whats flynns eventual value?

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whats flynns eventual value?
Sun Nov 04, 2012 7:56 pm
  • I'm think a 2nd and a 5th

    To a team like the jets cheifs cowboys eagles jags chargers browns

    What's everybody think
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Sun Nov 04, 2012 7:58 pm
  • I think a 2nd and a 5th is a bit of a reach. Remember, he didn't have too many suitors in FA this past offseason. I'd say he's worth about a 4th.
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Sun Nov 04, 2012 7:59 pm
  • I'm not sure. He didn't garner much attention in FA when we got him, and then he got supplanted by a rookie. People will keep bringing up the fact that his old OC in Miami didn't want him.

    We might get a 2nd for him if we keep him next year and:

    1. he tears it up in the preseason
    2. Wilson gets hurt during the reg season this year and he comes in and lights it up.
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Sun Nov 04, 2012 7:59 pm
  • Give me a 4th, and I will be quite satisfied.
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Sun Nov 04, 2012 8:02 pm
  • There wasnt much of a market for him to begin wtih and then he got beaten out by a 3rd round rookie (albeit a very good 3rd round rookie). I think his trade value is very minimal... like a 5th or something.

    If he gets a chance to get into a game and flashes a little bit then that coudl go up obviously.

    Edit... basically what hawks46 said.
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Sun Nov 04, 2012 8:02 pm

Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Sun Nov 04, 2012 8:07 pm
  • JSeahawks wrote:There wasnt much of a market for him to begin wtih and then he got beaten out by a 3rd round rookie (albeit a very good 3rd round rookie). I think his trade value is very minimal... like a 5th or something.

    If he gets a chance to get into a game and flashes a little bit then that coudl go up obviously.

    Edit... basically what hawks46 said.


    No chance he gets on the field with how close our games have been. His arm and ego should have recovered by now.
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Sun Nov 04, 2012 8:17 pm
  • Maybe a 6th or 7th.
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Sun Nov 04, 2012 8:17 pm
  • Damn harsh on him some teams will need him to play quarterback for them
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Sun Nov 04, 2012 8:25 pm
  • Honestly after the season I wouldnt be surprised if they restructured and released him . Giving him the oppurtunity to play elsewhere while getting some of that bonus money back.

    Trade Value ? would get no more then a 5th.
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Sun Nov 04, 2012 8:27 pm
  • Skater, no team will give up more than a 4th for him. He's proved nothing in a real NFL setting, except that he couldn't beat out a 3rd round 5'10" rookie, when he was all but a lock for the starting job after getting paid in FA. If some team is willing to do something like we did for Whitehurst, then our FO better jump all over it.
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Sun Nov 04, 2012 8:30 pm
  • you guys r on drugs. 1 4 th round at best. MY god this guy is the best overhyped bakup of all time.
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Sun Nov 04, 2012 8:30 pm
  • rainger wrote:you guys r on drugs. 1 4 th round at best. MY god this guy is the best overhyped bakup of all time.


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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Sun Nov 04, 2012 8:33 pm
  • I think the whole Kevin Kolb ordeal being still fresh in the minds would play a big part in keeping teams, even the desperate teams, in check for the time being anyway.
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Sun Nov 04, 2012 8:34 pm
  • rainger wrote:you guys r on drugs. 1 4 th round at best. MY god this guy is the best overhyped bakup of all time.

    :13:
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Sun Nov 04, 2012 8:39 pm
  • Depends on who you ask. Someone who's only looking for a more capable backup, maybe a 6th or 7th. Someone who's desperate for a starter, has good pass protection and timing receivers, and a talented offensive coordinator, might pay a 4th or even a 3rd.
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Sun Nov 04, 2012 9:02 pm
  • There wasn't a market for him. After this year? There is a market for him...
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Sun Nov 04, 2012 9:15 pm
  • I love me some RW and am VERY happy with him as our QB. But Matt Flynn is a starting caliber QB too, and he could be very good for somebody. I think there were two things that hurt Kolbs value.

    1) Peyton Manning taking too damn long to make a decision about who he was going to play for.

    2) Kevin Kolb.

    But, I do think that since Flynn is under a very reasonable contract he could fetch a 2nd round pick, maybe even a first if a team is desperate enough. It's not like they'd be paying a 2nd, a starting CB and paying 60 million dollars.
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Sun Nov 04, 2012 9:26 pm
  • I don't there's a chance in :twisted: that we trade him.

    1. We don't know if RW can last the full season. He seems to avoid contact, but we just don't know at this point.
    2. We're already on the hook for Flynn's guaranteed $.
    3. We don't have another backup.* Are we going to draft one? Perhaps. As good as Flynn? Doubtful.

    Look at it this way: for a bit more than the cost of an average QB (most of which is going to Flynn currently), we have a rising star and an above-average backup. What's not to like?

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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Sun Nov 04, 2012 9:31 pm
  • Why are we even talking about this?? Can't we for just once have a relatively stable quarterback roster?
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Sun Nov 04, 2012 9:47 pm
  • Even though they are only somewhat related. Russell Wilson's success is linked to Flynn's value.

    Once the world sees that Wilson won the job, and that Flynn didn't lose it, we'll be okay for a 2nd - 4th. Let me ask you a question. If we still had Tavaris, how much would you pay for him?
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Sun Nov 04, 2012 9:49 pm
  • Tell me getting a 2nd wouldn't be a huge bonus for next year
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Sun Nov 04, 2012 9:54 pm
  • The talk of a 2nd has no basis in reality unless Wilson gets hurt and Flynn comes in and blows it up in his 2nd NFL offense.

    Sure, Peyton took away from his market, but his market was only 2 teams, one of which didn't make a strong offer. He's not suddenly going to become a hot commodity without something changing drastically.

    If we got a 3rd it'd be nuts and we'd be extremely lucky, pretty lucky if we got a 4th.
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Sun Nov 04, 2012 10:30 pm
  • PlinytheCenter wrote:Why are we even talking about this?? Can't we for just once have a relatively stable quarterback roster?

    His cap hit will jump to $7.25 million next year, for a guy who is sitting on the bench. So no, we probably can't keep him. We don't even have much leverage to renegotiate the contract because if we cut him we'd still have to put something like $4mil in bonuses against the cap.

    Best case scenario for us would probably be if we can get him in on some garbage time. If he could step in and show the world that he really does have game, we could maybe unload him for a 3rd plus another low one. Plenty of teams will want QBs, and this draft class still looks weak. But his contract is going to hurt our chances, and at the moment he just doesn't have enough on tape to be worth it. As it stands right now, I'm thinking our best chance might be a 5th with a condition that it could go up to a 3rd or 4th if he starts and is awesome.
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Sun Nov 04, 2012 11:09 pm
  • aku wrote:
    PlinytheCenter wrote:Why are we even talking about this?? Can't we for just once have a relatively stable quarterback roster?

    His cap hit will jump to $7.25 million next year, for a guy who is sitting on the bench. So no, we probably can't keep him. We don't even have much leverage to renegotiate the contract because if we cut him we'd still have to put something like $4mil in bonuses against the cap.

    Best case scenario for us would probably be if we can get him in on some garbage time. If he could step in and show the world that he really does have game, we could maybe unload him for a 3rd plus another low one. Plenty of teams will want QBs, and this draft class still looks weak. But his contract is going to hurt our chances, and at the moment he just doesn't have enough on tape to be worth it. As it stands right now, I'm thinking our best chance might be a 5th with a condition that it could go up to a 3rd or 4th if he starts and is awesome.


    Well, there's that to consider... :34853_doh: It's just a shame we can't be solid at the position for once.
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Mon Nov 05, 2012 2:18 am
  • skater18000 wrote:I'm think a 2nd and a 5th

    To a team like the jets cheifs cowboys eagles jags chargers browns

    What's everybody think



    I think Pete probably has the occasional cocktail but shys away from the meth. In other words, Flynn likely won't be going anywhere, anytime soon.
    Having your views challenged is a lot more healthy than simply jabbering on with people who think exactly the same way as you.
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Mon Nov 05, 2012 2:56 am
  • Possible franchise QBs are such a hot commodity though that they get overvalued. People will look at Flynn and say "well he was a 7th round draft pick and was then beaten out by a rookie", but by the end of the year they'll also be saying "that rookie would have beaten out our starter too".

    A team like KC, Buffalo, NYJ or possibly Cleveland, and arguably Dallas would take a serious look at Flynn for a 2nd, considering he has a relatively risk-free contract.

    I don't think I'd give him up for a 2nd though, as it's all good getting a 2nd for a backup until you need someone to step in and lead the team.
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Mon Nov 05, 2012 4:33 am
  • No idea if anyone even wants him, the only two teams that were interested in him have their franchise guys in place now, Miami with Tannehill, and Seattle with Wilson. Also one could argue Seattle didn't even See Flynn as a franchise QB because he had to compete for the starting spot. I think a 5th would be fair, a 4th I'd be friggin thrilled.
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Mon Nov 05, 2012 5:06 am
  • Conditional late round that can become a 3rd...maybe a 2nd, depending on starts/stats.
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Mon Nov 05, 2012 8:58 am
  • stop this nonsense. Flynn is a great backup QB and it makes absolutely no sense to trade him. depth is what wins championships, including at QB.

    with the way Russell runs all over the field scrambling for first downs, we are literally one unlucky hit away from starting Flynn.
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Mon Nov 05, 2012 9:07 am
  • Probably pretty minimal. If he never plays this year and shows that he is good, I doubt teams will be frothing at the mouth for him. I'd guess 5th tops, and that is probably being too optimistic. I think he's good, but his value lessens when he doesn't go out there and perform
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Mon Nov 05, 2012 9:09 am
  • Bipolar wrote:stop this nonsense. Flynn is a great backup QB and it makes absolutely no sense to trade him. depth is what wins championships, including at QB.

    with the way Russell runs all over the field scrambling for first downs, we are literally one unlucky hit away from starting Flynn.


    Either way, he makes too much to be a back up. He'll need to be restructured this offseason, if he turns it down, do you honestly think JS & PC will keep him around?
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Mon Nov 05, 2012 9:12 am
  • I think kearly is the one who brought up the Raiders as the most likely suitor. Maybe a 4th there, if, on the second day of the draft, there's slim pickings for QBs and the Raiders haven't taken 1 of Barkley, G. Smith, or Tyler Wilson.
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Mon Nov 05, 2012 9:14 am
  • Bipolar wrote:stop this nonsense. Flynn is a great backup QB and it makes absolutely no sense to trade him. depth is what wins championships, including at QB.

    with the way Russell runs all over the field scrambling for first downs, we are literally one unlucky hit away from starting Flynn.


    This is true for any NFL QB. Depth wins championships......true, but that is not true for the QB position. Backup QB's don't win championships...show me how many backup QBs that have come into play and have won Superbowl?
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Mon Nov 05, 2012 9:27 am
  • Flynn must be OK with the status quo or his agent would be leaking stuff to the media. His contract might address his future should he not be the starter: trade/buyout/release? Wilson better workout as the starter because I don't think any FA QBs would seriously consider Seattle after pondering the Flynn situation.
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Mon Nov 05, 2012 9:31 am
  • Bipolar wrote:stop this nonsense. Flynn is a great backup QB and it makes absolutely no sense to trade him. depth is what wins championships, including at QB.


    I totally agree. Unless It's a 1st round pick (which I think has zero chance of happening) or a really one sided trade in our favor (like what Philly got for Kolb) I'd rather just keep Flynn and have a good back up QB. I know some will bring up Flynns pay/cap hit, but the bigger picture IMO, is how much we are paying for BOTH our starter and back up, which is pretty low compared to the rest of the NFL.

    Bipolar wrote:with the way Russell runs all over the field scrambling for first downs, we are literally one unlucky hit away from starting Flynn.


    I don't really feel like Wilson is at any more risk than most of the other QBs out there, maybe I'm delusional, but for some reason I'm not really worried about it. But yeah, every team in the league is one unlucky hit away from starting their back up QB.
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Mon Nov 05, 2012 9:41 am
  • peachesenregalia wrote:Skater, no team will give up more than a 4th for him. He's proved nothing in a real NFL setting, except that he couldn't beat out a 3rd round 5'10" rookie, when he was all but a lock for the starting job after getting paid in FA. If some team is willing to do something like we did for Whitehurst, then our FO better jump all over it.


    Why do people keep saying this?

    Yeh he was beat out by a 5'10", 3rd round rookie. Big deal! That rookie is showing everyone why he won the job!

    It isn't like Flynn is some scubb. He just didn't beat out a guy who looks to finally be the franchise QB we have been looking for the last upteen years.
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Mon Nov 05, 2012 9:44 am
  • Tech Worlds wrote:
    peachesenregalia wrote:Skater, no team will give up more than a 4th for him. He's proved nothing in a real NFL setting, except that he couldn't beat out a 3rd round 5'10" rookie, when he was all but a lock for the starting job after getting paid in FA. If some team is willing to do something like we did for Whitehurst, then our FO better jump all over it.


    Why do people keep saying this?

    Yeh he was beat out by a 5'10", 3rd round rookie. Big deal! That rookie is showing everyone why he won the job!

    It isn't like Flynn is some scubb. He just didn't beat out a guy who looks to finally be the franchise QB we have been looking for the last upteen years.


    I'm more alluding to league perception, Dom. WE know that Wilson is just that good, but around the league, they're going to see a player who was given decent money to come in and be the starter, and couldn't perform well enough to beat out a 3rd round rookie in preseason. It will diminish his perceived value.
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Mon Nov 05, 2012 9:49 am
  • Probably nothing. Maybe a token 6th or 7th rounder at best.

    He'll be a 28 year old career backup looking for his third team. He got a nice payday from the Seahawks and he'll be competing for a #2 seat wherever he goes.

    Maybe not fair, but in the NFL youth is served. Teams do not pay for potential when it comes to older players.
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Mon Nov 05, 2012 9:49 am
  • I dont know how many others cringed when Russell was nearly made into a pretzel sandwich yesterday, I thought he may have to come out, but other than Russells health I was really I was not worried about it, if it was Josh Portis I would have been really concerned.
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Mon Nov 05, 2012 9:52 am
  • m0ng0 wrote:he has zero value, he is no good, just ask anyone here.


    Except for the ones that think he's Terry Bradshaw, Bart Starr, Johnny U, Peyton Manning, Joe Montana, Bob Greise, & Vince Lombardi combined.

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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Mon Nov 05, 2012 10:02 am
  • But Matt Flynn is a starting caliber QB


    I disagree with this statement. And the reason I feel that way is because he hasn't been able to show anyone if he is or not. (except for Pete)

    I think even tho he gets good money next year its offset by Wilson's cheap rookie signing contract. Keep him around until its time for Wilson to get good money and then if he isn't capable of being our backup let him go.

    By the way, I would suggest to the Seahawks they offer him a new contract after next year. One thing we don't want is a player to be pissed and leave over a lack of respect. While I don't see Wilson being that way like Hutch was I do think Wilson might feel differently if he continues to have success here.

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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Mon Nov 05, 2012 10:05 am
  • PlinytheCenter wrote:Why are we even talking about this?? Can't we for just once have a relatively stable quarterback roster?


    I'm with him. If we can work the money, we gotta. We have been very lucky so far, Wilson is a very mobile guy and takes off. His a great slider, but I don't line the idea of a ruined season if he gets hurt.
    Eh... Whatever...
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Mon Nov 05, 2012 10:10 am
  • T-Sizzle wrote:
    Bipolar wrote:stop this nonsense. Flynn is a great backup QB and it makes absolutely no sense to trade him. depth is what wins championships, including at QB.

    with the way Russell runs all over the field scrambling for first downs, we are literally one unlucky hit away from starting Flynn.


    This is true for any NFL QB. Depth wins championships......true, but that is not true for the QB position. Backup QB's don't win championships...show me how many backup QBs that have come into play and have won Superbowl?


    Staubach, Bradshaw, Plunkett, Jeff Hostetler, Doug Williams, Trent Dilfer, and Tom Brady were all backups who supplanted starters at some point in the season and went on to win the superbowl. That's about what 1/6 of all Superbowl winning QB's?

    There are also many who were backups that led teams to the Superbowl but didn't win.

    I remember clearly the years Plunkett took over for Pastorini/Wilson, Doug Williams took over for Jay Schroeder, Trent Dilfer took over for Tony Banks, and Tom Brady took over for Drew Bledsoe. Those all took place at varying times in the season. With Williams it was for the playoffs basically only. Hostetler took over for Simms very late in the season as well. Brady took over early for Bledsoe (about a quarter of the way in). Dilfer took over for Banks after a couple of weeks, as Banks wasn't performing and they needed somebody to just manage the game and not a guy who would try to force things and created turnovers like Banks did. Plunkett was stuck in the Al Davis revolving wheel of QB's. Jay Schroeder lost the confidence of his teammates and coach and kept coming out with injuries. Gibbs finally said "enough" and just put Williams in and decided to just run with it for better or worse.
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Mon Nov 05, 2012 10:31 am
  • It will all depend on how desperate a team is at the time he is put on the block. I saw on one of the Vike boards last night that at least one fan is calling for Ziggy to go after Flynn. To me Minny would be the team that would most benefit from Flynn because of his knowledge of Green Bay's offense. But really, who knows.
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Mon Nov 05, 2012 10:45 am
  • OK but think of someone like TJ Yates playing for Texans last year. a freaking 3rd string QB, a rookie, starts playing and dominates games, including in playoffs. yes, they lost the division game against Ravens, but it is still pretty good in my books.

    we need someone reliable like that, who can just step in and play lights out... Flynn is exactly this type of guy.
    yes, we paid him too much, in hindsight. but what if RW didn't pan out? the odds were against him, in all conventional wisdom!
    and if we didn't get Flynn, we would have been forced to draft some mediocre QB in the middle of the 1st round, Weeden or Osweiler.

    so it is really up to the front office to re-negotiate Flynn's contract during the offseason. his stock isn't worth much these days, so I doubt he will have much leverage. nobody in NFL is going to pay him millions of dollars to sit on the bench. trading him to another team for peanuts would be just plain stupid.
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    Bipolar
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Mon Nov 05, 2012 1:37 pm
  • Bipolar wrote:OK but think of someone like TJ Yates playing for Texans last year. a freaking 3rd string QB, a rookie, starts playing and dominates games, including in playoffs. yes, they lost the division game against Ravens, but it is still pretty good in my books.

    we need someone reliable like that, who can just step in and play lights out... Flynn is exactly this type of guy.
    yes, we paid him too much, in hindsight. but what if RW didn't pan out? the odds were against him, in all conventional wisdom!
    and if we didn't get Flynn, we would have been forced to draft some mediocre QB in the middle of the 1st round, Weeden or Osweiler.

    so it is really up to the front office to re-negotiate Flynn's contract during the offseason. his stock isn't worth much these days, so I doubt he will have much leverage. nobody in NFL is going to pay him millions of dollars to sit on the bench. trading him to another team for peanuts would be just plain stupid.



    If we didn't get Flynn in the off season we'd still have Tjack as are back up. I think Flynn Stays. The contract he signed isn't awful it just seems that way now because of RW. We have two starting QB for the price of what many teams pay one. In terms of getting something for him I don't see it being great maybe a 5th with the possibility of it being higher based on Flynn performance. Then they have to find and sign a back up and still pay him a decent amount, why do that.
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Mon Nov 05, 2012 1:56 pm
  • The Radish wrote:By the way, I would suggest to the Seahawks they offer him a new contract after next year. One thing we don't want is a player to be pissed and leave over a lack of respect. While I don't see Wilson being that way like Hutch was I do think Wilson might feel differently if he continues to have success here.


    Under the rules of the new CBA, the Seahawks cannot offer Wilson a second contract until after his third season with the team when the restrictions on the initial deal no longer apply (eg - Wilson gets an accelerator in his contract in year four for becoming a starter and playing a certain % of snaps). It's put complete control in the teams hands for 3/4 years for any player drafted outside of round one and it's even worse for R1 picks with teams holding an option for a 5th year on all contracts, essentially meaning teams get rookie value for 4/5 years.

    After year four for first round picks and year three for everyone else, the power transfers to the player. Then they know they're either going to get the franchise tag, a big deal or hit free agency. But they have to wait to hold the cards.
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Mon Nov 05, 2012 1:56 pm
  • is flynn even going to want to stay and be a back up, or will he ask for a trade.. i get the feeling this guy feels he's a starting caliber qb and is going to want a chance to compete.... i could actually see it getting ugly...
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Re: whats flynns eventual value?
Mon Nov 05, 2012 2:02 pm
  • SharkHawk wrote:
    T-Sizzle wrote:
    Bipolar wrote:stop this nonsense. Flynn is a great backup QB and it makes absolutely no sense to trade him. depth is what wins championships, including at QB.

    with the way Russell runs all over the field scrambling for first downs, we are literally one unlucky hit away from starting Flynn.


    This is true for any NFL QB. Depth wins championships......true, but that is not true for the QB position. Backup QB's don't win championships...show me how many backup QBs that have come into play and have won Superbowl?


    Staubach, Bradshaw, Plunkett, Jeff Hostetler, Doug Williams, Trent Dilfer, and Tom Brady were all backups who supplanted starters at some point in the season and went on to win the superbowl. That's about what 1/6 of all Superbowl winning QB's?

    There are also many who were backups that led teams to the Superbowl but didn't win.

    I remember clearly the years Plunkett took over for Pastorini/Wilson, Doug Williams took over for Jay Schroeder, Trent Dilfer took over for Tony Banks, and Tom Brady took over for Drew Bledsoe. Those all took place at varying times in the season. With Williams it was for the playoffs basically only. Hostetler took over for Simms very late in the season as well. Brady took over early for Bledsoe (about a quarter of the way in). Dilfer took over for Banks after a couple of weeks, as Banks wasn't performing and they needed somebody to just manage the game and not a guy who would try to force things and created turnovers like Banks did. Plunkett was stuck in the Al Davis revolving wheel of QB's. Jay Schroeder lost the confidence of his teammates and coach and kept coming out with injuries. Gibbs finally said "enough" and just put Williams in and decided to just run with it for better or worse.


    I will give you Williams, Hostetler .... maybe Dilfer..... but stop it with the Brady, Bradshaw, or Staubach. The other thing you may notice is in the modern day NFL where QB plays a huge role its not happening. :141847_bnono:

    Matt Flynn has started 2 games, I would prefer to take the gamble he won't be one of those 1/7 backup (if that, personally I don't accept all your QBs) who won't win the SB and allocate that money to someone who will see the field.

    :les: If you want to over pay a backup QB lets bring one in with actual experience. :les:

    :th2thumbs:
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