bevellisthedevil wrote:No way should he be inducted. I don't think he should be vilified either.

RolandDeschain wrote:

bevellisthedevil wrote:No way should he be inducted. I don't think he should be vilified either.

We should be vilifying the fans who think he deserves to be in the Hall of Fame, though.

keasley45 wrote:Being soft at the point of contact IS NOT a defining characteristic of a HOF back. You dont have to be Campbell or Lynch. You can be cut from the Sanders, LT or Faulk cloth and juke the crap out of guy. (BTW, Lynch could do that too - Google Lynch jukes Ray Lewis - Classic). Shaun got the yards that were on the table when the blocking worked well. Not when it didnt.

keasley45 wrote:

IndyHawk wrote:

sdog1981 wrote:

fenderbender123 wrote:Davis also has 2 Super Bowl wins and 3 All Pros. And I don't think he deserved to be in it.

NFL MVP, Super Bowl MVP, 20 rushing TD season and a 2000 yard rushing season. He is a Hall of Fame player. He could have played for 15 more seasons rushing for 0 yards every year and still be a HOF running back, due to his 1996 to 1998 seasons.

SA had an MVP,27 tds,1880 rushing and got hosed in SB-Thats a HOF season too.
Here look at his stats closely and tell me he shouldn't be in.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/ ... exSh00.htm

He shouldn't be in. Its not all about the stats. he wasn't individually HOF great. He has HOF stats because he had a great O-Line opening gashes in defenses for him to chew up yards.

RolandDeschain wrote:

bevellisthedevil wrote:No way should he be inducted. I don't think he should be vilified either.

We should be vilifying the fans who think he deserves to be in the Hall of Fame, though.

pittpnthrs wrote:

keasley45 wrote:

IndyHawk wrote:

sdog1981 wrote:
NFL MVP, Super Bowl MVP, 20 rushing TD season and a 2000 yard rushing season. He is a Hall of Fame player. He could have played for 15 more seasons rushing for 0 yards every year and still be a HOF running back, due to his 1996 to 1998 seasons.

SA had an MVP,27 tds,1880 rushing and got hosed in SB-Thats a HOF season too.
Here look at his stats closely and tell me he shouldn't be in.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/ ... exSh00.htm

He shouldn't be in. Its not all about the stats. he wasn't individually HOF great. He has HOF stats because he had a great O-Line opening gashes in defenses for him to chew up yards.

Emmitt Smith should have never made it either right?

keasley45 wrote:

pittpnthrs wrote:

keasley45 wrote:

IndyHawk wrote:SA had an MVP,27 tds,1880 rushing and got hosed in SB-Thats a HOF season too.
Here look at his stats closely and tell me he shouldn't be in.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/ ... exSh00.htm

He shouldn't be in. Its not all about the stats. he wasn't individually HOF great. He has HOF stats because he had a great O-Line opening gashes in defenses for him to chew up yards.

Emmitt Smith should have never made it either right?

Umm, Emmitt Smith couldn't be kept out. He broke the all time rushing record. At some point, when you play as long as he did, and for as many yards as he did, that's HOF worthy in itself. And Emmitt was a more talented runner than Shaun. He had speed, he had vision, and he wasnt afraid to take a hit. Making a case for him is easy.

pittpnthrs wrote:

keasley45 wrote:

pittpnthrs wrote:

keasley45 wrote:
He shouldn't be in. Its not all about the stats. he wasn't individually HOF great. He has HOF stats because he had a great O-Line opening gashes in defenses for him to chew up yards.

Emmitt Smith should have never made it either right?

Umm, Emmitt Smith couldn't be kept out. He broke the all time rushing record. At some point, when you play as long as he did, and for as many yards as he did, that's HOF worthy in itself. And Emmitt was a more talented runner than Shaun. He had speed, he had vision, and he wasnt afraid to take a hit. Making a case for him is easy.

More talented? Guess we'll agree to disagree.

Imagine what Alexander could have dome behind Smiths line.

pittpnthrs wrote:

keasley45 wrote:Being soft at the point of contact IS NOT a defining characteristic of a HOF back. You dont have to be Campbell or Lynch. You can be cut from the Sanders, LT or Faulk cloth and juke the crap out of guy. (BTW, Lynch could do that too - Google Lynch jukes Ray Lewis - Classic). Shaun got the yards that were on the table when the blocking worked well. Not when it didnt.

You're contradicting yourself with this statement. You're saying being soft at the point of contact is NOT a defining characteristic of a HOF back and then proceed to list 3 backs that were. You act like Alexander never juked a defender and just laid down when one appeared and thats nowhere near the truth. Its unreal the disrespect the guy receives around here. It reminds me of a guy on another forum that was saying how Carson was better than Lynch because he is always looking for contact. Its as if he forgot about Lynch totally somehow and thats how It seems with Alexander in this thread. When reading some replies in this thread, one would think that Alexander was nothing more than an average back. Its unreal how quickly some forget.

keasley45 wrote:

pittpnthrs wrote:

keasley45 wrote:Being soft at the point of contact IS NOT a defining characteristic of a HOF back. You dont have to be Campbell or Lynch. You can be cut from the Sanders, LT or Faulk cloth and juke the crap out of guy. (BTW, Lynch could do that too - Google Lynch jukes Ray Lewis - Classic). Shaun got the yards that were on the table when the blocking worked well. Not when it didnt.

You're contradicting yourself with this statement. You're saying being soft at the point of contact is NOT a defining characteristic of a HOF back and then proceed to list 3 backs that were. You act like Alexander never juked a defender and just laid down when one appeared and thats nowhere near the truth. Its unreal the disrespect the guy receives around here. It reminds me of a guy on another forum that was saying how Carson was better than Lynch because he is always looking for contact. Its as if he forgot about Lynch totally somehow and thats how It seems with Alexander in this thread. When reading some replies in this thread, one would think that Alexander was nothing more than an average back. Its unreal how quickly some forget.

You're actually claiming the guys i mentioned above were soft??

Ok. No need to continue this further.

Shaun wont get in.

When he didnt have the continuity of the O-line and 2 HOF's, Toebeck, and a cast of underrated , and unheralded others opening holes for him, his YPC dropped from 5.1 in 2005 to 3.6 and 3.5 in 2006 and 2007. Yes, he had a few injuries but none that could account alone for the drastic decline in production. He sat out for the foot while it healed. Then he went on to Washington after being a free agent for 6 months. 6 months. Why? because every other team in the league knew then what some here know now. That he was a product of his O-line. And who signed him, but Jim Zorn. nd what happened there? behind another average o-line, he was ousted by Clinton Portis and Ladell Betts.

and what did JIM ZORN have to say about Alexander's 'want to' and effort? This is a quote directly from him when asked whether Shaun was unfairly cast:

Told of this theory, Zorn partly agreed but said: “Repeating that ’05 season would have been hard. And he just seemed to either not have the knack, or he seemed to take a view of, ‘Hey, listen, when the hole’s there, I’m going to run through, but if the hole’s not there, you might as well go and call the next play.’

“Shaun didn’t have a great work ethic in Seattle,” Zorn added. “He didn’t. He said he felt practice was for everybody else.”

How many other RB's in the HOF have such a damning thing said about them?? Sheeshh. Take off the glasses.

But I guess Jim Zorn hates him too like the other 31 teams in 2008 who didnt want to touch him and rest of us that see past the stats and can rightfully attriibute his success in good part to those who paved the way for him.

John63 wrote:

keasley45 wrote:

pittpnthrs wrote:

keasley45 wrote:Being soft at the point of contact IS NOT a defining characteristic of a HOF back. You dont have to be Campbell or Lynch. You can be cut from the Sanders, LT or Faulk cloth and juke the crap out of guy. (BTW, Lynch could do that too - Google Lynch jukes Ray Lewis - Classic). Shaun got the yards that were on the table when the blocking worked well. Not when it didnt.

You're contradicting yourself with this statement. You're saying being soft at the point of contact is NOT a defining characteristic of a HOF back and then proceed to list 3 backs that were. You act like Alexander never juked a defender and just laid down when one appeared and thats nowhere near the truth. Its unreal the disrespect the guy receives around here. It reminds me of a guy on another forum that was saying how Carson was better than Lynch because he is always looking for contact. Its as if he forgot about Lynch totally somehow and thats how It seems with Alexander in this thread. When reading some replies in this thread, one would think that Alexander was nothing more than an average back. Its unreal how quickly some forget.

You're actually claiming the guys i mentioned above were soft??

Ok. No need to continue this further.

Shaun wont get in.

When he didnt have the continuity of the O-line and 2 HOF's, Toebeck, and a cast of underrated , and unheralded others opening holes for him, his YPC dropped from 5.1 in 2005 to 3.6 and 3.5 in 2006 and 2007. Yes, he had a few injuries but none that could account alone for the drastic decline in production. He sat out for the foot while it healed. Then he went on to Washington after being a free agent for 6 months. 6 months. Why? because every other team in the league knew then what some here know now. That he was a product of his O-line. And who signed him, but Jim Zorn. nd what happened there? behind another average o-line, he was ousted by Clinton Portis and Ladell Betts.

and what did JIM ZORN have to say about Alexander's 'want to' and effort? This is a quote directly from him when asked whether Shaun was unfairly cast:

Told of this theory, Zorn partly agreed but said: “Repeating that ’05 season would have been hard. And he just seemed to either not have the knack, or he seemed to take a view of, ‘Hey, listen, when the hole’s there, I’m going to run through, but if the hole’s not there, you might as well go and call the next play.’

“Shaun didn’t have a great work ethic in Seattle,” Zorn added. “He didn’t. He said he felt practice was for everybody else.”

How many other RB's in the HOF have such a damning thing said about them?? Sheeshh. Take off the glasses.

But I guess Jim Zorn hates him too like the other 31 teams in 2008 who didnt want to touch him and rest of us that see past the stats and can rightfully attriibute his success in good part to those who paved the way for him.

Well actually several players that players with LT felt he did not run hard inside the 20s, and he ran out of bounds to much, So sorry if you look there are some who say bad things about every player. Also, there are others who spoke very highly of Lt and Alexander.

I mean of course you bring in a quote that backs you stance on him which again is personal and not based on stats.

"In a March Sports Illustrated article, Shaun Alexander’s former teammate, quarterback Matt Hasselbeck, said he believes Alexander is Hall-of-Fame material. “I sure do,” Hasselbeck said. “I’m not an expert on the numbers and I was never that big into stats. When we were teammates, he was one of the best running backs in the game, a household name, on the cover of Madden, breaking franchise and NFL records seemingly all the time.

“I do not know of a better red-zone runner,” Hasselbeck said. “There have been some great runners in NFL history that were Hall of Fame runners but weren’t great goal line running backs. I think Barry Sanders might be the greatest running back of all time. But on the goal line or inside the three-yard line was not his strength.”

Nate Burleson, another one of Alexander’s former teammates, believes Alexander is very underappreciated. “He’s a quiet individual who went out there and didn’t talk about how great he was,” Burleson said. “He’d rather do it on the field. And also I believe because it was a small window of time where he was the best running back in football.” "

amazing how there are other opinions as well and this form guys who actually player with him not an ex player

RolandDeschain wrote:Alexander's stats would be drastically lower if he played behind the same O-Line Lynch did.

It's kind of annoying how some people think Shaun Alexander is a HoF back based on pure stats and nostalgic memories of his time in Seattle. More objectivity needs to be brought to this table...

If Shaun had played with Lynch's ferocity and willingness to run through b1tch3s every single down, he'd have like 40 more TDs and 6,000 more yards for his career stats, and THAT would absolutely be HoF-worthy - not just because of the stats, but because of the elite, sustained EFFORT. That EFFORT was only visible in the red zone from Shaun, and THAT is why he DOES NOT DESERVE to be in the Hall of Fame.

keasley45 wrote:

pittpnthrs wrote:

keasley45 wrote:

pittpnthrs wrote:
Emmitt Smith should have never made it either right?

Umm, Emmitt Smith couldn't be kept out. He broke the all time rushing record. At some point, when you play as long as he did, and for as many yards as he did, that's HOF worthy in itself. And Emmitt was a more talented runner than Shaun. He had speed, he had vision, and he wasnt afraid to take a hit. Making a case for him is easy.

More talented? Guess we'll agree to disagree.

Imagine what Alexander could have dome behind Smiths line.

For sure

John63 wrote:

keasley45 wrote:

pittpnthrs wrote:

keasley45 wrote:Being soft at the point of contact IS NOT a defining characteristic of a HOF back. You dont have to be Campbell or Lynch. You can be cut from the Sanders, LT or Faulk cloth and juke the crap out of guy. (BTW, Lynch could do that too - Google Lynch jukes Ray Lewis - Classic). Shaun got the yards that were on the table when the blocking worked well. Not when it didnt.

You're contradicting yourself with this statement. You're saying being soft at the point of contact is NOT a defining characteristic of a HOF back and then proceed to list 3 backs that were. You act like Alexander never juked a defender and just laid down when one appeared and thats nowhere near the truth. Its unreal the disrespect the guy receives around here. It reminds me of a guy on another forum that was saying how Carson was better than Lynch because he is always looking for contact. Its as if he forgot about Lynch totally somehow and thats how It seems with Alexander in this thread. When reading some replies in this thread, one would think that Alexander was nothing more than an average back. Its unreal how quickly some forget.

You're actually claiming the guys i mentioned above were soft??

Ok. No need to continue this further.

Shaun wont get in.

When he didnt have the continuity of the O-line and 2 HOF's, Toebeck, and a cast of underrated , and unheralded others opening holes for him, his YPC dropped from 5.1 in 2005 to 3.6 and 3.5 in 2006 and 2007. Yes, he had a few injuries but none that could account alone for the drastic decline in production. He sat out for the foot while it healed. Then he went on to Washington after being a free agent for 6 months. 6 months. Why? because every other team in the league knew then what some here know now. That he was a product of his O-line. And who signed him, but Jim Zorn. nd what happened there? behind another average o-line, he was ousted by Clinton Portis and Ladell Betts.

and what did JIM ZORN have to say about Alexander's 'want to' and effort? This is a quote directly from him when asked whether Shaun was unfairly cast:

Told of this theory, Zorn partly agreed but said: “Repeating that ’05 season would have been hard. And he just seemed to either not have the knack, or he seemed to take a view of, ‘Hey, listen, when the hole’s there, I’m going to run through, but if the hole’s not there, you might as well go and call the next play.’

“Shaun didn’t have a great work ethic in Seattle,” Zorn added. “He didn’t. He said he felt practice was for everybody else.”

How many other RB's in the HOF have such a damning thing said about them?? Sheeshh. Take off the glasses.

But I guess Jim Zorn hates him too like the other 31 teams in 2008 who didnt want to touch him and rest of us that see past the stats and can rightfully attriibute his success in good part to those who paved the way for him.

Well actually several players that players with LT felt he did not run hard inside the 20s, and he ran out of bounds to much, So sorry if you look there are some who say bad things about every player. Also, there are others who spoke very highly of Lt and Alexander.

I mean of course you bring in a quote that backs you stance on him which again is personal and not based on stats.

"In a March Sports Illustrated article, Shaun Alexander’s former teammate, quarterback Matt Hasselbeck, said he believes Alexander is Hall-of-Fame material. “I sure do,” Hasselbeck said. “I’m not an expert on the numbers and I was never that big into stats. When we were teammates, he was one of the best running backs in the game, a household name, on the cover of Madden, breaking franchise and NFL records seemingly all the time.

“I do not know of a better red-zone runner,” Hasselbeck said. “There have been some great runners in NFL history that were Hall of Fame runners but weren’t great goal line running backs. I think Barry Sanders might be the greatest running back of all time. But on the goal line or inside the three-yard line was not his strength.”

Nate Burleson, another one of Alexander’s former teammates, believes Alexander is very underappreciated. “He’s a quiet individual who went out there and didn’t talk about how great he was,” Burleson said. “He’d rather do it on the field. And also I believe because it was a small window of time where he was the best running back in football.” "

amazing how there are other opinions as well and this form guys who actually player with him not an ex player

keasley45 wrote:

John63 wrote:

keasley45 wrote:

pittpnthrs wrote:
You're contradicting yourself with this statement. You're saying being soft at the point of contact is NOT a defining characteristic of a HOF back and then proceed to list 3 backs that were. You act like Alexander never juked a defender and just laid down when one appeared and thats nowhere near the truth. Its unreal the disrespect the guy receives around here. It reminds me of a guy on another forum that was saying how Carson was better than Lynch because he is always looking for contact. Its as if he forgot about Lynch totally somehow and thats how It seems with Alexander in this thread. When reading some replies in this thread, one would think that Alexander was nothing more than an average back. Its unreal how quickly some forget.

You're actually claiming the guys i mentioned above were soft??

Ok. No need to continue this further.

Shaun wont get in.

When he didnt have the continuity of the O-line and 2 HOF's, Toebeck, and a cast of underrated , and unheralded others opening holes for him, his YPC dropped from 5.1 in 2005 to 3.6 and 3.5 in 2006 and 2007. Yes, he had a few injuries but none that could account alone for the drastic decline in production. He sat out for the foot while it healed. Then he went on to Washington after being a free agent for 6 months. 6 months. Why? because every other team in the league knew then what some here know now. That he was a product of his O-line. And who signed him, but Jim Zorn. nd what happened there? behind another average o-line, he was ousted by Clinton Portis and Ladell Betts.

and what did JIM ZORN have to say about Alexander's 'want to' and effort? This is a quote directly from him when asked whether Shaun was unfairly cast:

Told of this theory, Zorn partly agreed but said: “Repeating that ’05 season would have been hard. And he just seemed to either not have the knack, or he seemed to take a view of, ‘Hey, listen, when the hole’s there, I’m going to run through, but if the hole’s not there, you might as well go and call the next play.’

“Shaun didn’t have a great work ethic in Seattle,” Zorn added. “He didn’t. He said he felt practice was for everybody else.”

How many other RB's in the HOF have such a damning thing said about them?? Sheeshh. Take off the glasses.

But I guess Jim Zorn hates him too like the other 31 teams in 2008 who didnt want to touch him and rest of us that see past the stats and can rightfully attriibute his success in good part to those who paved the way for him.

Well actually several players that players with LT felt he did not run hard inside the 20s, and he ran out of bounds to much, So sorry if you look there are some who say bad things about every player. Also, there are others who spoke very highly of Lt and Alexander.

I mean of course you bring in a quote that backs you stance on him which again is personal and not based on stats.

"In a March Sports Illustrated article, Shaun Alexander’s former teammate, quarterback Matt Hasselbeck, said he believes Alexander is Hall-of-Fame material. “I sure do,” Hasselbeck said. “I’m not an expert on the numbers and I was never that big into stats. When we were teammates, he was one of the best running backs in the game, a household name, on the cover of Madden, breaking franchise and NFL records seemingly all the time.

“I do not know of a better red-zone runner,” Hasselbeck said. “There have been some great runners in NFL history that were Hall of Fame runners but weren’t great goal line running backs. I think Barry Sanders might be the greatest running back of all time. But on the goal line or inside the three-yard line was not his strength.”

Nate Burleson, another one of Alexander’s former teammates, believes Alexander is very underappreciated. “He’s a quiet individual who went out there and didn’t talk about how great he was,” Burleson said. “He’d rather do it on the field. And also I believe because it was a small window of time where he was the best running back in football.” "

amazing how there are other opinions as well and this form guys who actually player with him not an ex player

Not amazing at all. Just different coming from a coach responsible for assessing the ability of a player to contribute to a team and whether that player should even be on the team. Different still when the talent evaluators on 31 other teams also looked at Shaun Alexander and came to the same conclusion and decided not to offer him a contract.

keasley45 wrote:

John63 wrote:

keasley45 wrote:

pittpnthrs wrote:
You're contradicting yourself with this statement. You're saying being soft at the point of contact is NOT a defining characteristic of a HOF back and then proceed to list 3 backs that were. You act like Alexander never juked a defender and just laid down when one appeared and thats nowhere near the truth. Its unreal the disrespect the guy receives around here. It reminds me of a guy on another forum that was saying how Carson was better than Lynch because he is always looking for contact. Its as if he forgot about Lynch totally somehow and thats how It seems with Alexander in this thread. When reading some replies in this thread, one would think that Alexander was nothing more than an average back. Its unreal how quickly some forget.

You're actually claiming the guys i mentioned above were soft??

Ok. No need to continue this further.

Shaun wont get in.

When he didnt have the continuity of the O-line and 2 HOF's, Toebeck, and a cast of underrated , and unheralded others opening holes for him, his YPC dropped from 5.1 in 2005 to 3.6 and 3.5 in 2006 and 2007. Yes, he had a few injuries but none that could account alone for the drastic decline in production. He sat out for the foot while it healed. Then he went on to Washington after being a free agent for 6 months. 6 months. Why? because every other team in the league knew then what some here know now. That he was a product of his O-line. And who signed him, but Jim Zorn. nd what happened there? behind another average o-line, he was ousted by Clinton Portis and Ladell Betts.

and what did JIM ZORN have to say about Alexander's 'want to' and effort? This is a quote directly from him when asked whether Shaun was unfairly cast:

Told of this theory, Zorn partly agreed but said: “Repeating that ’05 season would have been hard. And he just seemed to either not have the knack, or he seemed to take a view of, ‘Hey, listen, when the hole’s there, I’m going to run through, but if the hole’s not there, you might as well go and call the next play.’

“Shaun didn’t have a great work ethic in Seattle,” Zorn added. “He didn’t. He said he felt practice was for everybody else.”

How many other RB's in the HOF have such a damning thing said about them?? Sheeshh. Take off the glasses.

But I guess Jim Zorn hates him too like the other 31 teams in 2008 who didnt want to touch him and rest of us that see past the stats and can rightfully attriibute his success in good part to those who paved the way for him.

Well actually several players that players with LT felt he did not run hard inside the 20s, and he ran out of bounds to much, So sorry if you look there are some who say bad things about every player. Also, there are others who spoke very highly of Lt and Alexander.

I mean of course you bring in a quote that backs you stance on him which again is personal and not based on stats.

"In a March Sports Illustrated article, Shaun Alexander’s former teammate, quarterback Matt Hasselbeck, said he believes Alexander is Hall-of-Fame material. “I sure do,” Hasselbeck said. “I’m not an expert on the numbers and I was never that big into stats. When we were teammates, he was one of the best running backs in the game, a household name, on the cover of Madden, breaking franchise and NFL records seemingly all the time.

“I do not know of a better red-zone runner,” Hasselbeck said. “There have been some great runners in NFL history that were Hall of Fame runners but weren’t great goal line running backs. I think Barry Sanders might be the greatest running back of all time. But on the goal line or inside the three-yard line was not his strength.”

Nate Burleson, another one of Alexander’s former teammates, believes Alexander is very underappreciated. “He’s a quiet individual who went out there and didn’t talk about how great he was,” Burleson said. “He’d rather do it on the field. And also I believe because it was a small window of time where he was the best running back in football.” "

amazing how there are other opinions as well and this form guys who actually player with him not an ex player

Not amazing at all. Just different coming from a coach responsible for assessing the ability of a player to contribute to a team and whether that player should even be on the team. Different still when the talent evaluators on 31 other teams also looked at Shaun Alexander and came to the same conclusion and decided not to offer him a contract.

keasley45 wrote:Walter Jones: "I think anyone could have done what Shaun Alexander did behind our OL. All he had to do was make a linebacker or safety miss. I would have loved to block for Lynch"

Not that the opinion of the guy who blocked for him his whole career matters more than Nate Burlesons...

But he probably just hates him too and is a crap evaluator of NFL caliber RBs.

Bobblehead wrote:Gotta give a shout out to Joe Jurevious, that guy, I believe was the single most player responsible for Alexanders break out runs. Joe was a phenomenal down field blocker who would wipe out secondary defenders, thus allowing Alexanders big runs down field.

keasley45 wrote:

John63 wrote:

keasley45 wrote:

pittpnthrs wrote:
You're contradicting yourself with this statement. You're saying being soft at the point of contact is NOT a defining characteristic of a HOF back and then proceed to list 3 backs that were. You act like Alexander never juked a defender and just laid down when one appeared and thats nowhere near the truth. Its unreal the disrespect the guy receives around here. It reminds me of a guy on another forum that was saying how Carson was better than Lynch because he is always looking for contact. Its as if he forgot about Lynch totally somehow and thats how It seems with Alexander in this thread. When reading some replies in this thread, one would think that Alexander was nothing more than an average back. Its unreal how quickly some forget.

You're actually claiming the guys i mentioned above were soft??

Ok. No need to continue this further.

Shaun wont get in.

When he didnt have the continuity of the O-line and 2 HOF's, Toebeck, and a cast of underrated , and unheralded others opening holes for him, his YPC dropped from 5.1 in 2005 to 3.6 and 3.5 in 2006 and 2007. Yes, he had a few injuries but none that could account alone for the drastic decline in production. He sat out for the foot while it healed. Then he went on to Washington after being a free agent for 6 months. 6 months. Why? because every other team in the league knew then what some here know now. That he was a product of his O-line. And who signed him, but Jim Zorn. nd what happened there? behind another average o-line, he was ousted by Clinton Portis and Ladell Betts.

and what did JIM ZORN have to say about Alexander's 'want to' and effort? This is a quote directly from him when asked whether Shaun was unfairly cast:

Told of this theory, Zorn partly agreed but said: “Repeating that ’05 season would have been hard. And he just seemed to either not have the knack, or he seemed to take a view of, ‘Hey, listen, when the hole’s there, I’m going to run through, but if the hole’s not there, you might as well go and call the next play.’

“Shaun didn’t have a great work ethic in Seattle,” Zorn added. “He didn’t. He said he felt practice was for everybody else.”

How many other RB's in the HOF have such a damning thing said about them?? Sheeshh. Take off the glasses.

But I guess Jim Zorn hates him too like the other 31 teams in 2008 who didnt want to touch him and rest of us that see past the stats and can rightfully attriibute his success in good part to those who paved the way for him.

Well actually several players that players with LT felt he did not run hard inside the 20s, and he ran out of bounds to much, So sorry if you look there are some who say bad things about every player. Also, there are others who spoke very highly of Lt and Alexander.

I mean of course you bring in a quote that backs you stance on him which again is personal and not based on stats.

"In a March Sports Illustrated article, Shaun Alexander’s former teammate, quarterback Matt Hasselbeck, said he believes Alexander is Hall-of-Fame material. “I sure do,” Hasselbeck said. “I’m not an expert on the numbers and I was never that big into stats. When we were teammates, he was one of the best running backs in the game, a household name, on the cover of Madden, breaking franchise and NFL records seemingly all the time.

“I do not know of a better red-zone runner,” Hasselbeck said. “There have been some great runners in NFL history that were Hall of Fame runners but weren’t great goal line running backs. I think Barry Sanders might be the greatest running back of all time. But on the goal line or inside the three-yard line was not his strength.”

Nate Burleson, another one of Alexander’s former teammates, believes Alexander is very underappreciated. “He’s a quiet individual who went out there and didn’t talk about how great he was,” Burleson said. “He’d rather do it on the field. And also I believe because it was a small window of time where he was the best running back in football.” "

amazing how there are other opinions as well and this form guys who actually player with him not an ex player

Not amazing at all. Just different coming from a coach responsible for assessing the ability of a player to contribute to a team and whether that player should even be on the team. Different still when the talent evaluators on 31 other teams also looked at Shaun Alexander and came to the same conclusion and decided not to offer him a contract.

bevellisthedevil wrote:I am glad people have good memories of him. I remember him as a good back that had huge holes provided to him by very good olineman and a fullback who would make cb's ball up and cry to get him to the second level.

RolandDeschain wrote:

bevellisthedevil wrote:I am glad people have good memories of him. I remember him as a good back that had huge holes provided to him by very good olineman and a fullback who would make cb's ball up and cry to get him to the second level.

I remember him fondly as well. Everyone should. That fondness doesn't mean he's HoF-worthy, is all.

Seanhawk wrote:

keasley45 wrote:

John63 wrote:

keasley45 wrote:

You're actually claiming the guys i mentioned above were soft??

Ok. No need to continue this further.

Shaun wont get in.

When he didnt have the continuity of the O-line and 2 HOF's, Toebeck, and a cast of underrated , and unheralded others opening holes for him, his YPC dropped from 5.1 in 2005 to 3.6 and 3.5 in 2006 and 2007. Yes, he had a few injuries but none that could account alone for the drastic decline in production. He sat out for the foot while it healed. Then he went on to Washington after being a free agent for 6 months. 6 months. Why? because every other team in the league knew then what some here know now. That he was a product of his O-line. And who signed him, but Jim Zorn. nd what happened there? behind another average o-line, he was ousted by Clinton Portis and Ladell Betts.

and what did JIM ZORN have to say about Alexander's 'want to' and effort? This is a quote directly from him when asked whether Shaun was unfairly cast:

Told of this theory, Zorn partly agreed but said: “Repeating that ’05 season would have been hard. And he just seemed to either not have the knack, or he seemed to take a view of, ‘Hey, listen, when the hole’s there, I’m going to run through, but if the hole’s not there, you might as well go and call the next play.’

“Shaun didn’t have a great work ethic in Seattle,” Zorn added. “He didn’t. He said he felt practice was for everybody else.”

How many other RB's in the HOF have such a damning thing said about them?? Sheeshh. Take off the glasses.

But I guess Jim Zorn hates him too like the other 31 teams in 2008 who didnt want to touch him and rest of us that see past the stats and can rightfully attriibute his success in good part to those who paved the way for him.

Well actually several players that players with LT felt he did not run hard inside the 20s, and he ran out of bounds to much, So sorry if you look there are some who say bad things about every player. Also, there are others who spoke very highly of Lt and Alexander.

I mean of course you bring in a quote that backs you stance on him which again is personal and not based on stats.

"In a March Sports Illustrated article, Shaun Alexander’s former teammate, quarterback Matt Hasselbeck, said he believes Alexander is Hall-of-Fame material. “I sure do,” Hasselbeck said. “I’m not an expert on the numbers and I was never that big into stats. When we were teammates, he was one of the best running backs in the game, a household name, on the cover of Madden, breaking franchise and NFL records seemingly all the time.

“I do not know of a better red-zone runner,” Hasselbeck said. “There have been some great runners in NFL history that were Hall of Fame runners but weren’t great goal line running backs. I think Barry Sanders might be the greatest running back of all time. But on the goal line or inside the three-yard line was not his strength.”

Nate Burleson, another one of Alexander’s former teammates, believes Alexander is very underappreciated. “He’s a quiet individual who went out there and didn’t talk about how great he was,” Burleson said. “He’d rather do it on the field. And also I believe because it was a small window of time where he was the best running back in football.” "

amazing how there are other opinions as well and this form guys who actually player with him not an ex player

Not amazing at all. Just different coming from a coach responsible for assessing the ability of a player to contribute to a team and whether that player should even be on the team. Different still when the talent evaluators on 31 other teams also looked at Shaun Alexander and came to the same conclusion and decided not to offer him a contract.

Do you people just make $h!t up? The 31 other teams didn't even have the opportunity to offer him a contract. He signed his big 8 year extension before he even hit free agency.

https://www.seattlepi.com/sports/football/article/Seahawks-sign-Shaun-Alexander-for-62-million-1197619.php

keasley45 wrote:

Seanhawk wrote:

keasley45 wrote:

John63 wrote:

Well actually several players that players with LT felt he did not run hard inside the 20s, and he ran out of bounds to much, So sorry if you look there are some who say bad things about every player. Also, there are others who spoke very highly of Lt and Alexander.

I mean of course you bring in a quote that backs you stance on him which again is personal and not based on stats.

"In a March Sports Illustrated article, Shaun Alexander’s former teammate, quarterback Matt Hasselbeck, said he believes Alexander is Hall-of-Fame material. “I sure do,” Hasselbeck said. “I’m not an expert on the numbers and I was never that big into stats. When we were teammates, he was one of the best running backs in the game, a household name, on the cover of Madden, breaking franchise and NFL records seemingly all the time.

“I do not know of a better red-zone runner,” Hasselbeck said. “There have been some great runners in NFL history that were Hall of Fame runners but weren’t great goal line running backs. I think Barry Sanders might be the greatest running back of all time. But on the goal line or inside the three-yard line was not his strength.”

Nate Burleson, another one of Alexander’s former teammates, believes Alexander is very underappreciated. “He’s a quiet individual who went out there and didn’t talk about how great he was,” Burleson said. “He’d rather do it on the field. And also I believe because it was a small window of time where he was the best running back in football.” "

amazing how there are other opinions as well and this form guys who actually player with him not an ex player

Not amazing at all. Just different coming from a coach responsible for assessing the ability of a player to contribute to a team and whether that player should even be on the team. Different still when the talent evaluators on 31 other teams also looked at Shaun Alexander and came to the same conclusion and decided not to offer him a contract.

Do you people just make $h!t up? The 31 other teams didn't even have the opportunity to offer him a contract. He signed his big 8 year extension before he even hit free agency.

https://www.seattlepi.com/sports/football/article/Seahawks-sign-Shaun-Alexander-for-62-million-1197619.php

Tbis wasnt a reference to his massive contract. It was about him being cut by seattle, becoming a free agent, and nobody in the league but the redskins wanting to give him a shot. He was free to join any team that wanted him. No one did. Only Jim Zorn took a chance, and then cut him.

pittpnthrs wrote:

keasley45 wrote:

IndyHawk wrote:

sdog1981 wrote:
NFL MVP, Super Bowl MVP, 20 rushing TD season and a 2000 yard rushing season. He is a Hall of Fame player. He could have played for 15 more seasons rushing for 0 yards every year and still be a HOF running back, due to his 1996 to 1998 seasons.

SA had an MVP,27 tds,1880 rushing and got hosed in SB-Thats a HOF season too.
Here look at his stats closely and tell me he shouldn't be in.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/ ... exSh00.htm

He shouldn't be in. Its not all about the stats. he wasn't individually HOF great. He has HOF stats because he had a great O-Line opening gashes in defenses for him to chew up yards.

Emmitt Smith should have never made it either right?

Ad Hawk wrote:

Welshers wrote:As I said, fair or not, those things stick with the voting committee. Winning a SB has proven to be vital to getting into the hall

Hmmm... I wonder how that would affect someone like Larry Fitzgerald.

No, SB win on resume has an impact, but not overwhelmingly so.

keasley45 wrote:

pittpnthrs wrote:

keasley45 wrote:Being soft at the point of contact IS NOT a defining characteristic of a HOF back. You dont have to be Campbell or Lynch. You can be cut from the Sanders, LT or Faulk cloth and juke the crap out of guy. (BTW, Lynch could do that too - Google Lynch jukes Ray Lewis - Classic). Shaun got the yards that were on the table when the blocking worked well. Not when it didnt.

You're contradicting yourself with this statement. You're saying being soft at the point of contact is NOT a defining characteristic of a HOF back and then proceed to list 3 backs that were. You act like Alexander never juked a defender and just laid down when one appeared and thats nowhere near the truth. Its unreal the disrespect the guy receives around here. It reminds me of a guy on another forum that was saying how Carson was better than Lynch because he is always looking for contact. Its as if he forgot about Lynch totally somehow and thats how It seems with Alexander in this thread. When reading some replies in this thread, one would think that Alexander was nothing more than an average back. Its unreal how quickly some forget.

You're actually claiming the guys i mentioned above were soft??

Ok. No need to continue this further.

Shaun wont get in.

When he didnt have the continuity of the O-line and 2 HOF's, Toebeck, and a cast of underrated , and unheralded others opening holes for him, his YPC dropped from 5.1 in 2005 to 3.6 and 3.5 in 2006 and 2007. Yes, he had a few injuries but none that could account alone for the drastic decline in production. He sat out for the foot while it healed. Then he went on to Washington after being a free agent for 6 months. 6 months. Why? because every other team in the league knew then what some here know now. That he was a product of his O-line. And who signed him, but Jim Zorn. nd what happened there? behind another average o-line, he was ousted by Clinton Portis and Ladell Betts.
This ^^^^ right here showed through in his play once he got that contract. It was there before, but once he got that deal, he completely checked out. The Hawks might as well of had you or I back there during that time.

and what did JIM ZORN have to say about Alexander's 'want to' and effort? This is a quote directly from him when asked whether Shaun was unfairly cast:

Told of this theory, Zorn partly agreed but said: “Repeating that ’05 season would have been hard. And he just seemed to either not have the knack, or he seemed to take a view of, ‘Hey, listen, when the hole’s there, I’m going to run through, but if the hole’s not there, you might as well go and call the next play.’

“Shaun didn’t have a great work ethic in Seattle,” Zorn added. “He didn’t. He said he felt practice was for everybody else.”

How many other RB's in the HOF have such a damning thing said about them?? Sheeshh. Take off the glasses.

But I guess Jim Zorn hates him too like the other 31 teams in 2008 who didnt want to touch him and rest of us that see past the stats and can rightfully attriibute his success in good part to those who paved the way for him.

OrangeGravy wrote:Combine that with his houdini act once he got his big contract

OrangeGravy wrote:

keasley45 wrote:

pittpnthrs wrote:

keasley45 wrote:Being soft at the point of contact IS NOT a defining characteristic of a HOF back. You dont have to be Campbell or Lynch. You can be cut from the Sanders, LT or Faulk cloth and juke the crap out of guy. (BTW, Lynch could do that too - Google Lynch jukes Ray Lewis - Classic). Shaun got the yards that were on the table when the blocking worked well. Not when it didnt.

You're contradicting yourself with this statement. You're saying being soft at the point of contact is NOT a defining characteristic of a HOF back and then proceed to list 3 backs that were. You act like Alexander never juked a defender and just laid down when one appeared and thats nowhere near the truth. Its unreal the disrespect the guy receives around here. It reminds me of a guy on another forum that was saying how Carson was better than Lynch because he is always looking for contact. Its as if he forgot about Lynch totally somehow and thats how It seems with Alexander in this thread. When reading some replies in this thread, one would think that Alexander was nothing more than an average back. Its unreal how quickly some forget.

You're actually claiming the guys i mentioned above were soft??

Ok. No need to continue this further.

Shaun wont get in.

When he didnt have the continuity of the O-line and 2 HOF's, Toebeck, and a cast of underrated , and unheralded others opening holes for him, his YPC dropped from 5.1 in 2005 to 3.6 and 3.5 in 2006 and 2007. Yes, he had a few injuries but none that could account alone for the drastic decline in production. He sat out for the foot while it healed. Then he went on to Washington after being a free agent for 6 months. 6 months. Why? because every other team in the league knew then what some here know now. That he was a product of his O-line. And who signed him, but Jim Zorn. nd what happened there? behind another average o-line, he was ousted by Clinton Portis and Ladell Betts.
This ^^^^ right here showed through in his play once he got that contract. It was there before, but once he got that deal, he completely checked out. The Hawks might as well of had you or I back there during that time.

and what did JIM ZORN have to say about Alexander's 'want to' and effort? This is a quote directly from him when asked whether Shaun was unfairly cast:

Told of this theory, Zorn partly agreed but said: “Repeating that ’05 season would have been hard. And he just seemed to either not have the knack, or he seemed to take a view of, ‘Hey, listen, when the hole’s there, I’m going to run through, but if the hole’s not there, you might as well go and call the next play.’

“Shaun didn’t have a great work ethic in Seattle,” Zorn added. “He didn’t. He said he felt practice was for everybody else.”

How many other RB's in the HOF have such a damning thing said about them?? Sheeshh. Take off the glasses.

But I guess Jim Zorn hates him too like the other 31 teams in 2008 who didnt want to touch him and rest of us that see past the stats and can rightfully attriibute his success in good part to those who paved the way for him.

OrangeGravy wrote:Can someone out there find a youtube clip of the play/game where SA slides down (giving himself up) in the left flat ( I believe if memory serves, it was towards the North endzone/Hawks nest)? It was either a run play or a dump off and he had nothing but green around him and he performed the most cowardly, embarrassing baseball hook slide to end the play. It was and still is to this day, the single most cowardly play by an NFL ball carrier in the history of the league. Combine that with his houdini act once he got his big contract, he shouldn't even be mentioned in the best running backs to play a game in the city of Seattle conversation.

jon70 wrote:

pittpnthrs wrote:

keasley45 wrote:

IndyHawk wrote:SA had an MVP,27 tds,1880 rushing and got hosed in SB-Thats a HOF season too.
Here look at his stats closely and tell me he shouldn't be in.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/ ... exSh00.htm

He shouldn't be in. Its not all about the stats. he wasn't individually HOF great. He has HOF stats because he had a great O-Line opening gashes in defenses for him to chew up yards.

Emmitt Smith should have never made it either right?

Franco Harris is in the HOF for what?? catdhing one pass that one teams fans believe should have been incomplete

OrangeGravy wrote:Can someone out there find a youtube clip of the play/game where SA slides down (giving himself up) in the left flat ( I believe if memory serves, it was towards the North endzone/Hawks nest)? It was either a run play or a dump off and he had nothing but green around him and he performed the most cowardly, embarrassing baseball hook slide to end the play. It was and still is to this day, the single most cowardly play by an NFL ball carrier in the history of the league. Combine that with his houdini act once he got his big contract, he shouldn't even be mentioned in the best running backs to play a game in the city of Seattle conversation.

Uncle Si wrote:I loved Shaun Alexander.

However.. He's 36th in career rushing yards. He's tied for 8th in rushing TDs. He's not in the top 20 receiving for a back. He has comparable stats to Matt Forte (if we are keeping this to eras)

I'd say, optics argument aside, he is just on the outside looking in. If he had one more year, putting up 1500 and 10 TDs, he'd be a near lock.

pittpnthrs wrote:

Uncle Si wrote:I loved Shaun Alexander.

However.. He's 36th in career rushing yards. He's tied for 8th in rushing TDs. He's not in the top 20 receiving for a back. He has comparable stats to Matt Forte (if we are keeping this to eras)

I'd say, optics argument aside, he is just on the outside looking in. If he had one more year, putting up 1500 and 10 TDs, he'd be a near lock.

Gale Sayers has less than 5000 yards rushing and just 39 rushing TD's but he's in.

Stats aside, Alexander brought national attention to Seattle that players like Warner and Largent couldnt even do. Yeah, he might not get into the HoF, but he was one of the greatest Seahawks off all time. The lack of respect from Seahawk fans is mindboggling.

jon70 wrote:

pittpnthrs wrote:

keasley45 wrote:

IndyHawk wrote:SA had an MVP,27 tds,1880 rushing and got hosed in SB-Thats a HOF season too.
Here look at his stats closely and tell me he shouldn't be in.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/ ... exSh00.htm

He shouldn't be in. Its not all about the stats. he wasn't individually HOF great. He has HOF stats because he had a great O-Line opening gashes in defenses for him to chew up yards.

Emmitt Smith should have never made it either right?

Franco Harris is in the HOF for what?? catdhing one pass that one teams fans believe should have been incomplete