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To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders

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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Wed Sep 16, 2020 4:26 am
  • We run the ball to get the safety in the box and then we open up the pass. Atlanta stacked the box from the get-go, so they did all that work for us, allowing the passing game to flourish.

    There are many reasons other than the "let Russ cook" narrative that perfectly explain our game plan within Pete Carroll's philosophy. He's not an idiot - if he has a RB coming off injury and a stacked box, he's going to pass more.

    Until I have more data points, I'm saying Pete played Pete Ball, and that's just what it looks like when the QB hits on 89% of his passes.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Wed Sep 16, 2020 6:17 am
  • Regardless what you call it, it's winning ball. And other than the Pats, no team in the league has done it better than the Hawks since Pete became coach.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Wed Sep 16, 2020 6:59 am
  • In tennis the object is to "hit it where they ain't". In football it's "take what the defense gives you". Get them to commit to stopping the run and there are wide open spaces downfield. If they go heavy in coverage blow them off the line and run that sucker til it doesn't work.
    I remember when Walsh Ball (West Coast) was a new thing. I loved it, as ball control passing played to my personal skill set. Going with lighter faster linemen he developed influence blocking schemes and was successful. But he was ahead of his time and competing in a league of defenses built to stop the the "3 yards and a cloud of dust" system.
    Regardless how you intend to play the game you have to find a way to win at the line of scrimmage.
    Stopping the run may be the Seahawk's biggest weakness this year. I fully expect to see our opponents test that to the fullest.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:22 am
  • Atlanta has a pretty weak secondary and defense overall. I expect us to run the ball more than 16 times against the Pats.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:34 am
  • So much catharsis in this thread.

    (BTW The 'our runningback was coming back from injury and the other team had a weak secondary argument does not hold water.

    1 - Pete rarely adjusts to the other team. He knows what he wants to do and dares the other team to stop him. He rarely tries to change to exploit another team's weaknesses. He is the Anti-Bill.

    2 - We Pete Balled when Rawls was injured. Just used Lacey and Mike Davis. We dropped Pete Ball was when Lynch was injured. That year our offense went on a tear. So Pete adjusted...once.)

    Bottomline for Pete Ball:
    Works in the regular season
    Abysmal failure in the playoffs since 2015.
    (That is a half-decade for those of you scoring at home).

    It needed to die. It is stupid football. It works in the regular season but leads to quick exits, if not utter playoff blowouts outside of wildcard games.

    It got to the point I dreaded going into halftime with slight leads - because that meant we would start the 3rd quarter trying to milk our clock down instead of opening our offense up. So you had to cheer for the opposing team to score on my own defense just to force our own coach to use his star QB. Even then, we were reluctant to score in the 1st half. So the best possible start to a game was hopefully to give up a TD or ideally 2 by halftime. Then we would assuredly come roaring back and it would usually be a great game.

    Pete Ball had 2 terrible weaknesses, besides, the 1st halves, being ugly godawful football to watch.

    - Very susceptible to penalties or mistakes by the offense.

    - A officiating crew mistake could often decide the game as games were so close.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:03 am
  • I think people need to take a chill pill on the offense. The strength of Atlanta is their DL, Carson hadn’t practiced much in training camp, and many throws Russell took were short yardage throws that work in place of the run. Game script, match up, player health, and success created the perfect storm of a high volume passing day. That was about as perfect of a situation as possible to get a Let Russ Cook Game. I think the most exciting things that can be taken out of this game is the use of tempo and going for it on 4th Down.

    That’s not to say Seattle won’t throw more, because I think they will. But they’re built to be more match up oriented this year and I expect to see less throwing against NE. Game script probably figures to support more running.

    This doesn’t have to be a one or the other debate. It can be what works against the next team.

    And lastly, every year, we over react to something in September. Last year Dak Prescott looked like an MVP in September and then trailed off. Not saying that’s happening to Russ, just saying that it was game 1 after a bizarre offseason, where Seattle came out different than any other year. Everything was perfect. Let’s see how this team acts when it’s not perfect.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:15 am
  • That is kind of the point.

    It is better to fail this in the regular season a few times, than to succeed with Pete Ball in the regular season.

    Because Pete Ball just leads to quick exits in the playoffs outside of the wildcard game. Usually being blown out by halftime.

    If we lose a game with Wilson as the focus, after he has a bad game, then come back and have him as the focus the next game? That is a great sign.

    We don't even need to win the division this year. Homefield advantage isn't as big a deal as normal. Just get to the playoffs and win a game after the wildcard. Bonus is that getting to the playoffs should be easier this year.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:36 am
  • It's all Pete Ball.
    sc85sis
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:50 am
  • Oh look. I don't know how to post a tweet, but this is from Jason Butt: "Raheem Morris took responsibility for the defensive game-plan against the Seahawks. He said he went in wanting to stop Chris Carson and the run and didn't take the passing attack as seriously as he should have. Said he didn't do a good job having his guys disguise well enough."

    Ya think? Imagine that. We run to get teams into man. But hey, carry on with your shallow narrative.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Wed Sep 16, 2020 10:35 am
  • TwistedHusky wrote:
    It got to the point I dreaded going into halftime with slight leads - because that meant we would start the 3rd quarter trying to milk our clock down instead of opening our offense up.


    In the Wilson-Carroll era, (2012-present), the Seahawks are undefeated when entering halftime with a 4+ point lead, posting a record of 56-0.

    And you dreaded this? And think it's stupid football that needs to die?
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Wed Sep 16, 2020 10:39 am
  • They talked about it on the broadcast. They dared the Hawks to throw the ball. Please keep telling yourself that you can beat the Hawks by just taking away their running game. Good luck with that...….
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Wed Sep 16, 2020 10:42 am
  • This was a good win to be sure, but I would expect "Pete Ball" to be back with a vengeance this week as the Pats have a solid secondary and a suspect front 7.

    I'm not even sure what people think "Pete Ball" is. I couldn't stand our Offense under Bevell with all it's misdirection and sideline to sideline running. We were a finesse team and it was both ugly and embarrassing to watch.

    I am really looking forward to 2-TE sets with Carson and Hyde pounding it between the tackles this week. Russ will get his shots, but I want more Knox and less Patera!
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Wed Sep 16, 2020 11:00 am
  • Chapow,

    4+ pt lead means more than a FG, usually a TD. Sometimes it means someone missed an extra point.

    But slight lead is 3 or less. That means either a FG or worse, near tied with the other team missing an extra point.

    And yes, any strategy that involves regular season games with Russell effing Wilson throwing for 50 total yards at the half is 'stupid football that need to die' even if you win. Because it does not help you in the playoffs and is ugly, awful football to watch.

    Repeatedly punting and grinding the clock down might be strategic but it is boring. And it does not work against the good teams in the playoffs. As we have repeatedly learned.

    Here is what it gets you, near every year:

    - Season start...Seahawks are a popular Dark Horse SB candidate
    - They go on a tear at the 3/4 mark where you think they might go to the SB
    - Lose 1 or 2 must win games late to they needed to win the division (late in the season)
    - Go to wildcard game and win
    - Go to playoff game, down by multiple TDs at the half because you aren't used to playing real offense for 4 full quarters

    Basically it works well in the regular season. Beats wildcard opponents but gets shelled by division opponents. It has never worked otherwise after 2014. In the playoffs it only works against weaker teams.

    Usually we have a slow start, which we at least seem to have addressed. Hoping it is more us changing than the Falcons just starting their usual poor season start.
    Last edited by TwistedHusky on Wed Sep 16, 2020 11:09 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Wed Sep 16, 2020 11:01 am
  • I was never really that critical of Pete's style but the game where it came to a head for me and I was livid after was the Wild Card loss in Dallas. That was a game where the "run twice and hope Russ can work magic on third down" narrative truly fit. The one thing that was working that day was Russ throwing on early downs from play action but it was hardly used. That's the one game I recall being really frustrating to watch.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Wed Sep 16, 2020 12:03 pm
  • This offense is here to stay, otherwise Wilson's leaving. Get used to it.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Wed Sep 16, 2020 1:30 pm
  • Wilson stepping up to take the team to the next level with or without Pete's buy in.

    The true Wilson era is now underway and that's a good thing.

    He's likely the single sharpest playing football mind in the game today.

    Short passes, long ball, scramble, reaction times, etc., he's legit HoF levels right now.

    In Wilson we trust.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Wed Sep 16, 2020 1:36 pm
  • People are forgetting a key element of "Pete Ball" over the years.

    Pete's strategy comes from a philosophy of 'take an early lead and hold tenaciously to it.' Our record over his tenure when we take a 4 pt lead by halftime is stellar. Frankly, against Atl, we could have run the ball a little more in the 2d half, but Russ was completing so many passes, it didn't matter. The reason you throw less in the second half with a lead is more about the clock than stats. An incompletion stops the clock. Even an unsuccessful run doesn't do that unless there's a penalty.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Wed Sep 16, 2020 2:28 pm
  • Fade wrote:But more importantly it is about throwing your best punch and letting the chips fall where they may. Instead of holding back and wondering if they could've won the game had Wilson been more featured.


    Year of The Hawk wrote:So you think we were largely unsuccessful the past few years because we did not win it all?


    That is what you gleaned from that? :D :D

    I am a process guy, not a results guy.


    Their process was flawed in seasons past, and left a lot of meat on the bone.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Wed Sep 16, 2020 2:44 pm
  • xray wrote:Carroll will use whatever offense will work for each individual opponent this season . There will plenty of games when run 1st is the offense again .


    LTH wrote:I think your missing it totally... It's not about just one thing...It's about matchups and having the tools to attack a team in multiple different ways according to what matchups the Hawks favor... This is a multi talented diverse offense that can beat you at running and passing... no this is about matching up period...

    LTH


    What team have you guys been watching the previous 10 seasons? :D :D :D Pete rarely adjusts to the opponent. He plays his style and forces the other team to adapt to him. He is the anti-Bill Belichick. He's had Wilson to bail his ass out in the 4th quarter, to tidy up the mess that was created in the 1st half over the years. And the team would win just enough games every year to continue this failed process. Wilson was tired of it. It's over.

    Appyhawk wrote:In tennis the object is to "hit it where they ain't". In football it's "take what the defense gives you". Get them to commit to stopping the run and there are wide open spaces downfield. If they go heavy in coverage blow them off the line and run that sucker til it doesn't work.
    I remember when Walsh Ball (West Coast) was a new thing. I loved it, as ball control passing played to my personal skill set. Going with lighter faster linemen he developed influence blocking schemes and was successful. But he was ahead of his time and competing in a league of defenses built to stop the the "3 yards and a cloud of dust" system.
    Regardless how you intend to play the game you have to find a way to win at the line of scrimmage.
    Stopping the run may be the Seahawk's biggest weakness this year. I fully expect to see our opponents test that to the fullest.


    Which is the main complaint with "Pete Ball." It's the antithesis of this.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Wed Sep 16, 2020 3:06 pm
  • HawkRiderFan wrote:I was never really that critical of Pete's style but the game where it came to a head for me and I was livid after was the Wild Card loss in Dallas. That was a game where the "run twice and hope Russ can work magic on third down" narrative truly fit. The one thing that was working that day was Russ throwing on early downs from play action but it was hardly used. That's the one game I recall being really frustrating to watch.


    Some people on here were defending that garbage, even though Pete admitted it was a mistake shortly there after (they stubbornly stuck with the run for too long.)
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Wed Sep 16, 2020 3:29 pm
  • Sox-n-Hawks wrote:Can we make this the sequel to your Russel Wilson is Elite thread?


    It may turn into that. People love arguing against statistical facts. :D
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Wed Sep 16, 2020 3:36 pm
  • Tical21 wrote:Oh give over. We run to force teams to simplify their coverage and run man, which Russ is far more comfortable with. The Falcons, who have quite possibly the worst defense we will see all year, stayed in man all game despite getting torched (Russ was 22/23 against man). We had Carson on a strict pitch count and it worked out beautifully. I'll prefer Russ throws 50 times if we get to see man all game.

    We know what happens when we don't feature the run. But some choose to forget we've played this game before.


    It's not about passing vs. running. But when you're running and when you're passing.

    Russell is elite btw. :D :D :D
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Wed Sep 16, 2020 3:59 pm
  • Maelstrom787 wrote:I defend Peteball from time to time, but I'm fully aware it's pretty much solely because of my reverence for Carroll as one of my idols.

    For some reason, I respect the fact that he wasn't just winning, he was winning HIS way and that it made victory sweeter.

    I admire his conviction and his adherence to philosophy. Letting Russ cook is obviously the better approach, and I hope that he continues with it for the most part, but Carroll has pretty much infinite leeway with me. I'll disagree with his decisions from time to time, but I'll like him anyway because he wins.

    I could not have said it any better :irishdrinkers: ...Because he was THE architect that got us our First Lombardi, kind of adds a lot of credibility for me.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Wed Sep 16, 2020 4:37 pm
  • Fade wrote:
    xray wrote:Carroll will use whatever offense will work for each individual opponent this season . There will plenty of games when run 1st is the offense again .


    LTH wrote:I think your missing it totally... It's not about just one thing...It's about matchups and having the tools to attack a team in multiple different ways according to what matchups the Hawks favor... This is a multi talented diverse offense that can beat you at running and passing... no this is about matching up period...

    LTH


    What team have you guys been watching the previous 10 seasons? :D :D :D Pete rarely adjusts to the opponent. He plays his style and forces the other team to adapt to him. He is the anti-Bill Belichick. He's had Wilson to bail his ass out in the 4th quarter, to tidy up the mess that was created in the 1st half over the years. And the team would win just enough games every year to continue this failed process. Wilson was tired of it. It's over.

    Appyhawk wrote:In tennis the object is to "hit it where they ain't". In football it's "take what the defense gives you". Get them to commit to stopping the run and there are wide open spaces downfield. If they go heavy in coverage blow them off the line and run that sucker til it doesn't work.
    I remember when Walsh Ball (West Coast) was a new thing. I loved it, as ball control passing played to my personal skill set. Going with lighter faster linemen he developed influence blocking schemes and was successful. But he was ahead of his time and competing in a league of defenses built to stop the the "3 yards and a cloud of dust" system.
    Regardless how you intend to play the game you have to find a way to win at the line of scrimmage.
    Stopping the run may be the Seahawk's biggest weakness this year. I fully expect to see our opponents test that to the fullest.


    Which is the main complaint with "Pete Ball." It's the antithesis of this.

    Yes on the last bit. Pete Ball is all about establishing the run, and hitting long bombs to make defenses back off. It most definitely is not about taking what you're given. This offensive style is all about limiting the toxic differential, but I believe the sacrifice is too great. It puts huge limitations on the QB and it is a style that is extremely rigid. It allows the Seahawks to punish lesser teams, but it also is punished pretty hard against playoff caliber teams.

    What I liked about this style of offense is we ran a lot of WCO concepts. The game called almost looked like a Holmgren style. They tried blitzing and stacking the box and we responded with a game plan that emphasized getting the ball out of Russ's hands quickly. That is something that I see far too little of with a Carroll offense. We also did a good job of executing misdirection plays. Russ was also given a ton of freedom at the LOS, the fact that we haven't been giving Russell Wilson more autonomy until this year really is unforgivable.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Wed Sep 16, 2020 6:27 pm
  • Spin Doctor wrote: Pete Ball is all about establishing the run, and hitting long bombs to make defenses back off. It most definitely is not about taking what you're given. This offensive style is all about limiting the toxic differential, but I believe the sacrifice is too great. It puts huge limitations on the QB and it is a style that is extremely rigid. It allows the Seahawks to punish lesser teams, but it also is punished pretty hard against playoff caliber teams.

    What I liked about this style of offense is we ran a lot of WCO concepts. The game called almost looked like a Holmgren style. They tried blitzing and stacking the box and we responded with a game plan that emphasized getting the ball out of Russ's hands quickly. That is something that I see far too little of with a Carroll offense. We also did a good job of executing misdirection plays. Russ was also given a ton of freedom at the LOS, the fact that we haven't been giving Russell Wilson more autonomy until this year really is unforgivable.


    This.

    Image


    Adding onto that.

    -Play with zero urgency at the start of games. Come out of the huddle late and snap the ball with less than 4 seconds on the play clock. (Supposedly to shorten the game. But makes no sense, unless you're Nostradamus and know you're going to win. You might want that time back, also you're going to be punting an awful lot playing that lethargic.)

    -Punt on 4th and short in enemy territory.

    -Only run base stuff. The offense doesn't have to think, but neither does the opponent.

    -Rope-a-Dope. Ties in with only run base stuff. Don't show anything until you really need it.

    This style leads to unexpected losses to sub .500 teams because you often times end up playing down to your opponents with this style. Letting teams hang around is just asking for trouble in the NFL.

    And in the playoffs as we've seen over the years you can dig yourself a really big hole in a hurry.

    I much prefer what they did on Sunday. As Wilson put it "Play every quarter like it's the 4th quarter."

    I agree it was very Holmgren esque on Sunday as well in that, short, high % passes on 1st down. Use the RB in the passing game. (Alexander screwed this one up a little bit. :D ) Look to run the ball more after you've built the lead, but don't get stupid with it. If they're giving you the pass by selling out to stop the run, take it.

    A far cry from when Schottenheimer showed up and the first thing out of his mouth was. "We're going to run the ball even when they know we're running it. We're going to throw it when they know we're going to throw it." AKA "Pete Ball."

    The opposite took place on Sunday.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Wed Sep 16, 2020 6:49 pm
  • Fade wrote:Do you guys put on your clown shoes before you go to, or after you come home from work? LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOOLOOLOLLOO LOLOOLO.

    The ones who fall in that camp, must condemn this current approach as it is completely antithetical to what they have been arguing season after season, FOR YEARS.

    As they told us running into loaded boxes repeatedly was required for Wilson to be effective. Punting in enemy territory was smart football, and throwing on early downs was bad.

    No matter how much evidence we presented to the contrary. Clowns decided to die on that hill.

    Where is the conviction!? The "Let Russ Cook" proponents never wavered, the "Pete Ball" crowd seemed to have rolled over without a fight… Pathetic. LOL


    I was pleasantly surprised not only that we got a lead but widened it through the game. I don't even think that garbage ATL TD was worth taking the foot off the gas. The greater the spread the more dominant the win than wondering every Sunday whether that 20-24 would side against us.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Wed Sep 16, 2020 6:55 pm
  • Major WIN here, 506sports.com is out and it appears the Hawks game is on SNF football so obviously i'll get to watch it and record it on the nice 60" ultraHD as well as all nationwide Hawk fans out of market. I thought for sure that'd have to happen the next week in DAL, because they're DAL.

    If anyone cares, y'all get the SF-Jets game earlier in the day. It'll beat Den vs. Pitt which we also all will get on the wc.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:38 pm

  • Seattle's EPA/ a play about to be record setting.


    He's been doing it for years, Greg, nothing new.


    Mina did good. Summarized a whole lot in under 1 min.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Thu Sep 17, 2020 12:34 pm
  • It's interesting how committed people are to seeing what they want to see in these sort of discussions.

    Personally, I didn't find Pete going for that fourth down surprising. I expected it and we've gone for less likely 4th down conversions in the past. It would have been a major departure if we were on the 50, and we'll see if that happens going forwards, but punting from the 36 is unusual for everybody including Pete.

    I also didn't find the amount of passing surprising. Russ was statistically the most accurate that he's ever been, against a defense with a strong front seven but a poor secondary, while that defense was playing single high safety often, and he threw a few more times than normal. The results were a lot better than normal due to him hitting almost every throw, but I'm not sure that there is really cause and effect here with the offensive game plan; he just looked really sharp to me.

    That being said, if there is a causation between whatever we were doing and his accuracy then we need to keep doing that, as we aren't going to lose ANY games where Russ is hitting 85% of his throws. Maybe there's a confidence component there, but I just don't see the link schematically.

    Finally, throwing more to the RBs was one of the main discussions of the previous off-season, and we did so a lot until the pass catchers got hurt. I don't know why people ignore that personnel affects what you can call, but it reminds me of everybody calling for more screen passes when we've thrown plenty over the years to backs like Mike Davis who were good with them. Carson, Penny and Dallas should all be good targets in the passing game this year but that's a personnel thing more than a scheme thing.

    Of course, we don't have to wait long to see another data point. The Patriots defense has a strong secondary and Gilmore is a legitimate shut-down corner, whereas they lost some of their DL. On paper, this looks like the sort of game where they'd want to be as close to 50/50 run/pass as possible, so if they were to go 40/60 or something in a close game that would seem more significant than last week.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Thu Sep 17, 2020 1:22 pm
  • So all this might be moot as [urlhttps://www.nfl.com/news/pete-carroll-plans-to-get-seahawks-run-game-going-after-pass-happy-week-1/[/url]


    ""First time out it went fine,'' Carroll said of the RB usage in Week 1, via the Seattle Times. "Seven and six carries wasn't enough for our guys and we need to get more. We were at 20 (runs). We want to get more than that in general."

    So we will see.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Thu Sep 17, 2020 3:30 pm
  • I'm not sure who these Pete ball defenders are Fade. As for myself i don't care if they run it or throw it what i care about is what works and gets TD's . Clearly with the addition of Metcalf and Wilson's amazing talent at QB they should throw the ball more. I'll just remind you that Atlanta doesn't have a good secondary at all and there not a great team running the football either . It's to early to say if Air Carroll is a consistent strategy i hope it is that's more fun to watch.
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Thu Sep 17, 2020 4:35 pm
  • I have always thought that RW should have been given more control of the play calling. Not only is he extremely talented, he puts in the work with game film.

    His mantra "the separation is in the preparation" indicates a QB with more than just talent, it reveals a QB with great discipline and work ethic.
    DomeHawk
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Thu Sep 17, 2020 5:03 pm
  • Settle down. This team won't morph into the SD Chargers of yester year , but it would be fun . :D
    xray
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Thu Sep 17, 2020 5:09 pm
  • That's my guy Dome right there!
    Call it whatever makes you feel best, but IMO our best offensive scheme would be for Schotty to send Russ a few plays to consider, Pete to let Russ know what he wants to accomplish, and let Russ call the offensive game. He's more than ready for that. He's the one feeling the game. He sees what the defense is doing. Let him dial up the response he feels like it's time for.
    That's what it's time for.
    Appyhawk
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Thu Sep 17, 2020 8:24 pm
  • Tical21 wrote:We know what happens when we don't feature the run. But some choose to forget we've played this game before.

    Sorry, but there was more creativity and flat-out ballsy decisions in this game than we've ever seen under Pete Carroll before in a single game, save possibly one from Russell's rookie season. This isn't just an over-simplification that we "threw more".
    RolandDeschain
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Fri Sep 18, 2020 12:35 am
  • John63 wrote:One HUGE thing SChotty was in the booth not on the sidelines. This is HUGE!!!

    I don't agree with you on much but on this I sure do,I hope he stays up there.
    IndyHawk
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Fri Sep 18, 2020 8:41 am
  • Tical21 wrote: .....I'll prefer Russ throws 50 times if we get to see man all game.

    We know what happens when we don't feature the run. But some choose to forget we've played this game before.


    Because "Russ can't read zone"...correct? :roll:

    We have NOT seen what can happen! That was with an entirely different Oline, Oline coach, and blocking scheme! :177692:
    Seymour
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Fri Sep 18, 2020 9:01 am
  • SoulfishHawk wrote:My wife was like "FINALLY, they do something different"
    She does make a good point. Not that the formula hasn't work for years. But, switching it up, being creative and aggressive was SO good to see.


    :ditto:

    That is pretty much how felt as well. At least it was a change which has been very rare in the PC era. Who knows if it's for only one game or a fundamental shift in his thinking. I just was glad we could watch the first three quarters and be pleasantly surprised by the approach. I personally am not shocked it worked so well!
    kf3339
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Sun Sep 20, 2020 2:34 pm
  • Wasting 3 quarters establishing the run to setup playaction is dumb.


    And the numbers back it up as well.
    Fade
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Tue Sep 22, 2020 7:57 pm
  • New offense looked pretty awesome. I'm convinced.
    Tical21
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Wed Sep 23, 2020 6:27 am
  • This ^
    I have no doubt they can move the ball and put up 27-30+ on ANY defense. And they are gonna' get better which is scary. To me at least, it looks a lot more creative as a whole.
    SoulfishHawk
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Re: To all of the "Pete Ball" defenders
Wed Sep 23, 2020 8:06 am
  • I don't know it it's more creative, but it is more aggressive than we've become accustomed to seeing. That seems like a plus. A passive approach to offense will diminish desired result. I always considered compromise an exercise in losing more slowly (see prevent defense).
    Not sure exactly what the beef is regarding "Peteball". Carrol's approach is to present a balanced attack, which I wholeheartedly endorse. I still think Russ is entirely capable of reading the situation and making the right call from the suggestions he receives. I bet he would take as much advantage of the run game as he could. He knows what sets up the big plays and how to make it happen. RPO is maybe the most efficient style I know of to do that as you have options for adjustment on every play. I'm confident if Russ was doing the cooking you would see him handing/pitching the ball off about half the time.
    Appyhawk
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