Take back something I said about Bevell

Childress called them and BRENT FAVRE changed them at the line

LymonHawk":2fctqvgg said:

hawker84":2fctqvgg said:

pehawk":2fctqvgg said:

He's confusing.

Moore on the sideline route? Set-up a wheel route for Turbin, when Leon's there (not ripping on Turbin, that's a tough catch for inexpeirenced backs). Why Tate on those jump posts every time, why not the best WR on the roster, Rice? Why ditch I formation at the 50?

When the plays there, it seems the wrong players are getting their numbers called.

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DISAGREE... the ball was placed perfectly, easy over the left shoulder catch that landed softly in his hands.. it was too easy of a catch and he was probably thinking TD before he secured it... no excuse that's not a tough catch at all, and that play has got to be made... having said that moving on, i'm sure nobody feels worse than turbin about it..

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How come Russell gets a get-out-of-jail card for being a rookie, but Turbin does not?

Although the pass was placed perfectly, it was wobbling, and not that easy to catch. IMHO, you could see it in Turbin's eyes when he reached for the ball. YMMV.

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you're going to compare being a rookie qb to catching a routine pass.... interesting, you're entitled to your opinion...being someone who played the game a bit...it was a routine catch... for a pro, rookie, college, high schooler....and sometimes the wabbly passes are easier to catch the spirals, you can see them better in the air....

Turbin was a fine/great receiver in college. It all depended on the day and what type of defense they were opposing. There's a reason I said he reminded me of a mini John L. Williams around draft time. The guy has very sure hands, and I thought he would be used like we used MoMo and John L. Throw to him out of the backfield on swing passes and screens, but also split him out as a WR and have him run plays exactly like the one we saw him drop on Thursday. It was great to finally see that play. It was disheartening that he dropped it, because in watching Robert for a few years, that is a play he makes 99 out of 100 times. He's not a bobbly-handed receiver. He's very MoMo-eque, and Mo was a guy who ran routes and caught the ball like a receiver many times over his career. But he was a change-up running back. Turbin has the chance to be an every down back and add that dimension of being an extra WR, and he is strong enough and can pick up blocks so that he could be in the backfield with Lynch.

As the offense grows (and we hope Bevell doesn't give up on things and throw them out) then there is a good chance that we'll see plays with Lynch and Turbin both in at once and Lynch moving to the slot, and then Turbin going in motion and splitting wide. I can see it creating real havoc for defenses who are going to be LBer heavy when seeing those two guys in at once and assuming run all the way and we end up with an empty backfield. We have the players to come up with creative options right now. You don't need the best talent in the world to beat teams. Look at what Boise State has done. Look at what even some NFL teams have done. The Broncos were knocking off teams all year with the world's worst QB, just by creating plays that used his advantages. The Raiders were winning games with Jason Campbell at QB. The Dolphins even went so far as to line Ronnie Brown up at QB extensively a few years ago and won games doing it.

We've got talent. Let's use it. We've got Edwards, Rice (2 tall WR's), Tate, Baldwin, Obo (3 good possession receivers), Miller, McCoy, Moore (3 BIG TE's), Turbin, Lynch, (2 STRONG RB's that can catch), Robinson (a VERY athletic and smart FB who can also throw the ball), and Leon Washington (A VERY dangerous weapon when given the ball in space, but all they ever use him for now is an occasional handoff like he's the usual running back... how about an end around? How about a bubble screen? How about an option play to Leon? How about splitting him out to WR and have him run that Lockette 'just run past everybody on the field and throw it as far as you can' play?

Get creative with what you have guys. Our QB is a playmaker. Give him the chance to make plays to the playmakers he is surrounded with.

Great stuff Shark. I've always looked forward to your posts. I live in Utah and am an Aggie (1998), so your knowledge of local sports, especially related to the Hawks, is always informative and interesting to me.

BTW. Bobby Wagner was at the USU game last Saturday. Awesome to see two Aggies drafted in the same year, never thought I would see that. Turbin effed up, but he is a solid back and is an extremely motivated worker. He'll be just fine.

I remember being so frustrated with drops in 03 and 04. Once we got that worked out, things got a little a better Hopefully the same follows suit with this team.

Oops now that I read my post, I am realizing that I was thinking of Jazz. SHOOT! Jazz is from Utah

Still love your posts though Shark, especially in this thread.

Sorry for the massive brain fart.

Umm, no, Shark is our resident Utahite. I've officially coined him our WAC/Mountain West dot.net scout. He's beyond reliable scouting those conferences.

Thanks for setting me straight Pe! I should have trusted my instinct. Maybe the Utah Jazz and JazzHawks threw me off!

Jazzhawks our resident passive-aggressive poster.

Didn't mean to come off demeaning, rj. Just making sure one of our resident experts gets their due.

LymonHawk":6g8jkvu3 said:

hawker84":6g8jkvu3 said:

pehawk":6g8jkvu3 said:

He's confusing.

Moore on the sideline route? Set-up a wheel route for Turbin, when Leon's there (not ripping on Turbin, that's a tough catch for inexpeirenced backs). Why Tate on those jump posts every time, why not the best WR on the roster, Rice? Why ditch I formation at the 50?

When the plays there, it seems the wrong players are getting their numbers called.

Click to expand...

DISAGREE... the ball was placed perfectly, easy over the left shoulder catch that landed softly in his hands.. it was too easy of a catch and he was probably thinking TD before he secured it... no excuse that's not a tough catch at all, and that play has got to be made... having said that moving on, i'm sure nobody feels worse than turbin about it..

Click to expand...

How come Russell gets a get-out-of-jail card for being a rookie, but Turbin does not?

Although the pass was placed perfectly, it was wobbling, and not that easy to catch. IMHO, you could see it in Turbin's eyes when he reached for the ball. YMMV.

Click to expand...

After watching the play over again I'd say it's more rookie mistake on Turbo's part. Turbo slowed for a moment after beating his man. That pass was well thrown and easily caught if Turbo had anticipated the pass to come his way while beating his man then quickly running up the sideline. Just a slight hesitation was the difference between a difficult catch and getting it in stride for a potential touchdown. As for the slightly wobbly passes criticism, had it been a perfect spiral it gets there faster and likely makes it even more out of reach.

I was thinking the same thing with the personnel, thinking Washington would've been better in the pass route than Turbin.

Thing is, SF would've thought the same thing. It's also the reason we ran the ball on 3rd and 4 with Washington. SF doesn't believe we're going to run Washington, and that we will run Turbin. You're using personnel in situations where there isn't a lot of tape of them doing these things. It will take the defense by surprise, as evidenced by Turbin being that open against a good secondary. Turbin, if he does go out in pass routes, is usually out in the flat and is the checkdown.

Washington rarely runs the ball; he's usually in pass routes.

We bitch about Bevell's play calling, then we bitch that he puts the "wrong" guys in, when he's trying to catch the defense off balance. We can't have it both ways.

Hawks46":2rlrjybx said:

I was thinking the same thing with the personnel, thinking Washington would've been better in the pass route than Turbin.

Thing is, SF would've thought the same thing. It's also the reason we ran the ball on 3rd and 4 with Washington. SF doesn't believe we're going to run Washington, and that we will run Turbin. You're using personnel in situations where there isn't a lot of tape of them doing these things. It will take the defense by surprise, as evidenced by Turbin being that open against a good secondary. Turbin, if he does go out in pass routes, is usually out in the flat and is the checkdown.

Washington rarely runs the ball; he's usually in pass routes.

We bitch about Bevell's play calling, then we bitch that he puts the "wrong" guys in, when he's trying to catch the defense off balance. We can't have it both ways.

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Then how do bisexuals have it both ways? If anything, my current GF proves it's possible.

But, yeah, I do kinda agree. Although, SF's 2nd half-adjustments weren't rocket science. It was the right personnel, right play calls, and neither was a mystery to Seattle's defense.

So, maybe Bevell's outthinking himself with trying to catch defenses offguard based on personnel?

C'mon Pehawk, we all know that's the best kind of both ways. Unless you're bisexual.....cuz bisexual dudes are still gay. But I digress....

I don't know if he's over thinking it, or if we're just not making necessary adjustments, or if we're just not executing. If Turbin catches that pass, the play call is genius. Personally, I still think it's a damn good call. Turbin wasn't known as a receiver in college, he was more well known for his ypc average and his TD's, but if you actually watched a lot of tape on the guy, he was a good receiver in college. He's also faster than Lynch, meaning he will get better separation from LBers downfield.

Washington has proven to be a decent runner on 3rd downs, and he's more than capable of getting 4 yards. There was good blocking, but SF's defense is capable of getting him down without a perfect tackle, which is what happened. Turbin could've broken the tackle, but with Turbin in the backfield, SF would've been keying run more.