Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?

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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Thu Feb 28, 2013 4:27 pm
  • If Gonzaga bails out before the Final Four, the bolded might be way. I had thought Few made an Elite Eight on one of the cinderella runs, but I was wrong. Only 1 team that's been a 1 seed has made a Final Four with a snake bit coach, and that was Texas in 2003. Few would need to break out in a big way this year.



    I too thought they would make the fast eight that year. Not that I liked it but it looked like their big chance. As I recall it was their rebounding that killed them that game. Now watch someone have a cow for me saying that.

    As I mentioned to Sar via PM its not as much fun poking youse guys about Gonzaga cause its to easy.

    :lol:
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Mon Mar 04, 2013 1:02 pm
  • It's official, they're number one in the polls:
    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-03-0 ... -time.html

    Sadly I think their guard play isn't good enough to get them past the Sweet 16. The tourney is often about guard play and they have quite average guards IMO. Do hope I'm wrong and they make that first ever Final Foiur appearance.
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Mon Mar 04, 2013 1:43 pm
  • Good for them that they made the ranking but you will never convince me they have better team/players than the Indianas, Dukes, and all the others in the top 10.

    This just insures they get a cupcake in the first round.

    :les:
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Mon Mar 04, 2013 4:23 pm
  • I approve this thread.
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Mon Mar 04, 2013 6:15 pm
  • The Radish wrote:Good for them that they made the ranking but you will never convince me they have better team/players than the Indianas, Dukes, and all the others in the top 10.

    This just insures they get a cupcake in the first round.

    :les:

    Pretty easy(and lazy) to sit back and predict an eventual loss in the tourney for any team seeing as only one team won't end with a loss and only 52% of number one seeds actually make the final four. No clear cut dominant team this year but a lot of good ones. I have no doubt you will never be convinced they have better players and or team even if they won the whole thing though. Some people are very determined to believe what they want. Fact is GU is a top 5 team this year and they have shown it on the court.
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Mon Mar 04, 2013 6:39 pm
  • Natethegreat wrote:
    The Radish wrote:Good for them that they made the ranking but you will never convince me they have better team/players than the Indianas, Dukes, and all the others in the top 10.

    This just insures they get a cupcake in the first round.

    :les:

    Pretty easy(and lazy) to sit back and predict an eventual loss in the tourney for any team seeing as only one team won't end with a loss and only 52% of number one seeds actually make the final four. No clear cut dominant team this year but a lot of good ones. I have no doubt you will never be convinced they have better players and or team even if they won the whole thing though. Some people are very determined to believe what they want. Fact is GU is a top 5 team this year and they have shown it on the court.


    Gee, doesn't this describe your post exactly?

    What do you care? This is a place of opinions and you seem to think yours is more important than mine. Is that about right?

    You have the right to think and say what you want here. But that right is only predicated on the idea that you have to accept what others think and say too.

    Just because you don't agree with my opinion does not make me wrong nor you right, just different.

    Please take it that way and try to not have such a cow over a silly college game that means nothing in the game of life. Its merely entertainment and nothing else. Bob Knight figured that out years ago and look how well he did. And that was in a REAL league with very good teams in it so they had to play championship type teams sometimes twice a week.

    All this excitement about winning every game in their weeny conference. Talk to me about UCLA winning 50 games in a row! Talk to me about Indiana going completely undefeated for an entire season! Talk to me about the hated UCLA winning more National Championships than the the Zags have played in. They have a wonderful 10-12 year record and have what appears to me a very good coach. But he/they will have to prove it in a real league where there are challanges every week, not 2-3 times a season. Do you think they could have gone undefeated in the SEC, or Big 10? See I don't. I think they have trouble making the show under those circumstances. And honestly I think if you looked hard you would too.

    But I'll allow you to be a big Zags fan. I ask you allow me not to be and not act like its a crime against God.



    So yes I have a lot of trouble with people ranking this team #1 in the country, seems outragous to me. But I did already say how great it is for them to get that ranking.

    :roll:
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Mon Mar 04, 2013 6:51 pm
  • Quite an accomplishment for a tiny school from Spokane
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Mon Mar 04, 2013 6:55 pm
  • The Radish wrote:
    Natethegreat wrote:
    The Radish wrote:Good for them that they made the ranking but you will never convince me they have better team/players than the Indianas, Dukes, and all the others in the top 10.

    This just insures they get a cupcake in the first round.

    :les:

    Pretty easy(and lazy) to sit back and predict an eventual loss in the tourney for any team seeing as only one team won't end with a loss and only 52% of number one seeds actually make the final four. No clear cut dominant team this year but a lot of good ones. I have no doubt you will never be convinced they have better players and or team even if they won the whole thing though. Some people are very determined to believe what they want. Fact is GU is a top 5 team this year and they have shown it on the court.


    Gee, doesn't this describe your post exactly?

    What do you care? This is a place of opinions and you seem to think yours is more important than mine. Is that about right?

    You have the right to think and say what you want here. But that right is only predicated on the idea that you have to accept what others think and say too.

    Just because you don't agree with my opinion does not make me wrong nor you right, just different.

    Please take it that way and try to not have such a cow over a silly college game that means nothing in the game of life. Its merely entertainment and nothing else. Bob Knight figured that out years ago and look how well he did. And that was in a REAL league with very good teams in it so they had to play championship type teams sometimes twice a week.

    All this excitement about winning every game in their weeny conference. Talk to me about UCLA winning 50 games in a row! Talk to me about Indiana going completely undefeated for an entire season! Talk to me about the hated UCLA winning more National Championships than the the Zags have played in. They have a wonderful 10-12 year record and have what appears to me a very good coach. But he/they will have to prove it in a real league where there are challanges every week, not 2-3 times a season. Do you think they could have gone undefeated in the SEC, or Big 10? See I don't. I think they have trouble making the show under those circumstances. And honestly I think if you looked hard you would too.

    But I'll allow you to be a big Zags fan. I ask you allow me not to be and not act like its a crime against God.



    So yes I have a lot of trouble with people ranking this team #1 in the country, seems outragous to me. But I did already say how great it is for them to get that ranking.

    :roll:

    LOl wow someone a little touchy today ehh? Overeact much? By the way the thread is about this years top teams not teams from decades ago and this year the Zags are a top 5 team even most ardent BCS lovers admit that. Clearly this topic touches a nerve with you for whatever reason.
    You asked if I thought the Zags would go undefeated and the answer is no but neither did Indiana or Duke. Your statement that they would have trouble making the tourney is pretty laughable though. Especially considering they played 5 Big 12 teams(top teams not bottom dwellers) and won all of them.
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Mon Mar 04, 2013 9:26 pm
  • hawksfansinceday1 wrote:It's official, they're number one in the polls:
    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-03-0 ... -time.html

    Sadly I think their guard play isn't good enough to get them past the Sweet 16. The tourney is often about guard play and they have quite average guards IMO. Do hope I'm wrong and they make that first ever Final Foiur appearance.


    This. I can't stress this enough - they just don't have the look of a team that will go deep in the tournament this year. So far, I've watched them 3 times, the OkSU game, one I forget now and the most recent Santa Clara game. They deserve to be ranked #1 right now, but I'll be fairly shocked if they make it past the sweet 16.
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Wed Mar 06, 2013 8:31 am
  • peachesenregalia wrote:
    hawksfansinceday1 wrote:It's official, they're number one in the polls:
    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-03-0 ... -time.html

    Sadly I think their guard play isn't good enough to get them past the Sweet 16. The tourney is often about guard play and they have quite average guards IMO. Do hope I'm wrong and they make that first ever Final Foiur appearance.


    This. I can't stress this enough - they just don't have the look of a team that will go deep in the tournament this year. So far, I've watched them 3 times, the OkSU game, one I forget now and the most recent Santa Clara game. They deserve to be ranked #1 right now, but I'll be fairly shocked if they make it past the sweet 16.


    At this point, I think we're going to be shocked at who *IS* actually in the sweet sixteen. Gonzaga might be the only team that's had consistent success.
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Wed Mar 06, 2013 11:01 am
  • Sarlacc83 wrote:
    peachesenregalia wrote:
    hawksfansinceday1 wrote:It's official, they're number one in the polls:
    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-03-0 ... -time.html

    Sadly I think their guard play isn't good enough to get them past the Sweet 16. The tourney is often about guard play and they have quite average guards IMO. Do hope I'm wrong and they make that first ever Final Foiur appearance.


    This. I can't stress this enough - they just don't have the look of a team that will go deep in the tournament this year. So far, I've watched them 3 times, the OkSU game, one I forget now and the most recent Santa Clara game. They deserve to be ranked #1 right now, but I'll be fairly shocked if they make it past the sweet 16.


    At this point, I think we're going to be shocked at who *IS* actually in the sweet sixteen. Gonzaga might be the only team that's had consistent success.


    the issue with their "consistent" success is that it comes against a notably weak schedule. Should they apologize for that? Absolutely not? And do they deserve to be #1 in the nation? Yep.

    But Zags fans cant get defensive when the rest of the nation isnt buying the hype as them being an elite 8 team. The teams that have been ranked #1 have subsequently gone up against other top 10 teams almost immediately. Gonzaga doesnt have the problem/luxury.

    Now, I think Gonzaga would win the Pac-12. I do. But I also think they will struggle to make it to the Elite 8 and it will end there. Wont be surprised if they make the Final Four (would enjoy it, much like Butler), but they havent really passed any tests to prove that sort of longevity, yet.

    Thats whats interesting... they wont find a test until the tourney. so the question will remain that until they do.
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Wed Mar 06, 2013 11:58 am
  • Uncle Si wrote:
    Sarlacc83 wrote:
    peachesenregalia wrote:
    This. I can't stress this enough - they just don't have the look of a team that will go deep in the tournament this year. So far, I've watched them 3 times, the OkSU game, one I forget now and the most recent Santa Clara game. They deserve to be ranked #1 right now, but I'll be fairly shocked if they make it past the sweet 16.


    At this point, I think we're going to be shocked at who *IS* actually in the sweet sixteen. Gonzaga might be the only team that's had consistent success.


    the issue with their "consistent" success is that it comes against a notably weak schedule. Should they apologize for that? Absolutely not? And do they deserve to be #1 in the nation? Yep.

    But Zags fans cant get defensive when the rest of the nation isnt buying the hype as them being an elite 8 team. The teams that have been ranked #1 have subsequently gone up against other top 10 teams almost immediately. Gonzaga doesnt have the problem/luxury.

    Now, I think Gonzaga would win the Pac-12. I do. But I also think they will struggle to make it to the Elite 8 and it will end there. Wont be surprised if they make the Final Four (would enjoy it, much like Butler), but they havent really passed any tests to prove that sort of longevity, yet.

    Thats whats interesting... they wont find a test until the tourney. so the question will remain that until they do.


    First, I do agree that if Gonzaga was in the Big 10, they'd have more than 2 losses. I still think they'd be competitive with Indiana for the Big 10 title, though.

    Moving on, it might be helpful to reference the numbers concerning my assertions. Here's some good resource on the team of Gonzaga without diving into the asinine notion that their conference makes them a better or worse team. (Memphis wasn't a crap team in 2008 even though they were/are in the Conference USA).

    Gonzaga meets raw efficiency stats of a National Champion(Scroll to the bottom)if not some statistical trends:

    http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketb ... e-favorite

    When compared to teams of years past using Ken Pomeroy rankings, they're right at the historic line of the 'final' 1 (i.e. the team ranked #4 on the 68 team curve.) in terms of its 'strength'.

    http://www.cbssports.com/collegebasketb ... lity-cliff

    What is important is that this might be one of the weakest fields we've seen in an NCAA tournament (yet) which will likely mean lots of upsets. It also means that Gonzaga may not be as tested this year as some might predict because the teams that are closer to the 2011 line are the ones likely to get knocked off in any given round.

    Again, as I mentioned, I don't have a fan's skin in the outcome, since I agree they're unlikely candidates for the Final Four given the fact only one coach who didn't have a previous trip to the Elite Eight has done it, but I think a bow out before the Elite Eight, at least at this snapshot in time, is also unlikely given the level of play Gonzaga has produced and the level of quality it will see in the field. But again, I'll know more when we see those matchups because then I'll have better ideas of the probabilities of each matchup. (I seriously go through the process of handicapping every potential matchup.) If they get unlucky and have a team like Ohio State as the #4 in their region as in the latest ESPN bracketology (link: http://espn.go.com/mens-college-basketball/bracketology), then I could see them losing in the Sweet Sixteen, too.
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Thu Mar 07, 2013 11:02 am
  • Sarlacc83 wrote:..........What is important is that this might be one of the weakest fields we've seen in an NCAA tournament (yet)...........

    And this is the biggest thing that gives me hope that they will make the Final Four. Clearly there are no elite teams this season though now that Duke has Ryan Kelly back they may become that team.



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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Sun Mar 17, 2013 2:55 pm
  • No. 1 seed!! GO ZAGS!! (and go to hell Doug Gottlieb)
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Sun Mar 17, 2013 3:30 pm
  • They're going to have a tough matchup in the sweet 16. Wisconsin will be tough. At least they get a shot a 2 top big-10 teams on the way to the final 4.
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Sun Mar 17, 2013 3:37 pm
  • hawksfansinceday1 wrote:No. 1 seed!! GO ZAGS!! (and go to hell Doug Gottlieb)


    I hate Doug Gottlieb right now............Come'on Zags, make a run!
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Sun Mar 17, 2013 4:49 pm
  • Was that the guy that seemed furious over Gonzaga getting a #1 seed?
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Sun Mar 17, 2013 5:28 pm
  • CurryStopstheRuns wrote:Was that the guy that seemed furious over Gonzaga getting a #1 seed?

    Yep and he went on and on and on and........about it. REALLY hope the Zags get to the Final Four and he chows on raw, shitty tasting crow.




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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Sun Mar 17, 2013 6:58 pm
  • I just like the fact that Gonzaga rarely gets any top 100 players in the nation yet they consistently get to the tournament. They have never made a final four and just one elite eight but to be that consistent with overlooked players or other college transfers is amazing to me.
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Mon Mar 18, 2013 9:58 am
  • I might add that Douchebag Gottlieb stated that the way to beat Gonzaga was "out-physical them". Same EXACT thing he said last year before they went up against West Virginia a team coached by Bob Huggins who's teams are notoriously physical in their approach. Final score: Gonzaga 77, West Vagina 54. How'd that one work out for you Douchebag Gottlieb?

    And now here you are spouting the same tired ol' bullshit again this year. Have you even watched the Zags play the last 2 years or do you just automatically denigrate them cuz you hate them for whatever reason? Let me explain something to you idiot, the way to beat Gonzaga is outplay their guards and hang with them in the paint. Geez, they should pay me the 6 figure salary you pull for being better at analyzing college hoops than you are......well, GU hoops anyway. You sir, are freaking moron!!




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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Mon Mar 18, 2013 1:43 pm
  • What I like about the bullying reference is most people dont understand the depth of the bench. The Zags have far more fouls to give than most of their opponents do. The East coast media can hate all they want. Just win baby!
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Thu Mar 21, 2013 2:27 pm
  • Well they look like shit so far
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Thu Mar 21, 2013 2:32 pm
  • Southern is shooting lights out this half, pretty hard to stop that
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Thu Mar 21, 2013 3:19 pm
  • Credit to Southern. That was a hell of a game. I can't believe they were a 16 seed. I think they could have taken down a 2 or 3 seed easy.
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Thu Mar 21, 2013 3:23 pm
  • They way they were shooting 3's today....wow.......we were very lucky to get by.
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Thu Mar 21, 2013 7:09 pm
  • Yeah, shooting dang near 50% from 3-point range is pretty ridiculous.
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Thu Mar 21, 2013 7:20 pm
  • CurryStopstheRuns wrote:Yeah, shooting dang near 50% from 3-point range is pretty ridiculous.


    And most were heavily contested 3's as well.
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Fri Mar 22, 2013 12:46 pm
  • Sarlacc83 wrote:Credit to Southern. That was a hell of a game. I can't believe they were a 16 seed. I think they could have taken down a 2 or 3 seed easy.

    Agree. I think Zags have a bit of an easier time with Witchita St. though it ain't gonna be a cakewalk either.




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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Sat Mar 23, 2013 1:03 pm
  • I think Gonzaga should be able to win tonight though will be in pretty tough and not the greatest matchup for them. Hopefully got the rust from the long layoff they had out of the way and will be a bit more lively right from the tip.

    Wichita St. seems like a really tough, physical team who really slows it down big time (would fit in the Big 10 well). If the 2 Canucks ball out and run that pick and roll they do so well, efficiently the Zags should be good.
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Sat Mar 23, 2013 6:14 pm
  • If Gonzaga wins this game y'all need to send this officiating crew lots and lots of flowers.
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Sat Mar 23, 2013 7:18 pm

Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Sat Mar 23, 2013 7:22 pm
  • Well, it sure looks like Few has no idea how to coach in the NCAAs. He was gifted an Elite Eight with the losses of both Wisconsin and KSU, and he still couldn't prepare his team properly. He just can't handle the burden of expectation.
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Sat Mar 23, 2013 7:34 pm
  • Sarlacc83 wrote:Well, it sure looks like Few has no idea how to coach in the NCAAs. He was gifted an Elite Eight with the losses of both Wisconsin and KSU, and he still couldn't prepare his team properly. He just can't handle the burden of expectation.


    As a Zag fan Few has costly said and held the view that he would rather have teams shot 3's than give up 2's. The problem with that thought is that the last few years we have been knocked out because of teams killing us from deep. Learn to change Few!!!!
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Sat Mar 23, 2013 7:37 pm
  • Hate to say 'I told you so' (I don't), but I told you so.
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Sat Mar 23, 2013 7:39 pm
  • Sweet!
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Sat Mar 23, 2013 8:33 pm
  • SonicHawk wrote:
    CALIHAWK1 wrote:Over rated but in the system they absolutely should be.


    How do you figure? Just because it's Gonzaga?


    Because they do this every tournament.
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Sun Mar 24, 2013 7:40 am
  • Collossal failure how do you let one of the worst shooting teams in the tourney go off on you like that? It didn't help that Bell was injured but man that was brutal. I feel like I have been kicked in the stomach.
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Sun Mar 24, 2013 9:05 am
  • Blitzer88 wrote:
    Sarlacc83 wrote:Well, it sure looks like Few has no idea how to coach in the NCAAs. He was gifted an Elite Eight with the losses of both Wisconsin and KSU, and he still couldn't prepare his team properly. He just can't handle the burden of expectation.


    As a Zag fan Few has costly said and held the view that he would rather have teams shot 3's than give up 2's. The problem with that thought is that the last few years we have been knocked out because of teams killing us from deep. Learn to change Few!!!!



    I call bullshit on that this year Blitz. Mark Few said they got lazy going out to cover those 3s and got burned by it. And he was right

    The real problem is they were thinking they were #1 ranked/rated Gonzaga in that first game and because of the level of teams they mostly play they almost got burned. Did they learn anything from that? Nooooooooooo. (also pretty hard for them not to be thinking that after the previous weeks emotions)

    Started out again like they were thinking they were #1 ranked/rated Gonzaga they can catch up. Got behind a mile and had to use so much energy not letting them get any further ahead and then catching up they didn't have it at the end. You've all seen teams do that in all levels of play.

    And stop this whining about Few. I can see the ones that are going to blame him are probably the same ones that were screaming at me what a great defense they have. Well where the hell was it?

    I still say they have been way overranked in recent years and people have been ignoring the fact that their league is a cake walk not much above Jr. College level.(Not saying they are, but their league is) Playing 3-4 tough teams a season does not make you ready to face teams that face tough teams every week. I'm not saying they're bad its just a matter of real competition every game.

    I've never subscribed to the storyline anytime that they have a line up that compares with many of the strong east coast/midwest/southern leagues. But many of you were screaming at me how tough they were. Please remember "tough" is a relative term.

    One thing the media said yesterday and in the sports pages today is this will have a back lash on their program as far as ratings are concerned. They won't be so quick to say they are top 10 or better and rated #1 in the tourney.

    Remember 2-3 years ago when they got rated in the lower half of the ladder and got bounced the first game? That's the kind of thing that might happen in the next few seasons. The ratings I mean not necessarily the play.

    And Few? Be damned glad he's the coach there. Not being a fan even I can see what a great job he does and how much money he's turned down to go elsewhere.


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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Sun Mar 24, 2013 1:08 pm
  • Well the almighty Hoosiers almost went down but unlike Wichita they didn't hit 15 threes and still should have won. I'll have to take some kind of solace from this somehow.
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Sun Mar 24, 2013 1:40 pm
  • Maybe next year Gonzaga fans.
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Sun Mar 24, 2013 2:13 pm
  • Hawksfanatik wrote:Maybe next year Gonzaga fans.


    Just like Clipper fans.
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Sun Mar 24, 2013 3:22 pm
  • peachesenregalia wrote:Hate to say 'I told you so' (I don't), but I told you so.


    You also said OSU was legit. It looks like the non-Kansas part of the Big 12 suuuuuuuuucked.
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Sun Mar 24, 2013 3:33 pm
  • Sarlacc83 wrote:
    peachesenregalia wrote:Hate to say 'I told you so' (I don't), but I told you so.


    You also said OSU was legit. It looks like the non-Kansas part of the Big 12 suuuuuuuuucked.


    *sigh* yeah....
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Sun Mar 24, 2013 6:00 pm
  • I'm taking the Zags' loss very hard............... SIGH!
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Tue Mar 26, 2013 9:24 am
  • Zag 2001 Alumni. Been waiting 12 years for anything beyond a sweet sixteen and disappointed each time, hell the two times we were a #1 and #2 seed we didn't even make it to the sweet sixteen in the first place. I honestly still left all my Seahawk banners/posters/pictures up throughout the college basketball season just because I'm so disappointed with the Zags every year. Don't get me wrong, I root for them during games, but I've just stopped expecting them to do well. I had them out of the sweet sixteen in my bracket this year and even then I had a hard time picking them to make it even that far (which they didn't). I don't know what kind of fan this makes me, fair weather? bitter? realistic?
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Re: Gonzaga, new #1 in the nation?
Tue Mar 26, 2013 10:54 am
  • gspin2k1 wrote:Zag 2001 Alumni. Been waiting 12 years for anything beyond a sweet sixteen and disappointed each time, hell the two times we were a #1 and #2 seed we didn't even make it to the sweet sixteen in the first place. I honestly still left all my Seahawk banners/posters/pictures up throughout the college basketball season just because I'm so disappointed with the Zags every year. Don't get me wrong, I root for them during games, but I've just stopped expecting them to do well. I had them out of the sweet sixteen in my bracket this year and even then I had a hard time picking them to make it even that far (which they didn't). I don't know what kind of fan this makes me, fair weather? bitter? realistic?



    More realistic than most Zags fans.

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