WR Riley Cooper gets $25 mil / 5 years: Golden Tate impact?

Missing_Clink

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$10 mil guaranteed, apparently with some contract escalators that can take the total up to $25 million. Seems like this contract is very similar to what Tate could be worth.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/20 ... ix-months/

2013 stats:
Cooper: 47 for 835 yds (17.8 ypc), 8 TDs
Tate: 64 for 898 yds (14.0 ypc), 5 TDs

Cooper is the clear #2 in Philly behind DeSean Jackson (who makes over $10 mil per season). Tate is the #2 guy in Seattle behind a healthy Harvin.

I think most of us would be ok with Tate signing a deal like this. I'd hope it wouldn't be any more that this, but if this is the market value for a quality #2 WR, so be it.
 

BHF

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Great news for the Hawks. Hopefully JS can negotiate a similar deal with less salary, but more SB to spread out the cap hit.
 

-The Glove-

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I'm down with this...about what I thought Tate would be getting
 

Popeyejones

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That's really overpaying for Reilly, IMO. He was a mediocre player in a high tempo, pass first offense who had an unrepeatable number of flukey big plays, and all three of these things over-inflated his stats to being very average.

Tate has much better hands, is a better route runner, is a good downfield blocker, is MUCH better after the catch and is also a monster in the return game. He's a vastly superior player, IMO. If that's actually Reilly's true value and the Hawks are able to resign Tate at a similar price, more power to 'em. I'm higher on Tate than most non-Hawks fans, but that would be an absolute steal. Tate is a 5/35 player, IMO. If the 9ers didn't have cap issues to deal with I'd want him on the 9ers at 5/35 without second thought.
 

Laloosh

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Popeyejones":2ywyg99f said:
That's really overpaying for Reilly, IMO. He was a mediocre player in a high tempo, pass first offense who had an unrepeatable number of flukey big plays, and all three of these things over-inflated his stats to being very average.

Tate has much better hands, is a better route runner, is a good downfield blocker, is MUCH better after the catch and is also a monster in the return game. He's a vastly superior player, IMO. If that's actually Reilly's true value and the Hawks are able to resign Tate at a similar price, more power to 'em. I'm higher on Tate than most non-Hawks fans, but that would be an absolute steal. Tate is a 5/35 player, IMO. If the 9ers didn't have cap issues to deal with I'd want him on the 9ers at 5/35 without second thought.

I'd be really sad if I had to watch Tate in a Niner uniform. Then again, he did say he'd rather stay here for a little less than play in some crappy city where they only won a game every few weeks ;)
 

MizzouHawkGal

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Well it looks like we will have no problem resigning Tate. The market is obviously soft probably because of the upcoming draft with it's bumper crop of ridiculously good WR's.
 

Popeyejones

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^^^^ You think this is a sign of the market being soft? I thought Cooper would probably end up at something like this if he attracted serious attention on the market, not be given a contract like this before the market even opens. Agreed that this years incoming WRs probably helps a bit, but Cooper just made more than I think many thinks he's worth before the market even started, and he's now one less receiver on the market (meaning the value of the others rise).
 

RolandDeschain

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I completely agree with Popeye, the freaking moronic Eagles just made it harder for us to keep Tate on the cheap, and Tate was better in virtually every stat this year.

Riley: 58.0% catch rate, 1002 snaps, 835 yards, 17.8 YPC, 8 TDs, 242 yards after the catch, 5.1 yards after the catch per reception, 4 dropped passes, 4 missed tackles

Tate: 68.8% catch rate, 790 snaps, 898 yards, 14.0 YPC, 5 TDs, 506 yards after the catch, 7.9 yards after the catch per reception, 3 dropped passes, 21 missed tackles

Damnit, Philly.
 

Popeyejones

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^^^ Yeah, really the only way to positively spin this I think is that it's a signal that the Eagles might be dumb enough to think they're good at WR. If I were the Eagles org I'd be all over Tate. He'd be a monster on that squad and would also add some much needed toughness over there. If the Eagles resigning Reilly means they won't be in the market for Tate, I guess that's a good thing. Overall though Reilly getting 5/25 before FA starts is definitely a bad sign though, IMO. This is also colored through the lens of not knowing if NFL teams like Tate as a player much as I do.
 

SeahawksFanForever

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RolandDeschain":3nm2y06v said:
I completely agree with Popeye, the freaking moronic Eagles just made it harder for us to keep Tate on the cheap, and Tate was better in virtually every stat this year.

Riley: 58.0% catch rate, 1002 snaps, 835 yards, 17.8 YPC, 8 TDs, 242 yards after the catch, 5.1 yards after the catch per reception, 4 dropped passes, 4 missed tackles

Tate: 68.8% catch rate, 790 snaps, 898 yards, 14.0 YPC, 5 TDs, 506 yards after the catch, 7.9 yards after the catch per reception, 3 dropped passes, 21 missed tackles

Damnit, Philly.

Don't forget special teams. He's a very good punt returner. I am not sure if Cooper player special teams other than maybe kickoff/punt coverage.
 

RolandDeschain

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If Racist Riley is worth $5m/year, then Golden Tate is worth $8m/year; and as much as I love Tate, he is not worth that...Except comparatively, to this stupid contract for Riley.

Sigh.
 

DavidSeven

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I don't see how this changes Golden's value. Yes, I think Riley is overrated, but that's not really the perception around the league. He had similar production to Golden and is more prototypical in size/build. Golden was never signing for less than $5-6M anyway, and that's still his market value. I've said from the beginning that his closest comps are Amendola and Hartline. Both make a hair under $6M/yr. Cooper is considered to be in a similar tier -- legit WR#2 (but not elite). I'm not surprised by this contract at all, and it ain't pushing Golden's deal above $6M.
 

Popeyejones

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Amendola isn't even in the same ballpark as Tate, and Hartline signed an extension w/ the Dolphins for 5/31. It was similar to Meachem's 5/32 deal with the Chargers that he got as a FA. The ballpark for low-end #2s is 5/25 - 5/32. Tate is a high-end #2 with upside due to being one of the best punt returners in the league. I have to imagine that GMs are actually watching him play and recognize that his 900 receiving yards and 5 tds are partially a reflection of the Hawks throwing the ball less than practically anyone else in the league.

We can think about it this way: If you were John Schneider and the contracts were the same would you be seriously on the fence about trading Tate straight up for Meachem, Amendola, or Hartline? If not, you need some other comparables.
 

Smelly McUgly

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Popeyejones":3oaq8gdy said:
That's really overpaying for Reilly, IMO. He was a mediocre player in a high tempo, pass first offense who had an unrepeatable number of flukey big plays, and all three of these things over-inflated his stats to being very average.

This is pretty much it. Watched ten Eagles games in condensed form/some All-22 form over Rewind and about maybe twelve Eagles games overall, and Cooper was often schemed open and has iffy hands. He's not particularly fast, not particularly physical...it's an overpay for someone of his caliber.
 

DavidSeven

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Popeyejones":3v0g7po6 said:
Amendola isn't even in the same ballpark as Tate, and Hartline signed an extension w/ the Dolphins for 5/31. It was similar to Meachem's 5/32 deal with the Chargers that he got as a FA. The ballpark for low-end #2s is 5/25 - 5/32. Tate is a high-end #2 with upside due to being one of the best punt returners in the league. I have to imagine that GMs are actually watching him play and recognize that his 900 receiving yards and 5 tds are partially a reflection of the Hawks throwing the ball less than practically anyone else in the league.

We can think about it this way: If you were John Schneider and the contracts were the same would you be seriously on the fence about trading Tate straight up for Meachem, Amendola, or Hartline? If not, you need some other comparables.

And who are your comparables? Please check here and tell me if Tate is closer to Hartline/Amendola or the names above him on that list. Amendola isn't close to Tate? In his last season with St. Louis, he averaged 60.5 yards/game. Tate just averaged 56.13 yards/game in 2013. Additionally, while it's true that SEA doesn't pass a lot, Golden saw more targets than usual because he was vaulted into the #1 WR role due to injuries. He was targeted 15 more times than Cooper last year.

I know you'd love to see SEA break the bank on Tate, but it ain't happening.

Davis Hsu ‏@DavisHsuSeattle 1h
Cooper at 5/25 pretty much confirms my thought on Tate being 5/30, and perhaps he is only 5/25
 

SonicHawk

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Why did the Eagles overpay for someone they could have gotten for cheap?

What team wants that awful PR move? Overpaid. Stupid. Eagles suck.
 

cacksman

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I would be all over signing Tate for 7 a year if I managing a team with a WR need and decent cap space.

I really hope Seattle can work out a deal for 5.5-6m. Tate is a very good WR, but it's going to be hard to keep Tate, Baldwin, Harvin, and draft a big WR.
 

Marvin49

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E.C. Laloosh":3jj6g5f2 said:
Popeyejones":3jj6g5f2 said:
That's really overpaying for Reilly, IMO. He was a mediocre player in a high tempo, pass first offense who had an unrepeatable number of flukey big plays, and all three of these things over-inflated his stats to being very average.

Tate has much better hands, is a better route runner, is a good downfield blocker, is MUCH better after the catch and is also a monster in the return game. He's a vastly superior player, IMO. If that's actually Reilly's true value and the Hawks are able to resign Tate at a similar price, more power to 'em. I'm higher on Tate than most non-Hawks fans, but that would be an absolute steal. Tate is a 5/35 player, IMO. If the 9ers didn't have cap issues to deal with I'd want him on the 9ers at 5/35 without second thought.

I'd be really sad if I had to watch Tate in a Niner uniform. Then again, he did say he'd rather stay here for a little less than play in some crappy city where they only won a game every few weeks ;)

You don't have to worry about it. As much as I respect him he's not what they need. They have Crab and Boldin and even Patton with semi-similar skillsets. They either need a true vertical threat who can stretch the field and create space or a guy with size to be a RZ threat. Golden is a better player than he gets credit for, he's just not the style of WR the Niners need to add.
 

Popeyejones

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DavidSeven":2mg9luug said:
I know you'd love to see SEA break the bank on Tate, but it ain't happening.

:lol:

It's not a conspiracy. I've posted about how much I like Tate repeatedly since I started posting here.

And nice job of punting on my question. If you'd trade Tate straight up for Meachem, Amendola, or Hartline, by all means, just say so, man. If not, you're just wolfing.

As for your link, even though you won't answer my question, I'll still answer yours. As a FA I'd prefer Tate to easily 50% of the guys in the 7-9 million salary range.

That's Steve Johnson, Mike Williams, Colston, Steve Smith, Sidney Rice, Antonio Brown, Anquan Boldin, Santonio Homes, Pierre Garcon, Victor Cruz, Roddy White, Greg Jennings, and Miles Austin.

With age and injury involved the only folks in that group I'd definitely put Tate above on a new contract would be Cruz and then maybe Brown and Garcon. The rest is debatable at best for me. It's precisely why I said if the 9ers had the cap room I'd hope they sign Tate for 5/35 in a heartbeat. That's between Brian Hartline and Steve Johnson money. He's DEFINITELY worth that to me. Maybe not to you.

If you think his peers are guys like Nate Burleson, Riley Cooper and Lance Moore more power to you.
 

RolandDeschain

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The more I think about this signing, the more it pisses me off. Go to hell, Philly. Seriously. This could possibly result in either Tate or Bennett walking.
 
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