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When will we move on from John Schneider?

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When will we move on from John Schneider?
Mon Nov 16, 2020 10:02 am
  • John Schneider is overrated. Only one successful DE in draft (Frank Clark) everyone else has been a bust. Living off of the 2011/2012/2013 success for too long. No DB depth since LOB No LBs since Bobby and KJ no DL outside of Frank. Got lucky on Cliff and MB in Free Agency. Couldn’t develop a Offensive Tackle in house. Outside of Lewis this year, OL drafting has been terrible. WR outside of DK and Tyler have been miserable. TE drafting has been terrible. Reliant on Trades too much and even those have not hit since the Clemons and Beast trades. He needs to be on the hot seat for the failure to backfill with a decent roster but as mentioned earlier, lives off of 2011/2012/2013 success and it needs to stop.
    ludakrishna
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  • Pete and John won a championship in one of the most depressing Sports cities in America. Now one of the most depressing cities in general. The only way either one of them leaves is on their own accord.
    RCATES
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  • RCATES wrote:Pete and John won a championship in one of the most depressing Sports cities in America. Now one of the most depressing cities in general. The only way either one of them leaves is on their own accord.


    This attitude is exactly what’s wrong. He is now a Bill Bavasi. But since he helped us win a SB once upon a time, it’s okay.
    ludakrishna
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  • His contract runs through the '21 season, according to his Wikipedia page.
    HagFaithful
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  • If we dont make the playoffs 3 straight years in a row.

    Right now we are tied for 1st in the toughest division in the NFL. We have the #1 offense and on paper our defense should be decent.

    We have the best qb in football and most hype/exciting WR. You got a superstar in Jamal Adams.

    Since John/Pete been here they been winning games....So yeah unless we dont make the playoffs 3 years in row, we keep him.
    rcaido
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  • What does the new ownership think is John? How hand on or off is the new ownership? I think he should go. I’m not a fan. Does make some good moves but overall we could do for a change. Too much loyalty to Pete.
    zchurch74
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  • Pete and John built a team at the time Carroll knew the talent level of the college players he selected and hit a home run with a gamble on Wilson. Since then they have been mediocre to bad drafting and in free agency. Sad this organization is so lenient on laurels from the past because the team is now stuck in the same predictable pattern.
    pittpnthrs
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  • Russell Wilson was all John.....Pete wanted to draft someone else. John had to convince Pete Russ was the one to take. Another thing I would add is Pete is like GM 2.0 he’s got as much to do with our drafting and player transactions as John.
    PNW
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  • PNW wrote:Russell Wilson was all John.....Pete wanted to draft someone else. John had to convince Pete Russ was the one to take. Another thing I would add is Pete is like GM 2.0 he’s got as much to do with our drafting and player transactions as John.

    I think your GM is only as good as what he is told to scout and those scouting for him.

    I think we fail to realize Schneider drafts for Carroll’s “ideal” players to fit “his system.”

    Everything is on Pete and always have been.

    Schneider is a decent negotiator, but Carroll ultimately decides what to give up and who to draft.

    Everything starts with old man Carroll and the game that has passed his old man ways.

    We’re doomed!
    TheLegendOfBoom
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  • Why are all his "hits" luck, and all his misses a true analysis of who he is?
    misfit
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  • misfit wrote:Why are all his "hits" luck, and all his misses a true analysis of who he is?


    Besides DK and Lockett, who has he ‘hit’ on over the past 7 years?
    ludakrishna
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  • In before somebody brings up Frank Clark.
    pittpnthrs
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  • JS does need to go.

    He also hit on Carson to be fair.
    JayhawkMike
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  • from 2014 onwards below are players from our drafts that I would consider decent

    Britt
    Clark
    Lockett
    Jarran Reed
    Ifedi (ish)
    Nick Vannett
    Alex Collins
    Shaquill Griffin
    David Moore
    Chris Carson
    Penny
    Dissly
    Shaquem Griffin
    Dickson
    Marquise Blair
    DK Metcalf
    Jordyn Brooks
    Damien Lewis
    DeeJay Dallas

    Maybe I've missed some? Maybe I'm slightly reaching on others, but that's not the worst list considering the meltdowns people are having. Perhaps lacking star power but we haven't had decent picks for a long long time (in terms of having a top 10 pick in the draft etc)
    English12thMan
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  • John and Pete have drafted 4 HOF locks, a player that should be a HOF and one of the greatest players to ever wear a Hawk uniform in Chancellor and a future HOF’er in DK add to that dozens of players that have directly contributed to a continued culture of winning. There is a high percentage chance this team endures another long long stretch similar to the one before the P&J era If they made the wholesale changes this board calls for after every loss.

    Please show me another team in the NFL that has drafted that many HOF players in the same time.and show me the list of all the teams that have more wins. But by all means let’s dump everyone and get one of the many many names of the future greats that have come and gone in the last 10 years.....then we could do all again in 3 years.
    Flyingsquad23
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  • Omg you guys are ridiculous.

    Schneider consistently puts one of the most competitive rosters together every year.
    The last 10 years of Seahawks football has been the best football in our franchise's history.

    And you want to fire him? For who?!
    Omg we lost 2 games in a row and our defense sucks. Fire the GM! Are you serious? Are you hearing yourselves before you type this up?

    His whole tenure here in Seattle, he's worked like a dog to give us fans to most competitive roster in the league.

    When he took over what Ruskell had left behind, this team was in shambles. It was a disaster. We had no star players in 2010. Our best receiver was Mike Williams.
    He got us the greatest QB in franchise history, built the L.O.B. from the ground up, traded a 4th Round pick for Lynch, drafted Wagner, Metcalf in the 2nd round. Canton will need to build a separate Seahawks wing just to fit all these amazing players in. I can go on.
    Do you guys know how lucky we have it?
    Yeah, we lost to a good Bills team and to a Rams team WE CAN NEVER BEAT and you guys want to fire this man?

    I'm irate. I feel like Stephen A Smith. The hypocrisy here is palpable!!
    No, we should not fire our GM.
    Jerhawk
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  • ludakrishna wrote:
    misfit wrote:Why are all his "hits" luck, and all his misses a true analysis of who he is?


    Besides DK and Lockett, who has he ‘hit’ on over the past 7 years?

    Lewis
    Shaq
    Carson
    Pocic
    Clark

    and you wanna discount his trades? thats part of what a gm does

    who do you want to replace schneider with?
    misfit
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  • Seem like this franchise is going to be like the Packers where a Great QB has to carry the whole team to wins despite having lackluster coaches acting as dead weight. The GM is fine for now.
    bandiger
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  • I will always say this: The problem is Pete and the fact that Pete hired John so John serves at the whim of Pete. I think John has made some shrewd moves. Look at getting Carlos Dunlap for only a 7th Round Pick and dumping the salary of BJ Finney who wasn't cutting it at Center! The draft is a crap shoot. But I think the last 2 drafts will be good. Look at teams like the Jets who used a number 1 pick on Sam Darnold and 4 years later are already looking at Trevor Lawrence. John insisted on getting Russell Wilson in the 3rd Round, and look at what the team has accomplished since then. Yes, I wish we made different moves in the drafts. Specifically passing on Budda Baker and Taylor Rapp. But I still think Pete is the one holding John back.
    vigilantgrrl
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  • vigilantgrrl wrote:I will always say this: The problem is Pete and the fact that Pete hired John so John serves at the whim of Pete. I think John has made some shrewd moves. Look at getting Carlos Dunlap for only a 7th Round Pick and dumping the salary of BJ Finney who wasn't cutting it at Center! The draft is a crap shoot. But I think the last 2 drafts will be good. Look at teams like the Jets who used a number 1 pick on Sam Darnold and 4 years later are already looking at Trevor Lawrence. John insisted on getting Russell Wilson in the 3rd Round, and look at what the team has accomplished since then. Yes, I wish we made different moves in the drafts. Specifically passing on Budda Baker and Taylor Rapp. But I still think Pete is the one holding John back.

    I think this as well.

    I think Schneider can only do what Pete allows.

    Everything from the top of the organization starts with Carroll.
    TheLegendOfBoom
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  • I think the early Success of PC and JS drafting was Pete familiarity with the college players while Pete was at USC.. since he's moved on, he's not as familiar and it shows in his and Johns drafting...2012 was really the last great class right?
    Bobblehead
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  • I find it hard to judge Schneider ... because like other say --- it's two headed beast with him and Pete Look at Cleveland -- that used to be us. I'm not satisfied with a lot of the results but I'm happy to give Schneider many benefits of many doubts.
    Hawkstorian
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  • Bobblehead wrote:I think the early Success of PC and JS drafting was Pete familiarity with the college players while Pete was at USC.. since he's moved on, he's not as familiar and it shows in his and Johns drafting...2012 was really the last great class right?

    thats was like one of the greatest drafts in nfl history. are we really holding them to that standard? all pros and hall of famers out of every draft?
    misfit
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  • Schneider will go whenever Pete goes, I believe. Pete was very clear about wanting full control of things when he came from USC. JS can't do anything without Petes approval. They are a team and will go together. I don't want either out for the near future. I'm very happy with how they have done. It is very hard winning a SB and we already have one. People need to stop calling for heads on a 6-3 team. At least wait and see how the season pans out please.
    Welshers
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  • PNW wrote:Russell Wilson was all John.....Pete wanted to draft someone else. John had to convince Pete Russ was the one to take. Another thing I would add is Pete is like GM 2.0 he’s got as much to do with our drafting and player transactions as John.


    Position coaches are picking players. Look closely.
    Atradees
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  • English12thMan wrote:from 2014 onwards below are players from our drafts that I would consider decent

    Britt
    Clark
    Lockett
    Jarran Reed
    Ifedi (ish)
    Nick Vannett
    Alex Collins
    Shaquill Griffin
    David Moore
    Chris Carson
    Penny
    Dissly
    Shaquem Griffin
    Dickson
    Marquise Blair
    DK Metcalf
    Jordyn Brooks
    Damien Lewis
    DeeJay Dallas

    Maybe I've missed some? Maybe I'm slightly reaching on others, but that's not the worst list considering the meltdowns people are having. Perhaps lacking star power but we haven't had decent picks for a long long time (in terms of having a top 10 pick in the draft etc)


    Man, the rainbow glasses are in full effect. That is a terrible record. I’m not expecting a superstar every pick, but that list only has 1 superstar on it, and that’s DK. The guy has drafted role players, which any GM can do. We can name the players above because they play for our team.
    ludakrishna
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  • Is this roster good enough to contend for a super bowl this year?

    Have we been a winning franchise for the last 10 years?

    I think were fine at GM.
    getnasty
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  • Hawkstorian wrote:I find it hard to judge Schneider ... because like other say --- it's two headed beast with him and Pete Look at Cleveland -- that used to be us. I'm not satisfied with a lot of the results but I'm happy to give Schneider many benefits of many doubts.


    Jerhawk wrote:Omg you guys are ridiculous.

    Schneider consistently puts one of the most competitive rosters together every year.
    The last 10 years of Seahawks football has been the best football in our franchise's history.

    And you want to fire him? For who?!
    Omg we lost 2 games in a row and our defense sucks. Fire the GM! Are you serious? Are you hearing yourselves before you type this up?

    His whole tenure here in Seattle, he's worked like a dog to give us fans to most competitive roster in the league.

    When he took over what Ruskell had left behind, this team was in shambles. It was a disaster. We had no star players in 2010. Our best receiver was Mike Williams.
    He got us the greatest QB in franchise history, built the L.O.B. from the ground up, traded a 4th Round pick for Lynch, drafted Wagner, Metcalf in the 2nd round. Canton will need to build a separate Seahawks wing just to fit all these amazing players in. I can go on.
    Do you guys know how lucky we have it?
    Yeah, we lost to a good Bills team and to a Rams team WE CAN NEVER BEAT and you guys want to fire this man?

    I'm irate. I feel like Stephen A Smith. The hypocrisy here is palpable!!
    No, we should not fire our GM.


    So well said fellas, As I said in another thread, I remember the early 90's with Flores. I'm good with our leadership.
    FPD
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  • They need to reevaluate the entire player personnel and scouting department. We haven't had a stellar draft since Scot McCloughan left.

    Having late 1st round picks every year and trading away top picks hasn't helped either. Meanwhile, teams like the 49ers were able to stack their roster by having multiple top first round picks year after year.

    But it's not only on JS and PC. Here's everyone in the front office that needs to be reevaluated.

    Executive vice president/general manager – John Schneider
    Vice president of football operations – Scott Fitterer
    Vice president of player personnel – Trent Kirchner
    Director of college scouting – Matt Berry
    Director of pro personnel – Nolan Teasley
    Personnel executive – Alonzo Highsmith
    hoxrox
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  • hoxrox wrote:They need to reevaluate the entire player personnel and scouting department. We haven't had a stellar draft since Scot McCloughan left.


    What team outside of the top 10 bottom dwellers that have a bunch of high draft picks every year has had a stellar draft?

    I'm not defending Schneider, he's been just above average since our first 2-3 drafts. But the norm is all about trying to get a 40-50% hit rate on your picks, not the crazy 80-90% hit rate we had in the early drafts of Pete and John's tenure.

    Lockett, Clark, Reed, DK, Griffin, Pocic, Carson, Moore, Swain, Dissly, Dickson, Blair, Amadi, Lewis and Brooks.

    That's a good hit rate........and you have to remember Pete has the final say on every draft pick. If they're debating in the war room, Pete wins. We will never know all the inner debates and conflict over who to draft, but this is Pete's team, from top to bottom.........including final say on who we draft every single year.
    Sgt. Largent
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  • Sgt. Largent wrote:
    hoxrox wrote:They need to reevaluate the entire player personnel and scouting department. We haven't had a stellar draft since Scot McCloughan left.


    What team outside of the top 10 bottom dwellers that have a bunch of high draft picks every year has had a stellar draft?

    I'm not defending Schneider, he's been just above average since our first 2-3 drafts. But the norm is all about trying to get a 40-50% hit rate on your picks, not the crazy 80-90% hit rate we had in the early drafts of Pete and John's tenure.

    Lockett, Clark, Reed, DK, Griffin, Pocic, Carson, Moore, Swain, Dissly, Dickson, Blair, Amadi, Lewis and Brooks.

    That's a good hit rate........and you have to remember Pete has the final say on every draft pick. If they're debating in the war room, Pete wins. We will never know all the inner debates and conflict over who to draft, but this is Pete's team, from top to bottom.........including final say on who we draft every single year.


    The 2019 draft in particular is looking pretty stellar compared to what can reasonably be expected from the draft slots they had.
    Maelstrom787
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  • Are we really blaming JS?

    He does not hit on many 1st rounders. But his hit rate on 7th rounders is spectacular.

    Imagine his overall grade( not per pick ) but in total player value acquired per draft is high. Certainly above average.

    His UDFA success rate is high.

    Trades are probably 50/50 w more failures in the splash trades. Same thing on splash FA deals.

    But overall not terrible. He struggles to draft for need. But he hits enough HRs and triples to offset it.
    TwistedHusky
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  • TwistedHusky wrote:
    But overall not terrible. He struggles to draft for need. But he hits enough HRs and triples to offset it.


    Good point on drafting for need instead of best available.

    Pete and John have also been slow to the party with drafting to how the league is changing. They just now stopped drafting prototypical LB's and CB's.......and went to the smaller quicker nickel and dime hybrid LB's and CB's.

    The game is changing, and that means how we draft should also be changing, especially on the defensive side of the ball. Shouldn't be drafting 6'2 long slower CB's and 250 lb middle LB's. Defenses now need 4-5 quick sideline to sideline hybrid defenders, i.e. Budda Baker/Honey Badger types. Not Cody Barton/Tre Flowers types.
    Sgt. Largent
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  • Sgt. Largent wrote:
    Lockett, Clark, Reed, DK, Griffin, Pocic, Carson, Moore, Swain, Dissly, Dickson, Blair, Amadi, Lewis and Brooks.



    IMO, hits are above average or exceptional players.

    Lockett (HIT)
    Clark (HIT)
    Reed (HIT, kind of)
    DK (HIT, but very lucky he fell into our laps)
    Griffin (average)
    Pocic (HIT)
    Carson (HIT)
    Moore (HIT)
    Swain (not enough play to evaluate)
    Dissly (has shown flashes, but due to injuries, not enough play to evaluate)
    Dickson (HIT)
    Blair (good potential, but not enough play to evaluate)
    Amadi (not enough play to evaluate)
    Lewis (good potential but not enough play to evaluate)
    Brooks (not enough play to evaluate)

    So maybe 8 hits out of a total of how many draft picks over the years? Perhaps PC makes the final decisions, but the entire war room needs to better. For example, how did we miss on Budda Baker when he’s right in our back yard?
    hoxrox
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  • hoxrox wrote:
    So maybe 8 hits out of a total of how many draft picks over the years? Perhaps PC makes the final decisions, but the entire war room needs to better. For example, how did we miss on Budda Baker when he’s right in our back yard?


    I mentioned Baker above, and we missed for just the reason I listed......too late to the how to draft in the modern football era conversation. John and Pete were still drafting prototypical defensive players, and Baker didn't fit into that box.

    My point is this entire thread is not accurate. You can't say "move on" from anybody without involving Pete into the conversation. Same as the "FIRE <insert coordinator>" threads.

    You don't like the way the offense is schemed or personnell'd? Pete.
    You don't like the way the defense is schemed or personnell'd? Pete.
    You don't like who we're drafting or acquiring via trades and free agents? Pete.
    Sgt. Largent
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  • Total different philosophy. Probably why we didn't get Baker or Rapp. We don't draft the best player for need.

    Carroll (and likely JS) believe that teams with the best advantage are the teams with 'field tilters'. The trade for Adams is another example of that.

    That field tilting player only comes along (outside of top 10 picks). Once every other year. Outside of 1st round picks even less.

    So you start with the realization that it is probably easier to find a great player than a great player at a certain position. You also likely realize that players that fit the physical mold you set, won't always pan out. You likely spend 3-4 picks for every hit. This means you need a greater # of picks.

    If you look, you notice we tend to trade back to get more picks that allow us to spin the wheel more.

    You are drafting for upside, instead of the ability to immediately contribute (which is the usual measuring stick).

    But you are trading uncertainty (the % chance the player can immediately come in and contribute) for the upside. And since your scouting and evaluation processes all center on this, you likely are better at it than evaluating talent to fill immediate holes.

    Great for building a program. But terrible for filling holes due to losses to FA or injury. Additionally terrible for shoring up depth in areas of projected need. We seem to try to address that after the fact with UDFA (where we are very good) and trades (where we have a mixed bag of effectiveness).

    But this strategy gets you the Frank Clarks and DK Metcalfs that you never would have gotten. It gets the Chris Carsons. Those kinds of stellar finds are not accidents, they are planned.
    TwistedHusky
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  • TwistedHusky wrote:Are we really blaming JS?

    He does not hit on many 1st rounders.
    But his hit rate on 7th rounders is spectacular.

    Imagine his overall grade( not per pick ) but in total player value acquired per draft is high. Certainly above average.

    His UDFA success rate is high.

    Trades are probably 50/50 w more failures in the splash trades. Same thing on splash FA deals.

    But overall not terrible. He struggles to draft for need. But he hits enough HRs and triples to offset it.


    Also factor in Pete is pretty much deciding who they take in the first.

    John needs to be given full autonomy before he can properly be evaluated. Based on his track record in KC, WAS, SEA (back in the Holmgren era), and Green Bay, he is awesome.

    Early PC era I credit mostly Pete and Scott MC for their successful drafting, but John wanted Wilson bad, so credit goes to him for seeing it. I think he is one of the better GM's that is being hampered by the old man. Let John Cook.
    Fade
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  • hoxrox wrote:
    Sgt. Largent wrote:
    Lockett, Clark, Reed, DK, Griffin, Pocic, Carson, Moore, Swain, Dissly, Dickson, Blair, Amadi, Lewis and Brooks.



    IMO, hits are above average or exceptional players.

    Lockett (HIT)
    Clark (HIT)
    Reed (HIT, kind of)
    DK (HIT, but very lucky he fell into our laps)
    Griffin (average)
    Pocic (HIT)
    Carson (HIT)
    Moore (HIT)
    Swain (not enough play to evaluate)
    Dissly (has shown flashes, but due to injuries, not enough play to evaluate)
    Dickson (HIT)
    Blair (good potential, but not enough play to evaluate)
    Amadi (not enough play to evaluate)
    Lewis (good potential but not enough play to evaluate)
    Brooks (not enough play to evaluate)

    So maybe 8 hits out of a total of how many draft picks over the years? Perhaps PC makes the final decisions, but the entire war room needs to better. For example, how did we miss on Budda Baker when he’s right in our back yard?


    I would also throw in Glowinski, Ifedi, & Moore. Probably include Alex Collins too. So that's 12 out 29 picks from 2015-2017


    What number would you consider good?
    rcaido
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  • :roll:
    vigilantgrrl wrote:I will always say this: The problem is Pete and the fact that Pete hired John so John serves at the whim of Pete. I think John has made some shrewd moves. Look at getting Carlos Dunlap for only a 7th Round Pick and dumping the salary of BJ Finney who wasn't cutting it at Center! The draft is a crap shoot. But I think the last 2 drafts will be good. Look at teams like the Jets who used a number 1 pick on Sam Darnold and 4 years later are already looking at Trevor Lawrence. John insisted on getting Russell Wilson in the 3rd Round, and look at what the team has accomplished since then. Yes, I wish we made different moves in the drafts. Specifically passing on Budda Baker and Taylor Rapp. But I still think Pete is the one holding John back.

    :roll:
    scutterhawk
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  • I think you're over estimating the success rate of GM's in the NFL.

    Since 2015 and excluding the first 20 picks. Players drafted by Seattle have played in 1413 games, been selected to 4 Pro Bowls, and voted All Pro 2 times.

    This ranks 5th best in Games played, Tied for 5th in Pro Bowl Selections, and tied for 2nd in All Pro selections.
    JGreen79
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  • I think Schneider is the LAST concern for the Seahawks. I hope they keep him even after Pete's gone.
    TypeSly
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  • I'd be interested to see what JS could do without Carroll. For example all of the QB's that he's looked at in the first round have been really good starters. Seattle showed some interest in Josh Allen, and we also showed some interest in Tannehill in 2011, and of course we drafted Russell Wilson. All of those QB's ended up being above average in the NFL, we know that at least Russell Wilson was John Schneider's call. I would be curious to see what a Seahawk's FO led by Schneider, free of Carroll would look like. If he had the power to higher is own coach, bring in his own scouts, free from Carroll's system.
    Spin Doctor
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  • TwistedHusky wrote:Total different philosophy. Probably why we didn't get Baker or Rapp. We don't draft the best player for need.

    Carroll (and likely JS) believe that teams with the best advantage are the teams with 'field tilters'. The trade for Adams is another example of that.

    That field tilting player only comes along (outside of top 10 picks). Once every other year. Outside of 1st round picks even less.

    So you start with the realization that it is probably easier to find a great player than a great player at a certain position. You also likely realize that players that fit the physical mold you set, won't always pan out. You likely spend 3-4 picks for every hit. This means you need a greater # of picks.

    If you look, you notice we tend to trade back to get more picks that allow us to spin the wheel more.

    You are drafting for upside, instead of the ability to immediately contribute (which is the usual measuring stick).

    But you are trading uncertainty (the % chance the player can immediately come in and contribute) for the upside. And since your scouting and evaluation processes all center on this, you likely are better at it than evaluating talent to fill immediate holes.

    Great for building a program. But terrible for filling holes due to losses to FA or injury. Additionally terrible for shoring up depth in areas of projected need. We seem to try to address that after the fact with UDFA (where we are very good) and trades (where we have a mixed bag of effectiveness).

    But this strategy gets you the Frank Clarks and DK Metcalfs that you never would have gotten. It gets the Chris Carsons. Those kinds of stellar finds are not accidents, they are planned.



    This is an excellent post which rather clearly sets out JS’ draft philosophy. JS has really not screwed up many picks and frankly is better at it than many here acknowledge. Constantly picking late in each round requires agility to move around to acquire the talent you have identified. The draft after all is a best guess type situation where many of the key variables are not certain.

    I agree with Jerhawk for his reasons as well but think Mike Williams was a Pete acquisition yet the talent on the team was so depleted they were at a start over state beginning 2010. JS.haschurned the roster to try to improve weak areas better than many FOs in the NFL.

    JS has made this team constantly competitive. Getting rid of him would be a huge mistake.
    jammerhawk
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  • What GM/HC/Ownership tandem in the league is better than John and Pete and our ownership (ownership beginning with Allen)?
    IMO we have the best there is. If I were a player in the market there is nowhere and no organization I'd rather play for/with than in Seattle for Seahawks.
    Appyhawk
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  • The other issue is that we only have like what - 4 picks in the upcoming draft?? So these MUST hit. We have too many holes to fill, and very little draft capital to do it.
    hoxrox
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  • Trader John has a way of manipulating draft picks to make more from less.
    jammerhawk
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  • Trader John has a way of manipulating draft picks to make more from less.
    jammerhawk
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  • jammerhawk wrote:Trader John has a way of manipulating draft picks to make more from less.



    Hmm this wheeling and dealing is kind of what I'm afraid of. We have no 1st round picks in 2021 or 2022, so he will probably trade away the second round pick for a couple of late round picks, hoping we'll get a Sherman or Chancellor.. That's like gambling. The odds aren't good.

    The other thing I did not understand was why he gave way draft capital for one-year rental players. For example,

    Clowney for a third-round pick, and LB Jacob Martin - unless it is an "all-in" year, why didn't we just keep and develop Martin and the draft pick?

    Sheldon Richardson in exchange for Jermaine Kearse and a second-round pick. Would rather just have the second round pick that could have been an impact player today.

    And the ultra high-priced Adams trade - is he going to be a long-term impact player, or is this just another bad trade deal?
    hoxrox
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  • Appyhawk wrote:What GM/HC/Ownership tandem in the league is better than John and Pete and our ownership (ownership beginning with Allen)?


    Kansas City, Baltimore, and New Orleans.
    94Smith
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  • rcaido wrote:If we dont make the playoffs 3 straight years in a row.

    Right now we are tied for 1st in the toughest division in the NFL. We have the #1 offense and on paper our defense should be decent.

    We have the best qb in football and most hype/exciting WR. You got a superstar in Jamal Adams.

    Since John/Pete been here they been winning games....So yeah unless we dont make the playoffs 3 years in row, we keep him.



    So many key pieces went down early and kept going down throughout the year. That is not a Schneider issue. Irvin/Blair going out early and shaq being hurt like he has been, adams being hurt for like 3-4 weeks. That doesn't even look at the Carson and Hyde being out like they have been, Pocioc being out last week and having a 2nd year practice squad player in and unable to keep other teams honest on defense with a decent running threat and keep the defense off the field longer with more extended drives...none of that is on Schneider.
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