Can everyone please just boycott the mariners?

Uncle Si

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jkitsune":3c91huwu said:
It's a variety of things, which isn't surprising, because I imagine that if the issue were singular it would have much more easily been addressed by now. Ownership is very uninvolved in the team, which in and of itself doesn't have to be a problem, but when an organization isn't working well, having absent ownership can be a problem. That said, having OVERinvolved ownership, particularly when the owner is a buffoon, can also be a problem.

During the Bavasi years, the Mariners were devastated by a series of catastrophically stupid baseball moves. The talent that the Mariners shipped away during the Bavasi years for no returns is staggering, and is enough to make you want to vomit. This is all pretty well-documented and is the absolute foundation of the team's struggles. That Lincoln/Armstrong let Bavasi stick around long enough to devastate the team in this manner is inexcusable.

During the Zduriencik years, the Mariners have made much better baseball decisions (no, not all of them are winners), but have suffered their fair share of awful luck. Everyone thought Smoak, Montero, and Ackley would hit (and maybe Montero and Ackley still will), and if those three players were hitting to their potential right now, the Mariners look like a completely different team. Getting Guti (et al) for Putz was a stroke of brilliance, and if not for injury troubles, he'd be a star. A lot of extremely talented young players have completely tanked on the Mariners, and while you could assume that must be an indictment of coaching staff, I think it's more likely beyond the team's control. Prospects are always fluky in this way, and the Mariners have been on the receiving end of more than their share of highly-touted prospects flaming out.

Zduriencik is also hamstrung by a relatively limited budget. It's not true that management is UNWILLING to spend, and they have certainly made their fair share of lucrative offers, but unfortunately, the Mariners' reputation as a club (and the tendency of talented hitters to fade into nothingness in Seattle) makes them a difficult place to sell to free agents. You could argue whether or not buying bats like Fielder and Pujols is a good idea for the team, but I think it's fair to say that IF you had an unlimited budget, it's a fine idea - the Mariners don't, unfortunately.

On top of that, Zduriencik has suddenly decided that adding aging vets on 1-year deals to take up otherwise-useful at-bats from younger players is a fine idea. Jason Bay is one thing, but Raul Ibanez is another entirely. It probably doesn't substantially harm the club, but it certainly doesn't help the club.

I'm sure I could think of others, but the bottom line is - the Mariners are a mess. Their highly-talented farm system/trades produced three top-tier hitting talents that are all tanking. Those three were supposed to be the cornerstone of a new generation of Mariners that would carry the team back to relevance. That it hasn't happened is pretty devastating to the franchise. Seager seems good. Maybe Saunders and Zunino will be good. Maybe Ackley and Montero will turn it around, and Smoak will be the only loss of the three. Here's hoping.

Pretty well said... alot of faith put into younger players after the debacle that Bavasi caused, and those younger players arent working out. Thankfully (atleast on the very front end) Hamilton turned us down or we'd have another 25 million a year invested in a player who isnt hitting.

Baseballs a funny sport, and to put together a successful team you either need to spend 100s of millions or get lucky with young players. Weve tried the younger player approach and while each of Smoak, Ackely and Montero all looked the part in their projections, they just havent hit.

We still have a strong farm system with young talent. if the younger guys can show promise and start to become atleast average MLB level players we may rebound for 2014 with a new crop of free agent possibilities and the likes of Walker, Hultzen, Franklin and Zunino joining
 

SouthSoundHawk

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Sports Hernia":1lrftim5 said:
"...I will not give the M's another dime thru ticket or merchandise sales until Lincoln and Armstrong are gone..."


Exactly.


I don't even bother watching the games or keeping up with them, it's a waste of time until real changes are made.


Chances are they lost anyway.
 

Seahawk Sailor

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After seeing the Seahawks completely revamp the organization from a laughingstock disaster to the potential for a dynasty in three short years, I have even less faith in the Mariners than I did before. I'm sorry, but fielding a crappy product and actively working against other local sports franchises, and trying to shellac it with a cheep coat of humor and a beard hat is not a professional way to run a sports franchise. Disjointed leadership in the team + concerted effort to keep the Sonics away + laughable product on the field + gimmicks and funny commercials as the only efforts to bring fans in = train wreck I am not willing to pay to see.
 

jkitsune

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Seahawk Sailor":3c7f08ka said:
After seeing the Seahawks completely revamp the organization from a laughingstock disaster to the potential for a dynasty in three short years, I have even less faith in the Mariners than I did before. I'm sorry, but fielding a crappy product and actively working against other local sports franchises, and trying to shellac it with a cheep coat of humor and a beard hat is not a professional way to run a sports franchise. Disjointed leadership in the team + concerted effort to keep the Sonics away + laughable product on the field + gimmicks and funny commercials as the only efforts to bring fans in = train wreck I am not willing to pay to see.

I'm not going to defend the Mariners too much on this, because they don't really give me much to defend them with. Baseball franchises don't rebuild as quickly as football franchises, in large part because there's so many levels of minor league system before players are even prepared to join the major league club. Good drafts in baseball don't generally pay dividends until several years down the road, and so you would expect, generally, that it may take 5-6 years to rebuild.

Obviously, it's taken longer than that, so I'm not using that as an excuse. Z has been a far better GM than Bavasi was (low bar to hurdle), and if Ackley, Smoak, and Montero were living up to their potential, we'd be looking at a much different future than we are right now. I think it's easy to forget that it's not as if the Mariners were the only people who thought these three would hit - Smoak and Montero were both top-10 prospects for many years in the eyes of scouts league-wide, and everyone thought Ackley would hit.

As for the PR, yeah. I don't really fault them for funny commercials and gimmicky promotions because all teams do that (the Giants do it less well, I can attest), but their tone-deaf bickering about the Sonics was an awful decision, and only served to alienate the franchise from the town.
 

birdman5

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RolandDeschain":2jsnfdjy said:
Their attempts at blocking the Sonics really pissed me off. I already am boycotting them. I normally go to 1-2 games each season to support the local team, but not now. Thank the baby Jesus that the Seahawks officially supported the arena deal.

This^ except I was more the 5-7 per year.
 

Largent80

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They have played pretty good ball the last 4 games, and seem to be gaining some confidence.
 

TheRealDTM

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Unless we want to be a 1 sport city we probably shouldn't boycott the Mariners.
 

Missing_Clink

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I started boycotting them last season. I used to love going to games but I didn't go to one last year and i likely won't go to one this year. They will not get any more money from me until they put a quality product out there for a meaningful period of time.
 
OP
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therealjohncarlson

therealjohncarlson

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TheRealDTM":1i2yiqhq said:
Unless we want to be a 1 sport city we probably shouldn't boycott the Mariners.

Seahawks and Sounders both get great attendance and actually care about winning. Not sure where you're getting 1 potential sport from.
 

pinksheets

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therealjohncarlson":emrvefv8 said:
TheRealDTM":emrvefv8 said:
Unless we want to be a 1 sport city we probably shouldn't boycott the Mariners.

Seahawks and Sounders both get great attendance and actually care about winning. Not sure where you're getting 1 potential sport from.
I'm not willing to give up Major League Baseball for a lower tier soccer league.
 

SonicHawk

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I'm not willing to give up an MLB team for an EPL team.
 

Hawkfan77

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therealjohncarlson":39rcg91k said:
Hawkfan77":39rcg91k said:
Nope, I'm still going to the games because that's what fans do.

I'm not one of those fair-weather, bandwagon part time fan though... :roll:

074

Do you also buy crappy products because "thats what consumers do"? Sports is a business. Don't sell yourself short by thinking you don't deserve to spend your money on something good.
Huh, since when did not being a fairweather fan make someone a sheep?

Do I like the ownership group? Nope. But I'm a FAN. :roll:
 

salamander

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Please refer to Sacramento Kings situation before deciding to boycott a crap product put forth by management that doesn't care. Or you can keep paying for a shit product. You're in a no win situation.
 

CurryStopstheRuns

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Are you going to begin trolling a mass of threads now? You are not doing very good at the one thread that you should remain in with your posts that wreak of whining.
 

salamander

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CurryStopstheRuns":3nqtu4wv said:
Are you going to begin trolling a mass of threads now? You are not doing very good at the one thread that you should remain in with your posts that wreak of whining.

If this is directed at me, my comment was relevant to the conversation, whereas yours was not. You're calling me out for 'whining' in a board about boycotting your home team. Sacramento was about to (and still might) lose their team because of bad management; if you want to ignore that example then fine; boycott the team until your owner can blame bad attendance on the bad market and move the team to North Carolina.
 

Uncle Si

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I think we can cut salamander some slack here because (despite the consistent inability to grasp the emotions of Sonics fans on this board) he does have a point. Boycotting and poor team attendance only fuel owners to move on, not make changes. On the contrary, in the Premier League fans take to the streets all the time to protest ownership and often help facilitate changes and in some cases push the owners out. However, ownership of teams here in the US know they have the power and dont feel threatened by the whims of its fans.

Now, the Ms seem to be getting things together a little.
 

jkitsune

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pinksheets":36u8oxmq said:
therealjohncarlson":36u8oxmq said:
TheRealDTM":36u8oxmq said:
Unless we want to be a 1 sport city we probably shouldn't boycott the Mariners.

Seahawks and Sounders both get great attendance and actually care about winning. Not sure where you're getting 1 potential sport from.
I'm not willing to give up Major League Baseball for a lower tier soccer league.
We'd have the wnba too, to be fair.
 

CurryStopstheRuns

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Uncle Si":3rbztsk2 said:
I think we can cut salamander some slack here because (despite the consistent inability to grasp the emotions of Sonics fans on this board) he does have a point. Boycotting and poor team attendance only fuel owners to move on, not make changes. On the contrary, in the Premier League fans take to the streets all the time to protest ownership and often help facilitate changes and in some cases push the owners out. However, ownership of teams here in the US know they have the power and dont feel threatened by the whims of its fans.

Now, the Ms seem to be getting things together a little.


I need not cut him any slack. He knows where his thoughts belong and it is not in this thread. He left that thread and decided to troll in others in an attempt to gather support from Seattle fans. Since he has done it here then he is demonstrating the willingness to infect any thread that may remotely relate to his cause therefore furthering his trolling. I give two shits about Sacramento.
 

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