Draft assessment

Nunya_

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pittpnthrs":2kofbi2r said:
hoxrox":2kofbi2r said:
pittpnthrs":2kofbi2r said:
I thought the great Waldron and his two TE sets with the awesome Everett pick up was supposed to take care of all of that.

The Seahawks could have drafted a crack dealer on a corner with their first pick and people on here would cheer and give them an A. I just dont feel a WR was as important as other positions and I feel Eskridge will have minimal if any impact. Only 3 picks is tough to deal with and people will start to realize how awful the Adams pick up was in a year or two when the lack of picks becomes a norm and his contract insanity begins. The FO has been pretty dismal for years now and continues to depress.

I wanted O-line too but there could be a number of reasons why the FO and their scouts didn't draft one in the second round. Maybe they wanted Dickerson. Maybe they thought Humphrey's arms were too short. Maybe they thought Meiners was too raw. For all we know, these guys could be John Moffitt 2.0. There's no guarantee they would step in year one, be instant starters, and be able to "stop Donald" More unlikely than not.

If you're depressed over football, then not sure what to tell you. It's really not that serious.

Not depressed at all. Just pointing out the incompetence of the FO.

I wanted Dickerson before the draft too. He would have been nice. As for the others, if the FO found fault in them then they definitely should have taken one.

So the FO is incompetent because they did not draft how YOU would have liked them to? Yet the FO is made up of professionals that are considered some of the best in the league....and YOU.....are nothing more than a poster on an internet forum. Pardon me if I do not give your opinion any serious thought.
 

pittpnthrs

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Maelstrom787":jqisk22i said:
pittpnthrs":jqisk22i said:
Maelstrom787":jqisk22i said:
pittpnthrs":jqisk22i said:
Eskridge wont be as good as Moore was last season and Swain and a free agent would be just fine at the most unimportant receiver position on the field. If Lockette or Metcalf go down, sure his numbers will see a rise by default, but until then, he'll be irrelevant. Cant change anything at this point so I hope i'm wrong.

I just cant believe that Russ asked for help upfront and Jackson is the only thing they did so far (well yes I can). Oh well. I'm sure B.J. Finney will be available.

Is Gabe Jackson somehow insignificant to you? If so, big L.

I'm sure Russ wants more support all around, which is exactly why he was heavily recruiting Carson to come back.

Same dudes who wouldn't shut the hell up about Moore in every gameday forum are the ones objecting to trying to fix WR3. Surprise. It's almost like the allegiance isn't to logic, but to criticism.

Personally, barring injury, I'm pretty confident Eskridge's athleticism alone in Waldron's scheme will make him a better option than Moore, in an offense that sorely needed a better option.

Jackson is a good player and an upgrade at the position, but does he fix the entire issue with the line? As for recruiting help, guess who Russ hasent been,,,,,,,the newly resigned Pocic. The only signing Wilson didnt tweet about afterwards. Team needs a center.

I thought Moore played well last season and said as much during the season. The people that werent happy with him,,,I cant help that.

Team SORELY needed a better option at #3 WR position? Lol. That position was the least of the teams problems.

You're acting like Pocic is the worst center in the league. He's not. He's easily top-20 and arguably sneaks into top-15 territory. If that's the indisputable worst guy on the starting line, then you have a pretty talented offensive line.

The issue with the offensive line will be solved by coaching more than talent, because the line is already talented. The personnel is there. If you want to say an average-at-worst center is the teams biggest issue, go ahead, but it is totally illogical.

It's almost like talking to a 2002 NFL fan. This just isn't how the league works anymore. WR3 is a starting position, and has been for a long time. For you to brush it off as if its not a need is asinine.

Pocic is terrible. Guy gets bull rushed all the time. Wonder what Russ really thinks about him.

If the issues with the Oline will be solved by coaching then they are doomed. When was the last good Oline under Pete Carroll? You can count college too if you want.

Lol. You act like every successful team has 3 Pro Bowl receivers. A cheap free agent with Swain is all the team needed. There's also players on the team like Hart, Thompson, Kidsy, Ursua, etc, to fill in.

This place is something else. Check out the first page of Eskridges draft thread and you see people shaking their heads at the pick and then the rose colored glasses wearing fans come in and come up with everything under the sky trying to justify it.
 

pittpnthrs

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Maelstrom787":1vluzd2v said:
Not to mention that, if we're talking about FREDDIE SWAIN as the current WR3... who the hell is behind him?

Absolutely NOTHING. It was as big of a need as any on the roster.

Answered already
 

pittpnthrs

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Nunya_":1k5i38a8 said:
pittpnthrs":1k5i38a8 said:
hoxrox":1k5i38a8 said:
pittpnthrs":1k5i38a8 said:
I thought the great Waldron and his two TE sets with the awesome Everett pick up was supposed to take care of all of that.

The Seahawks could have drafted a crack dealer on a corner with their first pick and people on here would cheer and give them an A. I just dont feel a WR was as important as other positions and I feel Eskridge will have minimal if any impact. Only 3 picks is tough to deal with and people will start to realize how awful the Adams pick up was in a year or two when the lack of picks becomes a norm and his contract insanity begins. The FO has been pretty dismal for years now and continues to depress.

I wanted O-line too but there could be a number of reasons why the FO and their scouts didn't draft one in the second round. Maybe they wanted Dickerson. Maybe they thought Humphrey's arms were too short. Maybe they thought Meiners was too raw. For all we know, these guys could be John Moffitt 2.0. There's no guarantee they would step in year one, be instant starters, and be able to "stop Donald" More unlikely than not.

If you're depressed over football, then not sure what to tell you. It's really not that serious.

Not depressed at all. Just pointing out the incompetence of the FO.

I wanted Dickerson before the draft too. He would have been nice. As for the others, if the FO found fault in them then they definitely should have taken one.

So the FO is incompetent because they did not draft how YOU would have liked them to? Yet the FO is made up of professionals that are considered some of the best in the league....and YOU.....are nothing more than a poster on an internet forum. Pardon me if I do not give your opinion any serious thought.

I realize my opinion means nothing, but all one has to do is look at the last 5 years or so to figure it out.
 

Nunya_

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pittpnthrs":z3tvkfuu said:
Nunya_":z3tvkfuu said:
pittpnthrs":z3tvkfuu said:
hoxrox":z3tvkfuu said:
I wanted O-line too but there could be a number of reasons why the FO and their scouts didn't draft one in the second round. Maybe they wanted Dickerson. Maybe they thought Humphrey's arms were too short. Maybe they thought Meiners was too raw. For all we know, these guys could be John Moffitt 2.0. There's no guarantee they would step in year one, be instant starters, and be able to "stop Donald" More unlikely than not.

If you're depressed over football, then not sure what to tell you. It's really not that serious.

Not depressed at all. Just pointing out the incompetence of the FO.

I wanted Dickerson before the draft too. He would have been nice. As for the others, if the FO found fault in them then they definitely should have taken one.

So the FO is incompetent because they did not draft how YOU would have liked them to? Yet the FO is made up of professionals that are considered some of the best in the league....and YOU.....are nothing more than a poster on an internet forum. Pardon me if I do not give your opinion any serious thought.

I realize my opinion means nothing, but all one has to do is look at the last 5 years or so to figure it out.

You mean the last 5 seasons where the team went 10-5-1, 9-7, 10-6, 11-5, and 12-4....and reached the playoffs in 4 of those seasons?
 

pittpnthrs

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Nunya_":13v6crik said:
pittpnthrs":13v6crik said:
Nunya_":13v6crik said:
pittpnthrs":13v6crik said:
Not depressed at all. Just pointing out the incompetence of the FO.

I wanted Dickerson before the draft too. He would have been nice. As for the others, if the FO found fault in them then they definitely should have taken one.

So the FO is incompetent because they did not draft how YOU would have liked them to? Yet the FO is made up of professionals that are considered some of the best in the league....and YOU.....are nothing more than a poster on an internet forum. Pardon me if I do not give your opinion any serious thought.

I realize my opinion means nothing, but all one has to do is look at the last 5 years or so to figure it out.

You mean the last 5 seasons where the team went 10-5-1, 9-7, 10-6, 11-5, and 12-4....and reached the playoffs in 4 of those seasons?

#3
 

Seattle Person

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Hi everyone,

I kinda see both points here but I just want to give my 2 cents about this. I actually really like all the picks the Seahawks made. I thought it was a pretty successful draft overall given the resources that we have.

I don't expect Eskridge to be a pro-baller or have a DK Metcalf impact. If he has a similar rookie season to Tyler Lockett, I will be more than happy. What I do expect from him is a viable option that scares the crap out of teams. Whether this is a deep ball a few times a game or a reverse that pops for 10-15+ yards. If our offense mirrors the Rams, WRs play a huge role in disguising with misdirection, fake jets, etc. D.E can play a huge role in this because he is a threat. Say what you want but Swain, Hart, or whomever on our roster is just not going to threaten defenses like this. You put 3 speed demons out there and other teams are going to have to pay attention. Moore was good for a play or two a game. No way does he scare anyone....

Hate the player, sure but understand the move. I think it's the right draft pick. You can't convince me that there were any DBs that could come in and start right away at the CB position. That's what I would have expected from #56 at CB. I don't see A. Robinson or anything other dude there that is that good. I think they got really good value from a CB that knows how to play CB. Tre Brown despite his size is way more polished than any of the 2nd or 3rd rd corners. He is extremely physical, smart, and he played in a pass-happy conference so he is tested. You can convince of the centers maybe being taken. However, the Hawks knew they wanted D.E and they still had Pocic as a hedge.

Pocic is not terrible, not great, and definitely not trash. Yes he gets pushed back but again if this offense mirrors anything like the Rams, we aren't going to ask Oline to straight up block dudes or maul them in the run game. It will be more about movement and angles. This suits Pocic because he is not the most physical guy there. The 49ers out-schemed the Rams and completely took Arron Donald out of the game. Besides Trent Williams, the rest of the Oline was trash that game. Pocic is also not and should not be the long-term answer at C. I want this addressed also but we can do a lot worse.
 

nwHawk

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pittpnthrs":2svhpoyt said:
Maelstrom787":2svhpoyt said:
pittpnthrs":2svhpoyt said:
nwHawk":2svhpoyt said:
You may think that, but I didn't miss your point - I just disagree with your point. D'Wayne Eskridge will be better than David Moore, 2020 Freddie Swain or Penny Hart - this year. Undoubtedly he will improve over the next couple of years.

Any OL or CB that was drafted would have been in the same boat. No team can rely on a draft pick, especially after the 1st round, to enter the league and play as a high level veteran. It happens, but those guys are more rare than we want to admit.

Eskridge wont be as good as Moore was last season and Swain and a free agent would be just fine at the most unimportant receiver position on the field. If Lockette or Metcalf go down, sure his numbers will see a rise by default, but until then, he'll be irrelevant. Cant change anything at this point so I hope i'm wrong.

I just cant believe that Russ asked for help upfront and Jackson is the only thing they did so far (well yes I can). Oh well. I'm sure B.J. Finney will be available.

Is Gabe Jackson somehow insignificant to you? If so, big L.

I'm sure Russ wants more support all around, which is exactly why he was heavily recruiting Carson to come back.

Same dudes who wouldn't shut the hell up about Moore in every gameday forum are the ones objecting to trying to fix WR3. Surprise. It's almost like the allegiance isn't to logic, but to criticism.

Personally, barring injury, I'm pretty confident Eskridge's athleticism alone in Waldron's scheme will make him a better option than Moore, in an offense that sorely needed a better option.

Jackson is a good player and an upgrade at the position, but does he fix the entire issue with the line? As for recruiting help, guess who Russ hasent been,,,,,,,the newly resigned Pocic. The only signing Wilson didnt tweet about afterwards. Team needs a center.

I thought Moore played well last season and said as much during the season. The people that werent happy with him,,,I cant help that.

Team SORELY needed a better option at #3 WR position? Lol. That position was the least of the teams problems.


Wow. #3 WR is a big reason for the failure down the stretch. Moore was worse than you will admit. Good person, but never meant to be counted on last year as our #3 until the Gordon suspension continued.

What do you see as the OL fix?
 

chris98251

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TheLegendOfBoom":2oe8okuw said:
hoxrox":2oe8okuw said:
TheLegendOfBoom":2oe8okuw said:
First and foremost, I think Eskridge is a nice player but his impact won’t be much this year as far as targets and receptions, yards goes. He is pretty low in the pecking order. He’ll also need to learn how to run routes. His collegiate Western Michigan tape he’ll need to learn the NFL game since defense are not what he is used too and he is not the route runner Lockett was coming out of Kansas State. His impact will be primarily on special teams cause he is on the bottom of the playmaker depth chart and may only see 5-6 targets a game and catch 3-4 balls a game.

Seattle has a need at wide receiver (third/fourth option) but Swain will be more trusted than Eskridge this year at receiver.

Hopefully, Eskridge can tilt the field consistently and contribute largely as the KR/PR on special teams cause he will almost certainly will not see many targets in games, think Seattle’s version of Tavon Austin but to use a second rounder on him a as quite questionable.

So remember when they tried Moore on a jet, or bubble, and he would get stuffed for like 2-4 yards? Eskridge can pop one of those for huge gains. That could be the difference between a first down, and a 3-and-out.

He doesn't need to be some polished route runner, who knows the whole route tree at this point. That's not who DK was when he was drafted in the second round.

It's not always about the number of touches. Ideally, if this offense is going to succeed, it's about impact and variety. Spread the ball around so defenses won't know what to defend.
Well, the obvious difference between DK and Eskridge is DK each week saw premier college defenses and NFL talented corners playing in the SEC. Eskridge doesn’t have that experience.

Eskridge is not a three down player since he does have not have the physicality traits in order to be a run blocker as well.

He may see jet, fly sweeps, short slants (Russ doesn’t throw many short quick slants) but when he does see the ball it will likely be against nickel corners.

I was hoping Seattle would have drafted a Z receiver since Metcalf primarily is their X and Lockett could do damage in the slot against nickel corners but if Seattle wants Eskridge then hopefully it works out for Carroll.

3 draft picks is tough but if Seattle surprises and is consistently moving the chains then no one here should complain.

But, we’ll have to wait and see how it plays out.

He's the same size as Golden Tate and Tate was called a very good blocker, he may need to learn to be effective but he isn't a extremely small guy.
 

nwHawk

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Seattle Person":3d0prlkz said:
Hi everyone,

I kinda see both points here but I just want to give my 2 cents about this. I actually really like all the picks the Seahawks made. I thought it was a pretty successful draft overall given the resources that we have.

I don't expect Eskridge to be a pro-baller or have a DK Metcalf impact. If he has a similar rookie season to Tyler Lockett, I will be more than happy. What I do expect from him is a viable option that scares the crap out of teams. Whether this is a deep ball a few times a game or a reverse that pops for 10-15+ yards. If our offense mirrors the Rams, WRs play a huge role in disguising with misdirection, fake jets, etc. D.E can play a huge role in this because he is a threat. Say what you want but Swain, Hart, or whomever on our roster is just not going to threaten defenses like this. You put 3 speed demons out there and other teams are going to have to pay attention. Moore was good for a play or two a game. No way does he scare anyone....

Hate the player, sure but understand the move. I think it's the right draft pick. You can't convince me that there were any DBs that could come in and start right away at the CB position. That's what I would have expected from #56 at CB. I don't see A. Robinson or anything other dude there that is that good. I think they got really good value from a CB that knows how to play CB. Tre Brown despite his size is way more polished than any of the 2nd or 3rd rd corners. He is extremely physical, smart, and he played in a pass-happy conference so he is tested. You can convince of the centers maybe being taken. However, the Hawks knew they wanted D.E and they still had Pocic as a hedge.

Pocic is not terrible, not great, and definitely not trash. Yes he gets pushed back but again if this offense mirrors anything like the Rams, we aren't going to ask Oline to straight up block dudes or maul them in the run game. It will be more about movement and angles. This suits Pocic because he is not the most physical guy there. The 49ers out-schemed the Rams and completely took Arron Donald out of the game. Besides Trent Williams, the rest of the Oline was trash that game. Pocic is also not and should not be the long-term answer at C. I want this addressed also but we can do a lot worse.


WELCOME to the board, Seattle Person.
 

pittpnthrs

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nwHawk":201z3z15 said:
pittpnthrs":201z3z15 said:
Maelstrom787":201z3z15 said:
pittpnthrs":201z3z15 said:
Eskridge wont be as good as Moore was last season and Swain and a free agent would be just fine at the most unimportant receiver position on the field. If Lockette or Metcalf go down, sure his numbers will see a rise by default, but until then, he'll be irrelevant. Cant change anything at this point so I hope i'm wrong.

I just cant believe that Russ asked for help upfront and Jackson is the only thing they did so far (well yes I can). Oh well. I'm sure B.J. Finney will be available.

Is Gabe Jackson somehow insignificant to you? If so, big L.

I'm sure Russ wants more support all around, which is exactly why he was heavily recruiting Carson to come back.

Same dudes who wouldn't shut the hell up about Moore in every gameday forum are the ones objecting to trying to fix WR3. Surprise. It's almost like the allegiance isn't to logic, but to criticism.

Personally, barring injury, I'm pretty confident Eskridge's athleticism alone in Waldron's scheme will make him a better option than Moore, in an offense that sorely needed a better option.

Jackson is a good player and an upgrade at the position, but does he fix the entire issue with the line? As for recruiting help, guess who Russ hasent been,,,,,,,the newly resigned Pocic. The only signing Wilson didnt tweet about afterwards. Team needs a center.

I thought Moore played well last season and said as much during the season. The people that werent happy with him,,,I cant help that.

Team SORELY needed a better option at #3 WR position? Lol. That position was the least of the teams problems.


Wow. #3 WR is a big reason for the failure down the stretch. Moore was worse than you will admit. Good person, but never meant to be counted on last year as our #3 until the Gordon suspension continued.

What do you see as the OL fix?

Lol. So the #3 receiver position was one of the bigger reasons why the offense slowed down huh? Think about what you are saying. Couldnt have been the horrid TE play, the lack of a running game, and most importantly the lack of coaching enabling the offense to combat a cover two. While I admit Moore did taper off, so did the entire offense. Putting a large portion of fault at the #3 receiver spot is kind of crazy.

A better center than Pocic (which shouldnt be hard). I mean good lord, they brought in a back up last season to start in B.J. Finney if that tells you anything.

Ok, i've voiced my opinion that I dont like the Eskridge pick. Whatever. Lets just forget about it and get ready for a usual Seahawk season of maybe making the playoffs and losing in the first or second round. Rinse and re-pete the season after. It is what it is.
 

nwHawk

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Everyone is free to have their opinion, and I respect you sticking to your guns Pitt. I certainly didn’t like how the season ended either, but I feel this year could be different.

Go Hawks
 

Maelstrom787

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pittpnthrs":1we99tui said:
Maelstrom787":1we99tui said:
pittpnthrs":1we99tui said:
Maelstrom787":1we99tui said:
Is Gabe Jackson somehow insignificant to you? If so, big L.

I'm sure Russ wants more support all around, which is exactly why he was heavily recruiting Carson to come back.

Same dudes who wouldn't shut the hell up about Moore in every gameday forum are the ones objecting to trying to fix WR3. Surprise. It's almost like the allegiance isn't to logic, but to criticism.

Personally, barring injury, I'm pretty confident Eskridge's athleticism alone in Waldron's scheme will make him a better option than Moore, in an offense that sorely needed a better option.

Jackson is a good player and an upgrade at the position, but does he fix the entire issue with the line? As for recruiting help, guess who Russ hasent been,,,,,,,the newly resigned Pocic. The only signing Wilson didnt tweet about afterwards. Team needs a center.

I thought Moore played well last season and said as much during the season. The people that werent happy with him,,,I cant help that.

Team SORELY needed a better option at #3 WR position? Lol. That position was the least of the teams problems.

You're acting like Pocic is the worst center in the league. He's not. He's easily top-20 and arguably sneaks into top-15 territory. If that's the indisputable worst guy on the starting line, then you have a pretty talented offensive line.

The issue with the offensive line will be solved by coaching more than talent, because the line is already talented. The personnel is there. If you want to say an average-at-worst center is the teams biggest issue, go ahead, but it is totally illogical.

It's almost like talking to a 2002 NFL fan. This just isn't how the league works anymore. WR3 is a starting position, and has been for a long time. For you to brush it off as if its not a need is asinine.

Pocic is terrible. Guy gets bull rushed all the time. Wonder what Russ really thinks about him.

If the issues with the Oline will be solved by coaching then they are doomed. When was the last good Oline under Pete Carroll? You can count college too if you want.

Lol. You act like every successful team has 3 Pro Bowl receivers. A cheap free agent with Swain is all the team needed. There's also players on the team like Hart, Thompson, Kidsy, Ursua, etc, to fill in.

This place is something else. Check out the first page of Eskridges draft thread and you see people shaking their heads at the pick and then the rose colored glasses wearing fans come in and come up with everything under the sky trying to justify it.

1. You're literally advocating for snap judgment being more accurate than actual evaluation, which is pretty par for the course, honestly. Anti-logic, anti-reasoning, anti-analysis.

2. Ethan Pocic's main issue is run blocking. He's a perfectly capable pass blocker at center. Does he get bull-rushed at times? Yeah. That's part of being a center. Most centers do. Pocic let in 2 sacks and 3 QB hits last year, and surrendered 18 pressures.

All-Pro Corey Linsley let in 1 sack, 2 hits, and 4 pressures, on about 150 less reps. He's the best pass-blocking center in the league. Pocic lets in less than 1 more pressure per game, on a team that passed the ball far more than the Packers did, with a quarterback/scheme that holds the ball longer than Rodgers does. If your angle is that erasing less than 1 pressure per game on average is worth more than upgrading WR3, which sees the field on about 2/3rds of the snaps... I just don't know what to tell you. It's irrational. It certainly doesn't jive with building around Russ.

Furthermore, if your angle is that a mid-day-2 rookie is likely to be that much better on pass sets than Pocic, I mean... no. Just no. More likely to be a virtual wash than anything.

3. Three Pro Bowlers? Would be nice, but no. 3 above average? Absolutely necessary. Chiefs had Hardman/Tyreek/Watkins. Tampa had Evans/Godwin/Miller, which was already great before AB. You're so damn keen on building around Russ? HE NEEDS PLAYMAKERS. Not 2 receivers and call it a day. That's not how CHAMPIONSHIP teams work, and the playoffs isn't an indicator of success to you.
 

Ad Hawk

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I'm looking forward to seeing our new draft-picks and UDFAs play each week and develop; sadly for some, they may not, but that's also part of the process.

Watching football as a week-to-week process is so much more enjoyable for me than SB or bust every single year. We won it in 2013 and you'd think we were still cellar-dwellers by the whining of some fans. That fact alone shows me that winning the SB is incredibly overrated; the high is gone very quickly and the lows must be worse afterwards.
 

toffee

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The team identified WR3 as a need for the last few years, and they tried to sign FA to feel that need. OK, the FA that we signed didn't work, injuries and suspension. But it was a need according to our coaching staffs and front office.



Sent from my IN2017 using Tapatalk
 

AgentDib

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It's remarkable to see people thinking they didn't draft for need when our three selections were a shifty WR/ST, outside CB/ST and a pass blocking OT. Those were three of our biggest needs going into the draft.

The focus on center seems misguided. Perhaps our change in offense is too theoretical at the moment for it to resonate, but watch what the Rams did last season in a zone stretch offense and you will hardly ever see the center blocking anybody one on one. Ask yourself if you can even name the Rams center without looking it up right now. When the ball is snapped the line is moving in a direction and the C is usually double teaming a tackle inside while the back looks to bounce it outside or reverse it into open field.
 

Maelstrom787

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AgentDib":3g4j0cic said:
It's remarkable to see people thinking they didn't draft for need when our three selections were a shifty WR/ST, outside CB/ST and a pass blocking OT. Those were three of our biggest needs going into the draft.

The focus on center seems misguided. Perhaps our change in offense is too theoretical at the moment for it to resonate, but watch what the Rams did last season in a zone stretch offense and you will hardly ever see the center blocking anybody one on one. Ask yourself if you can even name the Rams center without looking it up right now. When the ball is snapped the line is moving in a direction and the C is usually double teaming a tackle inside while the back looks to bounce it outside or reverse it into open field.

I just don't understand it. Especially the WR3 discussion.

I think people really, really undervalue the position here. It's vital, especially in the types of offense Waldron is known to run. Versatile threats with a combination of release, ability to separate, and YAC prowess are a necessity.

To think people watched David Moore underperform as the WR3 last year and somehow be fine with going into 2021 with even LESS talent at the spot just doesn't click for me.
 

SoulfishHawk

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They added a beast in Jackson with their 5th rounder. And drafted a guy who could have easily went in the 3rd or 4th round....in the 6th.
But yeah, they didn't do anything about the O Line :?
 

pittpnthrs

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Maelstrom787":2omdnpea said:
pittpnthrs":2omdnpea said:
Maelstrom787":2omdnpea said:
pittpnthrs":2omdnpea said:
Jackson is a good player and an upgrade at the position, but does he fix the entire issue with the line? As for recruiting help, guess who Russ hasent been,,,,,,,the newly resigned Pocic. The only signing Wilson didnt tweet about afterwards. Team needs a center.

I thought Moore played well last season and said as much during the season. The people that werent happy with him,,,I cant help that.

Team SORELY needed a better option at #3 WR position? Lol. That position was the least of the teams problems.

You're acting like Pocic is the worst center in the league. He's not. He's easily top-20 and arguably sneaks into top-15 territory. If that's the indisputable worst guy on the starting line, then you have a pretty talented offensive line.

The issue with the offensive line will be solved by coaching more than talent, because the line is already talented. The personnel is there. If you want to say an average-at-worst center is the teams biggest issue, go ahead, but it is totally illogical.

It's almost like talking to a 2002 NFL fan. This just isn't how the league works anymore. WR3 is a starting position, and has been for a long time. For you to brush it off as if its not a need is asinine.

Pocic is terrible. Guy gets bull rushed all the time. Wonder what Russ really thinks about him.

If the issues with the Oline will be solved by coaching then they are doomed. When was the last good Oline under Pete Carroll? You can count college too if you want.

Lol. You act like every successful team has 3 Pro Bowl receivers. A cheap free agent with Swain is all the team needed. There's also players on the team like Hart, Thompson, Kidsy, Ursua, etc, to fill in.

This place is something else. Check out the first page of Eskridges draft thread and you see people shaking their heads at the pick and then the rose colored glasses wearing fans come in and come up with everything under the sky trying to justify it.

1. You're literally advocating for snap judgment being more accurate than actual evaluation, which is pretty par for the course, honestly. Anti-logic, anti-reasoning, anti-analysis.

2. Ethan Pocic's main issue is run blocking. He's a perfectly capable pass blocker at center. Does he get bull-rushed at times? Yeah. That's part of being a center. Most centers do. Pocic let in 2 sacks and 3 QB hits last year, and surrendered 18 pressures.

All-Pro Corey Linsley let in 1 sack, 2 hits, and 4 pressures, on about 150 less reps. He's the best pass-blocking center in the league. Pocic lets in less than 1 more pressure per game, on a team that passed the ball far more than the Packers did, with a quarterback/scheme that holds the ball longer than Rodgers does. If your angle is that erasing less than 1 pressure per game on average is worth more than upgrading WR3, which sees the field on about 2/3rds of the snaps... I just don't know what to tell you. It's irrational. It certainly doesn't jive with building around Russ.

Furthermore, if your angle is that a mid-day-2 rookie is likely to be that much better on pass sets than Pocic, I mean... no. Just no. More likely to be a virtual wash than anything.

3. Three Pro Bowlers? Would be nice, but no. 3 above average? Absolutely necessary. Chiefs had Hardman/Tyreek/Watkins. Tampa had Evans/Godwin/Miller, which was already great before AB. You're so damn keen on building around Russ? HE NEEDS PLAYMAKERS. Not 2 receivers and call it a day. That's not how CHAMPIONSHIP teams work, and the playoffs isn't an indicator of success to you.

Now your somehow convinced that Pocic is as good as Linsley . Like you said, with that kind of thinking, I dont know what to tell you. At this point, I fully expect the front office to sign another guard since they whiffed on center so far, so that Lewis takes over the position. Minus a couple bad snaps, Lewis (a rookie) played just as well as Pocic. The two biggest weaknesses on the line last season was left guard and center. In typical Carroll fashion, he half assed the solution by only addressing one of them. I liken it to bringing in Adams (a safety) to fix the pass rush issue. It failed and the team had to bring in a legit pass rusher in Dunlap mid season to actually really fix the problem. They will do the same eventually with the Oline, but its frustrating it takes them so long to see the obvious.

I think its also cute that you feel Waldron is going to come in and miraculously change the offense so much so that it should mask the offensive lines shortcomings with different looks and schemes with Wilson getting the ball out quicker thus eliminating him getting throttled all the time. If you think for one second that at some point during the season that Pete doesnt meddle and resorts back to Pete Ball again, I dont know what to tell you. It happens every season regardless of the OC and its going to happen again this season. Why? Because Pete cant help himself. It will happen. Bank it.

Mercole Hardman - 560 yards and 4 TDs. Scotty Miller - 501 yards and 3 TDs. David Moore - 417 yards and 6 TDs. What am I missing here? All seem pretty comparable to me. Know what else they all have in common? They are all a dime a dozen in FA. Again, the #3 WR position is not that critical. Even when Seattle had Gordon and he played, they only threw at him once or twice a game. I get it. Your defending your narrative because the Seahawks went that route and your the most optimistic person on the boards. Thats totally cool. I just feel you may have glanced past the big picture. Russ wanted help on the Oline (man he was jealous of Brady sitting back there eating a sandwich during the Super Bowl) and all the FO did was give him a Guard and a rookie tackle that wont see the field barring major injuries. Thats not good enough.
 

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pittpnthrs":zntqtmk1 said:
Now your somehow convinced that Pocic is as good as Linsley .

Strawman. He said Linsley gives up on average one less pressure per game than Pocic does.

pittpnthrs":zntqtmk1 said:
In typical Carroll fashion, he half assed the solution by only addressing one of them. I liken it to bringing in Adams (a safety) to fix the pass rush issue.

Incorrect. Adams was brought in BEFORE Bruce Irvin was injured.

pittpnthrs":zntqtmk1 said:
If you think for one second that at some point during the season that Pete doesnt meddle and resorts back to Pete Ball again, I dont know what to tell you. It happens every season regardless of the OC and its going to happen again this season. Why? Because Pete cant help himself. It will happen. Bank it.

If Pete Ball means fixing the horrendous 10 turnover over 4 game fiasco, then more Pete Ball please. But my feeling is that the offense WILL be different under Waldron. We will just have to wait and see.

pittpnthrs":zntqtmk1 said:
Russ wanted help on the Oline (man he was jealous of Brady sitting back there eating a sandwich during the Super Bowl) and all the FO did was give him a Guard and a rookie tackle that wont see the field barring major injuries. Thats not good enough.

The FO job is not to placate Russell, or any individual player. Their job is to set up the TEAM for success. The moves they've made in this off season indicate to me that is exactly what they are doing.
 
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