M's Off season, 2017-2018

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Bobblehead

Bobblehead

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You know, there is another way to go about this..Instead of a 6 man rotation, you limit your starters to 2 times through the rotation.. the at bats of opposing hitters.

Just thinking cause, unless your a very good pitcher, the 3rd time through the rotation, the pitchers seem to get shelled. So just let them go twice and bring in your relievers, that should not only cut down the innings, but help keep you out of the troublesome 3rd time through the rotation as well. Of course, you will need a lot of reliever, perhaps we can go with a 4 man rotation and have lots of relievers. :)
 

Uncle Si

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Bobblehead":1t6tkzcn said:
You know, there is another way to go about this..Instead of a 6 man rotation, you limit your starters to 2 times through the rotation.. the at bats of opposing hitters.

Just thinking cause, unless your a very good pitcher, the 3rd time through the rotation, the pitchers seem to get shelled. So just let them go twice and bring in your relievers, that should not only cut down the innings, but help keep you out of the troublesome 3rd time through the rotation as well. Of course, you will need a lot of reliever, perhaps we can go with a 4 man rotation and have lots of relievers. :)

That seems to be the plan given how they are loading up on relievers
 

IndyHawk

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I do agree that a pitcher that is average or below usually will get rocked the third time around.
I recall Tampa Bay's ex manager one year using a reliever's a lot after 3-4 innings and they still had a winning record.
I think Price was one of the reliever's ..
 

Shanegotyou11

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Sports Hernia":1u85xrh7 said:
Shanegotyou11":1u85xrh7 said:
Yes I believe David cone in game 5 vs our M's, cone was at 148 pitches.

The M's need another solid starting pitcher IMO.
Cone pretty much blew his arm out in that game too.


Yep. Damn what a pitcher tho.
 

massari

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Dipoto feels James Paxton, Felix Hernandez. Mike Leake and Erasmo Ramirez are a solid top four, with Ariel Miranda, Marco Gonzales and Andrew Moore competing for the fifth spot. https://amp.mlb.com/263550952-mariners- ... ssion=true

The rotation is no better than last season and WHEN Paxton and Felix (what's left of him) end up on the DL, their #1 will be Leake or Erasmo Ramirez.

The Cleveland Browns of baseball.
 

Sports Hernia

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Shanegotyou11":3jwct2xa said:
Sports Hernia":3jwct2xa said:
Shanegotyou11":3jwct2xa said:
Yes I believe David cone in game 5 vs our M's, cone was at 148 pitches.

The M's need another solid starting pitcher IMO.
Cone pretty much blew his arm out in that game too.


Yep. Damn what a pitcher tho.
Yep, dude was a warrior.
 

sutz

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Bobblehead":3k4dnt2i said:
You know, there is another way to go about this..Instead of a 6 man rotation, you limit your starters to 2 times through the rotation.. the at bats of opposing hitters.

Just thinking cause, unless your a very good pitcher, the 3rd time through the rotation, the pitchers seem to get shelled. So just let them go twice and bring in your relievers, that should not only cut down the innings, but help keep you out of the troublesome 3rd time through the rotation as well. Of course, you will need a lot of reliever, perhaps we can go with a 4 man rotation and have lots of relievers. :)
Sure, works great...until your starter goes through the rotation (batting order, actually) twice by the 3rd inning. If that happens too much, we'd need a 12 man bullpen, and would only have 8 position players on the roster. ;)
 
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Bobblehead

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sutz":2cci9kmu said:
Bobblehead":2cci9kmu said:
You know, there is another way to go about this..Instead of a 6 man rotation, you limit your starters to 2 times through the rotation.. the at bats of opposing hitters.

Just thinking cause, unless your a very good pitcher, the 3rd time through the rotation, the pitchers seem to get shelled. So just let them go twice and bring in your relievers, that should not only cut down the innings, but help keep you out of the troublesome 3rd time through the rotation as well. Of course, you will need a lot of reliever, perhaps we can go with a 4 man rotation and have lots of relievers. :)
Sure, works great...until your starter goes through the rotation (batting order, actually) twice by the 3rd inning. If that happens too much, we'd need a 12 man bullpen, and would only have 8 position players on the roster. ;)

Thats why it was so important to get that Japanese fella. :)
 
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Bobblehead

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sutz":3vxi7gvv said:
Hawkscanner":3vxi7gvv said:
Bobblehead":3vxi7gvv said:
There's been some talk about a 6 man rotation, what do you all think of that?

I"m just concerned that if that happens, and you don't have good starters, won't your bullpen be shy since, you need another starter?

Honestly, I'd say that baseball (as a whole) has been moving in that direction for some time now. It's just that it's taken a long time for a lot of baseball purists (I would lump myself in that category) to get on board with that idea.

Seriously though, take a look at the pitching landscape in baseball. How many guys threw complete games last year? How about the last few years? How many guys are honestly even going 7 or 8 innings consistently anymore? Even the ones who DO get up into the 7th and 8th inning -- just how effective are they (in general) at that point?

We are seeing pitchers throwing harder than ever ... and they are basically done after 90-100 pitches (at best) anymore. For me as a long time MLB fan (and a fan of the Mariners), there's a part of me that just flat out makes me sick. Seriously, I remember well the days of Nolan Ryan ... and Randy Johnson (when he was with the M's) regularly being up in that 120-130 pitch range ... and going into the 8th and 9 innings with regularity. You just expected that.

That's not the case anymore in baseball at all. You are seeing a lot of move towards specialization in pitching. MLB clubs are looking for that hard throwing middle relief guy you can bring in in the 6th or 7th inning that can get you to the 8th or your closer in the 9th. Many clubs are really beefing up their bullpen (ergo, which is why you're seeing JeDi do the exact same thing over the course of these last few days).

Things are changing ... and I guess I'd just say that the Mariners are pioneering (leading the charge) towards what we are going to eventually be seeing throughout baseball. I expect 6 man rotations to become fairly commonplace in the next 5 years or so.

And it makes sense -- especially from what we saw from this M's team last year, it makes definite sense. Some day, if someone ever asks you, "What does it look like when a club has great offense, but no pitching?" -- you can honestly say -- "See the 2017 Seattle Mariners." They are the quintessential textbook example of what happens when your pitching goes awry. We'll see if it works. If the powers that be honestly think it might help, I'm game for virtually any kind of innovative idea at this point. With the status of the division and how it looks to be shaping up once again, it certainly can't hurt. Yeah, sure. Why not?
I mentioned this last year, specifically with Felix. I was thinking I would be fine if he took every 3rd or 4th start off to rest, especially since he basically wasted about a month of his MLB season pitching in the WBC. Don't have to worry about that this year, I guess, but last season he ended up not pitching enough to worry if he was in a 4, 5, or 6 man rotation. It looks very much like he won't be available for much more than 20 starts anyway this year. Problem, of course, is if you expand to 6 starters, you have the risk of having 4 or 5 "back end" starters that could barely give you 6 innings of competitive play.


I don't know, there is so many variables to think about.

I just don't like the idea of diluting the starters even more so, gads.
I"d like to see us have 2 closers.. 1 closer for the end of the game a 2nd closer, not for game end, but more a "rally" killer, who can come in during the middle of the game and stop the rally, when the opposition has put together several hits and are on verge of getting the go ahead run home. I don't know why clubs haven't implemented something like that. There is always it seems at one point where the oppo will string together several hits.

Just a thought.
 

Uncle Si

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massari":1tanxkgd said:
Dipoto feels James Paxton, Felix Hernandez. Mike Leake and Erasmo Ramirez are a solid top four, with Ariel Miranda, Marco Gonzales and Andrew Moore competing for the fifth spot. https://amp.mlb.com/263550952-mariners- ... ssion=true

The rotation is no better than last season and WHEN Paxton and Felix (what's left of him) end up on the DL, their #1 will be Leake or Erasmo Ramirez.

The Cleveland Browns of baseball.

0-162? That would be something.

They will go in for one of the 2nd tier free agent pitchers and shove one (if it two) of the current back end guys to the bull pen
 

Sports Hernia

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KitsapGuy":2bel00k3 said:
[tweet]https://twitter.com/RyanDivish/status/951927743628783616[/tweet]
20th round pick that hits for average, with very little pop. Never heard of him before today.
Looks like the performance enhancing drugs failed him.
 

sutz

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https://www.seattletimes.com/sports/mar ... ke-zunino/

Mariners avoid arbitration with five eligible players, including James Paxton and Mike Zunino

The Mariners avoided arbitration hearings for their five remaining eligible players this offseason prior to Friday’s 10 a.m. deadline. Pitchers James Paxton, David Phelps, Nick Vincent and Erasmo Ramirez and catcher Mike Zunino all agreed to one-year contracts. Per club policy, the team did not disclose the contract figures.

However reports and sources have leaked some of the contract information.

Sources said that Paxton, who is in his second year of arbitration eligibility, will receive $4.9 million in 2018, an expected bump up from the $2.35 million he made in 2017. The big lefty posted a 12-5 record with a 2.98 ERA in 24 starts and was named the Mariners’ Pitcher of the Year by Seattle chapter of Baseball Writers Association of America. He set career bests in wins (12), starts (24), innings (136), strikeouts (156) and ERA (2.98), despite going the disabled list twice for a strained forearm in May and a strained pectoral muscle in August.
 

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It's crazy that pitchers and catchers report in less than a month! I'm pumped! I know the current rotation is leaving a lot to be desired, but I have high hopes for this year.
 

sutz

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Thepeelsessions":1rpvyu34 said:
It's crazy that pitchers and catchers report in less than a month! I'm pumped! I know the current rotation is leaving a lot to be desired, but I have high hopes for this year.
The off season isn't over yet. ;) Maybe, with no WBC, our pitchers will come in fresh and able to work up to being in the starting rotation without pitching competitively prior to the season. Perhaps the injury bug will be less harsh this year.
 

Thepeelsessions

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sutz":2455lw6a said:
Thepeelsessions":2455lw6a said:
It's crazy that pitchers and catchers report in less than a month! I'm pumped! I know the current rotation is leaving a lot to be desired, but I have high hopes for this year.
The off season isn't over yet. ;) Maybe, with no WBC, our pitchers will come in fresh and able to work up to being in the starting rotation without pitching competitively prior to the season. Perhaps the injury bug will be less harsh this year.
Great point! Let's hope so. I just can't get over the Smyly ordeal. I still think DiPoto should've signed him. The Cubs got him on a decent contract. Coming off TJ injury is a big deal, but he's worth the risk of a small contract, IMO. I mean come on! He was their prized acquisition last off-season.
 
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Bobblehead

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Thepeelsessions":cmsizs0q said:
It's crazy that pitchers and catchers report in less than a month! I'm pumped! I know the current rotation is leaving a lot to be desired, but I have high hopes for this year.

I feel the same way, yet, I look at what some other teams are doing and it just boggles my mind that they can afford these players. I know, we gotta see it on the field but, still. We really haven't done a bloody thing with our rotation.
 
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