Well, 'something' seems wrong - per Lockett

toffee

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 9, 2016
Messages
13,324
Reaction score
9,051
Location
SoCal Desert

12thmanrising has had several interesting pieces lately.
What Leonard Williams and Lockett said in this article mirrored what we observations on TV. Players, some of them, looked like they have checked out.

I hereby speculate that the switching from Carroll culture to MacDonald culture could be the source of problem here.
 

SoulfishHawk

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 6, 2012
Messages
35,861
Reaction score
16,843
Location
Sammamish, WA
Dot Net, "12s" losing their minds after 6 games in a season that they were in transition etc.
Players being pissed off after losses isn't some Seahawk thing, it's a football locker room thing.
Sadly, I knew the comparisons to Pete would come. Ridiculous, imo.
 

Maelstrom787

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 28, 2011
Messages
13,396
Reaction score
12,519
Location
Delaware
Dot Net, "12s" losing their minds after 6 games in a season that they were in transition etc.
Players being pissed off after losses isn't some Seahawk thing, it's a football locker room thing.
Sadly, I knew the comparisons to Pete would come. Ridiculous, imo.
It's a little bit different when multiple locker room vets are straight up implying that the team is unfocused and lacking in spirit when things go badly, though. That's no longer speculation - that's a report from a direct source.
 

Maelstrom787

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 28, 2011
Messages
13,396
Reaction score
12,519
Location
Delaware
This is something people took for granted with Carroll.

The reality of most organizations is that they're not as culturally resilient. Not quite as eternally filled with the belief that they can manifest glory.

That was Carroll's biggest strength. He was an organizational tonesetter like no other.

Mike is a first-timer. Most of these dudes are NFL first-timers. We don't know if he's built to handle the challenge of a locker room that's losing it's focus and, more importantly, could be losing it's belief in his vision. I think that's fair to speculate about without entirely writing him off as a disappointment at HC.

Winning cures all, and they need to win fast. This could get ugly as hell if they don't. I suspect it's already a little worse than we know based on Leonard Williams and Tyler Lockett talking like they have in the media. Those guys are leaders, and for it to spill into the public record indicates some real frustration.
 

toffee

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 9, 2016
Messages
13,324
Reaction score
9,051
Location
SoCal Desert
It's a little bit different when multiple locker room vets are straight up implying that the team is unfocused and lacking in spirit when things go badly, though. That's no longer speculation - that's a report from a direct source.
I found no reason to think big cat and Lockett are trouble maker or pot stirrers. These two are seasoned vets and locker room leaders, aren't they?
 
OP
OP
CalgaryFan05

CalgaryFan05

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 17, 2016
Messages
3,098
Reaction score
3,394
It's a little bit different when multiple locker room vets are straight up implying that the team is unfocused and lacking in spirit when things go badly, though. That's no longer speculation - that's a report from a direct source.
This.
 

MORGULON

Well-known member
Joined
May 2, 2009
Messages
9,191
Reaction score
5,366
Location
Spokane, Wa
It's a little bit different when multiple locker room vets are straight up implying that the team is unfocused and lacking in spirit when things go badly, though. That's no longer speculation - that's a report from a direct source.
Shame on these players for going public with that. That crosses a line and puts everyone in a bad spot. That's something PC was able to do with the high strung personalities he coached. MM will learn .

See? I said something very complimentary of Pete Carroll.
 

Maelstrom787

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 28, 2011
Messages
13,396
Reaction score
12,519
Location
Delaware
Shame on these players for going public with that. That crosses a line and puts everyone in a bad spot. That's something PC was able to do with the high strung personalities he coached. MM will learn .

See? I said something very complimentary of Pete Carroll.
Protect the team. The Carroll golden rule.
 

keasley45

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 4, 2010
Messages
4,999
Reaction score
9,084
Location
Cockeysville, Md
This is something people took for granted with Carroll.

The reality of most organizations is that they're not as culturally resilient. Not quite as eternally filled with the belief that they can manifest glory.

That was Carroll's biggest strength. He was an organizational tonesetter like no other.

Mike is a first-timer. Most of these dudes are NFL first-timers. We don't know if he's built to handle the challenge of a locker room that's losing it's focus and, more importantly, could be losing it's belief in his vision. I think that's fair to speculate about without entirely writing him off as a disappointment at HC.

Winning cures all, and they need to win fast. This could get ugly as hell if they don't. I suspect it's already a little worse than we know based on Leonard Williams and Tyler Lockett talking like they have in the media. Those guys are leaders, and for it to spill into the public record indicates some real frustration.

Go watch the game against the Steelers last year. Players gave up on PC and his coaches as well.

I think part of the issue (a big one) is that young Mike is trying to maintain intensity and focus during games via coordinators who are vastly inexperienced and in Grubb's case, ebtirely absent from the sideline and up in the booth.

He's suffering from a similar issue as PC - his generals arent strong enough to hold things together when they go wrong.

Durdy seems like a knowledgable guy, but that doesnt mean he commands respect.

Grubb seems like a creative enough playcaller, but would he be able to keep DK in check when he starts throwing a tantrum? With Grubb, i have a sneaky suspicion he has little interest in managing player emotions, maintaining focus ans stoking moral on the sidelines.

So its not so much that Mike's method is failing. But if he is the type of leader to stand there stoically with his back to the bench while he's calling the D and working with Grubb to handle substitutions on O, he cant have a bunch of absent or quiet nice guys backing him up, especially when things go bad. Its not that it cant be done. Bill B was a quiet leader but led with a big stick and had young guys he groomed who maintained the sidelines... and he had Brady. A Reid is quiet, but had Spags and had Bienemy to chew guys out l, build them up and keep players heads in the game.

It remains to be seen if MM has the generals he needs

And therein lies the chasm in the execution of the culture on gameday. Pete was everywhere on the sideline, talking to everyone. Mike might be masterful monday to saturday and entirely competent (even moreso) on gameday, but if his way is less engaging in terms of interaction with guys on gameday and keeping things together, he needs men to do that for him.

I dont see it in Grubb (and he cant do it from the booth) and I cant say that I have seen Durdy at all.

Just my .02
 

Aircrew

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 25, 2016
Messages
1,180
Reaction score
2,212
Location
Eastern Washington
It's not uncommon that a turnover in personnel is needed when there's a change in leadership in any organization, especially when the personality types of the leaders are so vastly different. Chukar is right, we're in rebuild mode, make no mistake about it. I thought MM could keep our talent organized and make a go of it, but I was wrong. This season is going to reveal who's onboard and who isn't, the coming offseason will be a bloodbath and it needs to be.
 

onanygivensunday

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 14, 2010
Messages
6,265
Reaction score
2,377
This is the point of the season that we truly miss Bobby's leadership.

Bobby would call a team meeting and speak truthfully, calling out the bad play and shitty attitudes.

Jarran Reed might be able to do it... with Big Cat's help/support... maybe... but it sorely needs to be done.
 
Top