons back, it was a decent atmosphere. I stayed in Sunnyvale looking for the link to the WOPR. Never found it. Easy access to both rail systems to SF and to Santa Clara. Got on the Rail to the game at a stop called Lockheed Martin. 5 to 20 mins ride. Wandered into a hotel that had a bar set up and a restaurant set up. The access to the stadium was actually pretty dang good. Leaving it was actually not too bad either. Rails were in and ready to roll within 20 mins of the end of the game. That game had a lot of out of towners at it...even Seahawks fans. They handed out free pizza coupons to some of the rows and the fans for the most part were cordial. It is all in how you approach the game and how you handle yourself. Me and Riverdog were gentlemen.

BTW I was at the motel 6 north in sunnyvale...as opposed to across the street at South...LOL. Next door there was a brewhouse and it was open on New Years eve but closed on New Years day when I got back to the room. Dennys was across the street and there were a couple of other convenience stores nearby.

Remember this tho...for ME, a mile walk is nothing...so 2 miles to a rail system is not too bad for me either. 2 miles to a game and back depends upon the area and what I can see as a systematic threat. I saw none of that in Santa Clara.

And Levi stadium is host to a Bacon and Beerfest too...

https://www.facebook.com/events/729856413872158/

I hope (and believe) the 49ers will be back in 2018.

Who wouldn't want 2 extra competitive games a season?

Leading up to a 49er game the past couple of years was the least exciting week in NFL land for me. I want to be nervous, anxious and excited again!

Popeyejones wrote:

Marvin49 wrote:

SoulfishHawk wrote:Yeah, that was a hell of a trade for you guys. He looks like the real deal for sure.

Sure hope so. Love what I've seen so far and the hype train is in full gear, but we'll see what happens.

Out of curiosity, and because I'm a pessimist, how would you rank order (from most to least worried) the following four JGQ worries:

1) Inability to work out a long-term deal.
2) Injury (either due to fragility or hot garbage interior line play)
3) Deep passes outside the hashes aren't a small sample size thing, they're a player ability thing, and if true and that gets figured out, overage on middle depth passes within the hashes is going to tighten up more and more.
4) The Favre Effect (i.e. over-trusting of the arm and long-term interception issues)


For me I'd probably go #2, #3, #4, #1.

4, 3, 2, 1.

Marvin49 wrote:

Popeyejones wrote:

Marvin49 wrote:

SoulfishHawk wrote:Yeah, that was a hell of a trade for you guys. He looks like the real deal for sure.

Sure hope so. Love what I've seen so far and the hype train is in full gear, but we'll see what happens.

Out of curiosity, and because I'm a pessimist, how would you rank order (from most to least worried) the following four JGQ worries:

1) Inability to work out a long-term deal.
2) Injury (either due to fragility or hot garbage interior line play)
3) Deep passes outside the hashes aren't a small sample size thing, they're a player ability thing, and if true and that gets figured out, overage on middle depth passes within the hashes is going to tighten up more and more.
4) The Favre Effect (i.e. over-trusting of the arm and long-term interception issues)


For me I'd probably go #2, #3, #4, #1.

4, 3, 2, 1.

Nobody asks me but 2, 3, 4, 1 is pretty close to where I'm at, although after watching the 2017 highlights I bump 3 up to the top spot. Although I could be talked into the notion that who knows what the guy could be with a little better protection. He's already nearly completely negated the need for protection with his quick decisions and underneath passing.

What do you guys think about the YouTube video: "The Film Room Ep. 60: Is Jimmy Garoppolo the Real Deal?"

This guy basically says he's got a stupid quick release, dart accuracy on short passes, and good decision making when he's not Favring out. And that his downfield accuracy can be fixed by correcting some atrocious footwork such as not pivoting lead foot when passing downfield. The one point raised by the reviewer is being puzzled at how a guy who sat behind Brady for years could still have such a crazy footwork flaw, but who knows. Still seems eminently fixable.

I'm pretty interested in Garappolo because you can see a lot of Brady in his short game, and not "really trying hard to see Brady in his short game" but "jeez that is really good decision-making, accuracy, and release". As the reviewer says, if he can bring his downfield accuracy up then that takes "good" - which is where he is now - to "great."

All caveats apply here: sometimes QBs have world-beater first seasons or stretches then get figured out, sometimes they just never match that performance for other reasons, etc. etc.

^^^^^^

I thought the film room ep was great, and far and away the best in-depth breakdown of his game I've seen so far.

His footwork is one of those funny things (that kinda makes sense) in that he's crazily good at throwing off balance, while rolling left or right and while moving backwards to minimize a hit, but then he has problems wit his lower body on the clean throws from clean pockets (not all of them -- it's more inconsistent than consistently problematic).

Overall, yeah though, I think his flaws appear to be fixable (which doesn't mean they WILL be fixed of course), but like you, I'm pretty high on him, while also acknowledging that we just haven't seen that much of him yet (i.e. look at what Nick Foles did in 2013 or Josh Freeman did in 2010 before assuming even a full season of really good play is sustainable in the long term).

Hijack alert, but as we talk about one-hit wonders, I'm interested in your take on the Nick Foles 2018 post-season experience. I see 3 possibilities:

1) He had the game of his life against Minnesota. He's been playing relatively solid ball and hasn't hurt his team too much, but he doesn't have another game like that in him.

2) He is having the post-season of his life, ala Joe Flacco. He may have another surprisingly good game v the Pats, but he'll be the same backup-level player next season he has been the last few years.

3) He has turned the corner and we can now expect 300 yard performances against elite defenses.

I'm in camp 1, but that one great first season he had gives me just a touch of doubt. I do realize that first season his breakout was of a much different flavor i.e. he was in a Chip Kelly offense, and that doesn't necessarily say much about playing in a non-Chip-Kelly offense.

hawk45 wrote:Hijack alert, but as we talk about one-hit wonders, I'm interested in your take on the Nick Foles 2018 post-season experience. I see 3 possibilities:

1) He had the game of his life against Minnesota. He's been playing relatively solid ball and hasn't hurt his team too much, but he doesn't have another game like that in him.

2) He is having the post-season of his life, ala Joe Flacco. He may have another surprisingly good game v the Pats, but he'll be the same backup-level player next season he has been the last few years.

3) He has turned the corner and we can now expect 300 yard performances against elite defenses.

I'm in camp 1, but that one great first season he had gives me just a touch of doubt. I do realize that first season his breakout was of a much different flavor i.e. he was in a Chip Kelly offense, and that doesn't necessarily say much about playing in a non-Chip-Kelly offense.

The fact is he went to the QB graveyard after the Eagles, Fisher is a QB killer, he may just be in a offense with a coach that adapts and calls plays that fit his skill set much like Shurmer did in Minnesota with Bradford and Keenum, it's where many OC's get to much credit when they get a players or players that fit the system rather then adapt the system to fit a player. Why so many go someplace else and fail. You could make that argument for Bevell, had Peterson and then Lynch along with Farve and then Wilson, lose a piece of that equation and all of a sudden it isn't pretty anymore.

Solid point, Chris.

hawk45 wrote:Hijack alert, but as we talk about one-hit wonders, I'm interested in your take on the Nick Foles 2018 post-season experience. I see 3 possibilities:

1) He had the game of his life against Minnesota. He's been playing relatively solid ball and hasn't hurt his team too much, but he doesn't have another game like that in him.

2) He is having the post-season of his life, ala Joe Flacco. He may have another surprisingly good game v the Pats, but he'll be the same backup-level player next season he has been the last few years.

3) He has turned the corner and we can now expect 300 yard performances against elite defenses.

I'm in camp 1, but that one great first season he had gives me just a touch of doubt. I do realize that first season his breakout was of a much different flavor i.e. he was in a Chip Kelly offense, and that doesn't necessarily say much about playing in a non-Chip-Kelly offense.

I’m going #1.

That Chip Kelly season I mostly discount just because it was Kelly’s first year in the league, and it was really nuts that year to watch how unprepared the NFL was for his offense.That a year and some change later he was basically an add on for both sides in the Bradford trade tells us how anomalous even Kelly thought his ‘13 was.

I don’t think he’s awful or anything, but in the long run I think his ceiling is as a premium backup who might get lucky and get a chance to be the guy on a bad team with a rookie in the wings (think Glennon with the Bears this year). His floor is an average enough backup QB, which still isn’t that bad (think 3-4 APY as a #2 vs. 6-8 APY as a #2).