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 Post subject: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:22 pm 
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Take your emotions and team loyalty out of this thread and tell me how far you think this team can go with Hasselbeck.

He had plenty of time to throw the ball, but missed open receivers, threw behind guys who actually caught the ball and tossed some inexplicable interceptions.

I love the guy, always will...but when I watch him play it is painfully obvious that he is not the answer. At some point we need to find out what we have in Whitehurst.


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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:23 pm 
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2nd INT should have been a TD to Carlson. Terrible throw by Hasselbeck that had no zip on it.


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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:23 pm 
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He seemed late making all of his reads.


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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:23 pm 
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His passes lacked zip and he underthrew alot. I question his going deep on 4th and 2.

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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:24 pm 
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the 3rd one Matt being indecisive with the ball and throwing it to late. I would honestly trade matt to Minni cause Farve has been worse than matt this year.


Last edited by hburn21 on Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:25 pm 
8-8, division champs, lose in the 1st round of playoffs (maybe we eeck out a victory and lose on the road in the divisional round but I doubt it since I think the 5 seed will be a much better team than Seattle, being home is worth something but not that much IMO).

For the record I see the same upside with Charlie at QB but........

That is the best case scenario IMO and agree that its not worth it just to get to that point. But that is the plan so I have decided to embrace it and hope it happens, nothing else to do.


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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:26 pm 
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He's a system QB. Take him out of Holmgren's offense and his flaws are exposed. He's old, inconstant, has a noodle arm, is injury prone, and makes questionable decisions. I love Matt as a person, but as a QB in Bates offense not so much. Like you said, this team needs to see what it has in Whitehurst sooner or later, and if Hass keeps on playing like this it's going to be sooner.

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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:27 pm 
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There is something to say about QB/WR familiarness in a different offensive scheme.

Hass hasn't really developed a chemistry with this receiving core....and with Carlson, both Hass and John are in new offensive schemes. The pre-season just wasn't enought time to develop the chemistry...and hell...with the front office continually changing things, it didn't help things any (NOT that I am complaining....I think the FO did what they needed to do...huge kudos to them for having the cojones to do it).

I think the "long" reads are basically Hass not comfortable with the WR's and their pattern running. He just doesn't seem confident in them, even though they appear to be catching almost anything catchable that is thrown their way.

This is just my opinion, and what I think I'm observing. I think after the 4th game (I know, I know.....we shouldn't have to wait that long) we should see some improvement.


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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:28 pm 
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warner28 wrote:
For the record I see the same upside with Charlie at QB but........



I agree completely. We will stick with Hass until or unless we are out of the running for the division, but I have a hard time believing our FO sees him in the plan long-term. Even if Whitehurst projects as a future backup I would like to see him get snaps in games that Hasselbeck looks utterly worthless.


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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:29 pm 
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I am as big a Hass supporter as you will find on this forum but it is damn difficult to defend his performance today.

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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:31 pm 
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We now have better talent around him and he continues to struggle when he's pushing too hard. Let’s see what we got in CBJ even though I think Matt brings more experience to the table. Charlie just seems more accurate especially on the deep ball. But I am certain the coaches will do whats right.


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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:31 pm 
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Hass was horrible today. I'm normally a Hass defender but he made some bad decisions and really ugly throws to wide open receivers today.

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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:32 pm 
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The biggest problem is that Hasslebeck will only be here for THIS year. Why waste reps with Hass when you are rebuilding. I want to see what Whitehurst can do. Why get down timing when he is likely to be gone at the end of the year?

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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:33 pm 
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I hear you on the mistakes he made in the redzone. And i am really disapointed in his play today, but i just don't think Whitehurst could keep us ontime, driving the length of the field. I realize it is all for nothing when hass throws the ball away in the end but would whitehurst be able to throw a better ball (probably) but make a better read( i doubt it). I want to see Whitehurst but i doubt he would be an immediate improvement.

In Pete i trust. I would not be surprised if he benched Matt, though i don't think he will. From what i saw today i am actually pretty excited about our offense. Cut out the stupid mistakes(by everyone) and we win that game. I think Hass will bounce back next week, even against the dreaded Chargers.

Yes, at some point we will find out what we have in Whitehurst, but i would guess it won't be for at least a couple of months... at least.

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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:33 pm 
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Too early to pull the plug on him.. Let's talk again in 2-3 week and he continues to stink it up..

But regarding the original question.. He is good enough to win this division but lose in first round of playoff. More to do with what other teams are like in our division than anything...


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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:36 pm 
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Hasselbeck had a pretty bad game for sure.

But I'm old enough to remember conversations like this about Dave Krieg at the end of his run with the Hawks. We fans just couldn't wait to be rid of him and those irritating soap-dish fumbles.

And then we wandered in the QB wilderness for a long, long, long time.

So I dunno. I hesitate to abandon ship at this point.

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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:38 pm 
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Hawkfish wrote:
The biggest problem is that Hasslebeck will only be here for THIS year. Why waste reps with Hass when you are rebuilding. I want to see what Whitehurst can do. Why get down timing when he is likely to be gone at the end of the year?


Because he might not be gone at the end of this year.
So I don't want to see Whitehurst in there.
I honestly think, that if chemistry can be generated between Hass and this receiving group, some good things will happen. It will NEVER be the glorious long bomb accurate throws that CBJ can do, but I still think Hass is the better QB.


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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:39 pm 
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I love Hass, but ever since the Super Bowl he`s gone the way of Jake Delhomme or Marc Bulger. Sad, but it`s what has happened.

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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:39 pm 
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He was bad today - and his flaws were on show for the world. He deserves the chance to come back but if there are more weeks of this - we will have to pull the plug.

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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:44 pm 
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It is my stubborn opinion here that had the defense been able to hold on 3rd and long, 3rd and short......hell, 3rd and ANYTHING, those interceptions would not have mattered as much.

Don't get me wrong....they hurt (oh man they did....I am still cleaning up the popcorn I flung all over the room in exasperation at those picks)....but the defense MUST get off the damn field and give the offense more opportunities.

NOTE: I am NOT blaming the defense here. Those guys were frickin' warriors in there...to a man. Run defense was amazing...and the shut down of the screens was beautiful after awhile....I am sick and tired of Bradley's rinky dink defensive calls and him not thinking about....you guessed it....generating a pass rush.


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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:46 pm 
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Too slow of a starter nowadays.

He needs to get back to the days when his openning drives scored points.

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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:48 pm 
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Hass had a bad game. Move on. Last week everyone was praising him. Hawk fans are too up and down. Understand that this is the NFL. Players have bad and good games. Look at Joe Flacco, he threw 4 INT. Favre had 3, Young had 2 as well as a few other veteran QBs.

It happens. Stop crapping on our players when they have a bad game. Unless you can go in there and do a better job.

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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:49 pm 
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Can only make about half the throws this offense requires.

He's a game manager, not a playmaker in the Bates offense. Problem is, he keeps trying to make plays.


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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:50 pm 
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If he just had a bad game that would be one thing.

But the mistakes he made are not mistakes that an experienced QB should be making. They're rookie mistakes. Hell, I feel like calling them 'mistakes' is a compliment.

Also, he just can't make the throws that are necessary, and that is a huge problem.


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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:51 pm 
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Zowert wrote:
Hass had a bad game. Move on. Last week everyone was praising him. Hawk fans are too up and down. Understand that this is the NFL. Players have bad and good games. Look at Joe Flacco, he threw 4 INT. Favre had 3, Young had 2 as well as a few other veteran QBs.

It happens. Stop crapping on our players when they have a bad game. Unless you can go in there and do a better job.


The problem is that lately, Hass' bad games have far outnumbered the good. When that happens it changes from having a bad game to just being bad.

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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:55 pm 
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Trrrroy wrote:
Zowert wrote:
Hass had a bad game. Move on. Last week everyone was praising him. Hawk fans are too up and down. Understand that this is the NFL. Players have bad and good games. Look at Joe Flacco, he threw 4 INT. Favre had 3, Young had 2 as well as a few other veteran QBs.

It happens. Stop crapping on our players when they have a bad game. Unless you can go in there and do a better job.


The problem is that lately, Hass' bad games have far outnumbered the good. When that happens it changes from having a bad game to just being bad.


Lately? This was the second game of the season. He had a stellar game against the Niners and looked good that first drive, until the holding penalty. It killed his and the team's momentum.

It doesn't matter who our QB was. It could be Peyton Manning, and if he had a bad game, everyone would crap on him.

What are we going to do? Put Charlie in? Come on. Hass took this team to its first NFC championship and Superbowl. He may be a little older, but he's still a good QB.

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Last edited by Zowert on Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:57 pm 
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Mot sure why he is obsessed with the play down the sideline. Very few throws over the middle and, missed a critical throw late in the 3rd that would have been a difference maker - guy was open by at least 5 years. Bummer. I'm a big Hass fan but watching him live, I have to question his reads on the receivers. Opening drive looked great until he threw the pick. Went downhill from there.

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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 3:59 pm 
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Today he was simply doing his best Michael Vick impression... both his running and passing ability.

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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 4:02 pm 
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MeanBlueGreen wrote:
Mot sure why he is obsessed with the play down the sideline. Very few throws over the middle and, missed a critical throw late in the 3rd that would have been a difference maker - guy was open by at least 5 years. Bummer. I'm a big Hass fan but watching him live, I have to question his reads on the receivers. Opening drive looked great until he threw the pick. Went downhill from there.


Its not that Hass is obsessed with those plays, those were the cards he was delt. Hass isnt necessarily allowed to call audibles like he used to under Holmgren. He gets the play calls and tries to execute them, that's all he can do. Most of the completions Hass made were up the middle anyway, so I dont know what youre talking about.

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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 4:02 pm 
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It looks to me like Matt reads well, but his actual throws are an adventure.


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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 4:02 pm 
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Hass is not going to be our quarterback in the future. Honestly, IF this team ends up going on a losing streak, we need to see if CBJ can hack it as the future quarterback or if we need to spend our #1 next year on a QB. The last thing I want to see is this team go 8-8, 7-9 whatever, with Hass at qb, then start CBJ next year only to find out he sucks too.

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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 4:03 pm 
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TruFan23 wrote:
I love Hass, but ever since the Super Bowl he`s gone the way of Jake Delhomme or Marc Bulger. Sad, but it`s what has happened.


Actually he basically carried the offense the year after the SB.....28 TDs vs. only 12 ints and a 91.4 rating with Alexander out half the year. Since then though, he's been hurt and/or inconsistent at best and less than inconsistent at worst.

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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 4:03 pm 
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TruFan23 wrote:
Hass is not going to be our quarterback in the future. Honestly, IF this team ends up going on a losing streak, we need to see if CBJ can hack it as the future quarterback or if we need to spend our #1 next year on a QB. The last thing I want to see is this team go 8-8, 7-9 whatever, with Hass at qb, then start CBJ next year only to find out he sucks too.


Well, duh, he's 35 years old.

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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 4:03 pm 
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I don't think anyone can say how the year is really gonna play out. One game THIS SEASON. This is a different season, different players, different coaches. So he had a bad game. Let's see how he does next week. Do you really think benching Hass right now is gonna give this team any kind of confidence? I think he is still the leader of this team and had an off day.


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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 4:04 pm 
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TruFan23 wrote:
Hass is not going to be our quarterback in the future. Honestly, IF this team ends up going on a losing streak, we need to see if CBJ can hack it as the future quarterback or if we need to spend our #1 next year on a QB. The last thing I want to see is this team go 8-8, 7-9 whatever, with Hass at qb, then start CBJ next year only to find out he sucks too.


Concur. Problem will be that 8-8 could win the division.

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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 4:05 pm 
Zowert wrote:

What are we going to do? Put Charlie in? Come on. Hass took this team to its first NFC championship and Superbowl. He may be a little older, but he's still a good QB.



Its not 2005, just because people keep repeating "Matt is still a good QB" does not make it true.

More and more (and not just this one season) the good games are being far out weighed by the bad games, today he made 1 physical mistake (2nd INT, he just can't make that throw, not sure he ever could), 1 mental mistake (1st INT, a 7th grader knows not to throw that pass) and 1 that was both (the 4th down throw through the end zone).

Simple put, many of us are not in agreement with the "Matt is still a good QB" stance. He used to be, just not sure he still is.


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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 4:05 pm 
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Zowert wrote:
Trrrroy wrote:
Zowert wrote:
Hass had a bad game. Move on. Last week everyone was praising him. Hawk fans are too up and down. Understand that this is the NFL. Players have bad and good games. Look at Joe Flacco, he threw 4 INT. Favre had 3, Young had 2 as well as a few other veteran QBs.

It happens. Stop crapping on our players when they have a bad game. Unless you can go in there and do a better job.


The problem is that lately, Hass' bad games have far outnumbered the good. When that happens it changes from having a bad game to just being bad.


Lately? This was the second game of the season.


Yes lately. Last years games count too, don't they?

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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 4:05 pm 
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mrblitz wrote:
It looks to me like Matt reads well, but his actual throws are an adventure.


Agree with this too.

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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 4:11 pm 
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Aros wrote:
I am as big a Hass supporter as you will find on this forum but it is damn difficult to defend his performance today.

***sigh***

Sadly, I share your disdain.

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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 4:13 pm 
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Zowert wrote:
Hass had a bad game. Move on. Last week everyone was praising him. Hawk fans are too up and down. Understand that this is the NFL. Players have bad and good games. Look at Joe Flacco, he threw 4 INT. Favre had 3, Young had 2 as well as a few other veteran QBs.

It happens. Stop crapping on our players when they have a bad game. Unless you can go in there and do a better job.


In that case, I'll crap on Jennings. I'm 51, overweight, and use a cane after a bad motorcycle experience. But I could play corner better than that POS.

It has nothing to do with Hass, but it had to be said. :mrgreen:


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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 4:19 pm 
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i understand that hass is nearing the end of his career, however with a young team still developing it will take a couple of games. everyone thinks that 9-7 will win the division... ok we're 1-1. still too early to make any judgement except that matt won't have another game like that. CBJ will get his turn and they will probably draft a QB in the first three rounds next year. i'm still in!!

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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 4:21 pm 
zhawk wrote:
i understand that hass is nearing the end of his career, however with a young team still developing it will take a couple of games. everyone thinks that 9-7 will win the division... ok we're 1-1. still too early to make any judgement except that matt won't have another game like that. CBJ will get his turn and they will probably draft a QB in the first three rounds next year. i'm still in!!



This would make sense if Matt Hasselbeck does not play like a junior high QB that was picked out of the crowd to play. Matt needs to make up for the mistakes of the young team, not make matter worse, today he made matters worse.

Even with the terrible defense if Matt does not make 3 boneheaded passes (the 2 first half picks and the 4th down throw through the endzone) that no 'Pro Bowl' QB should ever make (at least not 3 times in a game) they could have had a shot in a shoot out type of game.


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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 4:35 pm 
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i don't disagree that he had a horrible day.... i also don't expect him to have another game like that. it felt like he was trying to make up for his mistakes and just made it worse

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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 4:45 pm 
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zhawk wrote:
i don't disagree that he had a horrible day.... i also don't expect him to have another game like that. it felt like he was trying to make up for his mistakes and just made it worse


THAT is THE problem with Matt Hasselbeck

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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 4:46 pm 
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To me, the first 2 int were potential TD if had a little more power to them. The first int was a little under thrown, therefore champ got it. the 2nd he under Carlson who was open if had a little more zip to it.
and the 3rd was just a bad throw which got eaten up by a rookie cb. sadface


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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 4:46 pm 
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zhawk wrote:
i don't disagree that he had a horrible day.... i also don't expect him to have another game like that.


Why? He's had 13 interceptions in his past five games. It's beginning to turn into a trend.

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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 4:55 pm 
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warner28 wrote:
Zowert wrote:

What are we going to do? Put Charlie in? Come on. Hass took this team to its first NFC championship and Superbowl. He may be a little older, but he's still a good QB.



Its not 2005, just because people keep repeating "Matt is still a good QB" does not make it true.

More and more (and not just this one season) the good games are being far out weighed by the bad games, today he made 1 physical mistake (2nd INT, he just can't make that throw, not sure he ever could), 1 mental mistake (1st INT, a 7th grader knows not to throw that pass) and 1 that was both (the 4th down throw through the end zone).

Simple put, many of us are not in agreement with the "Matt is still a good QB" stance. He used to be, just not sure he still is.


Well you don't like to look at the situation he's put in, you would rather blame it all on the QB.

He has a crap O-line protecting him, questionable receivers, a lack of a "go-to" man and an unproven offensive coordinator (until Bates). What do you expect? A quarterback is limited to the team around him and in the last couple seasons, the team around him has been a complete joke.

Look at all the successful QB's in the league. Brees, Manning, etc. What do they have in common? They're behind a solid O-line and at least one go to receiver. What's Hasselbeck got? Deon Branch and a former 1st round bust.

Where was our #1 receiver today anyway? Oh that's right, he was SHUT DOWN!

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Last edited by Zowert on Sun Sep 19, 2010 5:01 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 4:57 pm 
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If you want to look objectively at hasselbeck, you have to do the same with Whitehurst and from what I've seen he's not the answer today, tomorrow, next year or ever. We wasted a pick on him and we'll still be looking for our qb of the future next year and the year after until someone figures this out. Hasselbeck is our only option at winning now.


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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 4:58 pm 
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Just like when Shaun Alexander was done, there is no way to have an 'objective' discussion about Hasselbeck. The uber supporters will make excuses all day long, and anyone that doesn't make excuses for him will be labelled a hater.


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 Post subject: Re: Objective look at Hasselbeck
 Post Posted: Sun Sep 19, 2010 4:58 pm 
Yeah, he had nothing to do with it. Everyone else's fault.

Today, Matt was the reason the offense did not score 20+ points, no one else and this is not the first time he has been a disaster.

If you want to let him off the hook that is your choice but Matt is not playing at anywhere near the level he did in 2005 and IMO he is no longer capable of playing anywhere near that level on a regular basis regardless of the team around him.


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