If we don't dump Jamal Adams for some nice trade...

Jerhawk

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He is a liability in pass coverage.

But we're a better team with him than without him. He's still young and has an alpha mentality that we've been missing since the LOB
 

hawk45

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He brings a lot as a blitzer but I dislike being outmanned in the secondary when a safety blitzes unless we drop a DE in cover which isn’t much better coverage-wise. If he gets home say 1 out of 5 times, we are at a disadvantage in coverage 80% of the time he blitzes.

And, if you have a guy who is extremely gifted at blitzing, you will use that, quite rightly. I do admit the defense looked sharper with him out there, but much of that can be attributed to having any pass rush at all. Dunlap provided that, and similarly boosted the defense, without the attendant coverage drawbacks. I’d like 2 picks and cap to look for another DL impact like that.

If we were better at disguising it that’d mitigate this disadvantage but we were quite obvious about it and cam Newton of all mopes was able to beat our blitz with success.

I feel like Adam’s would be almost all profit on a team who blitzes slyly, but that we are not necessarily that team, hope that changes.

So, I’d rather have mcdougald, the picks, the cap, and a focus in getting home with the front four. Spilt milk and all that I suppose.

I also am nervous about 15 mil for a guy who had a groin for 4 games, and a shoulder which he toughed out for the playoff game but which obviously impacted his ability, notably on a TD stand where he was helpless to shed a block and thus couldn’t fill a gap.

I hope the injuries last season were an outlier, but the fact is we are facing a pay-or-don’t-pay decision for cap impacting dollars coming off an injury plagued year for him.

Do people feel we disguise blitzes well? Are we all sanguine that he’ll play in 16 games? Do we think KNJ is the mastermind to use him slyly so we don’t sacrifice advantage? Because if not, front 4 focus for pass rush and numbers on the back end are much easier for a so so DC to succeed with.
 

pittpnthrs

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Adams is a great tackler and at getting to the QB, but lets face it, the defense was on pace to become the historically worse pass defense in the NFL before Dunlap was signed. Now Adams is coming off of multiple surgeries. I just dont know.
 

Maulbert

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pittpnthrs":1orly8op said:
Adams is a great tackler and at getting to the QB, but lets face it, the defense was on pace to become the historically worse pass defense in the NFL before Dunlap was signed. Now Adams is coming off of multiple surgeries. I just dont know.

You're right. You DON'T know.
 

Throwdown

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pittpnthrs":2kpvlqua said:
Adams is a great tackler and at getting to the QB, but lets face it, the defense was on pace to become the historically worse pass defense in the NFL before Dunlap was signed. Now Adams is coming off of multiple surgeries. I just dont know.

It doesn’t matter if you had the whole LOB in their prime back there and subbed Browner/Maxwell out for Revis they were still gonna get cooked cuz we had no pass rush at all from the front 7, only one getting pressure was Adams. That’s not Adams fault.

Also McDougald is cheeks, he cost us so many unnecessary points given up.
 

Rat

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He's an amazing player, and one of the most exciting young defenders to watch in the NFL . I'm very happy we have him.

Given that he was trying to force his way out of NYC though, and that he plays what isn't really considered a premium position, it's easy to wonder if we traded more than we needed to. I guess we wont know unless the Jets, or someone else involved, comes out and says what other teams were offering.

I kinda see both sides of it: we traded for a tremendous player, but I cant really argue with those who think we traded too much. If he becomes our Troy Polamalu, there wont be many of them. Regardless, we have him and should continue building the defense around him. I would need one hell of an offer to move him, especially now that we're post-draft.
 

massari

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Maelstrom787":3vkq4n04 said:
Also, if getting sacks were so easy simply by blitzing the safety, I think most teams would be doing it. There's a reason this was an NFL record, and he didn't even do it on a full season.
Adams was unblocked/untouched on all but two of his sacks, which came against a poor effort from a RB on the NYG, and a TE on the Bills.

Here's a good explanation:
So while many people bring up his sack numbers to justify the trade, this is the reality:

— He blitzed 8.2 times per game

— He registered 0.8 sacks per game

the Seahawks were scheming ways to create free runs to the quarterback — often using Bobby Wagner as a decoy:

Almost one sack per game sounds really good without context. The reality is different. You are taking someone out of coverage and manufacturing a situation where they can freely rush the passer, usually without resistance.

When a defensive end wins off the edge against a tackle — that’s a 1v1 victory. When a safety blitzes — the quarterback is going to have an opportunity to capitalise.

It’s a risk. Some schemes thrive on that risk/reward. The Seahawks have never been one of those teams. They’ve always sought a four-man rush enabling their players to stick to their jobs, execute and fly to the ball at the second level.

The fact is — seven out of eight times Jamal Adams is vacating the secondary and not getting home. What happens on those plays?
 

Sports Hernia

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Aros":u17u15wy said:
Every time I come to .NET I always hope - like a battered spouse - things will improve. Then BAM. Threads like this.

Sigh.
Yep. At Times this place reminds me how much I hate fantasy football and Madden.
 

Sports Hernia

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scutterhawk":1h6v0rco said:
jamescasey1124":1h6v0rco said:
Get over it. He isnt going anywhere and no it doesnt make sense to trade him and go back to mediocre ss play. Sorry. Not sorry. Dumb post.
I couldn't agree more.
Where the hell are these guys coming up with these dumb ideas...Pete Carroll likes the hell out of JA, and he's not wrong in his assessment.
The man is a big time play disrupter, get him signed long term.
:irishdrinkers:
It’s the off-season (see silly season), people are bored, fantasy football and madden mentalities.....
 

Ad Hawk

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pittpnthrs":3fuqxh01 said:
Adams is a great tackler and at getting to the QB, but lets face it, the defense was on pace to become the historically worse pass defense in the NFL before Dunlap was signed. Now Adams is coming off of multiple surgeries. I just dont know.

You're confusing correlation with causation, it appears. The entire defense doesn't improve that much on the basis of one single player, ever, even the Donald.
 

Maulbert

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Ad Hawk":f8i33lqd said:
pittpnthrs":f8i33lqd said:
Adams is a great tackler and at getting to the QB, but lets face it, the defense was on pace to become the historically worse pass defense in the NFL before Dunlap was signed. Now Adams is coming off of multiple surgeries. I just dont know.

You're confusing correlation with causation, it appears. The entire defense doesn't improve that much on the basis of one single player, ever, even the Donald.

Well, it can, but it's not just because that player is that great. The whole defense got better when Dunlap got here, but it wasn't because he was a game changer. He mostly just made everyone else's job easier because it was one more wrinkle that needed to be accounted for.
 

pittpnthrs

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Ad Hawk":2m3cszu7 said:
pittpnthrs":2m3cszu7 said:
Adams is a great tackler and at getting to the QB, but lets face it, the defense was on pace to become the historically worse pass defense in the NFL before Dunlap was signed. Now Adams is coming off of multiple surgeries. I just dont know.

You're confusing correlation with causation, it appears. The entire defense doesn't improve that much on the basis of one single player, ever, even the Donald.

All the more reason why they shouldnt have signed him. I like him as a player, but hate the trade. I think they gave way to much for a safety.
 

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A lot of the posters are discounting how much chemistry and attitude help out a defense in football. Several of us have commented on Adams attitude in his press conferences. He is the type of passionate player that loves being out there making plays. That is infectious. It can boost the entire team, not just the defense. Players feed off of it. It has seemed to be missing from the team ever since Lynch left.

The main problem early in the season was the chemistry was not there. The players were not trusting one another and were trying to do more than their assignment. Adams was definitely a part of that problem, but the coaches saw the problem and corrected it after that ridiculous Bills game. The addition of Dunlap also brought in a passionate player that loves being out there making plays. His press conferences were very impressive and had me wanting to put the pads on again and play with the guy.

Being able to build around guys that are like that is the beginnings of a good to great defense. Every great defense has had those types of players that just get the others up and elevate their play. Adams falls in that category.
 

Rat

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Sports Hernia":198h044o said:
Aros":198h044o said:
Every time I come to .NET I always hope - like a battered spouse - things will improve. Then BAM. Threads like this.

Sigh.
Yep. At Times this place reminds me how much I hate fantasy football and Madden.
Nice rebuttal of his points.
 

5thgen

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Tokadub":23dklqeo said:
Our best result will be knocked out in 1st or 2nd round, most likely a wild card.

Just a gut feeling Jamal has to go. Let him go sign KJ, and like 1-2 other players... we might have a snowballs chance in hell if we let Jamal go... I think we are looking at .500 territory if we keep Jamal it just doesn't work with this team and he's so inconsistent can't even get an interception he's overrated.
Obviously KJ is asking more than any team are willing to play. I say trade Jamal for a couple of good OL.
 

scutterhawk

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BASF":1cqpzzcj said:
A lot of the posters are discounting how much chemistry and attitude help out a defense in football. Several of us have commented on Adams attitude in his press conferences. He is the type of passionate player that loves being out there making plays. That is infectious. It can boost the entire team, not just the defense. Players feed off of it. It has seemed to be missing from the team ever since Lynch left.

The main problem early in the season was the chemistry was not there. The players were not trusting one another and were trying to do more than their assignment. Adams was definitely a part of that problem, but the coaches saw the problem and corrected it after that ridiculous Bills game. The addition of Dunlap also brought in a passionate player that loves being out there making plays. His press conferences were very impressive and had me wanting to put the pads on again and play with the guy.

Being able to build around guys that are like that is the beginnings of a good to great defense. Every great defense has had those types of players that just get the others up and elevate their play. Adams falls in that category.
You bet, it's what Alpha's do to unify the pack...What Kam Chancellor did for the LOB...The Seahawks needed to reinvigorate, & put the spark back to the Defense and Jamal Adams did just that.
 

hawk45

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Chemistry exists, sure, but so does pass rush. The defense was still awful before Dunlap. I’d be prepared to accept losing Adams’s fire for the picks and the cash to build a deeper pass rush up front and who knows, maybe find that leader in house.
 

Maulbert

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hawk45":2hi75rim said:
Chemistry exists, sure, but so does pass rush. The defense was still awful before Dunlap. I’d be prepared to accept losing Adams’s fire for the picks and the cash to build a deeper pass rush up front and who knows, maybe find that leader in house.

Do you really think they haven't addressed the pass rush this offseason?!?

Jesus Christ.
 
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