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Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)

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Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Tue Dec 19, 2017 5:06 pm
  • I'm creating this topic because the other one only has a spoiler warning for The Force Awakens in it's title.

    So, I saw this last night, and I think the haters can go suck eggs. I loved it, and I'm a veteran hardcore Star Wars nerd (I read all the books). Yeah, it subverted some tropes, but you need to do that once in awhile to stay fresh. As for people complaining about the humor, you've clearly never seen a Star Wars film before. My only real complaint is that Canto Bight felt like a complete waste of time and somewhat hamfisted. I have to mention, as a Star Wars fanboy, I got goosebumps when Chewie and Rey baited the fighters into the canyon on Crait and John Williams broke out Tie Fighter Attack from A New Hope, easily one of the best and most underused themes from Star Wars.

    (This theme, in case you're wondering:)

    9/10, will see again.

    BTW, this is my rankings all the movies. My first list is with the theaterical cuts of the original trilogy, the second is with the *shudder* special editions. And yes, that does make a difference.

    1. Return of the Jedi
    2. The Empire Strikes Back
    3. The Last Jedi
    4. A New Hope
    5. Rogue One
    6. The Force Awakens
    7. Revenge of the Sith
    8. The Phantom Menace
    9. Attack of the Clones (Yes, this IS objectively the WORST Star Wars film. Yes, worse then The Phantom Menace. Everything other ranking on this list is opinion, but this one is a fact.)

    1. The Empire Strikes Back
    2. The Last Jedi
    3. A New Hope
    4. Rogue One
    5. Return of the Jedi (Yes, the Special Edition ruined this movie and only scratched the others. I won't go into detail, but it's all down to Vader's scream.)
    6. The Force Awakens
    7. Revenge of the Sith
    8. The Phantom Menace
    9. Attack of the Clones
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Tue Dec 19, 2017 6:02 pm
  • Thank you for creating this. It felt weird posting my thoughts on a 2-yr-old thread for a completely different film. I gave it a solid 7.5/10 banthas.

    My peeves:
    1) when the hell did Leia become a force-floater? That whole sequence was odd
    2) the second act was way too long, and I suspect was only to squeeze in some celeb cameos in the casino. This could have been pared down 20-30 min and condensed the film to a more reasonable 2 hours
    3) still no Lando? Dammit! He would have been a great resource to find a codebreaker
    4) Snoke. We still know nothing about him, and now have no reason to care. Missed opportunity here, unless they plan to flesh him out in a spin-off
    5) the irreverence when Admiral Akbar bit it. Just a passing, almost dismissive reference to the demise of the crustacean that led the attack on Death Star II?
    6) still no trailer for Solo? It’s only 5 months away!!!

    There may be more, but that’s all that came to mind right now. All of that said, this rates as my third favorite film, just between IV & VI.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Tue Dec 19, 2017 7:05 pm
  • Maulbert, don't think I could agree with your post more. It's almost as if I'm reading my own post. Even your list is almost the same.

    Finn too, I agree with most of what you wrote. I won't be super disappointed though if we never get more Snoke. I really don't need to know where he came from in the movies. I can live with that in a book or comic to be honest. I mean think about it, in ESB & ROTJ we had absolutely no back story and no explanation of who Palps was or where he came from. Don't remember that bothering anybody. So I'm good with it.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Tue Dec 19, 2017 7:27 pm
  • Zebulon Dak wrote:Maulbert, don't think I could agree with your post more. It's almost as if I'm reading my own post. Even your list is almost the same.

    Interesting, because I could have sworn you disagreed with me vehemently about TFA. He ranks TFA as the worst of the new films in both lists, but I never got that impression from your discussions on it on this forum.

    *shrug*

    In any case, I personally think TLJ is significantly better than TFA, and it worries me a little because Abrams is returning for IX.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Tue Dec 19, 2017 7:29 pm
  • RolandDeschain wrote:
    Zebulon Dak wrote:Maulbert, don't think I could agree with your post more. It's almost as if I'm reading my own post. Even your list is almost the same.

    Interesting, because I could have sworn you disagreed with me vehemently about TFA. He ranks TFA as the worst of the new films in both lists, but I never got that impression from your discussions on it on this forum.

    *shrug*

    In any case, I personally think TLJ is significantly better than TFA, and it worries me a little because Abrams is returning for IX.


    The difference is, I love TFA. The gap between TFA and RotS is gargantuan. The only things I love about the prequels are Obi-Wan, Qui-Gon, Darth Maul, and the lightsaber duels. BTW, I don't hate the prequels (Except AotC). I just don't love them.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Tue Dec 19, 2017 7:34 pm
  • RolandDeschain wrote:
    Zebulon Dak wrote:Maulbert, don't think I could agree with your post more. It's almost as if I'm reading my own post. Even your list is almost the same.

    Interesting, because I could have sworn you disagreed with me vehemently about TFA. He ranks TFA as the worst of the new films in both lists, but I never got that impression from your discussions on it on this forum.


    I go back & forth on whether I like TFA or RO better. I love them both. I don't think I can honestly rank either of them above anything in the OT but who knows with time. If that's not a solid enough explanation for you then by all means bring it up again and I'll attempt to further clear things up for you.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Tue Dec 19, 2017 7:38 pm
  • Zebulon Dak wrote:Maulbert, don't think I could agree with your post more. It's almost as if I'm reading my own post. Even your list is almost the same.

    Finn too, I agree with most of what you wrote. I won't be super disappointed though if we never get more Snoke. I really don't need to know where he came from in the movies. I can live with that in a book or comic to be honest. I mean think about it, in ESB & ROTJ we had absolutely no back story and no explanation of who Palps was or where he came from. Don't remember that bothering anybody. So I'm good with it.


    Honestly, I wonder if they had nowhere interesting to take Snoke, who was very bland and generic, so Rian Johnson decided to make use of him to make Kylo Ren far more interesting. I think that's about the best they could have done, as I mentioned before, using him to subvert a trope.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Tue Dec 19, 2017 7:43 pm
  • I think Maulbert read the phrase "subvert a trope" somewhere and is now addicted to it. :lol:
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Tue Dec 19, 2017 7:44 pm
  • Really enjoyed this movie.

    Thought 5-6 scenes were up there with if not better than anything in previous Star Wars movies.

    I know it’s a hotly debated item, but I really enjoyed the theme of the movie.. the complications around heroism and hero worship as well as building a platform for a new generation of Star Wars fans. I liked the expansion and simplification of “the Force.” Some very good thenes that set up future movies as well.

    There are some issues. Finns side story wasn’t deep. But again, I enjoyed that Del Torris character turns out to be a jerk.. and not a new Han. Some of the humor was ill placed.

    Still.. a great Star Wars movie.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Tue Dec 19, 2017 7:47 pm
  • So, one thing I haven't seen discussed yet on this forum: What did everyone think about how they got rid of Luke? I thought the method was kind of "meh" personally; he deserved something more epic than "I concentrated really hard and fainted away into the afterlife," IMO.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Tue Dec 19, 2017 7:48 pm
  • RolandDeschain wrote:I think Maulbert read the phrase "subvert a trope" somewhere and is now addicted to it. :lol:


    Sorry if you think I'm wrong. Would you prefer it if Episode IX ended with Snoke electrocuting Rey and Kylo throwing him down a shaft?
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Tue Dec 19, 2017 7:51 pm
  • RolandDeschain wrote:So, one thing I haven't seen discussed yet on this forum: What did everyone think about how they got rid of Luke? I thought the method was kind of "meh" personally; he deserved something more epic than "I concentrated really hard and fainted away into the afterlife," IMO.

    It's heavily implied that kind of projection requires massive power, which is why he died. He used his coporeal body as a conduit for the Force, and since he was much older, the strain was too great.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Tue Dec 19, 2017 7:55 pm
  • RolandDeschain wrote:So, one thing I haven't seen discussed yet on this forum: What did everyone think about how they got rid of Luke? I thought the method was kind of "meh" personally; he deserved something more epic than "I concentrated really hard and fainted away into the afterlife," IMO.


    I thought it was great. He used the force in a way we hadn’t seen before and to save the lives of a handful of people, it was so different than walking into Jabbas fortress with a light saber and no plan. He saved the remainder of the rebellion that was still fighting the battle he probably thought he’d won at return of the Jedi.

    Seen was intense and well shot, with call backs to the original.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Tue Dec 19, 2017 7:58 pm
  • Uncle Si wrote:
    RolandDeschain wrote:So, one thing I haven't seen discussed yet on this forum: What did everyone think about how they got rid of Luke? I thought the method was kind of "meh" personally; he deserved something more epic than "I concentrated really hard and fainted away into the afterlife," IMO.


    I thought it was great. He used the force in a way we hadn’t seen before and to save the lives of a handful of people, it was so different than walking into Jabbas fortress with a light saber and no plan. He saved the remainder of the rebellion that was still fighting the battle he probably thought he’d won at return of the Jedi.

    Seen was intense and well shot, with call backs to the original.


    That shot, the moment when he says "the rebellion is reborn" and we see Poe, Leia & 3PO with the light kind of fade up in slow motion, goddam beautiful.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Tue Dec 19, 2017 8:25 pm
  • Maulbert wrote:Sorry if you think I'm wrong. Would you prefer it if Episode IX ended with Snoke electrocuting Rey and Kylo throwing him down a shaft?

    I didn't say anything about whether I thought you were wrong or not. I don't even understand how you came to that conclusion. Don't be so sensitive.

    Maulbert wrote:It's heavily implied that kind of projection requires massive power, which is why he died. He used his coporeal body as a conduit for the Force, and since he was much older, the strain was too great.

    Yes, thanks, everybody knows this. I understand it; I just don't think it was an epic send-off for Luke Skywalker, kin of the Lady Vader, to make a reference to the EU.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Tue Dec 19, 2017 8:36 pm
  • RolandDeschain wrote:
    Maulbert wrote:Sorry if you think I'm wrong. Would you prefer it if Episode IX ended with Snoke electrocuting Rey and Kylo throwing him down a shaft?

    I didn't say anything about whether I thought you were wrong or not. I don't even understand how you came to that conclusion. Don't be so sensitive.

    Maulbert wrote:It's heavily implied that kind of projection requires massive power, which is why he died. He used his coporeal body as a conduit for the Force, and since he was much older, the strain was too great.

    Yes, thanks, everybody knows this. I understand it; I just don't think it was an epic send-off for Luke Skywalker, kin of the Lady Vader, to make a reference to the EU.


    I think it was more epic than the deaths Yoda or Obi got, which was pretty obviously the inspirations for how this went. But I'll be honest, it didn't really move me the first time I watched it. I didn't notice the twin suns though, so on second watch when I did it was a much more poignant moment.

    Somebody said to me that if he was just going to "die" anyway, he should have just gone to Crate and actually battled Kylo. If he'd died doing that, do you think that would have been more fitting?
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Tue Dec 19, 2017 8:43 pm
  • I thought it was epic.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Tue Dec 19, 2017 8:49 pm
  • Zebulon Dak wrote:
    RolandDeschain wrote:
    Maulbert wrote:Sorry if you think I'm wrong. Would you prefer it if Episode IX ended with Snoke electrocuting Rey and Kylo throwing him down a shaft?

    I didn't say anything about whether I thought you were wrong or not. I don't even understand how you came to that conclusion. Don't be so sensitive.

    Maulbert wrote:It's heavily implied that kind of projection requires massive power, which is why he died. He used his coporeal body as a conduit for the Force, and since he was much older, the strain was too great.

    Yes, thanks, everybody knows this. I understand it; I just don't think it was an epic send-off for Luke Skywalker, kin of the Lady Vader, to make a reference to the EU.


    I think it was more epic than the deaths Yoda or Obi got, which was pretty obviously the inspirations for how this went. But I'll be honest, it didn't really move me the first time I watched it. I didn't notice the twin suns though, so on second watch when I did it was a much more poignant moment.

    Somebody said to me that if he was just going to "die" anyway, he should have just gone to Crate and actually battled Kylo. If he'd died doing that, do you think that would have been more fitting?


    Honestly, the fact that he tricked the First Order made it seem more epic to me.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Tue Dec 19, 2017 9:16 pm
  • A sure sign of franchise fatigue in any series is when they start making each generation more and more powerful.

    Power inflation.

    It's lazy writing for one.

    Darth Vader was supposed to have ultimate force potential, and Luke was powerful - but not on the same level as his father, or Yoda, or any of that. It was his purity of heart and decency that won the day.

    Now along comes the new generation...

    Somehow Kylo is just massively powerful, and then Rey, "I've only seen this power once..."

    She doesn't have to even come close to finishing her training to be all uber -- she can just square off with Kylo "because".

    Suddenly the force isn't this mystical thing that surrounds us, it's a cheap magic trick.

    DRAGONBALL Z FORCE BABY! I've got the ultimate power now!

    Stupid, stupid, stupid.

    The best written heroes are always the underdogs who earn their way despite having the odds against them. It's Frodo Baggins, it's Jon Snow, it's Luke freaking Skywalker... they weren't the ultimate power in their setting, they were just heroes who did the right thing.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Tue Dec 19, 2017 9:31 pm
  • All the reasons you stated for Luke could be true of Rey. Or it’s something different and unforeseen.

    Lazy would be regurgitating the same story (Hobbitt; Lord of the Rings) over and over.

    Why make three new movies if people just want them to be the same as the old ones.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Tue Dec 19, 2017 9:33 pm
  • One of my main fundamental issues with the new trilogy is that using the force came too easy to Rey. It doesn't ruin anything for me but it's definitely something I've had to accept.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Tue Dec 19, 2017 10:16 pm
  • The_Z_Man wrote:A sure sign of franchise fatigue in any series is when they start making each generation more and more powerful.

    Power inflation.

    It's lazy writing for one.

    Darth Vader was supposed to have ultimate force potential, and Luke was powerful - but not on the same level as his father, or Yoda, or any of that. It was his purity of heart and decency that won the day.

    Now along comes the new generation...

    Somehow Kylo is just massively powerful, and then Rey, "I've only seen this power once..."

    She doesn't have to even come close to finishing her training to be all uber -- she can just square off with Kylo "because".

    Suddenly the force isn't this mystical thing that surrounds us, it's a cheap magic trick.

    DRAGONBALL Z FORCE BABY! I've got the ultimate power now!

    Stupid, stupid, stupid.

    The best written heroes are always the underdogs who earn their way despite having the odds against them. It's Frodo Baggins, it's Jon Snow, it's Luke freaking Skywalker... they weren't the ultimate power in their setting, they were just heroes who did the right thing.


    Zebulon Dak wrote:One of my main fundamental issues with the new trilogy is that using the force came too easy to Rey. It doesn't ruin anything for me but it's definitely something I've had to accept.


    As I understand it, Jakku was a force nexus that amplified and focused Rey's power, which allowed her to weild it so easily. She clearly had some fight training, and whether she knew it or not, she was always drawing on the Force when she scavenged. The fact is, Luke instinctively knew how to draw upon the Force to target Womprats on Tatooine. The only thing Ben did was to tell him to rely on his instincts. I see Rey as an outgrowth of the same idea.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Wed Dec 20, 2017 1:17 am
  • Yeah I get it. Like I said, it didn't ruin it for me and I don't even think it's wrong, it's just something I had to learn to accept.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Wed Dec 20, 2017 8:17 am
  • Zebulon Dak wrote:One of my main fundamental issues with the new trilogy is that using the force came too easy to Rey. It doesn't ruin anything for me but it's definitely something I've had to accept.


    You also see the force being used and described in new ways. I think it's an idea that is significant to the new direction, that its not isolated to just a few, but maybe within a lot more people than previously intimated by the other movies. Luke reflects on that with his determination that the Jedi can fade away.


    As I said, I really liked the changes in the theme this movie presented. It was less political, less traditional and more philosophical. Heroes are fallible. Balance requires sacrifice. Then they die. Wars rage on. New heroes take their place, renewing the fight with the lessons learned by the success and failure of their predecessors.

    Someone said in the other post that it felt like the old trilogy was thrown in a dumpster. I disagree. The concepts are the same, just with new faces. Luke's sacrifice to save the rebellion and his sister is no less dramatic and epic than Vaders or Obi Won's.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Wed Dec 20, 2017 9:41 am
  • 1. Raise fascinating new characters and subplots
    2. Work overtime in interviews to plug said characters and subplots
    3. Kill them off in TLJ without any interesting revelations of any kind*
    4. ???
    5. Profit

    That was my hangup. If you don't want to chase those rabbit holes down, don't pose them in the first place.

    Didn't really care about SuperLeia one way or the other. At least she got to manifest the Force in some way before going off-screen. Wish she'd gotten a heroic death, though.

    The entire First Order being stumped by HoloLuke didn't land well. I prefer my antagonists smart (like Uncle Si).

    Too much filler (mutiny and casino subplots).

    I'm of two minds about the Yoda scene. On one hand, I thought Forceghosts couldn't "interfere" (Kenobi's words). Wiping out the last of the ancient Jedi religion with a bolt of lightning certainly feels like interfering. On the other hand, his action did feel right somehow. Something Yoda would do.

    And where is the big impetus for IX now? Isn't the First Order pretty much dead? Holdo wiped out Snoke and most of their fleet, didn't she? I guess the movies haven't given us much of an impression of their fleet's size. They don't feel like the overarching Empire so much as Empire upstarts trying to fill a vacuum.

    So, yah. Not that good.

    * I didn't mind Rey's parents turning out to be drunks. That felt kinda truthful, and impactful to the character. Fans were disappointed that her lineage wasn't more interesting, but at least we were sharing the disappointment with Rey in that instance.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Wed Dec 20, 2017 9:52 am
  • MontanaHawk05 wrote:1. Raise fascinating new characters and subplots
    2. Work overtime in interviews to plug said characters and subplots
    3. Kill them off in TLJ without any interesting revelations of any kind*
    4. ???
    5. Profit

    That was my hangup. If you don't want to chase those rabbit holes down, don't pose them in the first place.

    Didn't really care about SuperLeia one way or the other. At least she got to manifest the Force in some way before going off-screen. Wish she'd gotten a heroic death, though.

    The entire First Order being stumped by HoloLuke didn't land well. I prefer my antagonists smart (like Uncle Si).


    I'm of two minds about the Yoda scene. On one hand, I thought Forceghosts couldn't "interfere" (Kenobi's words). Wiping out the last of the ancient Jedi religion with a bolt of lightning certainly feels like interfering. On the other hand, his action did feel right somehow. Something Yoda would do.

    And where is the big impetus for IX now? Isn't the First Order pretty much dead? Holdo wiped out Snoke and most of their fleet, didn't she? I guess the movies haven't given us much of an impression of their fleet's size. They don't feel like the overarching Empire so much as Empire upstarts trying to fill a vacuum.

    So, yah. Not that good.

    * I didn't mind Rey's parents turning out to be drunks. That felt kinda truthful, and impactful to the character. Fans were disappointed that her lineage wasn't more interesting, but at least we were sharing the disappointment with Rey in that instance.


    This was interesting as well... in that the end indicated that Rey had the books. Its seems Yoda used the same trick Luke would later use against Ren on the salt planet.

    rest of this is similar to my concerns. However, I felt the strong far outweighed the weak. I am very curious to see how JJ picks up the story. The direction seems far out of his realm
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Wed Dec 20, 2017 11:49 am
  • RolandDeschain wrote:
    Maulbert wrote:Sorry if you think I'm wrong. Would you prefer it if Episode IX ended with Snoke electrocuting Rey and Kylo throwing him down a shaft?

    I didn't say anything about whether I thought you were wrong or not. I don't even understand how you came to that conclusion. Don't be so sensitive.

    Maulbert wrote:It's heavily implied that kind of projection requires massive power, which is why he died. He used his coporeal body as a conduit for the Force, and since he was much older, the strain was too great.

    Yes, thanks, everybody knows this. I understand it; I just don't think it was an epic send-off for Luke Skywalker, kin of the Lady Vader, to make a reference to the EU.


    How does everyone understand this? Is there an interview out there that tells people this? My belief is he did the same thing Obi-won did. He allowed/made the force to take him. Where does this it takes power thing come from? My understanding from the movies is a person has a deep connection or they do not. (Or a high midichlorian count :( ....
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Wed Dec 20, 2017 12:03 pm
  • Uncle Si wrote:
    Zebulon Dak wrote:One of my main fundamental issues with the new trilogy is that using the force came too easy to Rey. It doesn't ruin anything for me but it's definitely something I've had to accept.


    You also see the force being used and described in new ways. I think it's an idea that is significant to the new direction, that its not isolated to just a few, but maybe within a lot more people than previously intimated by the other movies. Luke reflects on that with his determination that the Jedi can fade away.


    In Heir to The Jedi, one of the first "new canon" novels, set between A New Hope and Empire Strikes Back, Luke is trying to figure out all this stuff with the Force. He's basically in the same boat as Rey at the beginning of TLJ, only he's had a very small bit of training from Obi-Wan.

    So there's a particular scene where Luke is attempting to move a noodle or a worm or something across his plate with the Force and he's having the damnedest time figuring it out. I understand that Rey is supposed to be inherently more powerful in the Force than he is but I just can't help but feel like it stood out as a little inconsistent. But I guess maybe she is just that much better at it than him and that's something I have to accept. Which is fine. It's nit picky anyway, just something my brain wouldn't let me ignore.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Wed Dec 20, 2017 12:07 pm
  • Fudwamper wrote:
    RolandDeschain wrote:
    Maulbert wrote:Sorry if you think I'm wrong. Would you prefer it if Episode IX ended with Snoke electrocuting Rey and Kylo throwing him down a shaft?

    I didn't say anything about whether I thought you were wrong or not. I don't even understand how you came to that conclusion. Don't be so sensitive.

    Maulbert wrote:It's heavily implied that kind of projection requires massive power, which is why he died. He used his coporeal body as a conduit for the Force, and since he was much older, the strain was too great.

    Yes, thanks, everybody knows this. I understand it; I just don't think it was an epic send-off for Luke Skywalker, kin of the Lady Vader, to make a reference to the EU.


    How does everyone understand this? Is there an interview out there that tells people this? My belief is he did the same thing Obi-won did. He allowed/made the force to take him. Where does this it takes power thing come from? My understanding from the movies is a person has a deep connection or they do not. (Or a high midichlorian count :( ....


    I think you're both right. They bring up that it would take a lot of effort to accomplish something like that and they show that he is clearly spent after doing it, but then they essentially let him go exactly the way they did Obi. Did that have to kill him? Probably not. But he was ready to go. Same as Yoda. And I'd bet my left nut he'll be back as a Force ghost. "Nobody is ever truly gone". "See you 'round, kid."
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Wed Dec 20, 2017 2:02 pm
  • Zebulon Dak wrote:
    Fudwamper wrote:
    RolandDeschain wrote:
    Maulbert wrote:Sorry if you think I'm wrong. Would you prefer it if Episode IX ended with Snoke electrocuting Rey and Kylo throwing him down a shaft?

    I didn't say anything about whether I thought you were wrong or not. I don't even understand how you came to that conclusion. Don't be so sensitive.

    Maulbert wrote:It's heavily implied that kind of projection requires massive power, which is why he died. He used his coporeal body as a conduit for the Force, and since he was much older, the strain was too great.

    Yes, thanks, everybody knows this. I understand it; I just don't think it was an epic send-off for Luke Skywalker, kin of the Lady Vader, to make a reference to the EU.


    How does everyone understand this? Is there an interview out there that tells people this? My belief is he did the same thing Obi-won did. He allowed/made the force to take him. Where does this it takes power thing come from? My understanding from the movies is a person has a deep connection or they do not. (Or a high midichlorian count :( ....


    I think you're both right. They bring up that it would take a lot of effort to accomplish something like that and they show that he is clearly spent after doing it, but then they essentially let him go exactly the way they did Obi. Did that have to kill him? Probably not. But he was ready to go. Same as Yoda. And I'd bet my left nut he'll be back as a Force ghost. "Nobody is ever truly gone". "See you 'round, kid."


    Especially considering Carrie Fisher passed away. I have no doubt Force Ghost Luke will be back. Now just give us the hero of Tanaab, Disney....
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Wed Dec 20, 2017 2:50 pm
  • Seems obvious that some have missed the point when it comes to the force, who can wield it, and why.

    It's almost like sports fandom or thinking that god wins elections or frickin football games because of some sort of odd self righteousness. Luke was important because he understood this...eventually. Even said as much in the movie. Rey seems to be able to see this herself almost by not having the sort of religious doctrines of the jedi order. Even Snoke knew that the force would eventually counter the darkness of yet another powerful Skywalker.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Wed Dec 20, 2017 2:53 pm
  • In that respect I was happy with Rey's parents being no one even though I wanted it to be Galen Marek and Juno Eclipse so I could get 3 live action Starkiller movies.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Wed Dec 20, 2017 3:27 pm
  • Uncle Si wrote:
    MontanaHawk05 wrote:I'm of two minds about the Yoda scene. On one hand, I thought Forceghosts couldn't "interfere" (Kenobi's words). Wiping out the last of the ancient Jedi religion with a bolt of lightning certainly feels like interfering. On the other hand, his action did feel right somehow. Something Yoda would do.


    This was interesting as well... in that the end indicated that Rey had the books. Its seems Yoda used the same trick Luke would later use against Ren on the salt planet.


    FWIW I'm pretty sure at this point Yoda knew that Rey already had the books so all he really did was burn down an old ass tree stump.

    Related, Luke's "BUT THEY'RE THE ANCIENT JEDI TEXTS!!!" had me cracking up in the theater, even if I was the only one doing so.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Wed Dec 20, 2017 4:54 pm
  • I could have done without Luke milking that creature. That was just odd.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Wed Dec 20, 2017 5:00 pm
  • JSeahawks wrote:I could have done without Luke milking that creature. That was just odd.


    Definitely didn't need the close up on the titties hahaha.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Wed Dec 20, 2017 5:28 pm
  • Fudwamper wrote:How does everyone understand this? Is there an interview out there that tells people this? My belief is he did the same thing Obi-won did. He allowed/made the force to take him. Where does this it takes power thing come from? My understanding from the movies is a person has a deep connection or they do not. (Or a high midichlorian count :( ....

    I'm pretty sure he was referring to the force projection Luke did across the galaxy; not the act of disappearing into the force.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Wed Dec 20, 2017 5:35 pm
  • RolandDeschain wrote:
    Fudwamper wrote:How does everyone understand this? Is there an interview out there that tells people this? My belief is he did the same thing Obi-won did. He allowed/made the force to take him. Where does this it takes power thing come from? My understanding from the movies is a person has a deep connection or they do not. (Or a high midichlorian count :( ....

    I'm pretty sure he was referring to the force projection Luke did across the galaxy; not the act of disappearing into the force.


    I think Fudwamper was referring to YOUR comment that everyone understood why Luke died, not my explanation of it.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Wed Dec 20, 2017 5:36 pm
  • Maulbert wrote:I think Fudwamper was referring to YOUR comment that everyone understood why Luke died, not my explanation of it.

    CONFUSION ALL AROUND!

    I've also been drinking with a friend this afternoon... :D

    My original reply to you was just saying yeah I know about needing lots o' force energies and the like.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Wed Dec 20, 2017 5:45 pm
  • RolandDeschain wrote:
    Maulbert wrote:I think Fudwamper was referring to YOUR comment that everyone understood why Luke died, not my explanation of it.

    CONFUSION ALL AROUND!

    I've also been drinking with a friend this afternoon... :D

    My original reply to you was just saying yeah I know about needing lots o' force energies and the like.


    No worries. All in fun. :)
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Wed Dec 20, 2017 5:57 pm
  • vin.couve12 wrote:In that respect I was happy with Rey's parents being no one even though I wanted it to be Galen Marek and Juno Eclipse so I could get 3 live action Starkiller movies.


    The guy who played Galen Marek (Sam Witwer, who is also Darth Maul in Clone Wars/Rebels and Emperor Palpatine in Rebels) is a huge Star Wars nerd and actually part of a Star Wars trivia league run by Collider (part of a league called the Movie Trivia Schmoedown).





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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Wed Dec 20, 2017 9:11 pm
  • Zebulon Dak wrote:
    JSeahawks wrote:I could have done without Luke milking that creature. That was just odd.


    Definitely didn't need the close up on the titties hahaha.


    It’s a call ha k to the original. He drinks the same green milk at the first dinner scene with his Aunt and Uncle. Plus.. sorta distanced him further from “Luke Skywalker Jedi Legend”
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Wed Dec 20, 2017 9:33 pm
  • Uncle Si wrote:
    Zebulon Dak wrote:
    JSeahawks wrote:I could have done without Luke milking that creature. That was just odd.


    Definitely didn't need the close up on the titties hahaha.


    It’s a call ha k to the original. He drinks the same green milk at the first dinner scene with his Aunt and Uncle. Plus.. sorta distanced him further from “Luke Skywalker Jedi Legend”


    This might be the nerdiest thing I've ever wrote, but the original milk in Episode 4 was blue milk. Bantha milk. And we didn't have to see no titties. So same same, but different haha.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Wed Dec 20, 2017 10:32 pm
  • Maulbert wrote:
    vin.couve12 wrote:In that respect I was happy with Rey's parents being no one even though I wanted it to be Galen Marek and Juno Eclipse so I could get 3 live action Starkiller movies.


    The guy who played Galen Marek (Sam Witwer, who is also Darth Maul in Clone Wars/Rebels and Emperor Palpatine in Rebels) is a huge Star Wars nerd and actually part of a Star Wars trivia league run by Collider (part of a league called the Movie Trivia Schmoedown).


    :2thumbs: Nice! I did not know....
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Thu Dec 21, 2017 8:59 am
  • Maulbert wrote:
    RolandDeschain wrote:
    Fudwamper wrote:How does everyone understand this? Is there an interview out there that tells people this? My belief is he did the same thing Obi-won did. He allowed/made the force to take him. Where does this it takes power thing come from? My understanding from the movies is a person has a deep connection or they do not. (Or a high midichlorian count :( ....

    I'm pretty sure he was referring to the force projection Luke did across the galaxy; not the act of disappearing into the force.


    I think Fudwamper was referring to YOUR comment that everyone understood why Luke died, not my explanation of it.


    Yea I was referring to Luke dieing. I have never seen anything that relates using the Force and having an impact on the user.

    I did not get the whole multiple Rey/darkside scene. I think I missed something in that.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Thu Dec 21, 2017 2:55 pm
  • Saw it today. Thought the first half was good but a little slow, but the second half was amazing.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Thu Dec 21, 2017 6:23 pm
  • Fudwamper wrote:I have never seen anything that relates using the Force and having an impact on the user.


    Except you have, unless you didn't see Revenge of the Sith.

    Check 3:08.

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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Thu Dec 21, 2017 7:56 pm
  • Sort of like a....exceeding your mana or magica limits where it cannibalizes off your HP. lol
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Thu Dec 21, 2017 9:36 pm
  • vin.couve12 wrote:Sort of like a....exceeding your mana or magica limits where it cannibalizes off your HP. lol


    I'm totally impressed by your nerdiness.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Fri Dec 22, 2017 1:20 am
  • Also, I might add, in The Last Jedi, Kylo realizes that Rey isn't projecting into his mind because mustering the power would have killed her, and that was a simple mind link. Luke created a coporeal duplicate (remember, he touched Leia's hand and kissed her forehead), not to mention everybody saw him, not just Kylo and Leia. Even C-3P0! If a mind link could kill someone, it's surprising he maintained a full cross-galaxy projection as long as he did.
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Re: Star Wars: The Last Jedi (SPOILERS!)
Fri Dec 22, 2017 7:57 am
  • This was simply a bad movie. TFA was derivative, but introduced some likable new characters to the franchise. TLJ was just a mess.

    1) Plot: Slow speed chase of Empire fleet trying to catch Rebel corvette to eradicate last remnants of resistance. SLOW. SPEED. CHASE. Really? The empire with all their technical wizardry have no solution to catch the sea cow of spaceships? What happened to the Tie Fighters? They couldn't be scrambled to knock out shields, run interference? Furthermore, why didn't the resistance just hyperspace over to their salty safety planet and preserve their fleet, considering that the First Order would have tracked them either way? This moronic plot device sets up even dumber subplots.

    2) Subplot #1: leave the main ship to streak across the galaxy to find a hacker at a casino who will be identified by. a... broach. Streak back to Snoke's ship, sneak aboard and knock out a hyperspace tracker. If I pitched this to any of you guys you would have been like - "WTF? That's stupid". Yes it is. The super cheesy CGI in the casino only amplified its awfulness.

    3) Subplot #2: Poe mutinies. Why? Because he does not know the plan to launch the escape shuttles and send them to a fortified outpost. Why isn't this disclosed? Why doesn't the inept Rebel leadership simply share this with one of the heroes of their cause? We wouldn't have to waste an hour of the movie on inane misadventures.

    4) Snoke. Let's set up this hackneyed pantomime villain, make him the genius that reconstitutes the tattered empire into the dominant First Order, give him godly force powers.... and then slay him in 3 seconds without ever explaining, who he was, where he came from, or why we should care.

    5) Luke Skywalker - If you are going to kill him off anyway, why not let him go out in a blaze of glory? Astral projection? That's the best you got? This is the guy who killed a Rancor, faced down the emperor, blew up a death star, redeemed Darth Vader and you make him a prop? How epic would one last fight between he and the Empire have been - where all the powers Luke learned and cultivated could be fully unleashed? His death was the definition of anti-climax.

    BTW, Hollywood cannot comprehend that there are actual heroes in the universe that recognize evil for what it is and reject it. Hollywood loves moral relativism, anti-heroes, internal conflict - (at least within men - women, of course, are vessels of pure light). I am okay with Luke questioning his faith - but he was intimately aware, like no other person in the galaxy, with what the dark side creates: slavery and death. That he, with that knowledge would de-enlist himself from the battle against the Dark side is a betrayal of the character as we know him. That the person who redeemed Darth Vader would be cowed by the prospect of redeeming Kylo is just illogical.

    6) Leia - Force bubble. Oh dear. Can we still call Star Wars science fiction? Shouldn't there be some understanding of science and what happens to the human body when exposed to -450F degrees in space? Also, Carrie Fisher could barely emote with that scotch tape face-lift and botox. I found her off putting in every scene.

    7) Rey - I like Daisy Ridley but she doesn't have much to work with. She is a completely one dimensional character with zero weaknesses.

    8) Deus Ex Machinas Everywhere: We need a hacker. Oops we're in prison... coincidentally with a hacker....who later rescues us...and gets us on board Snoke's ship... then double-crosses us....now we're going to be executed... but Snoke's ship is serendipitously damaged before they can kill us....but the hangar bay is in ruins with ships exploding all around us... oh dear what shall we do....wait there is perfectly intact imperial shuttle over there amidst the fiery rubble... and it's right by the exit door - huzzah!

    We are in a slow speed chase bleeding fuel and watching the last remnants of the resistance get picked off one by one... that's cool cuz we know there is a salty safety planet only a few parsecs away with a giant impregnable door... "Ha ha" says the empire "we have a mini-death star door destroying cannon...so there"...yes, but the resistance has crystal kitties that show them a backdoor....but it's blocked by tons of boulders....enter Super Rey! huzzah!

    9) Light saber battles. What happened with Snoke''s henchman? The Light-saber is arguably the coolest weapon ever imagined. The duels are probably the most exciting parts of the movies. But this was so feebly choreographed that I just wanted it to be over. Where were the gymnastics? Environmental force attacks, etc? It was just so perfunctory and the costumes on the henchmen looked like something from Flash Gordon - not menacing like the Sith priests in the OT.

    10) CGI - How is it that Gollum 17 years ago looked more realistic than Snoke? All of the CGI in the casino, especially the floppy eared horses, was terribad. Disney has billions. How does this happen?

    Anyway, I've wasted enough time. Has our society become so dumbed down that the obvious absurdities in movies like this are no longer apparent? We live in a post Game of Thrones world. These writers need to trust that audiences are a little more sophisticated now and stop pandering to the CBS sitcom crowd. Plots need to make sense.
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