In a truly nightmarish story, nfl.com reports that the Lions are planning to pursue John Schneider - and if they're offering full personnel control to him, they'll be able to legally chase after him under the tampering policy.

One would think that Schneider has been offered full personnel control by many other organizations, presumably ones less hopeless than Detroit, so I don't think he'd really jump ship. Still, the prospect of it happening is sobering.

The Lions began their search for a new general manager with a series of interviews before the regular season ended. But Detroit brass is also plotting a potential blockbuster move.

Sources say the Lions plan to pursue Seahawks GM John Schneider for their vacant GM opening, a hire that would send shockwaves around the NFL.

https://www.nfl.com/news/lions-eye-bloc ... -schneider

This would seriously suck! It would mark the end of an era for the team and a team that competed in every personnel situation would be weakened. Make no doubt about it JS is chiefly involved in providing the material for the continuing success of the team.

It’s easy to see why any NFL team would want him especially one that has historically underperformed and made many personnel mistakes, or wishes a proven leader added to their program.

To me though, is there any genuine belief that JS is unhappy here, unappreciated by the ownership, underpaid, or truly working in the shadow of PC? I honestly don’t believe any of the foregoing has application. However, as contractual negotiation gambit or reminder of his true value it is genuine food for thought. I’d also believe there is no way that Jody Allen would want to see JS leave or get outbid for his services.I also suspect his family which has a few real challenges would not wish to relocate and have to deal with any uncertainty.

I doubt that JS has any thought about any of this and is entirely focused upon securing playoff success for his team. Make no doubt this FO is the best ever the team has had and their continuing winning record is proof positive the team has a correct formula and is a place where players want to be. JS is a legitimate personnel wizard and has been brilliant here.

Just so the Nellies Here are addressed, no GM is above making mistakes and JS has made a few, but he constantly works the roster, fixes his mistakes and acknowledges them. He reigns in Pete’s often reckless exuberance, is constantly working the roster, PS, combing the castoff pile for incremental improvements And manages a personnel group that has been way better than average at finding talent.

I think this is a “ cool story Bro” situation and Trader John isn’t likely to be going anywhere.

Just curious who is the assistant GM now? Wonder if there has been someone under John that he has trained in case he ever left.

Great News. Hopefully it comes true. Scot McCloughan, the real mastermind behind the LOB should be on our shortlist.

Nope. Don't like this one bit.

https://www.nfl.com/news/lions-eye-bloc ... -schneider

ludakrishna wrote:Great News. Hopefully it comes true. Scot McCloughan, the real mastermind behind the LOB should be on our shortlist.

Yes ignore everything Scneider has done behind the scenes because your mancrush for McCloughan has you convinced he was solely responsible for the LOB

cymatica wrote:

ludakrishna wrote:Great News. Hopefully it comes true. Scot McCloughan, the real mastermind behind the LOB should be on our shortlist.

Yes ignore everything Scneider has done behind the scenes because your mancrush for McCloughan has you convinced he was solely responsible for the LOB

John Schneider is overrated. Only one successful DE picked in the draft (Frank Clark) everyone else has been a bust. Living off of the 2011/2012 draft success for too long. No DB depth since LOB No LBs since Bobby and KJ, no DL outside of Frank. Couldn’t develop a Offensive Tackle in house. Outside of Damien Lewis this year, OL drafting has been terrible. Britt took 3 years to find a role he was somewhat average in. Same is true for Pocic. WR outside of DK and Tyler Lockett have been miserable. TE drafting talent has been horrendous. Reliant on Trades too much. For every Carlos Dunlap fluke trade, there is a Jimmy Graham, Percy Harvin, Sheldon Richardson, Jadeveon Clowney trade to counter it. Go look at his Drafts from 2013, 2014, 2015, 2016...complete joke. Go look at the 2013/2014 drafts. Only 1 player still on an active nfl roster from those draft picks. Add 2015 and that number jumps to 3. 3 players from 3 drafts still on an active NFL roster. Yep, great eye for talent

Gotta bad feeling hes gone...then again its Detroit..who would wanna go there.

ludakrishna wrote:

cymatica wrote:

ludakrishna wrote:Great News. Hopefully it comes true. Scot McCloughan, the real mastermind behind the LOB should be on our shortlist.

Yes ignore everything Scneider has done behind the scenes because your mancrush for McCloughan has you convinced he was solely responsible for the LOB

John Schneider is overrated. Only one successful DE picked in the draft (Frank Clark) everyone else has been a bust. Living off of the 2011/2012 draft success for too long. No DB depth since LOB No LBs since Bobby and KJ, no DL outside of Frank. Couldn’t develop a Offensive Tackle in house. Outside of Damien Lewis this year, OL drafting has been terrible. Britt took 3 years to find a role he was somewhat average in. Same is true for Pocic. WR outside of DK and Tyler Lockett have been miserable. TE drafting talent has been horrendous. Reliant on Trades too much. For every Carlos Dunlap fluke trade, there is a Jimmy Graham, Percy Harvin, Sheldon Richardson, Jadeveon Clowney trade to counter it. Go look at his Drafts from 2013, 2014, 2015, 2016...complete joke. Go look at the 2013/2014 drafts. Only 1 player still on an active nfl roster from those draft picks. Add 2015 and that number jumps to 3. 3 players from 3 drafts still on an active NFL roster. Yep, great eye for talent

You are overrated for your posts. Being a general manager is more than just drafts. There is free agency, bargaining, keeping and releasing players, keeping a practice squad and managing the money around all of it
You are basing judgment of said individual around one draft. No one else is.

The lions also plan to hire Belichick as HC, sign every top FA, and draft 5 future pro bowlers. They can wish all they want.

Florio (who is a lawyer) disputes the nfl media's article as "not nearly that simple" and possibly inaccurate in reference to the nfl.com media report that said:

“Schneider doesn’t have primary authority over all personnel decisions in Seattle — [coach Pete] Carroll does. That hasn’t really mattered, since Carroll and Schneider are in lockstep, but under the NFL’s anti-tampering policy, the Lions or another team could try to interview Schneider if it offered him full control.”

Florio points out that "primary authority" is not the same as "final authority" and says the definition stipulates that "final authority is not a requirement.

He also notes:

At the absolute bare minimum, the situation isn’t nearly as simple and clean as the NFL.com article suggests. Indeed, the Packers sought permission to interview Schneider in 2018 for the G.M. job, and the Seahawks declined. If it was simple enough to offer Schneider final authority over personnel to get him away from the Seahawks, Schneider possibly would be the Packers G.M. right now.

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2 ... so-simple/

Seems like he'd leave on his own terms when he simply wants to. Either this is nothing, or he wants to. I'm guessing it's nothing.

Players move on , coaches move on , etc. etc. . That's the way it is .

ludakrishna wrote:

cymatica wrote:

ludakrishna wrote:Great News. Hopefully it comes true. Scot McCloughan, the real mastermind behind the LOB should be on our shortlist.

Yes ignore everything Scneider has done behind the scenes because your mancrush for McCloughan has you convinced he was solely responsible for the LOB

John Schneider is overrated. Only one successful DE picked in the draft (Frank Clark) everyone else has been a bust. Living off of the 2011/2012 draft success for too long. No DB depth since LOB No LBs since Bobby and KJ, no DL outside of Frank. Couldn’t develop a Offensive Tackle in house. Outside of Damien Lewis this year, OL drafting has been terrible. Britt took 3 years to find a role he was somewhat average in. Same is true for Pocic. WR outside of DK and Tyler Lockett have been miserable. TE drafting talent has been horrendous. Reliant on Trades too much. For every Carlos Dunlap fluke trade, there is a Jimmy Graham, Percy Harvin, Sheldon Richardson, Jadeveon Clowney trade to counter it. Go look at his Drafts from 2013, 2014, 2015, 2016...complete joke. Go look at the 2013/2014 drafts. Only 1 player still on an active nfl roster from those draft picks. Add 2015 and that number jumps to 3. 3 players from 3 drafts still on an active NFL roster. Yep, great eye for talent

So you’re blaming JS for players that aren’t in the league after almost a decade? I mean man, those trades you mentioned were at the time the envy of everyone.

Tight end drafting talent has been horrendous? So you don’t think Will Dissly has talent? Just gonna blame JS for the injuries?

The EYE for talent is unmistakable as well as his work ethic. Which is why Detroit wants him to fix the whole damn thing.

Doesn't JS still have a year left on his contract with the Seahawks?

If so, the Lions have to pay Seahawks for the trade.

Let him go for five 1st round picks plus five 2nd round picks. He's worth it.

ludakrishna wrote:

cymatica wrote:

ludakrishna wrote:Great News. Hopefully it comes true. Scot McCloughan, the real mastermind behind the LOB should be on our shortlist.

Yes ignore everything Scneider has done behind the scenes because your mancrush for McCloughan has you convinced he was solely responsible for the LOB

John Schneider is overrated. Only one successful DE picked in the draft (Frank Clark) everyone else has been a bust. Living off of the 2011/2012 draft success for too long. No DB depth since LOB No LBs since Bobby and KJ, no DL outside of Frank. Couldn’t develop a Offensive Tackle in house. Outside of Damien Lewis this year, OL drafting has been terrible. Britt took 3 years to find a role he was somewhat average in. Same is true for Pocic. WR outside of DK and Tyler Lockett have been miserable. TE drafting talent has been horrendous. Reliant on Trades too much. For every Carlos Dunlap fluke trade, there is a Jimmy Graham, Percy Harvin, Sheldon Richardson, Jadeveon Clowney trade to counter it. Go look at his Drafts from 2013, 2014, 2015, 2016...complete joke. Go look at the 2013/2014 drafts. Only 1 player still on an active nfl roster from those draft picks. Add 2015 and that number jumps to 3. 3 players from 3 drafts still on an active NFL roster. Yep, great eye for talent

What makes the Dunlap trade a "fluke trade"? Curious

"WR out of Lockett and DK have been terrible." So Doug Baldwin doesnt exist anymore? An undrafted rookie that Schneider took a swing on, and knocked it out of the park.

He signed Avril and Bennett.

Jordyn Brooks looks like a fine linebacker.

He drafted Russell Okung, a fine LT who went to get paid elsewhere. He also saw potential in George Fant, but he also left to get paid. He would've got paid here if not for Schneider working the Brown trade.

He's done a fine job as GM, and is able to remain sober unlike McClaughlin

Love the fluke trades and every single good move is a "exception" and "getting lucky"

At least I have identified another poster that I can just scroll by.

You'd think winning in the NFL was easy.

I think the only authority John does not have at the Hawks is the authority to hire and fire head coach.

Sent from my IN2017 using Tapatalk

ludakrishna wrote:Great News. Hopefully it comes true. Scot McCloughan, the real mastermind behind the LOB should be on our shortlist.

There is one in every crowd..! You get more attention posting ridiclous statements than if you go along with the mainstream, logical, and correct thinking.
Someday both PC and JS will be gone and the Hawks will be bottom feeders for a decade or two. Then all of the people badmouthing both over the years, can sit back and remember the good old days. Some don't appreciate what they have, which is the envy of 95% of the league. Maybe 98%......

Donn2390 wrote:Someday both PC and JS will be gone and the Hawks will be bottom feeders for a decade or two. ..

Wont happen until Wilson moves on.

ludakrishna wrote:

cymatica wrote:

ludakrishna wrote:Great News. Hopefully it comes true. Scot McCloughan, the real mastermind behind the LOB should be on our shortlist.

Yes ignore everything Scneider has done behind the scenes because your mancrush for McCloughan has you convinced he was solely responsible for the LOB

John Schneider is overrated. Only one successful DE picked in the draft (Frank Clark) everyone else has been a bust. Living off of the 2011/2012 draft success for too long. No DB depth since LOB No LBs since Bobby and KJ, no DL outside of Frank. Couldn’t develop a Offensive Tackle in house. Outside of Damien Lewis this year, OL drafting has been terrible. Britt took 3 years to find a role he was somewhat average in. Same is true for Pocic. WR outside of DK and Tyler Lockett have been miserable. TE drafting talent has been horrendous. Reliant on Trades too much. For every Carlos Dunlap fluke trade, there is a Jimmy Graham, Percy Harvin, Sheldon Richardson, Jadeveon Clowney trade to counter it. Go look at his Drafts from 2013, 2014, 2015, 2016...complete joke. Go look at the 2013/2014 drafts. Only 1 player still on an active nfl roster from those draft picks. Add 2015 and that number jumps to 3. 3 players from 3 drafts still on an active NFL roster. Yep, great eye for talent

We get it, you hate success. You've made it abundantly clear.

Lessee.....SEATTLE...detroit...
Anyone see a tough choice there?

I've seen a few shocker moves, but choosing detroit in that matchup would be all time big seismic.

Cyrus12 wrote:Gotta bad feeling hes gone...then again its Detroit..who would wanna go there.

Yeah, if he didn't want to go to Green Bay, seems odd he would jump at the chance to go to.....Detroit.

But hey, you never know I guess

Appyhawk wrote:Lessee.....SEATTLE...detroit...
Anyone see a tough choice there?

I've seen a few shocker moves, but choosing detroit in that matchup would be all time big seismic.

Reports say he will get a free Ford company vehicle to use at team expense.

They may have us beat there

I could see him going to Detroit, hiring Saleh (former Hawk) as the head coach, then signing Russ in a few years.

Jerhawk wrote:

Appyhawk wrote:Lessee.....SEATTLE...detroit...
Anyone see a tough choice there?

I've seen a few shocker moves, but choosing detroit in that matchup would be all time big seismic.

Reports say he will get a free Ford company vehicle to use at team expense.

They may have us beat there

I would never discount anything.

A lot of really stupid decisions have been made under the guise of a challenge.

When stories like this come out, they don't come from the teams.... they come from AGENTS .... so I think we can connect the dots here ---

Detroit wants Schneider. They put feelers out to Schneider's agent --- and either Schneider is interested in the job, or wants leverage going into his next contract.

So the question to me is -- how hard does Seattle and Pete work to keep JS?

I think he's a very good GM, but I'm not going to be too upset if he leaves. It's an opportunity for somebody else to step in and see what they can do for us. Worst case scenario, I don't see our overall personnel management dropping off too much.

Hawkstorian wrote:When stories like this come out, they don't come from the teams.... they come from AGENTS .... so I think we can connect the dots here ---

Detroit wants Schneider. They put feelers out to Schneider's agent --- and either Schneider is interested in the job, or wants leverage going into his next contract.

So the question to me is -- how hard does Seattle and Pete work to keep JS?

JS is probably wanted by most of the NFL.

I am sure his agent will use every opportunity to create leverage, but there are only so many times one can cry wolf. Detroit doesn't seem like the type of situation where Seattle has to break the bank with worry. If JS ever wants to leave, he likely can do better

I think the difference here is --- 1) Pete just got a new deal and 2) John is probably about ready for his next deal and 3) Detroit came a calling and agent decided to use the opportunity to fire a shot across the bow.

I guarantee that he is not going anywhere.... The hawks would be stupid to not to pay him what he wants... this isn't even a consideration...

Pay the man and lets move forward


LTH

Exactly. John is an excellent GM with a contract negotiation coming up, and he's well within his rights to want a top dollar contract. The Lions are signaling that they are willing to pay for him and there is some debate as to whether that can be considered tampering under the current NFL rules. It probably is tampering but nobody will care enough to pursue it due to the gray area in terminology between principal and final.

Those who pay attention will remember a very similar story coming out before Schneider's previous extension and it resulted in nothing other than leverage in contract talks.

Given the amount of vacancies it's not surprising that poachers are going to try to grab success immediately with proven commodities. Scott Pioli had this happen with him, he had some success in KC but never the level of NE, there is a chemistry at work in many situations, we have it with Pete and John, I hope that both recognize this.

The Lions are not some legacy franchise.
In fact a very unstable franchise.

It will likely end in a “thanks, but no thanks.”

No salary cap for NFL management positions. Just saying.

I wonder who he would fire first?

jamescasey1124 wrote:

ludakrishna wrote:

cymatica wrote:

ludakrishna wrote:Great News. Hopefully it comes true. Scot McCloughan, the real mastermind behind the LOB should be on our shortlist.

Yes ignore everything Scneider has done behind the scenes because your mancrush for McCloughan has you convinced he was solely responsible for the LOB

John Schneider is overrated. Only one successful DE picked in the draft (Frank Clark) everyone else has been a bust. Living off of the 2011/2012 draft success for too long. No DB depth since LOB No LBs since Bobby and KJ, no DL outside of Frank. Couldn’t develop a Offensive Tackle in house. Outside of Damien Lewis this year, OL drafting has been terrible. Britt took 3 years to find a role he was somewhat average in. Same is true for Pocic. WR outside of DK and Tyler Lockett have been miserable. TE drafting talent has been horrendous. Reliant on Trades too much. For every Carlos Dunlap fluke trade, there is a Jimmy Graham, Percy Harvin, Sheldon Richardson, Jadeveon Clowney trade to counter it. Go look at his Drafts from 2013, 2014, 2015, 2016...complete joke. Go look at the 2013/2014 drafts. Only 1 player still on an active nfl roster from those draft picks. Add 2015 and that number jumps to 3. 3 players from 3 drafts still on an active NFL roster. Yep, great eye for talent

You are overrated for your posts. Being a general manager is more than just drafts. There is free agency, bargaining, keeping and releasing players, keeping a practice squad and managing the money around all of it
You are basing judgment of said individual around one draft. No one else is.

This story was the only reason he posted today. Otherwise he's in hiding after wins. He only shows up after losses to post usually inaccurate stuff.

Lions can also take Pete Carroll. His ass should have been dismissed after the biggest epic failure in history with SB Int. Stop blaming Bevell when Pete had the final say and decided to go with that crap. Pete stated "we weren't trying to score on that down". Without a doubt that is dumbest statement i've ever heard. You score whenever you can. How anyone can take Smiling Pete seriously after that with this fan base and Seattle media licking his pee pee amazing to me. 12's ran Beast Mode/Sherman/Bennett out of the town because they called out Pete on that BS. Pete only wants "yes men" who don't question him on his failures. The whole Rah Rah routine so played out and yesterday. Babies use the excuse about "living in the past" by that logic so are Hawks since that very moment this team has never been the team and failed to advance past Divisional Playoff round. Mediocrity.

The only way I'll ever know if Schneider is more valuable than Carroll is if he is GM alone. But, he's much younger, and I'd rather he be GM with the next Seahawks head coach than be GM on another team.

hawksfansince90 wrote:Lions can also take Pete Carroll. His ass should have been dismissed after the biggest epic failure in history with SB Int. Stop blaming Bevell when Pete had the final say and decided to go with that crap. Pete stated "we weren't trying to score on that down". Without a doubt that is dumbest statement i've ever heard. You score whenever you can. How anyone can take Smiling Pete seriously after that with this fan base and Seattle media licking his pee pee amazing to me. 12's ran Beast Mode/Sherman/Bennett out of the town because they called out Pete on that BS. Pete only wants "yes men" who don't question him on his failures. The whole Rah Rah routine so played out and yesterday. Babies use the excuse about "living in the past" by that logic so are Hawks since that very moment this team has never been the team and failed to advance past Divisional Playoff round. Mediocrity.

You would've fired a coach who brought his team to 2 straight Super Bowls, winning 1 of them, and has since had 7/7 winning seasons?

You're being serious right now?