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Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk

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Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Tue May 29, 2018 10:22 am
  • Anybody wanna talk Solo spoilers? Well I wanna talk Solo spoilers. So let's do it.

    Might as well get the big one out of the way first, how did you feel about Maul? What do you think it means going forward? We're suddenly forced to accept that Qi'ra is not only a high-up mobster in the Crimson Dawn crime syndicate, but working directly under a former Sith Lord. Considering the unlikelihood (IMO) that we get an actual, direct sequel to this movie, how do we process all of this and where does it lead?

    Personally, I thought it was great to see Maul. He was probably the coolest part of the prequels (PT), though criminally underutilized, and his re-emergence and presence in Clone Wars and Rebels has been one of the more interesting and entertaining parts of the animated universe.

    So at this point it's been reported that we're getting a Boba Fett movie, written and directed by James Mangold. That's certainly a very exciting thought. Nothing officially confirmed by Lucasfilm yet, but it's the most solid rumor we've gotten about a third anthology film. If it turns out to be true, if we do get this Boba Fett movie, or a "Bounty Hunters" movie of some sort, do you think they tie it in directly with the events of Solo? Or do you think they do something more truly "stand alone"?

    I had a thought the other night after my second watch of Solo. The movie feels like it fits in well with Rogue One (albeit, more lighthearted). I really enjoyed the brief development we got of Enfys Nest. Definitely put off a bit of a Boba Fett/Mandalorian vibe, with a connection to the rebellion. Plus she had Two Tubes with her (Saw Gererra/Rogue One connection). If they were to expand on that character (which I think they want to do, otherwise why introduce her the way they did? plus it just fits with what they're doing i.e. young female, person of color etc) either in the Boba Fett/Bounty Hunter movie, or in some sort of sequel to Solo, and then tie that in with Saw Gererra & Rogue One, we'd essentially have ourselves a new trilogy between the PT & the OT. I'm calling this my "secret trilogy theory" for fun but I think it would be a really cool, sort of unexpected way to loosely connect all these events. Now whether any of that includes Qi'ra or Maul, I don't know. I think it could, and that could be cool, but I don't feel like it has to.

    Tons more to talk about. Thoughts?
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Tue May 29, 2018 1:51 pm
  • Hopefully Alden Ehrenreich gains more acting chops for future films. Disney could, quite literally, make two (maybe even three) entire trilogies centered around the character of Han Solo if they wanted to. His character and history are worthy of it. Make Darth Maul and Qi'ra the long-term enemy and also just have some of them be Han running around the galaxy getting into all kinds of shenanigans. Many possibilities.

    Almost none of that is possible if the next film featuring him as Han Solo doesn't result in him giving off more of that wise-ass rogue charm that Harrison Ford nailed so perfectly in the original trilogy, though.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Tue May 29, 2018 2:04 pm
  • I thought Ehrenreich nailed the young Han Solo attitude. He would have to mature the character some to get it closer to the Han in A New Hope. But as far as being the "kid" version of the character, I don't think you could ask much more of him.

    As far as doing more Han Solo movies, I think the lack of box office success is a much larger speed bump than Alden's performance. The movie could still perform better over time but it's got a lot of making up to do. I just don't see it. Which is unfortunate because I really think it's a much better Star Wars story than it's getting credit for.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Tue May 29, 2018 2:13 pm
  • @Roland what about what you wanted to talk about regarding Lando? I assume it's about how they made him a cheater?
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Tue May 29, 2018 2:16 pm
  • Zebulon Dak wrote:I thought Ehrenreich nailed the young Han Solo attitude. He would have to mature the character some to get it closer to the Han in A New Hope. But as far as being the "kid" version of the character, I don't think you could ask much more of him.

    As far as doing more Han Solo movies, I think the lack of box office success is a much larger speed bump than Alden's performance. The movie could still perform better over time but it's got a lot of making up to do. I just don't see it. Which is unfortunate because I really think it's a much better Star Wars story than it's getting credit for.


    103,016,812 is not bad, on a holiday weekend they can be hit and miss. Just lower then what was expected, the Marvel movies have raised a bar to the stratosphere.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Tue May 29, 2018 2:26 pm
  • chris98251 wrote:
    Zebulon Dak wrote:I thought Ehrenreich nailed the young Han Solo attitude. He would have to mature the character some to get it closer to the Han in A New Hope. But as far as being the "kid" version of the character, I don't think you could ask much more of him.

    As far as doing more Han Solo movies, I think the lack of box office success is a much larger speed bump than Alden's performance. The movie could still perform better over time but it's got a lot of making up to do. I just don't see it. Which is unfortunate because I really think it's a much better Star Wars story than it's getting credit for.


    103,016,812 is not bad, on a holiday weekend they can be hit and miss. Just lower then what was expected, the Marvel movies have raised a bar to the stratosphere.


    It's not very good, considering the budget on this movie was reportedly somewhere between $250-$300 million.

    Memorial Day weekend is a rough one, and it was just a particularly down weekend at the theater (Deadpool dropped 77% from opening Friday to the next one). But it's pretty clear that Star Wars fatigue has set in, and I think just plain big budget movie fatigue as of late, and that the backlash against Star Wars by the fans is affecting viewership. I think the long gap between now and Episode IX will help, but this movie has serious ground to make up to be considered a success, which may or may not have some bearing on whether or not they run with Solo as a franchise.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Tue May 29, 2018 3:30 pm
  • Zebulon Dak wrote:@Roland what about what you wanted to talk about regarding Lando? I assume it's about how they made him a cheater?

    Correct. As you probably know, in the EU books, Lando actually refers to Han as cheating Lando out of the Milliennium Falcon.

    Yes, I know, they threw out all of the EU as canon, blahblah - but there's still the reference to it in ESB. Either way, I've never gotten a "dirty cheater" vibe from Lando in the films or the books.

    Regarding Ehrenreich's performance, he wasn't a bad Han Solo, he just didn't blow me away.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Tue May 29, 2018 4:04 pm
  • RolandDeschain wrote:
    Zebulon Dak wrote:@Roland what about what you wanted to talk about regarding Lando? I assume it's about how they made him a cheater?

    Correct. As you probably know, in the EU books, Lando actually refers to Han as cheating Lando out of the Milliennium Falcon.

    Yes, I know, they threw out all of the EU as canon, blahblah - but there's still the reference to it in ESB. Either way, I've never gotten a "dirty cheater" vibe from Lando in the films or the books.


    Yeah, they switched it up, I imagine to help with their whole "Han is a good guy" narrative (even though they did let him shoot first). It would have been nice to see maybe both Han and Lando pull off a little cheat move just to keep it more ambiguous**, but I can live with it. And who knows, maybe they are planning on doing more and giving Han a chance to be a slimy, double-crossing, no-good swindler.

    ** I guess technically Han did cheat in the first game, betting a ship he didn't actually own. So maybe Lando's still pissed off about that after all these years.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Tue May 29, 2018 4:33 pm
  • RolandDeschain wrote:
    Zebulon Dak wrote:@Roland what about what you wanted to talk about regarding Lando? I assume it's about how they made him a cheater?

    Correct. As you probably know, in the EU books, Lando actually refers to Han as cheating Lando out of the Milliennium Falcon.

    Yes, I know, they threw out all of the EU as canon, blahblah - but there's still the reference to it in ESB. Either way, I've never gotten a "dirty cheater" vibe from Lando in the films or the books.

    Regarding Ehrenreich's performance, he wasn't a bad Han Solo, he just didn't blow me away.


    I agree that Ehrenreich could stand to improve, but I'd also say he was nowhere near as bad as Hayden Christensen's performance in Attack of the Clones. Ehrenreich was at least serviceable.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Tue May 29, 2018 5:47 pm
  • Zebulon Dak wrote:
    chris98251 wrote:
    Zebulon Dak wrote:I thought Ehrenreich nailed the young Han Solo attitude. He would have to mature the character some to get it closer to the Han in A New Hope. But as far as being the "kid" version of the character, I don't think you could ask much more of him.

    As far as doing more Han Solo movies, I think the lack of box office success is a much larger speed bump than Alden's performance. The movie could still perform better over time but it's got a lot of making up to do. I just don't see it. Which is unfortunate because I really think it's a much better Star Wars story than it's getting credit for.


    103,016,812 is not bad, on a holiday weekend they can be hit and miss. Just lower then what was expected, the Marvel movies have raised a bar to the stratosphere.


    It's not very good, considering the budget on this movie was reportedly somewhere between $250-$300 million.

    Memorial Day weekend is a rough one, and it was just a particularly down weekend at the theater (Deadpool dropped 77% from opening Friday to the next one). But it's pretty clear that Star Wars fatigue has set in, and I think just plain big budget movie fatigue as of late, and that the backlash against Star Wars by the fans is affecting viewership. I think the long gap between now and Episode IX will help, but this movie has serious ground to make up to be considered a success, which may or may not have some bearing on whether or not they run with Solo as a franchise.


    Well any movie that centers around a lot of CGI is going to be expensive, I am sure they did a market test viewing and selling a movie with a Iconic Character as the focal point but replaced with someone new is a huge gamble. They had to know, this is what happens when you try to add more Teets to a cow that produces good Milk.


    They would have been better off taking advanatge of X23's popularity and making a young adult X23 and start a run with her, it would have fit in the Marvel Universe well and started a franchise with a young person that could make her own footprint instead of trying to walk in the steps of someone elses and fill them. That or go with a lesser known secondary character and let them make their own mark, god there were so many to choose from in Star Wars.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Tue May 29, 2018 6:28 pm
  • As that the Last Jedi and Solo came about nearly five months apart. And really fatigue is in the setting on in there. As really could had moved it to December, Solo movie that is.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Tue May 29, 2018 6:39 pm
  • I have no doubt it would have done better if they'd pushed it back to December, but I have a feeling they knew it was in trouble and decided to just get it out of the way and give episode IX a little breathing room. I don't think IX is in any danger of underperforming at this point. Unless they simply screw it all up somehow.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Tue May 29, 2018 8:41 pm
  • I liked the film. I think they did a good job setting up events that made it plausible as to how Han ultimately ends up becoming the cynical rogue we first met in Star Wars.

    It helps that I was willing to accept that no one was going to live up to Harrison Ford’s iconic portrayal of the character. Toss out the preconceptions and the movie is entertaining.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Wed May 30, 2018 10:02 am
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Wed May 30, 2018 10:06 am
  • Saw that floating around Facebook yesterday. Too bad it's not a moof instead of a regular cow, just to tie it all together.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Wed May 30, 2018 10:32 am
  • I think about half of the let down for Solo has been due to Star Wars fatigue, and I think the other half is the fact that no one asked for a Han Solo origin movie.

    I'm not the BIGGEST Star Wars buff myself, but I imagine I'm more invested than most. I grew up on the OT, specifically ESB/RotJ, watched all the other movies in theaters, watched The Clone Wars and Rebels in their entirety... never once in my life did I think to myself "gee I'd like to see Han when he was younger."

    I think Solo was a miscalculation by Disney. I don't think casual fans really wanted it. I don't think hardcore fans really wanted it. I think casual fans were already getting Star Wars fatigue, especially since a lot of folks were disappointed in TLJ. With the budget, the director woes and the timing of it all, I think it was a big misstep (as far as Box Office results go) to not move Solo to December.

    I've been (very impatiently) waiting to see Solo this Friday with friends. It's become a tradition to see the new Star Wars movies together since TFA, so I've been a good boi and not gone yet.

    Any other Star Wars movie and I'm there opening night, though.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Wed May 30, 2018 11:19 am
  • People were interested in the how he got the Falcon and the thing with Lando and Hans and how he and Chewy got together back when the original three were released. They made it a key point, Lando saying don't wreck my ship in one episode I believe it was The Empire Strikes Back. They just waited a really, really, long time. If they would have started doing these side Character movies infrequently staring in the late 70's I think it would have came off better, you could have used original actors.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Wed May 30, 2018 12:32 pm
  • chris98251 wrote:People were interested in the how he got the Falcon and the thing with Lando and Hans and how he and Chewy got together back when the original three were released. They made it a key point, Lando saying don't wreck my ship in one episode I believe it was The Empire Strikes Back. They just waited a really, really, long time. If they would have started doing these side Character movies infrequently staring in the late 70's I think it would have came off better, you could have used original actors.


    Oh, I definitely agree that there was plenty there to be interested in. I just think the time for doing it on the big screen passed a long time ago, even if I do think adding all of this to the lore/canon is pretty cool.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Fri Jun 01, 2018 5:20 am
  • After watching The Last Jedi, I'm done with Star Wars. Disney killed the franchise. It's over saturated with watered down movies now. It's done. Toast.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Sun Jun 03, 2018 7:17 am
  • JGfromtheNW wrote:I think about half of the let down for Solo has been due to Star Wars fatigue, and I think the other half is the fact that no one asked for a Han Solo origin movie.

    I'm not the BIGGEST Star Wars buff myself, but I imagine I'm more invested than most. I grew up on the OT, specifically ESB/RotJ, watched all the other movies in theaters, watched The Clone Wars and Rebels in their entirety... never once in my life did I think to myself "gee I'd like to see Han when he was younger."

    I think Solo was a miscalculation by Disney. I don't think casual fans really wanted it. I don't think hardcore fans really wanted it. I think casual fans were already getting Star Wars fatigue, especially since a lot of folks were disappointed in TLJ. With the budget, the director woes and the timing of it all, I think it was a big misstep (as far as Box Office results go) to not move Solo to December.

    I've been (very impatiently) waiting to see Solo this Friday with friends. It's become a tradition to see the new Star Wars movies together since TFA, so I've been a good boi and not gone yet.

    Any other Star Wars movie and I'm there opening night, though.

    I think Star Wars is under performing because the new ones are mediocre films without direction. A lot of this has to do with Lucas Film management under Kathleen Kennedy. There is no direction, and her decisions are questionable when it comes to directors. A good example of this is Solo. It went over budget, and it literally had to be shot twice. Kathleen Kennedy initially hired directors that had no experience with a movie like Star Wars. She hired the people behind Cloudy with a chance of meat balls. These people were known for their comedy, not a brilliant film epic. They were fired weeks before the move was supposed to be shot, and another director had to come, and re-shoot everything, and they even had to edit out a few characters because they couldn't come to the reshoot due to other projects. The movie was set up to fail from the beginning. They also were set back because of the actor playing Han Solo. They had to hire an acting coach to follow him around, and police him during shooting. He really slowed the shooting process down.

    In the new trilogy they are really screwing things up as well. I don't feel as if there was much continuity between the first and second movie. The second movie was a disaster of a story line. I don't think it is Star Wars fatigue so much as these are not good stories. The main character has no personality, Finn is a walking one liner machine, and Kylo Ren is 7th deadly sin of rage.

    First of all, Rey's character arch makes no sense. There is no heroes struggle, there is no journey. It took Luke Skywalker three films to finally best Darth Vader. Through that time he learned about his own past, and the force. He had struggles, and he had to learn how to master himself, and the force. He had internal battles over good and evil. Rey randomly uses force powers with no training, she picks up a light saber for the first time and bests Kylo, a man whom had been training his whole life in the art of the force, and art of the light saber. A man that was supposedly gifted in both. I want to be able to relate with Rey, but Disney is just making it so hard. She even beats Luke Skywalker in a duel, a man who has achieved the title of Jedi master. It makes no sense and it completely removes all source of tension from the film. The art of story telling is lost on this new trilogy, and personally I think Kathleen Kennedy needs to be removed.

    She has butchered this franchise, it isn't Star Wars fatigue. It is mediocre story telling, a myriad of questionable decisions, and lack of direction that is killing this franchise at the moment. Toys are sitting on shelves, the numbers are getting worse with each movie, and now there is a group of die hards that are threatening to boycott the franchise all together. The sense of mystery, journey, self-discovery, conflict and triumph that defined the original trilogy is lost on this new franchise.

    The way they are treating the villains is questionable as well. Why are the rebels still called the rebels? Aren't they supposed to be the establishment now? Isn't the first order supposed to be the equivalent of space ISIS? A rag, tag group of fighters that are well funded, that have taken over outer rim areas? Kylo Ren is bested by a girl that never picked up a light saber, or had any sort of formal training.Darth Vader is one of the things that made the original trilogy great. Every time he was on screen there was an sense of power, and genuine conflict. He seemed all powerful at times, and unrelenting. Every time he made an appearance there was a sense of danger, or a question of how is Luke going to get through this? Lets also talk about the leader of the first order, Snoke. This was probably the biggest let down here. He had maybe two or three scenes max, and he was felled by Kylo Ren with no effort what so ever. No explanation of his backstory, no indication as to what he even was. Was he a sith, what and the hell was he, and what was his background? No compelling personality, in fact none to speak of what so ever.

    These films are riddled with bad story telling, and no sense of tension, or relatability to the characters. It was a cheap attempt on Disney's part of capitalize on the former glory of Star Wars. They were so focused on the brand that they forgot the most important thing: the story.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Sun Jun 03, 2018 12:20 pm
  • Spin Doctor wrote:I think Star Wars is under performing because the new ones are mediocre films without direction. A lot of this has to do with Lucas Film management under Kathleen Kennedy. There is no direction, and her decisions are questionable when it comes to directors. A good example of this is Solo. It went over budget, and it literally had to be shot twice. Kathleen Kennedy initially hired directors that had no experience with a movie like Star Wars. She hired the people behind Cloudy with a chance of meat balls. These people were known for their comedy, not a brilliant film epic. They were fired weeks before the move was supposed to be shot, and another director had to come, and re-shoot everything, and they even had to edit out a few characters because they couldn't come to the reshoot due to other projects. The movie was set up to fail from the beginning. They also were set back because of the actor playing Han Solo. They had to hire an acting coach to follow him around, and police him during shooting. He really slowed the shooting process down.

    In the new trilogy they are really screwing things up as well. I don't feel as if there was much continuity between the first and second movie. The second movie was a disaster of a story line. I don't think it is Star Wars fatigue so much as these are not good stories. The main character has no personality, Finn is a walking one liner machine, and Kylo Ren is 7th deadly sin of rage.

    First of all, Rey's character arch makes no sense. There is no heroes struggle, there is no journey. It took Luke Skywalker three films to finally best Darth Vader. Through that time he learned about his own past, and the force. He had struggles, and he had to learn how to master himself, and the force. He had internal battles over good and evil. Rey randomly uses force powers with no training, she picks up a light saber for the first time and bests Kylo, a man whom had been training his whole life in the art of the force, and art of the light saber. A man that was supposedly gifted in both. I want to be able to relate with Rey, but Disney is just making it so hard. She even beats Luke Skywalker in a duel, a man who has achieved the title of Jedi master. It makes no sense and it completely removes all source of tension from the film. The art of story telling is lost on this new trilogy, and personally I think Kathleen Kennedy needs to be removed.

    She has butchered this franchise, it isn't Star Wars fatigue. It is mediocre story telling, a myriad of questionable decisions, and lack of direction that is killing this franchise at the moment. Toys are sitting on shelves, the numbers are getting worse with each movie, and now there is a group of die hards that are threatening to boycott the franchise all together. The sense of mystery, journey, self-discovery, conflict and triumph that defined the original trilogy is lost on this new franchise.

    The way they are treating the villains is questionable as well. Why are the rebels still called the rebels? Aren't they supposed to be the establishment now? Isn't the first order supposed to be the equivalent of space ISIS? A rag, tag group of fighters that are well funded, that have taken over outer rim areas? Kylo Ren is bested by a girl that never picked up a light saber, or had any sort of formal training.Darth Vader is one of the things that made the original trilogy great. Every time he was on screen there was an sense of power, and genuine conflict. He seemed all powerful at times, and unrelenting. Every time he made an appearance there was a sense of danger, or a question of how is Luke going to get through this? Lets also talk about the leader of the first order, Snoke. This was probably the biggest let down here. He had maybe two or three scenes max, and he was felled by Kylo Ren with no effort what so ever. No explanation of his backstory, no indication as to what he even was. Was he a sith, what and the hell was he, and what was his background? No compelling personality, in fact none to speak of what so ever.

    These films are riddled with bad story telling, and no sense of tension, or relatability to the characters. It was a cheap attempt on Disney's part of capitalize on the former glory of Star Wars. They were so focused on the brand that they forgot the most important thing: the story.


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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Sun Jun 03, 2018 12:47 pm
  • These films are riddled with bad story telling, and no sense of tension, or relatability to the characters. It was a Expensive attempt on Disney's part of capitalize on the former CASH COW of Star Wars. They were so focused on the MONEY that they forgot the most important thing: the story. AND INTELLEIGENCE OF THE VIEWERS

    There made a few adjustments for clarity :)
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Sun Jun 03, 2018 8:55 pm
  • I just have to say, however you feel about Solo or the Disney Star Wars films in general, I honestly believe releasing Solo now instead of waiting until December will end up costing them at least $200 million from the eventual total gross, and more likely $300 million (worldwide, not just domestic). Releasing it so soon after The Last Jedi and in the wake of Infinity War and Deadpool 2 was too much to overcome, on top of the reported set issues and TLJ's divisive reception.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Mon Jun 04, 2018 12:38 am
  • Maulbert wrote:Releasing it so soon after The Last Jedi and in the wake of Infinity War and Deadpool 2 was too much to overcome, on top of the reported set issues and TLJ's divisive reception.

    Yeah, it blows my mind that so many studios still try to have the whole "summer blockbuster" thing. Ever since Titanic came out in a December, it's known that you can have a blockbuster any time of the year - and hell, look at which Star Wars films came out in December, as well.

    The timing of this release should have been pushed for sure.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Mon Jun 04, 2018 2:58 am
  • RolandDeschain wrote:
    Maulbert wrote:Releasing it so soon after The Last Jedi and in the wake of Infinity War and Deadpool 2 was too much to overcome, on top of the reported set issues and TLJ's divisive reception.

    Yeah, it blows my mind that so many studios still try to have the whole "summer blockbuster" thing. Ever since Titanic came out in a December, it's known that you can have a blockbuster any time of the year - and hell, look at which Star Wars films came out in December, as well.

    The timing of this release should have been pushed for sure.


    Hell, Black Panther has grossed almost $700 million out of a February release, which would have been considered impossible a decade ago, even accounting for inflation (though admittedly, Black Panther had major outside factors that contributed to it's overwhelming success).
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Mon Jun 04, 2018 7:25 am
  • fenderbender123 wrote:After watching The Last Jedi, I'm done with Star Wars. Disney killed the franchise. It's over saturated with watered down movies now. It's done. Toast.


    The Last Jedi sucked. The Solo movie was really good. I'm sad it's not doing well at the box office as that does not bode well for future films in this particular series. But it was really good.

    I'm often torn between whether movies are well written, directed, or well acted. The Prequels, for example, I don't blame the actors. I thought the writing and directing sucked in a way that didn't allow for any real flow to the dialogue and thus made it almost impossible for the actors to come across well.

    In this one, I think the writing and directing make the movie. The acting is okay. I don't particularly like the Han guy and I while I thought Glover did a good job in the movie, he doesn't come across as Lando to me. But I think both of those things are generational issue to be.

    On Maul, I know they handled his (second) death in the cartoon, but I would love to see this set up a movie down the road that involved Han, Maul, and Obi-Wan (of course, Han and Obi-Wan couldn't actually meet in the movie). But maybe the plot of the Obi-Wan movie is Maul following Han to Tatooine and gets side tracked when he realizes Obi-Wan is there (and perhaps another force sensitive person). And the movie is about Obi-Wan protecting Luke from Maul but still remaining hidden. It ends with Han going to the Cantina, Obi-Wan killing Maul, and then hearing the sounds of the sand people attacking Luke.

    Just spit-balling there, but I think that could be really good.

    I've got other great ideas, like how the standalone Joker movie should be done like those chick flicks that have 4 intertwining stories. But in this case, they are 4 potential jokers, they all end up falling in the same vat of chemicals (not necessarily at the same time) but only one emerges so you don't know which one was actually the Joker, keeping with the storyline that his backstory is actually unknonwn.

    But that's for another thread . . . if anybody knows anybody at DC they could pass this on to so that DC stops making crappy movies, that'd be great.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Mon Jun 04, 2018 7:41 am
  • Maulbert wrote:I just have to say, however you feel about Solo or the Disney Star Wars films in general, I honestly believe releasing Solo now instead of waiting until December will end up costing them at least $200 million from the eventual total gross, and more likely $300 million (worldwide, not just domestic). Releasing it so soon after The Last Jedi and in the wake of Infinity War and Deadpool 2 was too much to overcome, on top of the reported set issues and TLJ's divisive reception.


    We're big Star Wars fans and even my wife assumed we would wait until this came out on DVD. I don't really know why she thought that. But it was at least there as an idea.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Tue Jun 05, 2018 11:47 am
  • Did not see the film. But seems to me the same feeling I get from the Wolverine series....3 movies about the same character including Xmen the original....sorry but just say no.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Tue Jun 05, 2018 12:20 pm
  • Seahawkfan80 wrote:Did not see the film. But seems to me the same feeling I get from the Wolverine series....3 movies about the same character including Xmen the original....sorry but just say no.


    It's way better than either X-Men Origins: Wolverine or The Wolverine.

    Though that's not saying much.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Tue Jun 05, 2018 12:30 pm
  • HawkGA wrote:
    The Last Jedi sucked. The Solo movie was really good. I'm sad it's not doing well at the box office as that does not bode well for future films in this particular series. But it was really good..


    The Last Jedi is directly responsible for the tepid response to Solo. It pissed off most hardcore Star Wars fans, to the point to where they don't want to get burned again.

    Disney has painted themselves into a corner with the Star wars franchise. The refuse to let writers and directors take the franchise in an edgier more bold direction, so it's not only leaving true fans feeling fatigued and bummed out with how safe and vanilla the series and side projects are.............they're also not attracting any new fans to the franchise.

    I get that they have a vision for how episodes 7-9 are to go (even though it's not really working), but to protect their precious Disney brand over allowing some more exciting direction for the side projects is pretty damn lame for this old Star Wars fan.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Tue Jun 05, 2018 2:36 pm
  • Sgt. Largent wrote:
    HawkGA wrote:
    The Last Jedi sucked. The Solo movie was really good. I'm sad it's not doing well at the box office as that does not bode well for future films in this particular series. But it was really good..


    The Last Jedi is directly responsible for the tepid response to Solo. It pissed off most hardcore Star Wars fans, to the point to where they don't want to get burned again.

    Disney has painted themselves into a corner with the Star wars franchise. The refuse to let writers and directors take the franchise in an edgier more bold direction, so it's not only leaving true fans feeling fatigued and bummed out with how safe and vanilla the series and side projects are.............they're also not attracting any new fans to the franchise.

    I get that they have a vision for how episodes 7-9 are to go (even though it's not really working), but to protect their precious Disney brand over allowing some more exciting direction for the side projects is pretty damn lame for this old Star Wars fan.

    I disagree with the fact that they have a vision for Star Wars. I think that where we are right now at this point in time, is because the Star Wars brand has no direction. Their goal is to emulate Marvel, but the thing with Marvel is they are using already established source material. They are keeping pretty close to the comic books from what I hear, They are also tying every movie together into an overarching universe. Star Wars had quite a bit of material with the extended universe but the folks at Disney set it on fire, and let it burn.

    The brand underneath Kathleen Kennedy has been managed very poorly. She had her name tied to all of the biggest projects that Lucas Film ever undertook. The thing that Disney has seemed to overlook is that her role was handling money, nothing to do with creative direction. We are seeing the result right here. Her main goal is to pump out movies as quick as possible, and with little regard for continuity, or story. Her handling of the directors has also been a nightmare to say the least. J.J Abrams laid out an outline for all three of the movies, the thing is he wasn't going to be the director for the second one -- he had something else going on. The guy that came in completely blew up his scripts, and outlines then completely rewrote the Last Jedi. This is why the film seemed so jarring compared to the force awakens. While the Force Awakens was not that great in my opinion, at least it captured the original feel of the series.

    This Last Jedi was what they call a cluster f---. It was a hastily thrown together story. It relied on deus ex machina style plot devices, and constant surprise to keep viewers interested. It was a train wreck of grandiose ideas and questionable plot lines. They tried to make the whole film a "Luke I am your father moment". The guy who did this script really should be ashamed of himself. This movie seemed like a 6th graders fan fiction, but I bet you a 6th graders fan fiction would be more coherent than this movie.

    In Solo we faced a similar director issue. Kathleen Kennedy hired the two directors behind "cloudy with a chance of meat balls". These guys were great at comedy, and ad lib style scripts, but a space opera like Star Wars was completely out of their realm of expertise. They said that they were under the impression that they were hired to direct a comedy when they originally shot the film. The film was shot, and they allowed ad lib, and random things to just happen, which was their MO, Kathleen Kennedy really should have taken that into consideration. Three weeks before the movie was due to be put into editing the two directors, and Kennedy decided to part ways. A director that close friends, and worked with Lucas on numerous occasions was brought in. The movie had veered so far off course that he had to completely re-shoot every scene in only three weeks. He called every single actor, and actress back in, some were not able to come back due to work on other movies. They were edited out of the movie. Every scene was then re-shot once again.

    The last thing I want to touch on is the over politicization of the Star Wars franchise. People look to films such as Star Wars as an escape from reality. A place to transport you to a new world, a new universe. I'm not going to go into much here, because politics is frowned upon in this forum. A good example of this is J.J Abrams coming out and saying that if you don't like this new Star Wars you're a bigot. No J.J we don't like the new Star Wars franchise because it is genuinely bad. Female leads didn't stop wonder woman from selling well, the gay love story of Brokeback mountain didn't stop people from shelling out money to watch that film in droves. Just recently Black Panther set records, and became one of the best selling movies of all time. Now that Star Wars is a flaming dumpster fire the directors, and Kathleen Kennedy are now blaming the fans. Now we're getting calls for the boycot of the new Star Wars. These people are insulting diehard fans, the people that go to the movie 6-7 times, the people that buy all the merchandise, and they wonder "why aren't the tickets selling?" It must be because we have a strong female lead, or we turned Lando into a fringe sexual identity, they are biggots!

    NO, people don't like Star Wars because your lead character is a Mary Sue. With a few days of training she was able to best a Jedi master. With no training she was able to beat a guy that was supposed to be gifted in the force, and had a whole life of Jedi training behind him. There is no heroes journey as I said before. We don't get to see Rey grow, we don't get to see the struggles, and journey of self discovery. She touches a light saber once and she is able to beat a man that was able to go toe to toe with Luke when he tried to kill him. We are teased that maybe she was a member of the school. When we learn that she is a nobody, it kind of makes the fact that she can use the force without any training asinine. More on this point, a little kid on the Casino planet uses the Force without any training as well. Not even Anakin, who supposedly was one of the most gifted force users wasn't able to do that. The whole story has taken place over a few months.

    We also don't like the new Star Wars because the plot is contrived. The purple haired ladies plan was idiotic, and the whole warp drive mechanics completely contradicted everything that the story had put into place in the story before hand. The last Jedi completely ignored set rules of the universe, it was like somebody vomited on a piece of paper and said HERE YA GO, HERE IS YOUR STORY, ENJOY. When fans call Kennedy and company on it, they insult them. This is why Star Wars is a burning dumpster fire right now. These people are insulting our intelligence, and resulting to name calling to deflect blame for their inability to best an average 6th graders fan fiction. These new Star Wars films are films that nobody asked for. Lucas Film needs to be purged of these idiots, and I believe they will be gone if the new Star Wars movie tanks. Disney will only put up with these kind of numbers for so long. They took one of the most valuable franchises and are driving it into the ground. It is hard to believe that Marvel and Star Wars exist under the same parent company. Sorry my post got a bit ranty, I was just floored by J.J Abrams, and Kennedy's remarks.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Tue Jun 05, 2018 5:24 pm
  • The one thing that absolutely amazes me is that Star Wars seems to be taking the approach DC is, which is to just throw a bunch of random stuff together with no real direction. Marvel has direction. It has an overarching theme. It's not that they are borrowing from source material so much as they have a plan and everything weaves together. The Episode 7-9 approach is just baffling. Last Jedi was so bad. So, so bad. And yet Disney seemed to love it and wants the director to do a whole new trilogy.

    What makes it even more baffling is that Solo showed a movie that could take Star Wars in a different direction from the galactic events, fate of the galaxy and the Force. There is no Force in Solo, and it's great. That should be their model for expanding the Star Wars series. Not turning to the person who messed up the Episode storyline.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Tue Jun 05, 2018 6:44 pm
  • HawkGA wrote:The one thing that absolutely amazes me is that Star Wars seems to be taking the approach DC is, which is to just throw a bunch of random stuff together with no real direction. Marvel has direction. It has an overarching theme. It's not that they are borrowing from source material so much as they have a plan and everything weaves together. The Episode 7-9 approach is just baffling. Last Jedi was so bad. So, so bad. And yet Disney seemed to love it and wants the director to do a whole new trilogy.

    What makes it even more baffling is that Solo showed a movie that could take Star Wars in a different direction from the galactic events, fate of the galaxy and the Force. There is no Force in Solo, and it's great. That should be their model for expanding the Star Wars series. Not turning to the person who messed up the Episode storyline.

    I think that the Disney Star Wars was messed up from the moment they decided Kennedy would be managing everything. No real experience in managing these sort of things. There has been a lot of questionable decisions on the directorial end, and a lot of infighting, and disorganization. Solo, for example ballooned way over its budget due to poor communication, and choosing directors who had no experience with this type of work. They were even confused as to why they were even there. In my opinion Ron Howard did a great job with what he was given. He rewrote a good portion of the story, and had to re-shoot everything. He did it in a miraculous time frame. While I think Solo was not a good story, it could have been much worse. He did an great job playing the bad cards he was given.

    As far as Rian Johnson's trilogy, it'll be interesting. I do think he was given a bad hand with the force awakens. The Force Awakens, if you look at the story was pretty bad. The term 'resistance' was questionable to me. This implies that they were some rebel group. The resistance is supposed to be the establishment, while the first order is supposed to be a rag tag, group of soldiers with a religious like fervor. How did they grow to be so big? They implied that the Star destroyer was their last ditch effort, so why is it that they have so much power over the "resistance". Rey had no real motivations either, and she instantly became better than Han at flying the falcon with no prior experience, instantly better than Kylo, a man who had trained his whole life. Why? Reasons. No back story, no motivations, no real substance.

    Rian played a bad hand and made it worse. Too much going on in that movie. Can he make a good trilogy? Maybe, I don't think he should be given another shot after he botched the Last Jedi so badly. That being said, Rian Johnson has written, and directed some very good films in the past. He directed Breaking Bad, wrote and directed BoJack Horseman, and wrote and directed Loop, and Brick. He has a good body of work, and his films such as Loop and Brick were interesting and unique. I think he has a tendency to outsmart himself sometimes, which is what he did here. I can see why Disney is giving him a shot, given his previous works, and experience. My thought is, they should have him collaborate with someone else. Don't give him the free reign, I think he surrendered that privilege when he made the worst Star Wars film of all time. I do think if he teams up with the right people he could make a pretty sweet, dark and gritty version of Star Wars given his previous work.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Tue Jun 05, 2018 6:51 pm
  • Spin Doctor wrote:
    HawkGA wrote:The one thing that absolutely amazes me is that Star Wars seems to be taking the approach DC is, which is to just throw a bunch of random stuff together with no real direction. Marvel has direction. It has an overarching theme. It's not that they are borrowing from source material so much as they have a plan and everything weaves together. The Episode 7-9 approach is just baffling. Last Jedi was so bad. So, so bad. And yet Disney seemed to love it and wants the director to do a whole new trilogy.

    What makes it even more baffling is that Solo showed a movie that could take Star Wars in a different direction from the galactic events, fate of the galaxy and the Force. There is no Force in Solo, and it's great. That should be their model for expanding the Star Wars series. Not turning to the person who messed up the Episode storyline.

    I think that the Disney Star Wars was messed up from the moment they decided Kennedy would be managing everything. No real experience in managing these sort of things. There has been a lot of questionable decisions on the directorial end, and a lot of infighting, and disorganization. Solo, for example ballooned way over its budget due to poor communication, and choosing directors who had no experience with this type of work. They were even confused as to why they were even there. In my opinion Ron Howard did a great job with what he was given. He rewrote a good portion of the story, and had to re-shoot everything. He did it in a miraculous time frame. While I think Solo was not a good story, it could have been much worse. He did an great job playing the bad cards he was given.

    As far as Rian Johnson's trilogy, it'll be interesting. I do think he was given a bad hand with the force awakens. The Force Awakens, if you look at the story was pretty bad. The term 'resistance' was questionable to me. This implies that they were some rebel group. The resistance is supposed to be the establishment, while the first order is supposed to be a rag tag, group of soldiers with a religious like fervor. How did they grow to be so big? They implied that the Star destroyer was their last ditch effort, so why is it that they have so much power over the "resistance". Rey had no real motivations either, and she instantly became better than Han at flying the falcon with no prior experience, instantly better than Kylo, a man who had trained his whole life. Why? Reasons. No back story, no motivations, no real substance.

    Rian played a bad hand and made it worse. Too much going on in that movie. Can he make a good trilogy? Maybe, I don't think he should be given another shot after he botched the Last Jedi so badly. That being said, Rian Johnson has written, and directed some very good films in the past. He directed Breaking Bad, wrote and directed BoJack Horseman, and wrote and directed Loop, and Brick. He has a good body of work, and his films such as Loop and Brick were interesting and unique. I think he has a tendency to outsmart himself sometimes, which is what he did here. I can see why Disney is giving him a shot, given his previous works, and experience. My thought is, they should have him collaborate with someone else. Don't give him the free reign, I think he surrendered that privilege when he made the worst Star Wars film of all time. I do think if he teams up with the right people he could make a pretty sweet, dark and gritty version of Star Wars given his previous work.


    Kennedy was already the head of Lucasfilm, and Lucas stipulated she had to stay for him to sell.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Tue Jun 05, 2018 10:00 pm
  • Maulbert wrote:
    Spin Doctor wrote:
    HawkGA wrote:The one thing that absolutely amazes me is that Star Wars seems to be taking the approach DC is, which is to just throw a bunch of random stuff together with no real direction. Marvel has direction. It has an overarching theme. It's not that they are borrowing from source material so much as they have a plan and everything weaves together. The Episode 7-9 approach is just baffling. Last Jedi was so bad. So, so bad. And yet Disney seemed to love it and wants the director to do a whole new trilogy.

    What makes it even more baffling is that Solo showed a movie that could take Star Wars in a different direction from the galactic events, fate of the galaxy and the Force. There is no Force in Solo, and it's great. That should be their model for expanding the Star Wars series. Not turning to the person who messed up the Episode storyline.

    I think that the Disney Star Wars was messed up from the moment they decided Kennedy would be managing everything. No real experience in managing these sort of things. There has been a lot of questionable decisions on the directorial end, and a lot of infighting, and disorganization. Solo, for example ballooned way over its budget due to poor communication, and choosing directors who had no experience with this type of work. They were even confused as to why they were even there. In my opinion Ron Howard did a great job with what he was given. He rewrote a good portion of the story, and had to re-shoot everything. He did it in a miraculous time frame. While I think Solo was not a good story, it could have been much worse. He did an great job playing the bad cards he was given.

    As far as Rian Johnson's trilogy, it'll be interesting. I do think he was given a bad hand with the force awakens. The Force Awakens, if you look at the story was pretty bad. The term 'resistance' was questionable to me. This implies that they were some rebel group. The resistance is supposed to be the establishment, while the first order is supposed to be a rag tag, group of soldiers with a religious like fervor. How did they grow to be so big? They implied that the Star destroyer was their last ditch effort, so why is it that they have so much power over the "resistance". Rey had no real motivations either, and she instantly became better than Han at flying the falcon with no prior experience, instantly better than Kylo, a man who had trained his whole life. Why? Reasons. No back story, no motivations, no real substance.

    Rian played a bad hand and made it worse. Too much going on in that movie. Can he make a good trilogy? Maybe, I don't think he should be given another shot after he botched the Last Jedi so badly. That being said, Rian Johnson has written, and directed some very good films in the past. He directed Breaking Bad, wrote and directed BoJack Horseman, and wrote and directed Loop, and Brick. He has a good body of work, and his films such as Loop and Brick were interesting and unique. I think he has a tendency to outsmart himself sometimes, which is what he did here. I can see why Disney is giving him a shot, given his previous works, and experience. My thought is, they should have him collaborate with someone else. Don't give him the free reign, I think he surrendered that privilege when he made the worst Star Wars film of all time. I do think if he teams up with the right people he could make a pretty sweet, dark and gritty version of Star Wars given his previous work.


    Kennedy was already the head of Lucasfilm, and Lucas stipulated she had to stay for him to sell.

    Ah, so this was the deal. I wonder if there is some kind of contractual obligation that is allowing her to stay on? I can't imagine Disney is happy with her performance over the last two Star Wars movies, or the way they have been handled from a business standpoint (see bloated Solo budget, and slow moving starwars merch). I knew she was head, but I didn't know there was a stipulation that she had to remain head in order for the deal to go through.

    I actually researched her quite a bit, what her capacity in the numerous films she had her name on. She moved money, that was her job. She handled the business side of things, while Lucas and company worked the creative. Either way, she is not qualified to be making creative decisions. If I were Disney I would try to find a way to relegate her to her old role and find a czar for the creative processes, and overall direction of the films. Clearly she is in way over her head.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Wed Jun 06, 2018 7:15 am
  • Spin Doctor wrote:

    This Last Jedi was what they call a cluster f---. It was a hastily thrown together story. It relied on deus ex machina style plot devices, and constant surprise to keep viewers interested. It was a train wreck of grandiose ideas and questionable plot lines. They tried to make the whole film a "Luke I am your father moment". The guy who did this script really should be ashamed of himself. This movie seemed like a 6th graders fan fiction, but I bet you a 6th graders fan fiction would be more coherent than this movie.


    Just not true. Abrams, Johnson with the help of Kasdan started fleshing out and writing episodes 8-10 shortly after Disney purchased the license back in 2012. Abrams has even commented that it was a difficult process with both introducing all the new characters that may be around for another 6-9 episodes AND incorporating the old characters.

    Again, has it worked? Uhh......no. But it certainly wasn't "hastily thrown together story." It's an uninteresting generic story that took no risks because Disney has to protect it's precious brand...........but not rushed or hastily thrown together.

    I agree with just about all your other points Spin. While I have no qualms about casting if you hire great actors...........but it's painfully obvious that there was a concerted effort to Disney-fi this cast, which is why half the cast looks like Mouskateer rejects, as well as a concerted effort to diversify the script with unnecessary character arcs for the sake of being PC.

    I still love Star Wars, it is THE reason I fell in love with movies. I waited in line at the Lakewood cinema for two hours when Return of the Jedi came out, then got back in line two more times to see it again the same day.

    But this? This is not my Star Wars. It's just an imposter pretending to be Star Wars. I'll still watch, but the magic is gone...........and it didn't need to be that way.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Wed Jun 06, 2018 7:53 am
  • Sgt. Largent wrote:Again, has it worked? Uhh......no. But it certainly wasn't "hastily thrown together story." It's an uninteresting generic story that took no risks because Disney has to protect it's precious brand...........but not rushed or hastily thrown together.

    I agree with just about all your other points Spin. While I have no qualms about casting if you hire great actors...........but it's painfully obvious that there was a concerted effort to Disney-fi this cast, which is why half the cast looks like Mouskateer rejects, as well as a concerted effort to diversify the script with unnecessary character arcs for the sake of being PC.

    I still love Star Wars, it is THE reason I fell in love with movies. I waited in line at the Lakewood cinema for two hours when Return of the Jedi came out, then got back in line two more times to see it again the same day.

    But this? This is not my Star Wars. It's just an imposter pretending to be Star Wars. I'll still watch, but the magic is gone...........and it didn't need to be that way.


    I agree with pretty much everything here. I think "Disney-fi'd" is probably the best term I'd use for the characters in episodes 7 & 8. I was completely let down in regards to the direction TLJ pushed this saga, not because I disagree with the themes or the need to move on from the past, but because I think they did it very poorly and filled the rest of the movie with uninteresting characters, uninteresting plot lines and gave us no larger stakes or reasons to care about what happens next. I left that movie feeling empty. I thought it had some of the highest of highs in regards to Star Wars moments (throne room scene, lightspeed kamikaze), but the lows just overshadowed the rest of that experience.

    Beyond that? I think Star Wars under Disney has actually been pretty good. Rogue One, while its earlier acts are all over the place, is a great Star Wars movie. I think the final third/act of that movie is fantastic, some of the best Star Wars action and storytelling we've seen. Do I put it in the same league as ESB or RotJ? No, but it's definitely better than anything we got in the Prequels.

    I thought the animated show Rebels was fantastic. Seriously, it had some awesome Star Wars moments, a great story that wraps up well at the end and it does some awesome canon/universe building. Some loose ends that might be explored on the big screen in the future as well, which I'm hoping and praying for. I was so invested by the end of this series that I shed tears multiple times, though I'm probably just a big baby.

    I thought Solo was a solid action/Western flick set in the Star Wars universe. Slightly above average, but nothing that special or as enjoyable as Rogue One. It was weird at first to see Solo and Lando played by different actors, but by the end of it I could believe. I was just happy to see a different Star Wars story.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Wed Jun 06, 2018 3:35 pm
  • JGfromtheNW wrote:
    Beyond that? I think Star Wars under Disney has actually been pretty good. Rogue One, while its earlier acts are all over the place, is a great Star Wars movie. I think the final third/act of that movie is fantastic, some of the best Star Wars action and storytelling we've seen. Do I put it in the same league as ESB or RotJ? No, but it's definitely better than anything we got in the Prequels.

    I thought Solo was a solid action/Western flick set in the Star Wars universe. Slightly above average, but nothing that special or as enjoyable as Rogue One. It was weird at first to see Solo and Lando played by different actors, but by the end of it I could believe. I was just happy to see a different Star Wars story.


    Agreed.

    I'd put the last 20 minutes of Rogue One up against any action sequence of the Star Wars canon. That's the magic I'm talking about. Just too bad it's literally the ONLY example we can come up with.

    I think what Rogue One and Solo have taught us is that for a spaghetti western in space, maybe light but action packed fun stand alone stories is the way to go. When the writers have to stretch and struggle to dive deeper into the characters and overall thin story to put together an interesting and cohesive series? That's where things go horribly wrong.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Wed Jun 06, 2018 8:45 pm
  • I want to see a written & directed by James Cameron Star Wars film.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Wed Jun 06, 2018 10:38 pm
  • RolandDeschain wrote:I want to see a written & directed by James Cameron Star Wars film.


    Oh god no. Avatar was utter shit, and Titanic was massively overrated. He hasn't made a great movie in 27 years.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Thu Jun 07, 2018 1:49 am
  • Maulbert wrote:
    RolandDeschain wrote:I want to see a written & directed by James Cameron Star Wars film.


    Oh god no. Avatar was utter shit, and Titanic was massively overrated. He hasn't made a great movie in 27 years.

    Titanic was a basic love story in a unique setting, well written, and executed well. Avatar was alright, personally I was underwhelmed by it -- but it was still a good watch. What that movie was really all about was the visuals, and technological advances in cinema.

    I think if I was running Lucas Films I would throw the bank at Christopher Nolan. I think he could do to Star Wars what he did for the Batman franchise. His last piece of work was also an epic space opera, though it is worth mentioning it was a bit unorthodox. He has experience in running successful trilogies, and epic space operas -- I can't think of a better man for the job.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Thu Jun 07, 2018 7:18 am
  • Spin Doctor wrote:
    Maulbert wrote:
    RolandDeschain wrote:I want to see a written & directed by James Cameron Star Wars film.


    Oh god no. Avatar was utter shit, and Titanic was massively overrated. He hasn't made a great movie in 27 years.

    Titanic was a basic love story in a unique setting, well written, and executed well. Avatar was alright, personally I was underwhelmed by it -- but it was still a good watch. What that movie was really all about was the visuals, and technological advances in cinema.

    I think if I was running Lucas Films I would throw the bank at Christopher Nolan. I think he could do to Star Wars what he did for the Batman franchise. His last piece of work was also an epic space opera, though it is worth mentioning it was a bit unorthodox. He has experience in running successful trilogies, and epic space operas -- I can't think of a better man for the job.


    The problem is any well established powerful director means giving up creative and writing control...........and as we've seen once Disney sees even the smallest amount of risk being taken, they pull the plug.

    Lord and Miller were exactly the kind of edgy and forward thinking directors you want if you're trying to find a new exciting direction for your franchise. Nope. Don't like things too dark or wacky!!! Let's hire Ron Howard, he's boring.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Thu Jun 07, 2018 8:31 am
  • Sgt. Largent wrote:Let's hire Ron Howard, he's boring.

    I wouldn't go that far; he did direct Backdraft and Apollo 13.

    Maulbert wrote:
    RolandDeschain wrote:I want to see a written & directed by James Cameron Star Wars film.


    Oh god no. Avatar was utter shit, and Titanic was massively overrated. He hasn't made a great movie in 27 years.

    *Pats Maulbert on the head.*

    Ok.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Thu Jun 07, 2018 8:50 am
  • RolandDeschain wrote:
    Sgt. Largent wrote:Let's hire Ron Howard, he's boring.

    I wouldn't go that far; he did direct Backdraft and Apollo 13.

    Maulbert wrote:
    RolandDeschain wrote:I want to see a written & directed by James Cameron Star Wars film.


    Oh god no. Avatar was utter shit, and Titanic was massively overrated. He hasn't made a great movie in 27 years.

    *Pats Maulbert on the head.*

    Ok.


    Howard is safe and competent, that's why Disney hired him after the fired Lord and Miller.............and that's the kind of movies he makes. Competent.Safe.Boring.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Thu Jun 07, 2018 9:55 am
  • Sgt. Largent wrote:
    Spin Doctor wrote:
    Maulbert wrote:
    RolandDeschain wrote:I want to see a written & directed by James Cameron Star Wars film.


    Oh god no. Avatar was utter shit, and Titanic was massively overrated. He hasn't made a great movie in 27 years.

    Titanic was a basic love story in a unique setting, well written, and executed well. Avatar was alright, personally I was underwhelmed by it -- but it was still a good watch. What that movie was really all about was the visuals, and technological advances in cinema.

    I think if I was running Lucas Films I would throw the bank at Christopher Nolan. I think he could do to Star Wars what he did for the Batman franchise. His last piece of work was also an epic space opera, though it is worth mentioning it was a bit unorthodox. He has experience in running successful trilogies, and epic space operas -- I can't think of a better man for the job.


    The problem is any well established powerful director means giving up creative and writing control...........and as we've seen once Disney sees even the smallest amount of risk being taken, they pull the plug.

    Lord and Miller were exactly the kind of edgy and forward thinking directors you want if you're trying to find a new exciting direction for your franchise. Nope. Don't like things too dark or wacky!!! Let's hire Ron Howard, he's boring.

    Lord and Miller are not what you want if you want to take a franchise like Star Wars in a different direction. They were completely out of their element here. They didn't have the technical chops, or the experience in these types of movies. In fact, they worked the whole time under the assumption that they were hired to direct a comedy. Lack of communication on Lucas Films, and Disney's part, and inexperience really are what killed Solo. I respect that they Disney was trying something out of the box, but I never really saw this marriage as a good fit.

    It seems like Disney is trying to push Star Wars in so many different directions, I honestly don't think there is a direction here. Everything seems so schizophrenic. J.J Abram's M.O when playing with established franchises such as mission impossible, and Star Trek is to play it safe, and just go with reeling the audience in with nostalgia. He is good at recreating the feel of the originals, though they are tepid, and lacking in charm in character when measured against their counter parts. Rian Johnson is the dark horse here. His films and TV shows are not very conventional, and are more on the dark and gritty side of the spectrum. I think his previous works are good, but I think it is a recipe of disaster when you pair him up with somebody like J.J Abrams. It is like he threw out the previous script, and decided to write his own movie, within a movie. There was a big lack of coherence here in between the first, and second films, and even within the last Jedi. Despite his approach being unconventional, Disney seemed to eat Rian's approach up.

    I think in order for a new trilogy to be successful they really need someone like Christopher Nolan to sure things up. The one thing in Nolan's films that is never lacking is consistency. He has a clear vision of what he wants to do, and how he wants to achieve it. When writing interstellar he even hired a team of physicist to make sure he got the science right. His attention to detail, and ability to seamlessly weave in complex layers, and philosophical/psychological elements is really unparalleled by any director now in my opinion. Just look at what Christopher Nolan did to Batman, and then compare it to the originals. He turned traditional tropes in that movie into dark and twisted versions of themselves, yet it was a movie still accessible to the masses. He gave a layer of complexity to Batman that I had never seen from that character. A hero that is teetering on the edge of killing, and becoming a villain himself. The crazy psychological battles he had within his head was something to behold. That is the kind of story telling that would bring a whole new depth to the struggle between the dark side, and light. If Disney is willing to throw the keys to Rian Johnson, I don't see why they wouldn't be willing to let one of the more successful directors in Hollywood have a crack at writing the story. He has exactly the kind of experience that would be needed to successfully pull of a Star Wars trilogy in a seamless manor.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Thu Jun 07, 2018 11:13 am
  • New direction would be hiring Quentin Tarantino and let him do what he does best, then you would have a new direction.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Thu Jun 07, 2018 12:07 pm
  • Spin Doctor wrote:
    Sgt. Largent wrote:
    Spin Doctor wrote:
    Maulbert wrote:
    Oh god no. Avatar was utter shit, and Titanic was massively overrated. He hasn't made a great movie in 27 years.

    Titanic was a basic love story in a unique setting, well written, and executed well. Avatar was alright, personally I was underwhelmed by it -- but it was still a good watch. What that movie was really all about was the visuals, and technological advances in cinema.

    I think if I was running Lucas Films I would throw the bank at Christopher Nolan. I think he could do to Star Wars what he did for the Batman franchise. His last piece of work was also an epic space opera, though it is worth mentioning it was a bit unorthodox. He has experience in running successful trilogies, and epic space operas -- I can't think of a better man for the job.


    The problem is any well established powerful director means giving up creative and writing control...........and as we've seen once Disney sees even the smallest amount of risk being taken, they pull the plug.

    Lord and Miller were exactly the kind of edgy and forward thinking directors you want if you're trying to find a new exciting direction for your franchise. Nope. Don't like things too dark or wacky!!! Let's hire Ron Howard, he's boring.

    Lord and Miller are not what you want if you want to take a franchise like Star Wars in a different direction. They were completely out of their element here. They didn't have the technical chops, or the experience in these types of movies. In fact, they worked the whole time under the assumption that they were hired to direct a comedy. Lack of communication on Lucas Films, and Disney's part, and inexperience really are what killed Solo. I respect that they Disney was trying something out of the box, but I never really saw this marriage as a good fit.


    We'll never know what kind of film Lord and Miller would have delivered, but from the Lego Movie and Jump Street IMO they would have delivered a uniquely funny and gritty Solo story full of kinetic energy and humor. Two things a story about Han freakin' Solo desperately should include.

    Not all Howard's fault, but Han Solo IS a smartass that comes from a gritty underground world full of scoundrels and backstabbing.

    Solo and Howard didn't deliver any of that. So why not see where Lord and Miller could have gone, rather than play it safe and get scared.

    Solo's an OK movie, but it resembles nothing of what Han Solo means to the Star Wars universe. It's a generic sci-fi movie that just so happens to have characters with names we know.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Thu Jun 07, 2018 11:50 pm
  • chris98251 wrote:New direction would be hiring Quentin Tarantino and let him do what he does best, then you would have a new direction.

    I actually thought of that, it would be interesting to see a Star Wars under him. The original Star Wars was inspired by eastern philosophy, an old anime (star blazers), and old westerns. These are all the kind of things that Tarantino already weaves into his movies. His movies are also a spin on classic styles, envisioned in a modern light. He could probably keep the same feeling of the original trilogy while having it be something completely different altogether. I'd imagine it would be dark, and gritty, probably too much so for the audience that Disney is trying to appeal to. It would probably be a story about revenge and redemption knowing Tarantino, WHICH I think would be an interesting twist.

    I'd imagine it going something like this: A young man/women is seeking revenge for the death of a loved one at the hands of the empire, or what have you. He or she has an affinity for the force, and is taken under the wing of somebody, lets just say Rey for convenience sake (can't think of any other Jedi that are alive). His/hers lust for revenge makes them walk a fine line between the light side, and dark side of the force. He/she rides through the galaxy not to save them from a tyrannical rule but for the sole purpose of drawing the blood of his enemies. Perhaps it would be a movie outlining the rise of a new sith.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Thu Jun 07, 2018 11:58 pm
  • Sgt. Largent wrote:
    Spin Doctor wrote:
    Sgt. Largent wrote:
    Spin Doctor wrote:Titanic was a basic love story in a unique setting, well written, and executed well. Avatar was alright, personally I was underwhelmed by it -- but it was still a good watch. What that movie was really all about was the visuals, and technological advances in cinema.

    I think if I was running Lucas Films I would throw the bank at Christopher Nolan. I think he could do to Star Wars what he did for the Batman franchise. His last piece of work was also an epic space opera, though it is worth mentioning it was a bit unorthodox. He has experience in running successful trilogies, and epic space operas -- I can't think of a better man for the job.


    The problem is any well established powerful director means giving up creative and writing control...........and as we've seen once Disney sees even the smallest amount of risk being taken, they pull the plug.

    Lord and Miller were exactly the kind of edgy and forward thinking directors you want if you're trying to find a new exciting direction for your franchise. Nope. Don't like things too dark or wacky!!! Let's hire Ron Howard, he's boring.

    Lord and Miller are not what you want if you want to take a franchise like Star Wars in a different direction. They were completely out of their element here. They didn't have the technical chops, or the experience in these types of movies. In fact, they worked the whole time under the assumption that they were hired to direct a comedy. Lack of communication on Lucas Films, and Disney's part, and inexperience really are what killed Solo. I respect that they Disney was trying something out of the box, but I never really saw this marriage as a good fit.


    We'll never know what kind of film Lord and Miller would have delivered, but from the Lego Movie and Jump Street IMO they would have delivered a uniquely funny and gritty Solo story full of kinetic energy and humor. Two things a story about Han freakin' Solo desperately should include.

    Not all Howard's fault, but Han Solo IS a smartass that comes from a gritty underground world full of scoundrels and backstabbing.

    Solo and Howard didn't deliver any of that. So why not see where Lord and Miller could have gone, rather than play it safe and get scared.

    Solo's an OK movie, but it resembles nothing of what Han Solo means to the Star Wars universe. It's a generic sci-fi movie that just so happens to have characters with names we know.

    The big thing with Lord, and Miller is they had trouble with the technical aspect of this movie as well as the script. It was a mess from the get go. To me a Solo film should mirror western stories about infamous outlaws and their legends. Think a folk hero outlaw such as Jesse James, or Billy the Kid. I think his story should have been built around that type of lore. It probably should have been more marvel like than Star Wars as well. This is the kind of story where you can fit the Marvel like story, and humor into.
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Re: Solo (Spoilers) + Star Wars talk
Fri Jun 08, 2018 12:06 pm
  • Sgt. Largent wrote:Not all Howard's fault, but Han Solo IS a smartass that comes from a gritty underground world full of scoundrels and backstabbing.

    Solo and Howard didn't deliver any of that. So why not see where Lord and Miller could have gone, rather than play it safe and get scared.

    Solo's an OK movie, but it resembles nothing of what Han Solo means to the Star Wars universe. It's a generic sci-fi movie that just so happens to have characters with names we know.


    I completely disagree with you on this. I think that, aside from the fact that we can't actually have young Harrison Ford (the single main driving force behind the personality of the character of Han Solo IMO) Kasdan, Howard & Ehrenreich (and Lord & Miller, depending on how much of their vision made it through the cutting room) did as good a job as could be expected in capturing that character, that personality that would have been reasonable and realistic for a Han Solo who's 10-13 years younger than the one we met in A New Hope. I don't think it was perfect, but I do think it was really well done, as good or better than I'd hoped, and I think you'd be hard pressed to find any combination of creators that could do a better job. They managed to capture the true essence of the character in an actor who doesn't particularly look or sound anything like Harrison Ford, without it feeling like an impression or impersonation. Obviously how one perceives, interprets and absorbs any actor's portrayal, and particularly one of a character that is long admired and beloved like Solo, is totally subjective to the viewer's thoughts and experiences. So I'm not minimizing or disregarding your opinion, just sharing mine as a contrast.

    Also, just wanted to say that you can count me as one who truly enjoys the direction this franchise has gone under Disney and am very much looking forward to seeing where it goes from here, assuming there's still enough of us left for Disney & Lucasfilm to continue with their planned trajectory. I have my fair share of criticisms and expectations not being met just like the rest of you, there's things I wish they'd done totally different, but when I step back and remember that I don't watch movies, tv, or read comics books or novels in the hope that it's somehow my personal vision being realized, I can let go of most of that stuff and just enjoy it (not saying that's the only reason people don't like these movies, but I think it is a very big part of why a lot of people don't like these movies). When I think about what they've done in recent years with other franchises that I love like TMNT and Transformers, I feel very fortunate to actually be enjoying Star Wars and feeling like the people involved honestly care about the product. Hollywood's Hollywood, and Disney is very much a part of what is both good and bad about the way things work over there, but I truly believe that they're doing their best to create exiting, enjoyable, memorable characters, settings, situations and movies. It may be time for them to take a breath, take a step back, sort of reevaluate their strategy, but based on what they've done so far, and the things they've put in place for what they plan to do in the future, I'm pretty thoroughly satisfied. I hope they do more of the familiar, and at the same time branch out to give us more (much more) of the unexplored. Again, just my opinion. This is how I feel about it. I don't expect anybody share the same experience.
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