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Re: US Mens Soccer
Sun Oct 08, 2017 12:00 pm
  • Pulisic is a prime example of why young players need to take their chances at big clubs in Europe.
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Sun Oct 08, 2017 12:30 pm
  • Uncle Si wrote:Pulisic is a prime example of why young players need to take their chances at big clubs in Europe.



    Seriously if you are 15 and have a pretty good idea that you might be really good at soccer you need to hit up one of the academies in Europe.
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Sun Oct 08, 2017 6:50 pm
  • Not necessarily what I meant. Pulisic benefitted from a father who played and coached in Europe. But there are a number of 17-20 year olds sitting in the seats behind the current roster who should be looking at the difference in Pulisic as developed by Dortmund (and even Wood) and the rest of the roster. It’s worth the risk if you’re really that ambitious .
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Mon Oct 09, 2017 8:50 am
  • Uncle Si wrote:Not necessarily what I meant. Pulisic benefitted from a father who played and coached in Europe. But there are a number of 17-20 year olds sitting in the seats behind the current roster who should be looking at the difference in Pulisic as developed by Dortmund (and even Wood) and the rest of the roster. It’s worth the risk if you’re really that ambitious .



    I mostly agree, but I also see the benefit of super young players like Yedlin and Morris getting their feet wet in MLS for a couple years before going overseas.

    Pulisic is not only mature beyond his years, but his technical skills are unparalleled from a US player at that age. But for some they might need that year or two of not only learning the pro game, but getting to play full time, as opposed to being on the bench, or practice team of Euro clubs.

    It's not a new trend, most of the great US players (Altidore, Dempsey, Howard, etc) played a couple years of MLS before having success overseas. IMO Pulisic is the exception, not the rule................NOW. Hopefully that rule changes as more and more extremely mature, talented and polished US players come up through the youth systems.
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Tue Oct 10, 2017 8:15 am
  • I couldn't agree more, Uncle Si. MLS is getting better and better, but Europe is still lightyears ahead.
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Tue Oct 10, 2017 12:01 pm
  • Sgt. Largent wrote:
    Uncle Si wrote:Not necessarily what I meant. Pulisic benefitted from a father who played and coached in Europe. But there are a number of 17-20 year olds sitting in the seats behind the current roster who should be looking at the difference in Pulisic as developed by Dortmund (and even Wood) and the rest of the roster. It’s worth the risk if you’re really that ambitious .



    I mostly agree, but I also see the benefit of super young players like Yedlin and Morris getting their feet wet in MLS for a couple years before going overseas.

    Pulisic is not only mature beyond his years, but his technical skills are unparalleled from a US player at that age. But for some they might need that year or two of not only learning the pro game, but getting to play full time, as opposed to being on the bench, or practice team of Euro clubs.

    It's not a new trend, most of the great US players (Altidore, Dempsey, Howard, etc) played a couple years of MLS before having success overseas. IMO Pulisic is the exception, not the rule................NOW. Hopefully that rule changes as more and more extremely mature, talented and polished US players come up through the youth systems.



    Everything that you are saying about Pulisic was developed at Dortmund. That's the exception. The difference between the way he plays and an Altidore is not born, but taught. Altidore only knows one purpose, while Pulisic is used to playing with a striker like Aubemayang or Dembele, who know so much more. Dempsey was a self taught tactician, but his movement and understanding of the game from a tactical standpoint was never quite at what Pulisic already sees. Dempsey and Donovan could string together 1-2s and race into the box for a finish or on the dribble. Pulisic is so much more. That goal that Altidore scored from Pulisic's pass is a perfect example. All he had to do was stick a foot in. Pulisic pulled that defense apart with his movements wide, then waited for Altidore to see the lane (he was waiting at the 12 for a cross for what seemed like a minute). Brilliant and incisive pass, tap in. These are goals Dortmund score all the time.

    again, this is developed with the teams they play for. The players in the MLS are not learning more than the game in that league requires (and it's a hard watch these days). Off ball movement is stagnated by aggressively direct tactics and poor technical skills. its more apparent in watching those MLS players with a kid like Pulisic. We hail him here as the "best" at this or that in US Soccer (maybe ever) and yet many of the nations in Europe have multitudes of players like him in how they approach the game.

    If you're 17-20 and on the short list of the USMNT, now is the time to try and find the path that Pulisic has already laid down.
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Tue Oct 10, 2017 1:26 pm
  • Uncle Si wrote:
    Everything that you are saying about Pulisic was developed at Dortmund..


    Not his mental toughness and maturity...........and that's really what it boils down to with a young phenom type player.

    Like I said, Pulisic is wise and mature WELL beyond his years. Would Yedlin have been that mature and ready to compete with the world class players of a big Euro club? Dempsey? Altidore? Hell, those guys still act immature.

    That's my only point. Depends on the maturity level, because in the end that's a a major factor as to whether a player can handle the insane stress and expectations of being in a pressure cooker like the Euro leagues.
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Tue Oct 10, 2017 4:38 pm
  • Bruce Arena needs to be fired as soon as this match is over. Don't even let him on the plane home.
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Tue Oct 10, 2017 5:50 pm
  • US is now eliminated. Big disappointment. I guess now the Sounders don't have to worry about Dempsey and Morris missing any time for USMNT.
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Tue Oct 10, 2017 5:54 pm
  • LMAO! This team is a joke. No heart, no tactics, they deserve to stay home next summer. The only joy I can take from this it this will mean we totally blow up the USMNT. #DavidWagner4USMNT
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Tue Oct 10, 2017 6:06 pm
  • The funniest part is, it was a Sounder that eliminated the US. Roman will probably get booed at their next game.
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Tue Oct 10, 2017 7:04 pm
  • SeatownJay wrote:The funniest part is, it was a Sounder that eliminated the US. Roman will probably get booed at their next game.


    Lol give me a break. He won’t be booed for making a great play for his country
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Tue Oct 10, 2017 7:06 pm
  • therealjohncarlson wrote:
    SeatownJay wrote:The funniest part is, it was a Sounder that eliminated the US. Roman will probably get booed at their next game.


    Lol give me a break. He won’t be booed for making a great play for his country

    Relax, I was being facetious.
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Tue Oct 10, 2017 7:22 pm
  • SeatownJay wrote:
    therealjohncarlson wrote:
    SeatownJay wrote:The funniest part is, it was a Sounder that eliminated the US. Roman will probably get booed at their next game.


    Lol give me a break. He won’t be booed for making a great play for his country

    Relax, I was being facetious.


    I’m on edge ok? For me World Cup is most exciting sporting event minus a Hawks super bowl
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Tue Oct 10, 2017 7:41 pm
  • Sgt. Largent wrote:
    Uncle Si wrote:
    Everything that you are saying about Pulisic was developed at Dortmund..


    Not his mental toughness and maturity...........and that's really what it boils down to with a young phenom type player.

    Like I said, Pulisic is wise and mature WELL beyond his years. Would Yedlin have been that mature and ready to compete with the world class players of a big Euro club? Dempsey? Altidore? Hell, those guys still act immature.

    That's my only point. Depends on the maturity level, because in the end that's a a major factor as to whether a player can handle the insane stress and expectations of being in a pressure cooker like the Euro leagues.


    Toughness and maturity is taught. It’s absurd to think it’s not. This team was just knocked out of the Workd cup because it’s full of players who were never taught how to challenge themselves to the degree their best players.

    Let’s hipe this the final nail in that antiquated notion that a mediocre league enabling mediocre, listless and soft willed players will still lead to Workd cups.

    The whole thing needs a change. Saying it on here for years.
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Tue Oct 10, 2017 11:31 pm
  • I'm more shocked than devastated. I didn't think it would ever get to this point given just how easy it is to qualify in concacaf, but the program has been tracking in this direction for years.

    It's really crappy to miss a world cup, but I'm not gonna miss watching this crap sandwich. Michael Bradley, Altidore, Howard, etc. just a bunch of soft has beens who haven't been challenged for years. Michael Bradley is horrible and for whatever reason is completely shielded from criticism. I love clint but he has no business on an international pitch anymore.

    Crappy brand of soccer, started under klinsmann, worsened under arena.

    Just awful
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Wed Oct 11, 2017 2:54 am
  • therealjohncarlson wrote:
    SeatownJay wrote:
    therealjohncarlson wrote:
    SeatownJay wrote:The funniest part is, it was a Sounder that eliminated the US. Roman will probably get booed at their next game.


    Lol give me a break. He won’t be booed for making a great play for his country

    Relax, I was being facetious.


    I’m on edge ok? For me World Cup is most exciting sporting event minus a Hawks super bowl

    Seriously? That can't be true. Soccer at high levels is worse then the NFL. It's literally scripted like wrestling. This result is EXACTLY what is needed. I'm sorry for Pulisik or whatever but we need to still lose for another 4 years so heads roll and we get to the level we should be which is top 12.

    This is a nation with the most youth players in the world. Follow me? Something better change quick because there's no excuse and it's ridiculous simple as that. Also Arians sucks dick like a professional whore.

    T@T seriously?
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Wed Oct 11, 2017 3:19 am
  • Si, where do you stand on the pay to play academy system? Personally I think it's one of the biggest reasons the US is failing and should be gotten rid of since it artificially decreases the potential player pool.
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Wed Oct 11, 2017 6:46 am
  • SeatownJay wrote:Si, where do you stand on the pay to play academy system? Personally I think it's one of the biggest reasons the US is failing and should be gotten rid of since it artificially decreases the potential player pool.


    Agree. It’s an indictment that the richest not the best are given more opportunities. However, The DA as a whole us fractured. There are just too many of them competing for players and money that the focus turns to winning at a young age instead of development.

    Oddly, the MLS academies will help that as their sponsorships will reduce the costs for high level players. But unfortunately they will be driving their players to a league that doesn’t adequately prepare players for high level soccer.

    The best thing here is twofold: promote young American coaches (get ready for my cover lettr) to high positions across the nation. Make licenses more accessible. Partner with big Euro clubs to help develop the players and coaches while accepting that the interchange of that will involve American kids going to these clubs.
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Wed Oct 11, 2017 6:59 am
  • What about making it easier for the DAs, especially those run by MLS clubs, to sell young players abroad?

    And on another note, here are two quotes from Bruce Arena last night that absolutely show he has no place in the USMNT or USSF going forward. "There is nothing wrong with what we're doing." and "Nothing needs to change."
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Wed Oct 11, 2017 7:15 am
  • Josea16 wrote:
    This is a nation with the most youth players in the world. Follow me? Something better change quick because there's no excuse and it's ridiculous simple as that. Also Arians sucks dick like a professional whore.


    To me this is at the crux of what happened under Arena, he decided right away to lean on his over the hill experienced players like Altidore, Dempsey, Bradley, Howard, Wondo, Beasley, Jones, Beckerman, Gonzales, etc............instead of having the balls to go with the youth movement that even if we didn't qualify (which we didn't anyway) would help mature and propel the national quad into the next WC cycle.

    I'm not on suicide watch over this result like most. Yes it's horrible, yes it should never happen to a nation that invests this much money and resources into it's national program. But the warning signs were all there YEARS ago under Klinsmann.........this squad was OLD, and not enough was being done to bring along and develop the next wave of players.

    That's on Gulati, that's on Klinsmann, and that's on Arena and the entire hierarchy of US Soccer Federation.
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Wed Oct 11, 2017 7:28 am
  • SeatownJay wrote:What about making it easier for the DAs, especially those run by MLS clubs, to sell young players abroad?

    And on another note, here are two quotes from Bruce Arena last night that absolutely show he has no place in the USMNT or USSF going forward. "There is nothing wrong with what we're doing." and "Nothing needs to change."



    Arena was always a desperation band aid. He was never a long term solution.

    The DAs can't sell kids until they are 18 (when they sign their first professional contract). What most clubs do is move them to wherever they are headed next and put in a clause that will allow the origin club to recoup money based on the player's next transfer or first long term contract.
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Wed Oct 11, 2017 7:34 am
  • Sgt. Largent wrote:
    Josea16 wrote:
    This is a nation with the most youth players in the world. Follow me? Something better change quick because there's no excuse and it's ridiculous simple as that. Also Arians sucks dick like a professional whore.


    To me this is at the crux of what happened under Arena, he decided right away to lean on his over the hill experienced players like Altidore, Dempsey, Bradley, Howard, Wondo, Beasley, Jones, Beckerman, Gonzales, etc............instead of having the balls to go with the youth movement that even if we didn't qualify (which we didn't anyway) would help mature and propel the national quad into the next WC cycle.

    I'm not on suicide watch over this result like most. Yes it's horrible, yes it should never happen to a nation that invests this much money and resources into it's national program. But the warning signs were all there YEARS ago under Klinsmann.........this squad was OLD, and not enough was being done to bring along and develop the next wave of players.

    That's on Gulati, that's on Klinsmann, and that's on Arena and the entire hierarchy of US Soccer Federation.


    It's hard to blame Arenas here. He was tasked with the very specific job of getting the team to the World Cup. While we can argue that leaning on aging stars in a mediocre league was the wrong choice, the crux of the issue which Klinsmann himself identified years ago is that the development and outlet for the nation's young players is limited by the balancing act the USSF plays with the MLS.

    Klinsmann may not have been the best touchline manager, but he had a very good plan for moving the program forward. He challenged USSF and the MLS to realize the issues he saw coming and take on the plans to remedy them. It was forward thinking, ambitious, creative and... in the end... probably correct.

    Instead, he was let go, the USSF hired Arenas, who then picked a bunch of older mediocre players from a pile of mediocre players (and two special ones) and they were exposed.

    I'm not losing my mind over this. I obviously wanted them to qualify. I also hoped that Arenas would submit a resignation today either way so the program, free of the concerns over qualification, could move forward in the way Klinsmann saw. Hoping the results finally spur that along anyways.

    It will be interesting to see if the USSF is more like the FA or more like the Germans and Spanish in the next 6 months.
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Wed Oct 11, 2017 7:51 am
  • Uncle Si wrote:
    I'm not losing my mind over this. I obviously wanted them to qualify. I also hoped that Arenas would submit a resignation today either way so the program, free of the concerns over qualification, could move forward in the way Klinsmann saw. Hoping the results finally spur that along anyways.


    My guess is Gulati is forced out first, then the search will begin for the next manager.

    No way in hell either stays, or at least they shouldn't. This is Gulati's failure first, he should be the first to go.

    The question is do we replace Arena quickly? Or wait until after the WC so we can go after a higher profile more successful manager? That usually means someone who's in the middle of managing another country in the WC.
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Wed Oct 11, 2017 8:13 am
  • Gulati won't be forced out but his spot is up for election in February.
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Wed Oct 11, 2017 8:57 am
  • Sgt. Largent wrote:
    Uncle Si wrote:
    I'm not losing my mind over this. I obviously wanted them to qualify. I also hoped that Arenas would submit a resignation today either way so the program, free of the concerns over qualification, could move forward in the way Klinsmann saw. Hoping the results finally spur that along anyways.


    My guess is Gulati is forced out first, then the search will begin for the next manager.

    No way in hell either stays, or at least they shouldn't. This is Gulati's failure first, he should be the first to go.

    The question is do we replace Arena quickly? Or wait until after the WC so we can go after a higher profile more successful manager? That usually means someone who's in the middle of managing another country in the WC.


    Arenas will be the first to go, and there should be no hurry to replace him. However, what should take place is an overhaul at the younger age groups. Start promoting top, young American coaches (Caleb Porter) and move them into positions of greater influence.

    Gulati should not be re-elected. He never had a suitable vision for long term success of American soccer. he was simply protecting the basic status quo to allow the MLS brand to grow under the auspice that those players would always be better than the likes of Honduras, Costa Rica, Panama.
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Wed Oct 11, 2017 9:41 am
  • Uncle Si wrote:
    Sgt. Largent wrote:
    Uncle Si wrote:
    I'm not losing my mind over this. I obviously wanted them to qualify. I also hoped that Arenas would submit a resignation today either way so the program, free of the concerns over qualification, could move forward in the way Klinsmann saw. Hoping the results finally spur that along anyways.


    My guess is Gulati is forced out first, then the search will begin for the next manager.

    No way in hell either stays, or at least they shouldn't. This is Gulati's failure first, he should be the first to go.

    The question is do we replace Arena quickly? Or wait until after the WC so we can go after a higher profile more successful manager? That usually means someone who's in the middle of managing another country in the WC.


    Arenas will be the first to go, and there should be no hurry to replace him. However, what should take place is an overhaul at the younger age groups. Start promoting top, young American coaches (Caleb Porter) and move them into positions of greater influence.

    Gulati should not be re-elected. He never had a suitable vision for long term success of American soccer. he was simply protecting the basic status quo to allow the MLS brand to grow under the auspice that those players would always be better than the likes of Honduras, Costa Rica, Panama.


    That's the irony of what's gone on with MLS, it's empowered and helped every other CONCACAF nation compete, except for the US. It's helped level the playing field by using our pro league to develop much poorer soccer nation's players.
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Wed Oct 11, 2017 10:14 am
  • Uncle Si wrote:The DAs can't sell kids until they are 18 (when they sign their first professional contract). What most clubs do is move them to wherever they are headed next and put in a clause that will allow the origin club to recoup money based on the player's next transfer or first long term contract.

    In regards to this, I was referring to the solidarity payments that FIFA allows and regulates but USSF and MLS don't honor. I remember there was a big stink raised when Yedlin was sold by Seattle to Tottenham where MLS didn't want to share the money they received with Crossfire and Northwest Nationals.
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Wed Oct 11, 2017 10:21 am
  • Did it though? Did it develop them right up to the same level of mediocrity that the US assumed was enough to get them an easy pass to the World Cup? I'd suggest that the mediocrity of the MLS has leveled the playing field, in the opposite direction.

    But to demonstrate further:

    Hexagonal teams by place
    Mexico: 25 players (2 in the MLS, 11 playing with a team in a top tier of European soccer, rest in Mexico)
    Panama: 22 players (6 in the MLS)
    Costa Rica: 24 players (7 in the MLS, 6 playing in a top European league)
    Honduras: 28 players (4 in the MLS, all but 4 more playing in the Honduran league)

    and.. the US: 22 players... all but 7 playing in the MLS.

    The MLS did work hard to level the playing field. Unfortunately, not in the way you are inferring.
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Wed Oct 11, 2017 10:25 am
  • SeatownJay wrote:
    Uncle Si wrote:The DAs can't sell kids until they are 18 (when they sign their first professional contract). What most clubs do is move them to wherever they are headed next and put in a clause that will allow the origin club to recoup money based on the player's next transfer or first long term contract.

    In regards to this, I was referring to the solidarity payments that FIFA allows and regulates but USSF and MLS don't honor. I remember there was a big stink raised when Yedlin was sold by Seattle to Tottenham where MLS didn't want to share the money they received with Crossfire and Northwest Nationals.


    I see... that I am not sure of to be honest. I imagine it has something to do with the way MLS pools all their money.

    Does seem counterproductive, however. DAs like the ones in the midwest (Gallagher) are producing pro level players. What is their motivation to promote them to an MLS reserve team
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Wed Oct 11, 2017 4:02 pm
  • Surprised no one's mentioned the unfairness that we had to play two countries in one match, Trinidad AND Tobago!
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Wed Oct 11, 2017 4:26 pm

Re: US Mens Soccer
Wed Oct 11, 2017 5:51 pm

Re: US Mens Soccer
Thu Oct 12, 2017 7:38 am
  • Uncle Si wrote:
    Sgt. Largent wrote:Surprised no one's mentioned the unfairness that we had to play two countries in one match, Trinidad AND Tobago!



    Those jammy bastages. I knew there was something amiss. Also.. did you see the ridiculous goal scored against Mexico AND the goal that wasn’t by Panama? Conspiracies on a regional scale. Also:

    http://the18.com/soccer-news/jurgen-klinsmann-mls-criticism?utm_campaign=news&utm_medium=organic-social&utm_source=facebook&utm_content=article



    I get the criticism, I always have. Jurgen is right.

    But if you're an American player going from Euro club to Euro club fighting for minutes and even bench time in your late 20's and early to mid 30's..............why? Why do that when you can come home, get a fat paycheck cashing in on your USMNT notoriety in your home country (or close in Canada) where you can play another 4-5 years raising your family in a stable familiar environment?

    AND you can help grow your home country's league. From a competitive aspect, Jurgen and other critics are absolutely right, these players should play in Europe as long as they can at the highest competitive level. But that's not life, these players have a small window to not only make as much money as they can, but they have families to think of.
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Thu Oct 12, 2017 9:07 am
  • Sure. But which of the players that you describe in that scenario were on the squad? I’m talking about young players, not Dempsey or Howard.

    Yedlin has taken the plunge. Bradley gave up. Altidire have up. Guys like Nagbe never took it on. There are many more who are late in on careers that were never adequately challenged. It’s a shame. And this is the consequence
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Thu Oct 12, 2017 9:35 am
  • Uncle Si wrote:Sure. But which of the players that you describe in that scenario were on the squad? I’m talking about young players, not Dempsey or Howard.

    Yedlin has taken the plunge. Bradley gave up. Altidire have up. Guys like Nagbe never took it on. There are many more who are late in on careers that were never adequately challenged. It’s a shame. And this is the consequence


    It's not all on the player, I think the Timbers have now rejected 2 or 3 transfer offers for Nagbe? Was suppose to go to Celtic last year.

    btw, Cameron, Wood, Bedoya, Johnson, Brooks, etc Have these guys exponentially benefited from playing in 1st and 2nd tier leagues overseas?

    Idk, they've looked pretty crappy in USMNT matches in the last 12 months.

    Anyway, while I agree, I'm not going to hyper fixate on ALL of our players MUST play overseas, or MOST. It's far more a talent/development issue for me than where these guys play.

    We have to stop being a soft suburban rich kids pay to play development country and figure out how to get the best athletes from all walks of life and income level playing soccer like the soccer power countries do.
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Thu Oct 12, 2017 11:47 am
  • Speaking of players going to Europe, there is some thought that, without this World Cup to showcase his skills, Jordan Morris may not get any serious offers from European clubs. He'll be 28 when the 2022 World Cup is played and by then he'll be considered too old to attract much interest. Morris may now spend his entire career in MLS, which is a shame.
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Thu Oct 12, 2017 1:42 pm
  • SeatownJay wrote:Speaking of players going to Europe, there is some thought that, without this World Cup to showcase his skills, Jordan Morris may not get any serious offers from European clubs. He'll be 28 when the 2022 World Cup is played and by then he'll be considered too old to attract much interest. Morris may now spend his entire career in MLS, which is a shame.


    Morris is the offensive equivalent of Yedlin, as long as he has world class pace, someone overseas will covet him.

    It'll just be a question of who, and whether that makes sense for him.

    As much as I'd love to see Morris stay, he needs to leave if he wants to get better and become a bigger factor in whatever direction the next manager of the USMNT wants to go.

    Guarantee you whoever the next manager is, he's going to clean house and go with a youth movement.
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Thu Oct 12, 2017 1:49 pm
  • Sgt. Largent wrote:
    Uncle Si wrote:Sure. But which of the players that you describe in that scenario were on the squad? I’m talking about young players, not Dempsey or Howard.

    Yedlin has taken the plunge. Bradley gave up. Altidire have up. Guys like Nagbe never took it on. There are many more who are late in on careers that were never adequately challenged. It’s a shame. And this is the consequence


    It's not all on the player, I think the Timbers have now rejected 2 or 3 transfer offers for Nagbe? Was suppose to go to Celtic last year.

    btw, Cameron, Wood, Bedoya, Johnson, Brooks, etc Have these guys exponentially benefited from playing in 1st and 2nd tier leagues overseas?

    Idk, they've looked pretty crappy in USMNT matches in the last 12 months.

    Anyway, while I agree, I'm not going to hyper fixate on ALL of our players MUST play overseas, or MOST. It's far more a talent/development issue for me than where these guys play.

    We have to stop being a soft suburban rich kids pay to play development country and figure out how to get the best athletes from all walks of life and income level playing soccer like the soccer power countries do.


    Cameron and Wood have certainly. Wood may be set for a transfer to a bigger club in Europe. And to suggest that it would every time simply ignores how difficult it is. Atleast they tried.

    The contentment of the MLS and USSF is what’s at discussion. While no one said ALL young players should go overseas the very good prospects should not only be looking but also be encouraged to by the national organization. Look how well the production line of the MLS did this cycle?

    Pulisic is not some phenom to a nation of 300 million. There are plenty like him in Europe and plenty more with the same ambitions here in the US.
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Thu Oct 12, 2017 7:12 pm
  • Well I guess the USA and Holland can have there own World Cup and mope about being losers.
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Fri Oct 13, 2017 6:45 am
  • Bruce Arena has officially resigned. It's a small step, sure, but at least it's in the right direction.

    http://www.espnfc.com/united-states/sto ... d-cup-miss
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Fri Oct 13, 2017 7:50 am
  • Uncle Si wrote:
    Cameron and Wood have certainly. Wood may be set for a transfer to a bigger club in Europe. And to suggest that it would every time simply ignores how difficult it is. Atleast they tried.

    The contentment of the MLS and USSF is what’s at discussion. While no one said ALL young players should go overseas the very good prospects should not only be looking but also be encouraged to by the national organization. Look how well the production line of the MLS did this cycle?

    Pulisic is not some phenom to a nation of 300 million. There are plenty like him in Europe and plenty more with the same ambitions here in the US.


    I think the whole blame MLS angle is an easy scapegoat.

    This squad was old, and would have got it's clocked cleaned in the WC if it did make it in. So the missing the WC isn't important to me.

    What's important to me is why is Howard still in goal? Why are guys like Demspey, Jones, Altidore, Bradley, Wondo, Beckerman, Zusi, Gonzales, etc still major contributors playing major minutes? Half these guys shouldn't even be on the squad, and the other half should be role players for leadership and to come off the bench.

    Everyone keeps pointing to Pulisic, but he's an outlier of a far greater systemic development issue.

    This country needs an entire overhaul of it's soccer academy/developmental system. Not it's pro league.
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Fri Oct 13, 2017 8:34 am
  • Pulisic is not an outlier. Once you get over that notion you'll understand where the overhaul needs to start. And yes.. it starts with a pro league that does not properly develop or challenge its players and a federation that was quite comfortable allowing (encouraging and at times almost forcing) it's mediocre players to play in that league while continually reaching the world cup through a sub par group.

    the average age of the field players on the roster was 27... that's not old.

    Missing the World cup should be important to you, if you care about the development of the sport in this county. tens of thousands of kids playing soccer at a high level between the ages of 12-17 will now miss out on watching players like Pulisic and Wood represent their country. The impact of that can be staggering. The only thing that saves Pulisic as model of the US soccer now is a move to the Premier League.

    The academy and development leagues are not the issue. they are creating fantastic opportunities for players. while i disagree with the focus on wins and the monetary incentives they are based on, their can be no doubting how much they have grown and are positively influencing development here. Problem is, when i help develop a player at 13 and get him to Sporting, and down there he is playing against the likes of Villareal, Barca, Bayern and Chelsea youth with great dreams of being a world class player and representing his country, he is then told by the director of the federation and his DA coaches that the MLS is where he should play.

    When has shooting for the middle ever amounted to success?
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Fri Oct 13, 2017 8:53 am
  • Uncle Si wrote:
    Missing the World cup should be important to you, if you care about the development of the sport in this county. tens of thousands of kids playing soccer at a high level between the ages of 12-17 will now miss out on watching players like Pulisic and Wood represent their country. The impact of that can be staggering. The only thing that saves Pulisic as model of the US soccer now is a move to the Premier League.


    I don't think you're giving the soccer youth and fans enough credit. The WC is the biggest sporting event on the planet for soccer players and fans, even in the US.

    They'll still be into it, they'll still watch, just like you and I as soccer fans will watch.

    Watching a stilted listless US squad get drubbed in whatever group they drew wouldn't help anything. My hope is this will end up being a good thing for US Soccer, maybe it'll help facilitate the much needed change many have been calling for a long time in every aspect of the program.
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Fri Oct 13, 2017 9:05 am
  • Sure.. they will watch..

    But that's not the point is it. You cannot quantify the impact of not having a 19 year old Christian Pulisic running around against the world's best in a US jersey.

    Yes... this might actually provide as an inspiration to change. that's all that can be hoped for. But... that shouldnt not have come at the expense of a world cup. Klinsmann identified these issues years ago and was roundly and heavily criticized (by you as well). People were so desperate to protect the MLS it has cost the nation a world cup.

    Sorry Sarge.. this is what it is. These things dont start at the base, they start at the top. The MLS and the USSF have been feeding off an inadequate and antiquated model for decades.

    It cost them.. and all of US soccer fans. Now at the base level coaches and DOCs have to pick up the pieces fast
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Fri Oct 13, 2017 9:24 am
  • Uncle Si wrote:Sure.. they will watch..

    But that's not the point is it. You cannot quantify the impact of not having a 19 year old Christian Pulisic running around against the world's best in a US jersey.

    Yes... this might actually provide as an inspiration to change. that's all that can be hoped for. But... that shouldnt not have come at the expense of a world cup. Klinsmann identified these issues years ago and was roundly and heavily criticized (by you as well). People were so desperate to protect the MLS it has cost the nation a world cup.

    Sorry Sarge.. this is what it is. These things dont start at the base, they start at the top. The MLS and the USSF have been feeding off an inadequate and antiquated model for decades.

    It cost them.. and all of US soccer fans. Now at the base level coaches and DOCs have to pick up the pieces fast


    So let's be proactive in our discussion, how would you fix MLS and USSF?

    I didn't want us to miss the WC btw, but my point is we're having this discussion NOW, as opposed to July 16th wondering what the hell happened, firing everyone and what to do now. I see this as a nine month head start on fixing these things we've stuck our head in the sand about because "we made the WC, everything's fine!"

    It's not fine.
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Fri Oct 13, 2017 11:25 am
  • We certainly agree there...

    The USSF is unbalanced. It should be promoting a system and idea that promote development through competition, not progression through winning. From Academy to the pros. It should be doing more at the older age groups to get its competitive groups playing and learning from internationals. It should make coaching these levels far more enticing through more open licensing and courses, as well as better pay.

    And then, it should be pushing it's better young players to challenge themselves at the highest level they can. Now, for some that might be the MLS. For others, it's elsewhere. Most nations do this.. you see these international players desperate to find teams they can get on to that will push them higher up the national tier, especially in the last year of a cycle

    The MLS is a different story. Look, the league is successful. What it needs now is more Atlantas. It needs less Dempseys and Bradleys and Jones and Gerrards and more Nagbes. I dont know enough about the league to know how it all works, but it should be attracting much younger and far more creative players than it does. Then it needs to promote young coaches with more creative ideas about playing the game. It certainly needs a promotion and relegation system.

    Those are the starts I guess
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Fri Oct 13, 2017 12:20 pm
  • Uncle Si wrote:
    The MLS is a different story. Look, the league is successful. What it needs now is more Atlantas. It needs less Dempseys and Bradleys and Jones and Gerrards and more Nagbes. I dont know enough about the league to know how it all works, but it should be attracting much younger and far more creative players than it does. Then it needs to promote young coaches with more creative ideas about playing the game. It certainly needs a promotion and relegation system.


    I do think this is the direction MLS is going.

    That's why they've created things like the S2 division, for small MLS division 2 regional leagues in order to give younger academy players better competition. I'd rather MLS merge with leagues like the NASL, so everything's not so splintered and dysfunctional when it comes to how USSF wants it's players developed. But it's a start.

    Also why MLS has a young DP rule, to allow cap space and allocation money to go after younger stars to compete with other leagues for good young talent.

    I don't think we'll ever see the end of the older well known DP, especially USMNT players that fans love and sell jerseys and tickets.
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Fri Oct 13, 2017 5:20 pm
  • Sunil Gulati was very successful in making the USSF into a financial giant. Now, we need someone in charge who makes decisions and hires people based primarily on how they will improve the product on the field and not how they improve the bottom line. They can start by hiring an actual full-time technical director for the entire national program.
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Re: US Mens Soccer
Mon Oct 16, 2017 11:25 am
  • In brighter news for US Men's Soccer, the U-17 squad pasted Paraguay 5-0 to reach the quarterfinals of their World Cup. They'll face the winner of England-Japan on Saturday. If you want to watch it will air on time delay on FS2 at 12:30pm PST/3:30pm EST.
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