Mass Shootings

The Lounge is for non-sport-related topics other than politics, war and religion. Order up your favorite beverage, kick back and enjoy the conversation! LANGUAGE RATING: PG-13
Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 6:11 am
  • Wenhawk wrote:
    KitsapGuy wrote:


    Interesting. Common sense says that’s a riffle.



    In some states, if that's classified as a rifle you only have to be 18 to buy it. Since it's a "pistol" you need to be 21.
    2_0_6
    NET Veteran
     
    Posts: 3263
    Joined: Sat Sep 21, 2013 12:40 am
    Location: South Seattle


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 6:26 am
  • Yeah I'm not sure what the point of that article is. Classifying a firearm as a pistol instead of a rifle makes it harder to buy.

    The article makes it sound like the legal classification makes the gun easier to conceal.
    XxXdragonXxX
    NET Veteran
     
    Posts: 2225
    Joined: Sat Mar 03, 2007 3:40 am
    Location: Enumclaw, WA


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 6:40 am
  • Gun on left: 18+ to buy
    Gun on right: 21+ to buy

    Same bullet, same mags, different classification by the ATF.

    Image
    2_0_6
    NET Veteran
     
    Posts: 3263
    Joined: Sat Sep 21, 2013 12:40 am
    Location: South Seattle


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 7:02 am
  • Sarlacc83 wrote:*yawn* At least, given your response (and despite your obvious protests otherwise), I can tell that hit home since you doubled down on it.

    I don't even understand this response tbh.

    Me: stating a fact that alcohol dwarfs guns in terms of negative effects towards a society yet guns are the hotter topic because media and politics have decided it to be.

    You: rambling about "stupid guns" and the 2nd amendment while delusionally assuming my stance and motive.

    Image
    massari
    NET Veteran
     
    Posts: 1451
    Joined: Thu Mar 19, 2015 6:58 am


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 8:46 am
  • massari wrote:
    Sarlacc83 wrote:*yawn* At least, given your response (and despite your obvious protests otherwise), I can tell that hit home since you doubled down on it.

    I don't even understand this response tbh.

    Me: stating a fact that alcohol dwarfs guns in terms of negative effects towards a society yet guns are the hotter topic because media and politics have decided it to be.

    You: rambling about "stupid guns" and the 2nd amendment while delusionally assuming my stance and motive.

    Image


    It's not some light over our heads that guns are more popular in the media and with politics than other societal ills. You know why? Because people aren't killing dozens of people in an hour by drinking a beer or running around with a bottle of Stoli. Moreover, no politician is getting elected / booted out of office based on their stance whether drinking is good or bad. (Well, at least not nationally. Maybe in the Deep South). Based on that, I figured it was the commonly used diversionary tactic that shows up in these threads. Well, what about cars and accidents? What about alcohol? What about; what about....

    But you know what? I can see your not understanding my response. I took your calling me an alcoholic and a crackpot is as a sign that you were annoyed by the implications of the post. I figured I'd rub it in a little bit. You seem to think you were merely being reasonable; I thought I'd try to rile you (and the pro 2A people up in this thread) up a bit. It appears that we've talked past each other. So, care to start over? I'll even acknowledge that I went overboard and apologize for it.
    Last edited by Sarlacc83 on Wed Aug 14, 2019 9:37 am, edited 1 time in total.
    Sarlacc83
    * NET Philistine *
     
    Posts: 17103
    Joined: Fri May 01, 2009 9:02 am
    Location: Portland, OR


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 9:09 am
  • Why is it worse if, say, 90 people die in one year due to 3 incidents where 30 people were killed in the span of an hour than it is if 90 people died in one year due to 90 separate incidents?

    Never understood why so many people think one is worse than the other. Unless you misspoke Sarlacc, then that is what you are implying. Care to explain?
    fenderbender123
    NET Veteran
     
    Posts: 5243
    Joined: Sun Sep 09, 2012 1:47 pm


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 9:22 am
  • fenderbender123 wrote:Why is it worse if, say, 90 people die in one year due to 3 incidents where 30 people were killed in the span of an hour than it is if 90 people died in one year due to 90 separate incidents?

    Never understood why so many people think one is worse than the other. Unless you misspoke Sarlacc, then that is what you are implying. Care to explain?


    My point is quite the opposite -- just because there are worse things doesn't mean that we can't focus on this one thing, too. It'd be like saying, well, breast cancer or prostrate cancer affect more people than pancreatic cancer so let's just focus on those. It's a way to sidestep the issue, either intentionally or unintentionally.

    My other point is visibility. Both are bad, but someone dying of cirrhosis, as horrendous as it is, won't make people fear for their lives in a public place. Is it good of the media to spread that kind of fear? No. But unfortunately, it's also a reality right now. Along with that, due to the 2nd amendment, this is a federal problem with an impact on people's voting habits and will garner attention accordingly.
    Sarlacc83
    * NET Philistine *
     
    Posts: 17103
    Joined: Fri May 01, 2009 9:02 am
    Location: Portland, OR


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 10:44 am
  • But don't you think it's relevant in terms of ranking what problems we should focus on?
    fenderbender123
    NET Veteran
     
    Posts: 5243
    Joined: Sun Sep 09, 2012 1:47 pm


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 11:01 am
  • fenderbender123 wrote:But don't you think it's relevant in terms of ranking what problems we should focus on?


    Sure, it's relevant as part of a cost/benefit analysis. In the case of alcohol consumption, it's a big problem, but it's got a host of different causes -- which in turn leads to (potentially) great expense with little gain. (Some effects are societal, some are genetic, etc.). In other cases, like automobile accidents, manufacturers continue to make cars safer and safer -- and if self-driving cars become a basic reality, then human error will be fully eliminated from the system. The US has plenty of money to spend on a lot of different problems, and in most cases is doing so. There's just an intractability about doing the same with guns (such as even studying the effects).
    Sarlacc83
    * NET Philistine *
     
    Posts: 17103
    Joined: Fri May 01, 2009 9:02 am
    Location: Portland, OR


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 11:37 am
  • peachesenregalia wrote:US Government has also heavily regulated the auto industry as far as safety standards and emmissions go, too. It's in the interest of the public health, and therefore falls into the purview of the government to regulate it. Same with guns. If more regulation could improve public health/safety, then why should the government not be looking at that?


    Have you been following the thread? Firearms are highly regulated both Federally and locally so much so that at this point some of those regulations likely exceed time, place, and manner standards applicable to a constitutionally protected right.

    Lots of hubbub currently about piling on more regulation, but don't be surprised as SCOTUS slowly roles back many of those oversteps.
    Osprey
    Silver Supporter
    Silver Supporter
     
    Posts: 870
    Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2010 5:06 pm
    Location: Camas, WA


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 12:15 pm
  • Make every fanny who buys a gun register and insure it. Pretty simple fix that'll increase responsibility from gun owners over time.
    pehawk
    Silver Supporter
    Silver Supporter
     
    Posts: 14946
    Joined: Fri Feb 23, 2007 1:08 pm


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 12:46 pm
  • pehawk wrote:Make every fanny who buys a gun register and insure it. Pretty simple fix that'll increase responsibility from gun owners over time.

    Insurance is a financial vehicle to ensure outstanding liabilities are paid. I'll ask you again, are you aware of outstanding judgments involving gun ownership? If not then your sole purpose is to drive down ownership by increasing cost. Disingenuous backdoor BS.
    Osprey
    Silver Supporter
    Silver Supporter
     
    Posts: 870
    Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2010 5:06 pm
    Location: Camas, WA


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 1:06 pm
  • pehawk wrote:Make every fanny who buys a gun register it.


    In this state all new gun purchases are registered.
    2_0_6
    NET Veteran
     
    Posts: 3263
    Joined: Sat Sep 21, 2013 12:40 am
    Location: South Seattle


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 1:15 pm
  • Sarlacc83 wrote:
    fenderbender123 wrote:Why is it worse if, say, 90 people die in one year due to 3 incidents where 30 people were killed in the span of an hour than it is if 90 people died in one year due to 90 separate incidents?

    Never understood why so many people think one is worse than the other. Unless you misspoke Sarlacc, then that is what you are implying. Care to explain?


    My point is quite the opposite -- just because there are worse things doesn't mean that we can't focus on this one thing, too. It'd be like saying, well, breast cancer or prostrate cancer affect more people than pancreatic cancer so let's just focus on those. It's a way to sidestep the issue, either intentionally or unintentionally.

    My other point is visibility. Both are bad, but someone dying of cirrhosis, as horrendous as it is, won't make people fear for their lives in a public place. Is it good of the media to spread that kind of fear? No. But unfortunately, it's also a reality right now. Along with that, due to the 2nd amendment, this is a federal problem with an impact on people's voting habits and will garner attention accordingly.



    Which again come back to my comment on the 1st amendment. The problems here run much deeper than the tools that are being blamed for peoples actions. What is going on in the media (both "professional" and social) is an abomination. And I am talking all sides before somebody takes that as a political statement. The irony will be when the people are unable to defend themselves and the 1st amendment becomes the target.
    JustTheTip
    NET Veteran
     
    Posts: 1776
    Joined: Sun Oct 03, 2010 1:38 pm


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 3:13 pm
  • Osprey wrote:
    pehawk wrote:Make every fanny who buys a gun register and insure it. Pretty simple fix that'll increase responsibility from gun owners over time.

    Insurance is a financial vehicle to ensure outstanding liabilities are paid. I'll ask you again, are you aware of outstanding judgments involving gun ownership? If not then your sole purpose is to drive down ownership by increasing cost. Disingenuous backdoor BS.


    If your gun is used to slaughter my child, I can sue your insurance company for your negligence.
    pehawk
    Silver Supporter
    Silver Supporter
     
    Posts: 14946
    Joined: Fri Feb 23, 2007 1:08 pm


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 3:32 pm
  • And another one in progress in Philadelphia. Apparently 6 policemen shot.

    :|
    sutz
    USMC 1970-77
     
    Posts: 17177
    Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2007 1:41 am
    Location: Kent, WA


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 3:37 pm
  • Police were first called to the scene for narcotics activity, according to Philadelphia Police Capt. Sekou Kinebrew.

    Sources tell CBS3 that the scene was sheer chaos as officers were taking fire. Video from Chopper 3 shows officers with guns drawn at the scene
    2_0_6
    NET Veteran
     
    Posts: 3263
    Joined: Sat Sep 21, 2013 12:40 am
    Location: South Seattle


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 3:40 pm

Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 3:44 pm
  • Serving a narcotics warrant. I'm going to go out on a limb and say that this hasn't been his first meeting with the Police and likely isn't even legally able to own guns.
    2_0_6
    NET Veteran
     
    Posts: 3263
    Joined: Sat Sep 21, 2013 12:40 am
    Location: South Seattle


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 4:19 pm
  • Osprey wrote:
    peachesenregalia wrote:US Government has also heavily regulated the auto industry as far as safety standards and emmissions go, too. It's in the interest of the public health, and therefore falls into the purview of the government to regulate it. Same with guns. If more regulation could improve public health/safety, then why should the government not be looking at that?


    Have you been following the thread? Firearms are highly regulated both Federally and locally so much so that at this point some of those regulations likely exceed time, place, and manner standards applicable to a constitutionally protected right.

    Eh, sort of. It depends on the firearm. I can go down to Walmart right now and buy a 12 gauge shotgun that holds 8 shells and has an 18" barrel, and as many shells of whatever I want (like 00 buckshot or slugs), and walk out the door with those items in the time it takes to run the NICS background check and ring up the sale. The same is true for any non-semiautomatic rifle. The same was true of semiautomatic rifles up until about 6 weeks ago, and even with the new laws in effect it's still awfully easy for anyone that hasn't already been legally disqualified from being able to own/posses a gun to buy one.

    Yes, there are regulations, but it's still very easy for any non-criminal to buy pretty much any firearm that isn't fully automatic, and I really don't think any of the brand new laws in our state regarding semiautomatic rifles are unreasonable considering the amount of damage an AR-15 is capable of inflicting (for instance, 26 people shot in 32 seconds).


    Lots of hubbub currently about piling on more regulation, but don't be surprised as SCOTUS slowly roles back many of those oversteps.

    I-1639 passed by almost 60% of the vote. Would you be in favor of SCOTUS overriding the will of the people?
    Chapow
    NET Veteran
     
    Posts: 3277
    Joined: Mon Jan 11, 2010 5:38 pm


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 4:33 pm
  • JustTheTip wrote: The irony will be when the people are unable to defend themselves and the 1st amendment becomes the target.


    There are close to 400 hundred million firearms in the hands of private citizens in this country. We're really, really far from not being able to defend ourselves against our government (that would apparently be stripping away our rights like hot cakes if only we didn't have hundreds of millions of guns).
    Chapow
    NET Veteran
     
    Posts: 3277
    Joined: Mon Jan 11, 2010 5:38 pm


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 4:54 pm
  • The thing is you can buy over the internet from another country piece's of guns and assemble them here, already being done and has been done, full Auto the works. If you want a assault rifle there are a lot of ways to get them.

    No checks at all other then the account confirmation for purchase.
    chris98251
    .NET Hijacker
     
    Posts: 28909
    Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2007 11:52 pm
    Location: Renton Wa.


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 5:24 pm
  • chris98251 wrote:The thing is you can buy over the internet from another country piece's of guns and assemble them here, already being done and has been done, full Auto the works. If you want a assault rifle there are a lot of ways to get them.

    No checks at all other then the account confirmation for purchase.


    Sure, but that would be illegal wouldn't it? I was talking about the ease of legally purchasing a firearm in response to the opinion that firearms are already highly regulated.

    For something that is so highly regulated, firearms sure are easy to purchase legally.
    Chapow
    NET Veteran
     
    Posts: 3277
    Joined: Mon Jan 11, 2010 5:38 pm


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 6:57 pm
  • peachesenregalia wrote:
    Osprey wrote:
    peachesenregalia wrote:US Government has also heavily regulated the auto industry as far as safety standards and emmissions go, too. It's in the interest of the public health, and therefore falls into the purview of the government to regulate it. Same with guns. If more regulation could improve public health/safety, then why should the government not be looking at that?


    Have you been following the thread? Firearms are highly regulated both Federally and locally so much so that at this point some of those regulations likely exceed time, place, and manner standards applicable to a constitutionally protected right.

    Lots of hubbub currently about piling on more regulation, but don't be surprised as SCOTUS slowly roles back many of those oversteps.

    Rubbish. I can go to a gun show and buy a whole arsenal of guns with very little issue. Private gun sales are extremely loosely regulated also. Stop trying to obfuscate the fact that it is way too easy for people to buy and sell guns in this country. You’re being disingenuous.


    Haha @Osprey
    pehawk
    Silver Supporter
    Silver Supporter
     
    Posts: 14946
    Joined: Fri Feb 23, 2007 1:08 pm


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 7:03 pm
  • peachesenregalia wrote:
    Osprey wrote:
    peachesenregalia wrote:US Government has also heavily regulated the auto industry as far as safety standards and emmissions go, too. It's in the interest of the public health, and therefore falls into the purview of the government to regulate it. Same with guns. If more regulation could improve public health/safety, then why should the government not be looking at that?


    Have you been following the thread? Firearms are highly regulated both Federally and locally so much so that at this point some of those regulations likely exceed time, place, and manner standards applicable to a constitutionally protected right.

    Lots of hubbub currently about piling on more regulation, but don't be surprised as SCOTUS slowly roles back many of those oversteps.

    Rubbish. I can go to a gun show and buy a whole arsenal of guns with very little issue. Private gun sales are extremely loosely regulated also. Stop trying to obfuscate the fact that it is way too easy for people to buy and sell guns in this country. You’re being disingenuous.


    In Oregon you're subject to the same background check at gun shows that you are at the store. But that didn't stop Kip Kinkel!
    Zebulon Dak
    * The Producer *
     
    Posts: 17095
    Joined: Sun Mar 04, 2007 3:57 pm
    Location: King In The North


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 7:11 pm
  • peachesenregalia wrote:
    Osprey wrote:
    peachesenregalia wrote:US Government has also heavily regulated the auto industry as far as safety standards and emmissions go, too. It's in the interest of the public health, and therefore falls into the purview of the government to regulate it. Same with guns. If more regulation could improve public health/safety, then why should the government not be looking at that?


    Have you been following the thread? Firearms are highly regulated both Federally and locally so much so that at this point some of those regulations likely exceed time, place, and manner standards applicable to a constitutionally protected right.

    Lots of hubbub currently about piling on more regulation, but don't be surprised as SCOTUS slowly roles back many of those oversteps.

    Rubbish. I can go to a gun show and buy a whole arsenal of guns with very little issue. Private gun sales are extremely loosely regulated also..




    Ever been to a gun show? The statement above tells me you have zero clue about what your even talking about. There are no such things as private sales any longer in Washington, that all went away when I594 went into place in '14. Each vendor at the gun show that sells firearms are licensed FFL's. You have to run a background check for any firearm, just like any other deal at any gun shop.
    2_0_6
    NET Veteran
     
    Posts: 3263
    Joined: Sat Sep 21, 2013 12:40 am
    Location: South Seattle


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 7:17 pm
  • pehawk wrote:
    Osprey wrote:
    pehawk wrote:Make every fanny who buys a gun register and insure it. Pretty simple fix that'll increase responsibility from gun owners over time.

    Insurance is a financial vehicle to ensure outstanding liabilities are paid. I'll ask you again, are you aware of outstanding judgments involving gun ownership? If not then your sole purpose is to drive down ownership by increasing cost. Disingenuous backdoor BS.


    If your gun is used to slaughter my child, I can sue your insurance company for your negligence.

    I see you know as much about tort law as you do about firearms. You could sue ME for wrongful death if I was the killer, but no policy covers that. The one scenario a policy might cover is gross negligence on my part, but odds are issuers will exempt via clause.

    In truth nothing prevents you from suing now, no need for an insurance regulatory scheme.
    Osprey
    Silver Supporter
    Silver Supporter
     
    Posts: 870
    Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2010 5:06 pm
    Location: Camas, WA


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 7:24 pm
  • chris98251 wrote:The thing is you can buy over the internet from another country piece's of guns and assemble them here, already being done and has been done, full Auto the works. If you want a assault rifle there are a lot of ways to get them.

    No checks at all other then the account confirmation for purchase.



    If someone is importing a full auto parts kit for any firearm and assembling them here without the proper process, that is a major issue. If someone got caught it would strip you of your gun rights for life, a large fine, and likely quite a bit of prison time.

    You can buy some old bolt action and other military surplus guns directly with a C&R license.
    https://www.atf.gov/firearms/curios-relics
    2_0_6
    NET Veteran
     
    Posts: 3263
    Joined: Sat Sep 21, 2013 12:40 am
    Location: South Seattle


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 7:30 pm
  • Osprey wrote:
    pehawk wrote:
    Osprey wrote:
    pehawk wrote:Make every fanny who buys a gun register and insure it. Pretty simple fix that'll increase responsibility from gun owners over time.

    Insurance is a financial vehicle to ensure outstanding liabilities are paid. I'll ask you again, are you aware of outstanding judgments involving gun ownership? If not then your sole purpose is to drive down ownership by increasing cost. Disingenuous backdoor BS.


    If your gun is used to slaughter my child, I can sue your insurance company for your negligence.

    I see you know as much about tort law as you do about firearms. You could sue ME for wrongful death if I was the killer, but no policy covers that. The one scenario a policy might cover is gross negligence on my part, but odds are issuers will exempt via clause.

    In truth nothing prevents you from suing now, no need for an insurance regulatory scheme.


    The gross negligence would come into play if your psycho kid shot up a school because you didnt lock up your gun properly.
    pehawk
    Silver Supporter
    Silver Supporter
     
    Posts: 14946
    Joined: Fri Feb 23, 2007 1:08 pm


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 7:31 pm
  • Chapow wrote:
    JustTheTip wrote: The irony will be when the people are unable to defend themselves and the 1st amendment becomes the target.


    There are close to 400 hundred million firearms in the hands of private citizens in this country. We're really, really far from not being able to defend ourselves against our government (that would apparently be stripping away our rights like hot cakes if only we didn't have hundreds of millions of guns).
    '

    Rights are always being stripped anyway. Lack of the potential of armed uprising would only make it easier.
    JustTheTip
    NET Veteran
     
    Posts: 1776
    Joined: Sun Oct 03, 2010 1:38 pm


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 7:32 pm
  • Chapow wrote:I-1639 passed by almost 60% of the vote. Would you be in favor of SCOTUS overriding the will of the people?

    Absolutely if any portion is found unconstitutional.
    Osprey
    Silver Supporter
    Silver Supporter
     
    Posts: 870
    Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2010 5:06 pm
    Location: Camas, WA


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 7:34 pm
  • 2_0_6 wrote:
    peachesenregalia wrote:
    Osprey wrote:
    peachesenregalia wrote:US Government has also heavily regulated the auto industry as far as safety standards and emmissions go, too. It's in the interest of the public health, and therefore falls into the purview of the government to regulate it. Same with guns. If more regulation could improve public health/safety, then why should the government not be looking at that?


    Have you been following the thread? Firearms are highly regulated both Federally and locally so much so that at this point some of those regulations likely exceed time, place, and manner standards applicable to a constitutionally protected right.

    Lots of hubbub currently about piling on more regulation, but don't be surprised as SCOTUS slowly roles back many of those oversteps.

    Rubbish. I can go to a gun show and buy a whole arsenal of guns with very little issue. Private gun sales are extremely loosely regulated also..




    Ever been to a gun show? The statement above tells me you have zero clue about what your even talking about. There are no such things as private sales any longer in Washington, that all went away when I594 went into place in '14. Each vendor at the gun show that sells firearms are licensed FFL's. You have to run a background check for any firearm, just like any other deal at any gun shop.

    Haha @Janus
    Osprey
    Silver Supporter
    Silver Supporter
     
    Posts: 870
    Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2010 5:06 pm
    Location: Camas, WA


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 7:34 pm
  • 2_0_6 wrote:
    chris98251 wrote:The thing is you can buy over the internet from another country piece's of guns and assemble them here, already being done and has been done, full Auto the works. If you want a assault rifle there are a lot of ways to get them.

    No checks at all other then the account confirmation for purchase.



    If someone is importing a full auto parts kit for any firearm and assembling them here without the proper process, that is a major issue. If someone got caught it would strip you of your gun rights for life, a large fine, and likely quite a bit of prison time.

    You can buy some old bolt action and other military surplus guns directly with a C&R license.
    https://www.atf.gov/firearms/curios-relics


    Ummm were talking about illegally doing stuff here like MASS SHOOTING'S, if someone wants to set up a gun for full auto to shoot people they can get a gun from Dads closet, and don't say gun safe they kid probably knows where the key is. Also you can buy most things on the street if you ask the right people, order over the internet it goes on if you are planning this type of thing.

    That doesn't cover Grandpas guns when he died that found their way into a daughters or sons house etc.

    Legally most people are responsible, people suffering from PTSD may get their guns before the disorder reaches a dangerous level also.

    Then again if the person was a Bomb expert who needs guns when you can drive a truck of fertilizer into a building.

    People dealing drugs and things of that side of the street I don't think are worried about their gun rights, chances are the ones they have use to be someone else's anyway.
    chris98251
    .NET Hijacker
     
    Posts: 28909
    Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2007 11:52 pm
    Location: Renton Wa.


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 7:44 pm
  • pehawk wrote:
    The gross negligence would come into play if your psycho kid shot up a school because you didnt lock up your gun properly.

    I understand the argument, but it has nothing to do with insurance and is a unicorn scenario.
    Osprey
    Silver Supporter
    Silver Supporter
     
    Posts: 870
    Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2010 5:06 pm
    Location: Camas, WA


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 7:49 pm
  • Osprey wrote:
    pehawk wrote:
    The gross negligence would come into play if your psycho kid shot up a school because you didnt lock up your gun properly.

    I understand the argument, but it has nothing to do with insurance and is a unicorn scenario.


    Insurance is for things or situations which can be dangerous or life endangering. Guns qualify now.

    You know I'm right...you're just scared it'll effect you. Which it wont because, I assume, you're responsible.
    pehawk
    Silver Supporter
    Silver Supporter
     
    Posts: 14946
    Joined: Fri Feb 23, 2007 1:08 pm


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 8:05 pm
  • There is no sales tax on gun safes in Washington state. Gun safe companies also do 0% or very low interest financing of them as well.

    If you are a gun owner, there is no reason whatsoever to not own a gun safe.
    2_0_6
    NET Veteran
     
    Posts: 3263
    Joined: Sat Sep 21, 2013 12:40 am
    Location: South Seattle


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 8:05 pm
  • pehawk wrote:
    Osprey wrote:
    pehawk wrote:
    The gross negligence would come into play if your psycho kid shot up a school because you didnt lock up your gun properly.

    I understand the argument, but it has nothing to do with insurance and is a unicorn scenario.


    Insurance is for things or situations which can be dangerous or life endangering. Guns qualify now.

    You know I'm right...you're just scared it'll effect you. Which it wont because, I assume, you're responsible.

    Walking down the streets of Seattle is dangerous, should insurance be mandatory for that?
    Osprey
    Silver Supporter
    Silver Supporter
     
    Posts: 870
    Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2010 5:06 pm
    Location: Camas, WA


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 8:14 pm
  • Osprey wrote:
    pehawk wrote:
    Osprey wrote:
    pehawk wrote:
    The gross negligence would come into play if your psycho kid shot up a school because you didnt lock up your gun properly.

    I understand the argument, but it has nothing to do with insurance and is a unicorn scenario.


    Insurance is for things or situations which can be dangerous or life endangering. Guns qualify now.

    You know I'm right...you're just scared it'll effect you. Which it wont because, I assume, you're responsible.

    Walking down the streets of Seattle is dangerous, should insurance be mandatory for that?


    No, that's not a thing you can insure
    pehawk
    Silver Supporter
    Silver Supporter
     
    Posts: 14946
    Joined: Fri Feb 23, 2007 1:08 pm


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 9:38 pm
  • pehawk wrote:
    Osprey wrote:
    pehawk wrote:
    Osprey wrote:I understand the argument, but it has nothing to do with insurance and is a unicorn scenario.


    Insurance is for things or situations which can be dangerous or life endangering. Guns qualify now.

    You know I'm right...you're just scared it'll effect you. Which it wont because, I assume, you're responsible.

    Walking down the streets of Seattle is dangerous, should insurance be mandatory for that?


    No, that's not a thing you can insure

    Sure you can: Life insurance.
    Osprey
    Silver Supporter
    Silver Supporter
     
    Posts: 870
    Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2010 5:06 pm
    Location: Camas, WA


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 9:59 pm
  • 2_0_6 wrote:Gun on left: 18+ to buy
    Gun on right: 21+ to buy

    Same bullet, same mags, different classification by the ATF.

    Image



    Yeah, so my question is why does that article try to make it sound like classifying the gun on the right as a pistol is a bad thing, when that classification makes it more difficult to purchase.

    Methinks it's because the author is an idiot that knows nothing about guns/gun laws.
    XxXdragonXxX
    NET Veteran
     
    Posts: 2225
    Joined: Sat Mar 03, 2007 3:40 am
    Location: Enumclaw, WA


Re: Mass Shootings
Wed Aug 14, 2019 10:46 pm
  • XxXdragonXxX wrote:
    2_0_6 wrote:Gun on left: 18+ to buy
    Gun on right: 21+ to buy

    Same bullet, same mags, different classification by the ATF.

    Image



    Yeah, so my question is why does that article try to make it sound like classifying the gun on the right as a pistol is a bad thing, when that classification makes it more difficult to purchase.

    Methinks it's because the author is an idiot that knows nothing about guns/gun laws.

    Assault rifle sounds scary, assault pistol not so much.
    Osprey
    Silver Supporter
    Silver Supporter
     
    Posts: 870
    Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2010 5:06 pm
    Location: Camas, WA


Re: Mass Shootings
Thu Aug 15, 2019 9:38 am

Re: Mass Shootings
Thu Aug 15, 2019 9:49 am
  • Gee, Osprey's a Fox news guy....what a surprise!!

    BTW: I agree with the 'what good are laws, if you don't enforce them.' A number of years ago I brought up this exact thing, on .net. :les:
    LymonHawk
    * El Primo *
     
    Posts: 7671
    Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2007 11:52 pm
    Location: Skagit County, WA


Re: Mass Shootings
Thu Aug 15, 2019 10:05 am

Re: Mass Shootings
Thu Aug 15, 2019 10:35 am
  • And criminals also don't care about r@p*, robbery, murder, etc., so why do we have any laws at all? :roll:
    LymonHawk
    * El Primo *
     
    Posts: 7671
    Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2007 11:52 pm
    Location: Skagit County, WA


Re: Mass Shootings
Thu Aug 15, 2019 10:44 am
  • LymonHawk wrote:And criminals also don't care about r@p*, robbery, murder, etc., so why do we have any laws at all? :roll:


    No laws! Awesome.
    2_0_6
    NET Veteran
     
    Posts: 3263
    Joined: Sat Sep 21, 2013 12:40 am
    Location: South Seattle


Re: Mass Shootings
Thu Aug 15, 2019 10:48 am
  • 2_0_6 wrote:
    Just goes to show that criminals do not care about gun laws, and will go to great lengths to get them.


    That'd be a compelling argument if the large majority of mass shootings weren't carried out with legally purchased guns.

    74% since 1982 to be exact.

    https://www.kunc.org/post/1982-74-perce ... y#stream/0

    Fact, there is no statistical case where 1st world societies imposed stricter gun laws that it didn't lessen gun related deaths. Most drastically.

    That's it, that's the only stat that matters in this discussion. Less guns = less gun related deaths and mass shootings.

    I can tell you that reducing 30% of the cars on the road would lessen serious accidents, or less unhealthy food in the stores would reduce heart disease and you'd be like "oh yeah that makes sense."

    But tell people less guns = less gun injuries and deaths, and they yell 'OMG NO THAT'S NOT TRUE!!"

    Crazy world we live in man.
    Sgt. Largent
    NET Pro Bowler
     
    Posts: 15902
    Joined: Mon Oct 01, 2012 11:10 am


Re: Mass Shootings
Thu Aug 15, 2019 10:59 am
  • Sgt. Largent wrote:
    2_0_6 wrote:
    Just goes to show that criminals do not care about gun laws, and will go to great lengths to get them.


    That'd be a compelling argument if the large majority of mass shootings weren't carried out with legally purchased guns.

    74% since 1982 to be exact.

    https://www.kunc.org/post/1982-74-perce ... y#stream/0

    Fact, there is no statistical case where 1st world societies imposed stricter gun laws that it didn't lessen gun related deaths. Most drastically.

    That's it, that's the only stat that matters in this discussion. Less guns = less gun related deaths and mass shootings.

    I can tell you that reducing 30% of the cars on the road would lessen serious accidents, or less unhealthy food in the stores would reduce heart disease and you'd be like "oh yeah that makes sense."

    But tell people less guns = less gun injuries and deaths, and they yell 'OMG NO THAT'S NOT TRUE!!"

    Crazy world we live in man.



    Do a quick search on how many shootings in Chicago happen every week, and how many of them are done by criminals. Yes "mass shootings" are an issue, but if your talking about an apple pie, talk about the whole pie and not just a slice of it.

    As of Monday 8.12, 1639 people have been shot in Chicago alone. A state with VERY strict gun laws, and most of these shootings relate directly to gang incited violence done by people with previous criminal records.

    It is a crazy world we live in, this is why I have taken many, many hours of firearms training courses, shoot regularly, have a concealed license and carry daily.

    Image
    2_0_6
    NET Veteran
     
    Posts: 3263
    Joined: Sat Sep 21, 2013 12:40 am
    Location: South Seattle


Re: Mass Shootings
Thu Aug 15, 2019 11:11 am
  • 2_0_6 wrote:
    As of Monday 8.12, 1639 people have been shot in Chicago alone. A state with VERY strict gun laws, and most of these shootings relate directly to gang incited violence done by people with previous criminal records. ]



    Where do you think those illegally purchased guns are coming from?

    They're coming from the gigantic pool of legally purchased guns over the past decades, and have slipped through the cracks of legal purchase channels.

    Just like with the other excuses like moral decay, video games, etc other countries also have criminals. You reduce guns, there's no other outcome that wouldn't also put less guns in the hands of criminals over time. If something is harder to get, then there will be less of it. How can you come to any other factual conclusion.
    Sgt. Largent
    NET Pro Bowler
     
    Posts: 15902
    Joined: Mon Oct 01, 2012 11:10 am


Re: Mass Shootings
Thu Aug 15, 2019 11:22 am
  • LymonHawk wrote:And criminals also don't care about r@p*, robbery, murder, etc., so why do we have any laws at all? :roll:

    Laws sure, but no one (outside of academia) suggests you should be licensed to have $ex and complete a consent form for each transaction. :stirthepot:
    Osprey
    Silver Supporter
    Silver Supporter
     
    Posts: 870
    Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2010 5:06 pm
    Location: Camas, WA


PreviousNext


It is currently Fri Dec 06, 2019 8:31 am

Please REGISTER to become a member

Return to [ THE .NET LOUNGE ]




Information
  • Who is online
  • Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 35 guests