Percy Harvin's Availaibility

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Sgt. Largent

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redhawk253":16gvwvny said:
this would be a pointless trade as the seahawks already have a poor man's Harvin in Golden Tate (they are both coming up on new contracts.. Harvin is going to cost about $8-10 mill a year.. Tate will be less than half that). they are nearly identical players Harvin just has better speed.. Tate is on the upswing however and proved to be clutch this year scoring some big tds and was the only guy on seattle that displayed good YAC. My guess is he continues to improve as he and Russell Wilson have become very good friends and hang out on the regular with their wives.. Seahawk's management isn't stupid.. they will keep their draft picks and let that chemistry build into something special.. not to mention mike wallace in free agency is a much better option for the seahawk's if they want to improve the receiving core.. he has played sandlot ball in pittsburgh for the last several years and has the speed we need to stretch the field on deep balls.. rice and wallace on the edges and tate in the slot would be DANGERUSS.

Harvin was a league MVP candidate last year during the first half of the season. He has scary speed, can return, catch and run out of the backfield.

Golden Tate has none of these things. Remember, we tried to have him return punts? Yeah, that didn't work out too well. I love me some Golden, but you're selling Harvin short by saying we don't need him because we already have Tate. Tate is closer to a Bobby Ingram type, than a Percy Harvin gamechanger type of player.
 

QuahHawk

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Harvin>Tate

Harvin is more versitile and productive than Desean Jackson and his explosiveness and game breaking ability are is the range of if not better than guys like.

CJ2K
Jamal Charles
Reggie Bush
Desean Jackson
Javid Best
 

SNDavidson

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I'm betting Pete really wants him, bad. He is the quintessential Pete Carroll special weapon/fiery competitor, with a little immature youth to mold with his win forever magic. He is Pete's dream boat. If you asked Pete to ID his perfect offensive weapon it would be Percy Harvin.... And Bevell knows how to use the kid!
 

DavidSeven

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I really don't get the obsession some people have with nabbing another supposed superstar receivers at a $10 million+ price tag.

Two things: 1) FA receiver acquisitions have to have the biggest bust rate of any position in the NFL; 2) Great QBs can win without a top 5 receiver and have done it time and time again. No one thought Denver had a better set of receivers than Seattle before Peyton got there. Brady has consistently been successful with plug-and-play journeymen as his targets. Eli has made receivers with mere above-average talent look better than they are.

I've been saying it since the season ended: if there's a good value proposition out there at WR, of course you jump on it, but this is not a position worth sinking a huge amount of additional cap space in. It would be a different story if we didn't already have a commitment to Rice. But we do.
 

SNDavidson

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DavidSeven":l9nj3wjq said:
I really don't get the obsession some people have with nabbing another supposed superstar receivers at a $10 million+ price tag.

Two things: 1) FA receiver acquisitions have to have the biggest bust rate of any position in the NFL; 2) Great QBs can win without a top 5 receiver and have done it time and time again. No one thought Denver had a better set of receivers than Seattle before Peyton got there. Brady has consistently been successful with plug-and-play journeymen as his targets. Eli has made receivers with mere above-average talent look better than they are.

I've been saying it since the season ended: if there's a good value proposition out there at WR, of course you jump on it, but this is not a position worth sinking a huge amount of additional cap space in. It would be a different story if we didn't already have a commitment to Rice. But we do.

A. How is a 24 year old electric game changer bad value?
B. I agree with whatever JS chooses to pay anybody.
 

DavidSeven

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SNDavidson":1bhvmgsu said:
A. How is a 24 year old electric game changer bad value?

When that 24 year old has a history of injury and personality concerns and that money can be spent more effectively on other areas (namely defensive line). No one was saying another 5'10-5'11 slot guy was the key piece we needed at the end of last season. If we could pay him on his rookie deal, it might be worth considering, but Harvin has already said he plans to hold out for a bigger contract. If we're going to pay big money to another receiver, he better either be big and physical or a speedster on the edges. Harvin is neither.
 

Hawkscanner

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Alright, like most of you guys I've read up on just about everything I can get my hands on regarding Harvin and listened to all the interviews. Here's my .02 FWIW.

As with all things that John Schneider and Pete Carroll do, it's all about value judgment -- just how much is it going to cost to land Harvin vs. the possible negative consequences of bringing in a potentially volatile personality like this. Putting my counseling hat back on for a second, Harvin profiles as being a highly Obsessive-Compulsive personality with probable Bipolar Disorder thrown in the mix. Now, just to take away the stigma of that for those of you who might be blanching at reading this -- everyone (and I mean everyone) can be diagnosed with something (even me). This is basically academic in the sense that it helps understand some of the personality dynamics going on here.

So in essence what I believe we have here is a guy who wants to win -- and to win badly at all costs. He may struggle at times with being able to relate to his teammates because of the overwhelming obsession with wanting to win has the potential of getting in the way in his relations with others. If in his head he perceives those around him as somehow not being as serious in wanting to achieve that goal of winning as badly as he does (i.e. they're having too much fun) -- he could turn on them and cohesion in the locker room could suffer, as he's going to let everyone know about it. If a coach's directions, decisions, etc. don't make sense in his own mind (or he doesn't agree with the course of action) -- he also has the potential of turning on them. It's as if he's unconsciously saying, "I know how things ought to be done and if you're not doing them my way -- it has to be wrong."

That type of intensity CAN be channeled ... but it is certainly an art-form -- let me tell you. In some ways, this is not unlike the same type of dynamics that Marshawn Lynch brings to the team. He's fairly aloof as well in the way that he deals with both the media and his teammates. But it works for him because they let him do his thing ... and they know what he's going to be about come Sunday morning. Russell Wilson brings a bit of that same singular focus (it's all about winning) as well. So yes, in theory is could work -- but you've got to keep in mind that unlike Lynch and Wilson, this guy can be volatile.

If anyone could harness such a personality and turn it in the right direction -- Pete Carroll MIGHT be that guy. But there are other coaches on this staff besides Carroll. How would he deal with other coaches like Tom Cable, for example, who to me reminds me a lot of Leslie Frazier. That's something else that ought to be considered.

YES, the talent is certainly there. But you DO have to wonder about the level of commitment. If he's truly going to be all in ... and the cost to bring him in isn't totally prohibitive, it might be worth a look see. Personally, if we're talking about anything more than the type of deal that the Hawks did in bringing in Lendale White (in this particular case, I'd say 5th Rounder or below) ... then I'd personally say pass. Percy Harvin could very easily turn out to be Kellen Winslow Part 2 -- a guy who in the end couldn't let go of HIS IDEAS of what his role ought to be -- and of just how valuable he thought he was. We saw how well that played out last year when push came to shove.
 

SNDavidson

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DavidSeven":2hb8ggpf said:
SNDavidson":2hb8ggpf said:
A. How is a 24 year old electric game changer bad value?

When that 24 year old has a history of injury and personality concerns and that money can be spent more effectively on other areas (namely defensive line). No one was saying another 5'10-5'11 slot guy was the key piece we needed at the end of last season. If we could pay him on his rookie deal, it might be worth considering, but Harvin has already said he plans to hold out for a bigger contract. If we're going to pay big money to another receiver, he better either be big and physical or a speedster on the edges. Harvin is neither.

Speed, catching abitility, route running, fire, and YAC YAC YAC YAC. Steve Largent wasn't big or fast. Harvin is literally a threat to score every time you put the ball in his hands, pretty valuable in my book, he changes your offense.
 

Rat

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The more I think about this, the more I hope we make a move for Harvin. Right now, our offense is very, very good. With Harvin, it's downright scary. Opposing defenses already have to sell out on the run to stop arguably the second-best running back in the NFL, plus the threat of a mobile QB with great escapability who can actually throw. Add one of the most electrifying wideouts in the league to that equation: how is anyone going to stop that? That's not even mentioning legitimate threats like Sidney Rice, Zach Miller, Golden Tate, Doug Baldwin, and Robert Turbin.

One of the opposing arguments I keep hearing for this potential deal is that we have young guys who will need to be paid soon. I don't want to lose any of our better players either, but all of our core players (Wilson, Sherman, Thomas, Okung, Wagner) have multiple years left on their contracts. Some are worried about holdouts, but thanks to the new CBA, those guys couldn't sign new deals right deal if Paul Allen gave them a signed blank contract. Cap hell is extremely overrated anyway. If your cap guys know what they're doing, you can do pretty much whatever you want. How many years have the Redskins been way over the cap, only to sign more players, without losing anyone important? Not that the Redskins are a shining example of how to run a franchise, but they are a good example of how overrated alleged cap problems are.

I don't know how credible the rumors are, but the rumor right now is that the Vikings would be willing to part with Harvin for less than a first round pick. How often are 24-year old players with his ability available? This isn't the age-old question of seasoned veteran vs unproven rookie. Harvin is only a year or two older than most of the rookie wideouts in this draft class, and we already know that he's a stud. As far as I'm concerned, if the Vikings were willing to accept something like a 2nd and a 4th, it's a no brainer.
 

chris98251

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I see Harvin as a Vince Young type, emotional fiery and unable to control himself. I also see him as a injury prone guy due to how you use him to begin with, he's not a real physical speciman.

No thanks at the cost it would be, we are not building for one year, were building for a repetitive representation. You guys can all enjoy your 30 seconds with Jennifer Lawrence I would rather spend all night with Hallie Berry.
 

travlinhawk

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If Pete wants him Pete shall have him. Pete was completely jacked when he was describing Harvin before we played Minni. He couldn't say enough good about him. I don't know if that was just pre-game talk or not but if it had a sliver of truth we may see Pete make a good case to get him. Do we need him, probably not.
 

chris98251

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travlinhawk":2degt61k said:
If Pete wants him Pete shall have him. Pete was completely jacked when he was describing Harvin before we played Minni. He couldn't say enough good about him. I don't know if that was just pre-game talk or not but if it had a sliver of truth we may see Pete make a good case to get him. Do we need him, probably not.

Pete has said that about most the players he cut also..................
 

SNDavidson

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[youtube]sFK3x31vne0[/youtube]

[youtube]UnboSsGWf1Q[/youtube]

Replaces Leon, this guy has a Seahawk mentality on the field, he is electric, Golden, Sidney, and this guy with Russell extending the play? Goodnight NFC West, Hello first round bye.
 

Jville

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It's the silly season!

No doubt about it :lol:
 

bestfightstory

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I will say this: I definitely don't want to see Harvin in a Niners jersey next year.
 

Jville

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Yea ....... a little to late to join Mike Singletary. LOL That would have been interesting.
 

HawkAroundTheClock

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No thanks. This is a fantasy league move. We have a QB who will make the players around him better, a la Peyton, Rodgers, Brady, etc. Put the money into a nasty D line and let Russell groom our future star WR draft picks, who will cost 1/10th that of Harvin.
 

Russ Willstrong

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I love what Harvin brings but Minny won't likely trade him to a championship contender for mere picks and/or Flynn. Next year Harvin is owed just $2.9 mil but a lucrative extension would need be negotiated.
Adrian Peterson is fruitlessly lobbying for the Vikes to keep Harvin. People question Harvin's durability but despite being on many pregame injury reports he played despite injuries and migraines in his time with the Vikings. He was placed on IR this last half season but there was more to the story than a sprained ankle. And as much as folks would like to question Harvin's character he got along with his teammates in the locker room and built real comradery with the great players on his team. He remained loyal to Minny after seeing his receiver comrades get shipped out one by one. He withstood the many post-Favre quarterback controversies (Tavaris Jackson vs Sage Rosenfels, Sage vs Joe Webb, Webb vs Ponder). He suffered a heartbreaking loss to the Saints--one in which he made a crucial fumble. He saw Rice get traded, Favre retire and AD tear his ACL leaving him to question whether the FO and coaches would be able to build a contender again. In the past off season he was a workout partner and motivator for Peterson's epic comeback. He was an MVP level player in the first half despite still playing under his rookie contract. His main flaw is he's passionate and a fierce competitor on the field.
Unfortunately a bad omen for Harvin and Seattle is Seahawks #12 is retired. Sorry Harvin.
 

lukerguy

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That run back vs. the Charger around 5:30 was ridiculous.
 

Hawkscanner

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Rat":1z35l9k9 said:
The more I think about this, the more I hope we make a move for Harvin. Right now, our offense is very, very good. With Harvin, it's downright scary. Opposing defenses already have to sell out on the run to stop arguably the second-best running back in the NFL, plus the threat of a mobile QB with great escapability who can actually throw. Add one of the most electrifying wideouts in the league to that equation: how is anyone going to stop that?

The more I think about this, the more I'm convinced that trading for Harvin would be a freaking bad idea. As I said above, there's no denying this guy's talent. I mean when things are going right, this guy can be a real game changer. I don't know why though ... but I keep hearkening back to another dynamic WR that the Seahawks had many years ago who was also a game changer and had a similar skillset -- Joey Galloway.

Like Harvin, Galloway incredible breakaway speed (dude could run a 4.18) and moves. Dennis Erickson and the Hawks fell in absolute love with that speed, envisioning that they could use him basically the exact same way that the Vikings use Harvin. And yeah -- he could be absolutely dynamic at times. But the fact of the matter is that the Seahawks never truly won with him. Now I know that people are going to be quick to point out that the Hawks didn't have the kind of overall talent on the team that they do now (and they're be right) -- but there was more to that IMO.

I actually met Joey Galloway (and John Kitna and others) back in 1999 when I was living in Spokane. In those days, training camp was held in Cheney ... and I up and decided to head out to Seahawks training camp one day to watch practice [Holmgren's first year with the team]. After practice, I had a chance to meet Galloway ... and let me tell you -- I walked away not liking the guy very much. He struck me as an extremely arrogant, pompous, me-first kind of player. He just rubbed me the wrong way. A real jerk I felt. Kitna wasn't like that -- nor were any of the other Hawks I met that day (Kitna and those other guys were very gracious, humble, team oriented, etc.) -- Galloway was the only one that wasn't like that. And the more that I think about it, the more I'm wondering if that's the kind of impression he left on Holmgren as well. Come that first offseason (February of 2000), Holmgren promptly traded Galloway to the Cowboys for a pair of 1st Round choices [in 2000 and 2001] -- who ended up becoming Shaun Alexander and Koren Robinson (oh well, 1 out of 2 ain't bad).

The Cowboys never truly won anything with Galloway either ... and neither did Tampa Bay after that. Seattle had 5 years of Joey Galloway in his prime and didn't win a thing. Now I'm not trying to suggest that Galloway necessarily had a bad attitude with his teammates ... was a real clubhouse cancer ... or was the reason that the Hawks and all of the other teams he was ever a part of didn't win a title because of him. There were far more factors involved in why they didn't win than that. What I am saying is that for whatever reason, this extremely fast dynamic playmaker DIDN'T make all the difference in the world. Despite his talent, he didn't transform those teams in to a contender by any means.

Remember, we had this exact same conversation about Brandon Marshall back in 2010 before he was traded to the Dolphins. The Phins traded two 2nd Round choices to the Broncos for Marshall. Just a mere 2 years later -- he's a Chicago Bear. Worked out well for Miami, huh?

Percy Harvin has demonstrated that he has electric talent ... but he also has shown an incredibly volatile personality to go along with it. According to reports, he was placed on the IR not because of an ankle injury ... but because of his attitude. Think about it -- he went on the IR with a supposed sprained ankle ... and the Vikings didn't even TRY to activate him for their biggest game of the year when they faced the Packers at Lambeau in the 1st Round of the Playoffs (a full 62 days after going on the IR).

All the talk surrounding him went from possible MVP Candidate early midway through the season ... to possibly being shipped out of town. The evidence is clear that the Vikings see Harvin as a potential cancer. Given all that has happened regarding him, it would be an absolute disaster for them to bring him back. In essence, they are over a barrel and I would say every team knows that by now. Why would you trade a 2nd or 3rd Round Pick for a guy that the Vikings likely will cut? It makes no sense. The only scenario I could possibly envision him coming to Seattle is either if the asking price is fairly low (I'd say a 5th Rounder or less) ... or if he gets cut altogether.

Given the overall package of who this guy is ... what the asking price sounds like it's going to be ... and the high likelihood that this may work out as well as Lendale White and Kellen Winslow did for Seattle ... I'd have to say pass.
 
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